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SBR - Sex Work

 
  

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Leigh Monster loses its cool
15:47 / 05.02.07
This afternoon marks the umpteenth time I've a) thought "hm, I need money" b) begun perusing wanted ads c) come across an ad for NUDE 18+ MODELS WANTED, or NOW HIRING EROTIC DANCERS d) begun filling out an application e) thought, nah. And dropped it.

I want to do this. I'm pretty sure I do, anyway; I'm always very, very tempted and intrigued by the ads. The reasons I always end up bagging it are 1) I feel strange that it was the need for money that led me to the idea in the first place, and 2) I usually conclude that whatever is telling me it would be fun to prance around naked in public or semi-public is less important than not diappointing my family and friends.

Has anyone else ever considered this? What were your boundaries and why? did you drop it or follow through? What Where Why How? (Okay, maybe not where.)
 
 
Tryphena Absent
16:10 / 05.02.07
I'm quite interested in why you want to do it? The money thing might have led you to the idea but it's clearly not the motivating factor so what is? Maybe if you focus on that then the family thing might become more clear.
 
 
Leigh Monster loses its cool
16:14 / 05.02.07
Just because it seems like it would be fun. I suppose I like exploring sexuality and it seems like it would be interesting and new to do so outside of the bedroom, and in a more aesthetic context. I feel like I have non-perverse reasons for wanting to do it, but because the thing itself is so loaded it won't matter to anyone else what my motivations are.
 
 
Spaniel
17:12 / 05.02.07
What's wrong with having perverse reasons? Not trying to start an argument, just genuinely interested in why you'd want to divorce your motivationsfrom notions of perversity.
 
 
Leigh Monster loses its cool
17:23 / 05.02.07
hm, good question. I guess if someone were to ask me why I was working for the sex industry, I'd like to be able to say "I'm doing something I believe in and support" rather than "I'm acting self-destructively/trapped in a cycle of sexual trauma" or something like that. That is, whatever I'm doing I want to be a good representative of it.
 
 
Triplets
17:30 / 05.02.07
Laoi, it's not what people think of you, mate, it's what you think of you. In the end, you have to ask yourself:

"I'm doing something I believe in and support"

"I'm acting self-destructively/trapped in a cycle of sexual trauma"

which of these is truer. If it's more* option 2 you may want to reconsider.

*These aren't mutually exclusive, obvs.
 
 
Spaniel
17:51 / 05.02.07
I think the thing I was getting at is that perversity does not necessarily=I'm acting self-destructively/trapped in a cycle of sexual trauma

There are self-identifying perverts on Barbelith, you know.
 
 
Triplets
17:59 / 05.02.07
Barbelith has a lot of perv. It's not a bad thing.

And, just in case, I wasn't saying that you were... saying that, Bbss. One of my points was that it might be best to move out of 'potential parental shame' box.
 
 
Spaniel
18:07 / 05.02.07
Trips, I was directing that last to Laoi-the-joy, not you
 
 
Leigh Monster loses its cool
18:09 / 05.02.07
well, of course it's always a little more complicated than that. If I cheated on my SO and if I took a job at a strip club, for example, both would be equally damaging to our relationship, despite the fact that (far as I'm concerned) the cheating is by far the worse option.

I said perverse, not perverted. I readily admit to being completely perverted, and proud of it. I meant that I don't think i have perverse motives as in I'm not interested in this just for the sake of being contrary.

so....no one on barbelith has ever been a stripper or made pr0n?
 
 
ibis the being
18:27 / 05.02.07
Boy, sex work is quite a huge broad category isn't it? Which part most appeals to you might be a good place to start. I'd say nude modeling and dancing are pretty different in terms of practical considerations, safety, etc.
 
 
Spaniel
18:30 / 05.02.07
People have done sex work around here.
 
 
Leigh Monster loses its cool
18:35 / 05.02.07
yes, that's one of the things I was curious about--how people categorize this type of thing, and why. a lot of people wouldn't be thrilled with their children becoming exotic dancers, but they'd be much happier with that than if their kids became porn stars.

I'd rather dance than model, because dancing is more performative and i think the dancer has more control over the art of it than the model does. but i know some people would say that a studio is a less skeezy environment than a strip joint..
 
 
Spaniel
18:38 / 05.02.07
Out of interest have you ever been to any strip joints? Might be worth checking'em out if you plan on makinga new career for yourself
 
 
Leigh Monster loses its cool
18:42 / 05.02.07
I'd rather dance than model, because dancing is more performative and i think the dancer has more control over the art of it than the model does. but i know some people would say that a studio is a less skeezy environment than a strip joint therefore modeling is the better job.

This is one of the things I have a hard time wrapping my head around. I know that, while my family would not be thrilled if I became a stripper, they'd be much happier with that than if I became a porn star. Okay, that makes a certain sense in terms of safety. What doesn't make sense is that it doesn't really hurt anyone's feelings if i grind with a random drunk guy at a nightclub, but if I perform in an environment where no one's allowed to touch me, the fact that I took off my clothes for that performance makes me a unfit for monogamy.
 
 
Leigh Monster loses its cool
18:46 / 05.02.07
no, unfortunately not. Strip joint is one place I wouldn't want to go alone, and I don't have anyone who'll go with me. ...I do kind of assume that the strip joints I generally have local access to (in the mafia capital of the US) aren't the kind I'd envision myself working in.
 
 
Leigh Monster loses its cool
18:47 / 05.02.07
boboss--no, unfortunately not. the whole thing is something i've thought about far more than acted on in any way.
 
 
Leigh Monster loses its cool
18:47 / 05.02.07
Boboss--no, I've never been....the whole thing is something i've thought about far more than acted on in any way.
 
 
Leigh Monster loses its cool
18:50 / 05.02.07
oops. weird.

anyway. i know there must be other people who've thought about it......yeah?
 
 
Dutch
18:51 / 05.02.07
This might be kicking in an open door, but:

After you've decided you really want to go through with it, I think it might be pretty important about the feeling you get from the people/establishment that you are thinking about working for. If the strip joint for example is giving you the creeps one way or the other, or if the person hiring you seems shady in any way, it might be a good thing to swiftly walk away.

Having said this, I believe it can be a fun experience going naked in front of others, expressing one's self. Even though my personal forays into semi-public nudity have been fueled mostly by alcohol, getting past a certain amount of shame is pretty liberating.
 
 
Leigh Monster loses its cool
19:31 / 05.02.07
yeep! am i actually being encouraged to do this? how...astonishing....

i'm searching for clubs in my area right now.
 
 
Leigh Monster loses its cool
20:16 / 05.02.07
Okay, I've found three. I'll go down and check them out and see what it's like sometime this week, I think.

Do people just learn as they go? It seems like this sort of thing takes a lot of skill. How do you become qualified?
 
 
Papess
20:27 / 05.02.07
Hi there, loai. I have being doing sex work for years. If you want to PM me and ask me anything at all, I would be happy to answer your questions and give any specific advice on various areas of the industry.

I would like to mention that it would be a better attitude, as a sex worker, to not display prejudice between strippers versus porn stars, or fetish models being somehow, better than a dominatrix. It is all the same thing, it is a matter of personal boundries as to what part of the industry you would feel most comfortable.

You might want to consider how this could effect your personal life as well.

I am curious about a few things, but mostly your age and what city you are in. You don't have to answer in this thread, or at all, if you are not comfortable, but age is important, because I certainly wouldn't encourgage you if you were not of legal age of consent, and/or a minor. Your city is important because different cities (and countries) have different laws and by-laws regarding the various aspects of sex work.

In Canada, for example, prostitution is not illegal but every other act necessary, in order to conduct the business of prostitution, is.

I am a bit pressed for time, atm, but I will read over this thread thoroughly, later on.

I certainly wish you the very best in all your endeavours, loai.
 
 
ONLY NICE THINGS
20:29 / 05.02.07
Um. Have you considered, laoi, that what you want to do may not be to be a sex worker but to upset your partner? Nothing wrong with that, per se, but it might be best to go in eyes open...
 
 
Leigh Monster loses its cool
21:05 / 05.02.07
yes. i probably would have experimented with it a couple of years ago, if not for the fact that i've been in a relationship with someone who would have been upset by it. And i still don't have any plans to upset things...I just noticed that, after a few years, i still keep considering it and i still haven't gone to actually check out the scene.
 
 
Jackie Susann
22:03 / 05.02.07
I think in general it's a bad idea to get a job that will upset your partner. If you think you'd like dancing naked, why not try it for your partner? Surely they wouldn't complain about that?
 
 
Leigh Monster loses its cool
22:27 / 05.02.07
it's the difference between playing guitar in your living room and playing with your band onstage, i guess. It's hard to get the--i don't know what you call it, the "art high"--with the former.
 
 
Disco is My Class War
00:43 / 06.02.07
Hi laoi. I'm guessing from what you've said that the idea of stripping or sexwork is something like a fantasy for you, perhaps. I haven't done sexwork but I have quite a few friends who have. Having watched them do it, it seems that to 'succeed' in sexwork you have to be really grounded in the reality of what it is: ie, an exchange of money for sexually charged acts -- posing, dancing, sex. A lot of the time, sexwork doesn't seem to live up to the fantasy. People seem to spend a lot of time (sometimes years) finding the ideal place to work, and in the meantime there are a lot of sharks. You might find that the desire to be an exhibitionist is just fuelled by the work, and on the other hand, you might find that the worky nature of it kills off desire altogether.

I kinda know what you're talking about with the difference between playing the guitar at home and playing with a band onstage, though. So you're turned on by the idea of people watching you dance. So are many of us. If that's what it is -- a turn-on -- is there a way you can explore the fantasy with someone else, to make it safe for you? Ie, you might be able to tell your partner that this turns you on and include hir in the process of figuring out what you want. It's totally possible that if you told your partner that you were having desires like this, and put that on the table as 'something you'd like to explore' (even just through explaining exactly what you would want, etc) your partner might be able to go there with you. There are plenty of places to show yourself off sexily to a crowd without the added requirement of having to earn money from it.

Good luck out there.
 
 
ibis the being
02:20 / 06.02.07
Does any job live up to the fantasy? All work is work in the end... if you are overly romanticizing any job it's bound to disappoint you. The key to choosing a job, rather like choosing a life partner or for that matter a dog, is to choose one whose downsides you can accept.

That'll be 5 cents please.
 
 
*
02:56 / 06.02.07
Jackie Susann, why is it necessarily a bad idea to get a job that will upset your partner?

To divorce this from sex work a little bit... one of my friends is a scientist. She works at a lab, doing heart surgeries on helpless animals, to learn more about how surgeons should be doing heart surgeries on humans. She enjoys this work and thinks it's a good thing to be doing. Her husband? A vegan animal rights activist who believes that ANY animal experimentation is unethical, let alone those that cause some suffering and a substantial number of deaths. Yeah it's something that challenges their relationship, but, and this is important, her husband doesn't own her. She believes this work is good and important, and it's important to her. He believes it's wrong and evil, but that it's important to her, and that she has the right to make her own ethical decisions. To me that's a lot harder to reconcile than "I don't want you to be doing sex work because I think it's dangerous/think you'll cheat on me/can't get over the idea of other people looking at you like that," which should be something people in a strong relationship can negotiate about.

I've done photo pr0ns, a friend of mine has done pro-dom work, I've considered pro-dom work and erotic massage. I think there are loads of healthy reasons to do sex work, and there are loads of unhealthy ones. When I did photo pr0ns, it was unhealthy for me. I think I'm in a much healthier place now, so that if I did decide to do erotic massage or similar I'd be more comfortable with it and I think it wouldn't damage me emotionally as much. But I still don't think it would be a good thing for me. Even though I'm a lot more comfortable with my body and my sexuality, and (consequently?) much more comfortable with other people's bodies, I'm still not totally there yet in terms of not having my self-worth bound up in the ability to make other people happy, which I think is particularly important in sexwork.
 
 
Evil Scientist
06:59 / 06.02.07
I think that's a good point m.r.i.

The important thing is that both partners show each other the same amount of respect. So whilst one shouldn't feel obliged to not do something because the partner may not approve it also follows that the partner's feelings on the matter be taken into account.

Relationships do involve a certain amount of compromise.

I think the important thing is honesty. If my SO said to me "I want to do (x), I know you don't approve but it's something I feel I need to do and I would appreciate your support." then I would certainly prefer that to finding out weeks later that my opinion/feelings were of little or no consequence to my SO.
 
 
Ganesh
08:05 / 06.02.07
Jackie Susann, why is it necessarily a bad idea to get a job that will upset your partner?

I think he said "in general" rather than "necessarily" - but yes, I agree with your main point. There are doubtless many graded staging posts along the Continuum Of Upset, though, and I suppose I'd modify Jackie's assertion to suggest that getting a job which one knows will make one's partner sexually unhappy/insecure is a risk which isn't always easy to calculate. Doesn't necessarily mean it's a bad idea, of course.
 
 
Leigh Monster loses its cool
12:00 / 06.02.07
Disco is my Class WarI'm guessing from what you've said that the idea of stripping or sexwork is something like a fantasy for you, perhaps. I haven't done sexwork but I have quite a few friends who have. Having watched them do it, it seems that to 'succeed' in sexwork you have to be really grounded in the reality of what it is: ie, an exchange of money for sexually charged acts

Hm. It's a fantasy the way that being a rock star or playing in an orchestra is a fantasy (not a sexual turn-on). Money becomes a harsh reality factor to anyone who's romantic about their work; at some point the writer, or the painter, or the scientist is going to have to decide how much they're going to focus on making money and how much they're going to do their own thing, even if their own thing isn't what's lucrative/expected of them. Maybe the idealist who succeeds in the sex industry is rarer than the idealist who succeeds in the music industry, just because of the nature of the field, but i don't think either case should suggest that it's not worth a shot.

ibis j. craneDoes any job live up to the fantasy? All work is work in the end... if you are overly romanticizing any job it's bound to disappoint you.

mm...all work is work, but hopefully at the point that you stop enjoying the work or believing in it, you quit the job or change your approach?
 
 
Papess
13:16 / 06.02.07
Other than one's family, the reactions from everyone else you meet can be quite varied and sometimes, quite prejudice. People start to treat you differently. I have had friends who refused to accept gifts from me because of the manner in which I earned the funds with which to buy it. Sometimes being a sex worker can feel like being the butt of a joke. I suppose there are lawyers out there who might encounter this, as well. It is by it's very nature, a provocative occupation. I will expand more on how to deal with relationships, as I would like to give it more thought. It is very important what attitude you take on approaching this kind of work. That can be the deciding factor of your success. You also have to decide what you want out of it.

Since you are just starting out, I would advise you make a one, two...five year plan, whatever suits your needs, and create goals for yourself. Those could be financial, but also you could have spiritual, mental, or emotional goals or challenges you would like to confront and overcome. This will give you focus, and I suspect that being questioned a little by your fellow 'lithers will help you to come to these decisions. That is a good thing, as there is much to distract a person in the sex industry from their purpose. If you are a practitioner, or spiritual, or religious, you may want to use some protection, as the energies in a club can be extreme. If you can always be centered and focused when you go in the club, you will do fabulous.

Specifically on stripping, or (as I prefer), erotic dancing or adult entertainer, (Exotic? I feel like an endangered species from a tropical forest! Or a fruit beverage! UGH!), I would like to quote from a book I just read about one woman, Sarah Katherine Lewis, and her experience in the sex industry:

"Stripping is pretty much like having a compulsive gambling problem. The hope of payoff always keeps you coming back, no matter how many times you play and lose to the house. Because we don't make an hourly wage or salary, every shift we work is a game of chance: You could come in, get in costume and makeup, and sit there all day without doing any business at all. But when you're hot, you're hot-and a good hit keeps you coming back the next day, hoping to turn your one shot success into a roll of good fortune." - from "Indecent - How I Make it and Fake it as a Girl for Hire" by: Sarah Katherine Lewis, page 186.

I believe Lewis is from Seattle and also has worked in New Orleans, according to the bio.

That paragraph hit home for me.

There is more support now for sex workers, because the working environment can be very harsh, as is the case in all sex work.

As a sex worker, our society and the industry itself tells us we are bad, and expendable. (Gee, I could have been the 50th.) Not everyone, of course, feels that way; certainly not overtly, but realise that as a sex worker you represent something pretty powerful, and many people have issues with their sexuality. That is reflected in our society by the lack of consideration given to the working conditions and dignity of sex work and the workers. If you choose to be open to people about it, be prepared for the variety of responses you will get. Some are pretty cool, others are quite negative, and some people just get plain nervous. Try not to personalize it because it is always more about them than you, and keep your eye on your goals.
 
 
grant
13:56 / 06.02.07
Here's an old Switchboard thread where I started tacking up sex industry memoirs, starting with "Notes from the Catwalk," which is plain good writing.

Check 'em out.
 
  

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