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Underground > Comic Books >

NXM 121 (SPOILERS)

  
  

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Our Lady of The Two Towers
15:04 / 05.01.02
There are two things that spring to mind, firstly, when I saw the snowglobe Quitely has so drawn the characters in there as Xavier and Cassie. Say what you like about the other artists, at least they can do more than two types of face for each sex.

And, in the womb, there is nothing to explain which baby is which. Is it Charles attacking Cassie then she fights back, or Cassie fights Charles and he tries to kill her in defense?

And did anyone else notice Jean making scissors with her fingers as she goes to release Charles in the tower?

Now we just have to wait for Marvel.com to get it's act together and release the script. I guess it won't be available until Monday evening at the earliest now.
 
 
Professor Silly
15:20 / 05.01.02
quote:The extraordinary 'going in' sequence with its six concentric circles - anyone else appreciate the veiled reference to King Mob's 'Barbelith' experience beneath Uluru, in the form of the enormous hollow fish buried deep? Good to see it's in the deepest chambers of Xavier's mind...

Whether he did it on purpose or not, GM has incorporated some elements of Qabalistic Psychology in this image. The outermost ring represents the connections between mind and body (Malkuth--the Kingdom), while the second ring represents animal intelligence/emotions (Yesod, the Foundation). Next you have the scientific learning/semantic time-binding (Hod--Spendour), followed by Xavier's passion (Netzach--Victory). All this leads to Tiphereth (Beauty)...the center of his human soul (as well as the center of Ruach/air...his mind).

Brilliant, brilliant.

quote:The extraordinary 'going in' sequence with its six concentric circles - anyone else appreciate the veiled reference to King Mob's 'Barbelith' experience beneath Uluru, in the form of the enormous hollow fish buried deep? Good to see it's in the deepest chambers of Xavier's mind...

quote:I took it to mean "how to cross?" (? 2 t ?) to the tower.

Yeah, I took it to mean "should we both cross," which oh course becomes a moot question as the doors resume their attack on WQ.

As for the final rule-breaking use of dialogue, should we expect any less from GM? I like him because he tends to break the rules of comics.
 
 
Matthew Fluxington
15:42 / 05.01.02
I think it was pretty obvious that it was Charles who was the first to 'wake up' in the womb...I think the two fetuses were drawn in a way that made it obvious that it was Charles (vague masculine features, the characteristic eyebrows... and also, before even reading the final page, I remembered the bits from E Is For Extinction when Cassandra refers to herself as the 'first enemy', and that "Charles tried to kill me once, a long time ago".

Now, I'm really wondering about how she grew up... or was she born at all? It seems to suggest that she may have somehow been a miscarriage when their mother falls down the flight of stairs... did she survive as part of Charles' mind? Hm.
 
 
Spatula Clarke
16:01 / 05.01.02
I don't think their mother does fall down the stairs. The psychic blast just seems to knock everyone else over; she's still upright, gripping on to the handrail.
 
 
Matthew Fluxington
16:11 / 05.01.02
Um, you think? It looks like she is very clearly falling down the stairs from the force of Cassandra's blast, and the guy at the bottom of the stairs (Charles' dad, I'm assuming) is just standing there in shock, not really directly effected by what happened in her womb...
 
 
Seth
16:14 / 05.01.02
Nah, it's a comics convention that I remember most from Spiderman comics. A figure is repeated several times in the same panel, to show the path of their movements as they perform a complex action. It's a good way of staging complex and quick action scenes with economy, as you don't require a great deal of panels in order to convey the details. In this case, she is shown in the various stages of tumbling down the stairs: it wouldn't have made narrative sense to dwell on the fall over several panels.

The "bullet time" effect, particularly as it was used in the Matrix, reminded me of a cinematic version of this effect.
 
 
Spatula Clarke
16:15 / 05.01.02
Holy fuck. I completely misread that panel and only see it now. I figured they were in a hospital going to a pre-natal wossname and there were three other women behind her. Didn't get the time-dilation thing going on there at all (in my defense, the transparency of the images of her later in time in that panel is a bit iffy).

Whoops.

[ 05-01-2002: Message edited by: E. Ranty Dupre ]
 
 
Seth
16:17 / 05.01.02
Wu-Tang fans roll together as one! I call my brother </son/sun/> cause he shines like one!
 
 
Seth
16:20 / 05.01.02
I was a bit disappointed with the script in this issue. I would have expected Morrison to include lots of details about why he chose the symbols. I got the impression Marvel asked him to edit it for easy consumption by a wide audience - it just didn't feel like him writing (even considering it was directed soley at Quitely).
 
 
Lothar Tuppan
16:23 / 05.01.02
quote:Originally posted by expressionless:
I was a bit disappointed with the script in this issue. I would have expected Morrison to include lots of details about why he chose the symbols. I got the impression Marvel asked him to edit it for easy consumption by a wide audience - it just didn't feel like him writing (even considering it was directed soley at Quitely).

I'm surprised that they aren't forcing the writers to write the 'Marvel Style' of script.

When did the powers that be stop requiring that?
 
 
Spatula Clarke
16:31 / 05.01.02
A few other bits 'n' bobs.

The next panel, where Jean is looking at the snow globe again. The snow is no longer sperm. There's a clear question mark hovering in front of the figure supposedly representing Charles and Cassie's father - just in front of his groin, in fact. Is he their father?

The PENIS globule is over Emma's mouth, suffocating her.

Xavier, curled up on the beach like some human foetus/beached whale hybrid.

Penultimate page, second panel. It's Wolverine we see looking to the door, not Cyclops. A definite shift away from traditional X-Men thinking here. Previously, Cyclops would have been the one anxious about Xavier and Jean's well-being. He now seems nonplussed.

Y'know, that's the first issue of New X-Men that's got me interested. The previous six (?) have just left me cold. Hope Morrison's found his legs now.

[ 05-01-2002: Message edited by: E. Ranty Dupre ]
 
 
Matthew Fluxington
17:09 / 05.01.02
quote:Originally posted by expressionless:
A figure is repeated several times in the same panel, to show the path of their movements as they perform a complex action.

It's a trick Quitely has used many times in his previous work...there's a few really odd experiments with the trick in Flex Mentallo, for example.

Re: "Marvel style plots"... Marvel stopped insisting that its writers all write in a uniform way a long time ago. Many writers currently working for Marvel now, Morrison in particular, would simply not work any other way.

I don't feel like the plot for NXM 121 was edited for publication... It looks like every other Grant script I've ever seen, and honestly, I think it's amazing that they published it at all, seeing in how it spells out a lot of things that should be left up for interpretation, and makes all kinds of unusual (for comics) references.

But I think it is cool, cos I know there will be a bunch of folks out there who will try to figure out what the references to Dali, Greenaway, etc are...

I wonder what book Wolverine was reading, and what Cyclops was listening to... I've got a feeling Cyclops listens to very mainstream rock music.
 
 
A
01:57 / 06.01.02
Correct me if I'm wrong, but aren't identical twins, which is what Charles and Cassandra seem to be, always the same sex?

Non-identical twins can be different sexes, obviously, but they come from the ovum being impregnated by two sperm at once, rather than one baby-to-be splitting into two at a very early stage, which is how identical twins happen.

At any rate, i'm sure that everything will be made clear at some point. Maybe they're both hermaphrodites.

Kick arse issue, though. I don't think that this sort of thing would work nearly as well if there was any text.
 
 
The Natural Way
01:57 / 06.01.02
I thought it was pretty clear that Charles was the first to wake up, too. Jean says: "Prof X tried to kill his twin sister in the womb..". I don't think she'd be making such a big deal about it if Charles was the baby acting in self defense. Now the question is "why"? Could he sense her evil right from the get go, or is it something else? Cassandra as birth trauma? The product of Charles's vicious, angry terror?

Lothar, were you under the impression that NXM was being written Marvel style up until this issue? Weirdness....

Every ish of this comic really does feel very different from the last. And Grant's still hammering out that wicked horror vibe, with this ish: The claustrophobic, hellish landscape, snapping, gobbing doors (urgh!), foetus fight.... And Randy, I don't think Grant's "found his feet", or whatever. It sounds to me like your trying to make some kind of objective truth out of an internal one. You just liked this ish - doesn't mean Grant's suddenly managed to *sort it out*. Far as I'm concerned it was never unsorted...

I love the way this story juxtaposes with GFG - the trade's gonna be real odd.

Yeah, I don't get the whole "I don't like the way Quitely draws Cyk" thing, either. And the hospital scene? I'm not sure I get what yr moaning about at all.... Each to his own, I suppose.

That bridge...so animated.

And I lurv the thing about the wheelchair as cross. Very clever.
 
 
sleazenation
01:57 / 06.01.02
Well i'll say again the currently available proof is not conclusive and can still support a reading that charles was attacked then attempted to kill cassie in self defense.

Cassie could still feel hacked off that he was more successful in attacking his sibling than she was but what the hey.

On the white queen fron I thought it was more personality faults rather than ability faults that kept her where she was -
She refused to help jean or move forward when she had the opportunity prefering instead to get mired in her own rage and lust for vengence against cassie's faces.
 
 
UziTenenbaum
13:19 / 06.01.02
Well, actually, I think it's Charlie because he's got blue eyes. Cassie appears to have greenish ones. But that's really the only clue.

I've always stood behind the notion that identical twins could be male and female. Not that Grant positing the idea confirms it's place in reality but still, it's nice to see.
Benjamin.
 
 
Captain Zoom
13:57 / 06.01.02
I kind of thought that since mutant powers were supposed to manifest at puberty that the baby with the powers couldn't possibly be Charles. As for his attacking her, if instinctually he realized that she was a predator (as she's explained to be earlier in the series) then he got the drop on her, having woken up earlier, and took his shot. Why she didn't kill him right back is the real question.

Zoom.
 
 
Spatula Clarke
14:59 / 06.01.02
G'n'R> Good point. NXM hadn't grabbed me at all up until this issue and I was seriously considering cancelling, only holding back on doing so because of the claims that Morrison's using the first twelve months to reshape the basics of the comic before really letting loose. This issue felt, to me, less forced than the others (something yawn was talking about in another thread).
 
 
yawn - thing's buddy
19:15 / 06.01.02
really beautifully illustrated - the girls were ultra thin - idealised versions of themslves? or does the artist have a fetish for extaordinarily thin chicks? emma can look like an 80 yar old supermodel and still be a total babe.

bridge - animated - yes - genius - nuff said

interesting to see quitely's deviations from script - his superior visual awareness and economy clearly stated.

As for grant's script - a little disappointing: I'd expected more detailed arcana - and I wasn't expecting the greenaway ref. As stated above by gun runce, I too loved the dali/exploding cross/wheelchair reference: psychologically and visually it was incredibly powerful.

the intro and outro were superb. that blank corridor, those two dorks....man, the girls really do run the show.

I was expecting to read something about the fallen letters surrounding the tower, but the script was silent on this matter. shame.

the sequence with the door attacking emma and the diamond icon twinkling in victory -
supermariosonicgenius!

as for grant's scripts following this pattern flux; I'd have to say I've seen considerably denser scripts by the man (including a new xmen number). I too felt the script had been lobotomised but maybe that's a daft notion.

Yeah, this was a pretty cool issue.

Thank fuck.
 
 
Seth
20:44 / 06.01.02
Maybe Grant edited the script himself because he wanted to encourage multiple readings?
 
 
Our Lady of The Two Towers
15:13 / 07.01.02
IIRC, the 'rules' about mutant powers that were mainly made up by Claremont during his time on the comics that people liked, it was at times of great physical stress, puberty just being the most common. I think Multiple Man's poweres were supposedly on from birth, and wasn't there someone who's mutant powers only came on when they died?

Or maybe the stress of fighting caused a sudden burst of Charles' powers but they didn't come out properly until puberty.

Quite how Cassie alone can be the next stage in human evolution beyond mutants if she's Charles' twin I still don't understand...
 
 
Sax
15:21 / 07.01.02
And wasn't Hank McCoy born with fucking big feet?
 
 
Matthew Fluxington
15:48 / 07.01.02
One little craft touch I really enjoyed is that the sequence in the real world has white gutters, and the psychic sequence was all black...

I don't know about the Grant's-script-being-edited thing, because everything he would need to tell Frank seems to be there, I don't get the feeling there's anything missing. I'm sure Grant and Frank talked on the phone about the issue before and during the making of the issue, so I'm sure there's things left out there, but as far as a typed-out plot/script, it seems very complete to me.
 
 
yawn - thing's buddy
17:05 / 07.01.02
re: script.

youre probably right flux.
 
 
Matthew Fluxington
17:19 / 07.01.02
I'd also like to note that assuming the script was edited in a way is also assuming that Frank Quitely doesn't not bring any ideas to the table, that he lacks the creativity to throw in interesting little bits to the art, that Grant needs to spell EVERYTHING out for him. I don't think so...I think Frank is the perfect visual artist for Grant in that a) he can bring even Grant's most complex art ideas to life (see: the concentric circle page) and b) match the guy in terms of creativity and craft.

I hope they remain a team for many more projects to come... Besides the Authority and his very early work, has Frank even done anything without Grant?

I wish more was known about Frank Quitely - his background, his education, his tastes, what kind of art he's done before comics (it seems obvious to me that he's done other things...)...

It seems obvious what his taste in women is like though, eh?
 
 
Seth
22:13 / 07.01.02
quote:Originally posted by Flux = A Brain In Psychic Peril:
I'd also like to note that assuming the script was edited in a way is also assuming that Frank Quitely doesn't not bring any ideas to the table

I don't think anyone suggested this.

I reckon the entire sequence is more researched than the script makes out - in a lot of ways it's a natural successor to the journey that Jim Crow took to free the zombie souls in Invisibles Volume One. It's my conjecture, yeah. But pay lip service to Quitely's role? Certainly not. He's a more than adequate artist for the title, and he contributes greatly.

[ 08-01-2002: Message edited by: expressionless ]
 
 
cliff steele
00:13 / 08.01.02
Shame he can't draw faster.
 
 
yawn - thing's buddy
06:16 / 08.01.02
FQ is a glasgow boy who in his early days did promotional work for a shop called ARTSTORE in glasgow - he still does some stuff for them - I got a incredibly groovy sale poster done by him - it's of the street just outside the shop in glasgow and features a huge corwd of passers by doing the oddest things - sfuckin great!

he also did a strip called he Greens for a comic called Electric Soup, another glasgow based project.

Anyway, theres loads more....
 
 
The Natural Way
06:32 / 08.01.02
re the Cassy as next evolution thing.

I'm not sure we've seen all Charles is capable of, yet. And I'm sure Cassy'll be "beaten" by some weird integration type thing. I imagine it'll be quite moving when Cassandra finally realises she's been trying to kill her twin brother, etc.... (yes, yes... I know she already "realises", but she's not really...ummm...feeling it).

And Grant did say the end of the Cassy story might not be what some people expect.

Just throwing ideas in the air, seeing where they land...
 
 
Seth
08:55 / 08.01.02
I'm hoping it ends with a permanent sex change for Professor X, gaining Nova's powers into the bargain.
 
 
Our Lady of The Two Towers
15:08 / 08.01.02
The number of times Xavier's used his power and been stronger and stronger each time, I hope they aren't going to try and do that again "Only now do I use my power to the full, despite the millions of times my life has been in danger!"
 
 
Murray Hamhandler
09:28 / 09.01.02
I like the fact that Prof. X was intelligent enough =in the womb!= to figure out that he could use an umbilical cord as a strangling device. =That's= ingenuity.
Arthur Sudnam
 
 
Mr Tricks
09:55 / 09.01.02
yeah... each issue continues to improve!!!

While the Art was FABULOUS!!! there were some oddities...
Jean & Emma really looked like clones!!!
Emma's neck was like a foot long at some points.
The thin chick thing is certainly a Quietly main stay but at some points it was a bit much for me.

Wolvie looked great in suspenders...

The hair as Phoenix was excellent, and baised on what was said on the script, purely a Quietly contribution!!!

I read the killer fetus as prof. X. responding to the threat of his sister's potential... it would've been all to human of him to seek to kill what he didn't understand. (ala the Cassandra Nova's intro in isue 114) Perhaps his mutant power was the capacity to evolve out of that sort of mentality... this could also explain his "dream", or it could be motivated by guilt at this immature attempt at murder.
But Hey... he wasn't even born yet, talk about immature. There's a potential arguement there about his Not being socialised or moralised & thus was functioning on much more primal instincts... perhaps percieving his sister as a threat to available resourses.

Also consider that Many Mutants come in twin sets:
Quick Silver & Scarlet Witch
Northstar & Aurora
The Fenris twins . . . to name 3, Of them.

The later 2 have powers that are significantly altered by Touch. Perhaps there's a synergetic effect that occurs while Cassie & Charles are near each other, This would explain the drastic leap in her abilities while detained at the manson. As well as the Professor's relative lack of abilities.

Also the use of Color was exceptional! Especially the "half-tone" patturn to underscore the Microscopic activity happening on a cellular level!!!

Missed the "penis" bit, but I thought there was something.

figured the liquid language thing would come up in this issue...

As for the fallen letters, I would figure it relates to some of the theories GM's thrown into the invisibles about the "Alpabet spell" or the 64 letter alphabet. Perhaps the towers was a relm immune to the effects of "language."

In this same context, Emma proves immune to the severe inspection of those Cassandra/Door's vision/Lazer beams,(a reflection of her stuck-up "bitchieness") yet falls victim to the more maluable medium of language (all green & gooey Envy? Vanity?). Yet that same substance seems to be easily manipulated by Jean Grey (who in turn, was much more subject to the lazor-vision of the Cassandra Heads on the tower). Perhaps Jean as artist (building bridges) made her much more vulnerable to the severe inspection of others?

"thanks for the help Emma"

Loved that Wolverine would be reading yet obviously more comfortable with sitting & waiting (4 days of Za-Zen) while Scott can bairly keep still listening to whatever he's come accross... my guess is that he's probably buying lots of different music as a side-effect of his evolving introspection.

Wolvie's hypersences probably had him aware of the women on the other side of the door, so of course he would look up first.

& that final touch of dialogue was perfect!!!
The whole story ends with ..."we ought to talk."

quote:
Anyone notice the use of "l"'s in the script instead of apostrophes?

I noticed that, but suspect it's more a glitch in the actual font that the script was type-set in. Some font's just don't have the "'s and automaticly replace them with "l"
 
 
Sandy Haired Bruce Wayne
14:37 / 09.01.02
In recent years, Frank has drawn comics written by Mark Waid, Jamie Delano, Jen Van Meter, Bruce Jones, Robbie Morrison and Alan Grant (SCCAM Bammers Unite!), as well as the previously mentioned Millar and Morrison.

[ 09-01-2002: Message edited by: Sandy Haired Bruce Wayne ]
 
 
Matthew Fluxington
14:41 / 09.01.02
quote:Originally posted by Sandy Haired Bruce Wayne:
In recent years, Frank has drawn comics written by Mark Waid, Jamie Delano, Jen Van Meter, Bruce Jones, Robbie Morrison and Alan Grant (SCAAM Bammers Unite!), as well as the previously mentioned Millar and Morrison.

would you mind telling us which comics those may be?

He certainly has only worked with talented folks, that's really refreshing...
 
  

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