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China Mieville

 
  

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Thorn Davis
12:23 / 14.09.07
I'd rather Mieville threw people for a loop now and again, even if it puts some of them off.

That's true, I was certainly thrown for a loop by the fact that a writer whose work I'd previously found gripping and remarkable had turned in something unengaging and tired.

Throughout the book I got the sense that Mieville was bored with Bas-Lag - and I read with some interest the comment earlier on this thread that he's going to leave the place alone for a bit. It did make me wonder whether he was feeling less inspired by the setting than when he wrote the preceeding novels, and that this creeping lack of enthusiasm started to seep into his writing.
 
 
Happy Dave Has Left
12:30 / 14.09.07
That's true, I was certainly thrown for a loop by the fact that a writer whose work I'd previously found gripping and remarkable had turned in something unengaging and tired.

Exactly. My problem with the opening coda isn't that he's moved out of New Crobuzon and OMG, abandoned his setting. It was that it wasn't all that well written.

What do I mean by that?

Well, it was classic 'White Room Syndrome', as in, 'I woke in a white room'. Thumbnail sketch characters in thumbnail sketch situations, with no way to place them. Two characters who died without saying more than about ten lines each. A goal that was reached through a series of jerky, barely-linked scenes, with a weird nemesis following close behind who was defeated in about half a page. It felt rushed, disjointed and just a bad way to start the book. Maybe it'll all come clear as I read further, but it's just put me off a whole lot.
 
 
Jack Fear
14:13 / 14.09.07
Just a point of interest: "Coda" literally means "tail," and is by definition something that comes after the main body of a piece. I think the word you're looking for is "prologue," or "prelude," or maybe even "opening section."
 
 
Happy Dave Has Left
14:16 / 14.09.07
You are, of course, completely correct. Prologue then.

Of course, one could argue that with the lack of context to it, you could stick it anywhere in the book!
 
 
Jack Fear
14:24 / 14.09.07
Dude, it's your basic in medias res opening. It's a technique that dates back to Homer, fa chrissakes; get you into the action quickly and explain everything later.

And everything is explained, eventually. Brace for flashbacks a-plenty. For now, just groove on the weirdness, and roll 2d6 every ten pages to check for Wandering Monsters.
 
 
Happy Dave Has Left
14:32 / 14.09.07
I get that Jack, I really do, but forty-nine pages of in medias res? I found it really jarring, which I feel it would have been even if it hadn't been badly paced and jerky.

However, I'm persevering, and I'm sure it'll come good in the end. I will, as you say, hie myself off to groove on the Wierdness.
 
 
Regrettable Juvenilia
14:42 / 14.09.07
49 pages is really not that long. I seem to recall Perdido Street Station has several hundred pages of what is basically set-up before the main plot kicks in.
 
 
Spaniel
14:50 / 14.09.07
Yes, that's probably why I'm having so much difficulty getting into the Scar.
 
 
Jack Fear
14:54 / 14.09.07
I dunno. As I said, Iron Council was my first (and so far last) Mieville. Maybe that helped, that I came into it fresh.

I mean, great swathes of Iron Council are devoted entirely to atmosphere, prologue included. Are the other books more plot-driven?
 
 
Happy Dave Has Left
14:55 / 14.09.07
Fair point, but in PSS, it was several hundred pages of introducing fully formed characters and, through their eyes, exploring a vast and byzantine city.

The opener to Iron Council is, by contrast, 49 pages of 'and then they went here, and then they went there, and then they killed some guys, and then a couple of them died, and then, and then'.

Anyway, off to read before I comment further.
 
 
STOATIE LIEKS CHOCOLATE MILK
16:43 / 14.09.07
To be honest, while I enjoyed the beginning of The Iron Council, I did find it rather unengaging on an emotional level for the reasons people have already mentioned. Had the whole book been like that I think I'd have come away disappointed. Given that the context comes in later, I think when I finally get round to re-reading it I'll enjoy the opening a lot more.

I thought it was a great book, really- though it is true that what Mieville does best is cities, whether London, or New Crobuzon, or the floating pirate city whose name I forget, and that IC works best when the action's taking place in New Crobuzon. Though he writes the train almost as if he's writing a city, and that works pretty well too.
 
 
Happy Dave Has Left
22:26 / 14.09.07
Stoatie - t'was called Armada.

I think there's a definite point here - Mieville writes best when he's systematising things - when he's laying out the environment like some deranged and gifted D&D gamesmaster - he's even said as much in this inteview, where he says:

I start with maps, histories, time lines, things like that. I spend a lot of time working on stuff that may or may not actually find its way into the novel, but I know a lot more about the world than makes it into the stories. That’s the “RPG” factor: it’s about systematizing the world.

But though that’s my method, I don’t start with it. I don’t start with a bunch of graph papers and rulers. When I’m writing a book, generally I start with the mood and setting, along with a couple of specific images—things that have come into my head, totally abstracted from any narrative, that I’ve fixated on. After that, I construct a world, or an area, into which that general setting, that atmosphere, and the specific images I’ve focused on can fit. It’s at that stage that the systematization begins for me.


I think that's what is different with IC is that he's forgone a lot of that upfront exploration of the fictional world, to the detriment of the story. Like I said, I'm gonna keep reading before I comment much more here, but as a starting section (maybe a good tenth of the book) it's just too disjointed to make a positive impression for me.
 
 
Our Lady Has Left the Building
10:55 / 15.09.07
On the subject of IC, I found I didn't really enjoy reading it the first time round. I don't think I was undergoing any real life trauma at the time that could account for it, I didn't like it. I then read it again, again no real life trauma or happiness influencing me, and really enjoyed it.

I don't know whether reading it the first time to get the main thrust of the story blinded me to whatever it is in the book that made it a pleasurable read the second time round but it might be something to bear in mind.
 
 
Our Lady Has Left the Building
10:57 / 15.09.07
Really enjoyed Un Lun Dun too. He's done what I always wanted to do with childrens books, have a load of prophecies and 'chosen ones' and then have them not work. To build up Zanna and then toss her aside in favour of her 'sidekick' was brilliant.
 
  

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