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Runes: making and using a set.

 
  

Page: 12(3)4

 
 
Unconditional Love
13:32 / 05.10.05
Is there a base character similar to a bind rune from which all the other runes can be birthed from?
 
 
grant
13:40 / 05.10.05
If runes were used to support houses, that might explain the lack of horizontal lines.

I suppose a house-shape might contain all the runes, then? I mean, besides the flashing and lintel....
 
 
Less searchable M0rd4nt
13:59 / 05.10.05
Is there a base character similar to a bind rune from which all the other runes can be birthed from?

The bindrune of the entire Elder Futhark? (You can see one version of this here)
 
 
Unconditional Love
14:00 / 05.10.05
This might be useful

I enjoyed reading it and it certainly opened my mind to possible conceptions of how the runes represent the worlds and the respective powers.
 
 
Unconditional Love
14:03 / 05.10.05
I see, thats one of his i havent read yet, so the web of the wyrd, which is what immediately comes to mind upon seeing that, odin hanging from the tree stareing into the well(web) of the wyrd.
 
 
Less searchable M0rd4nt
14:07 / 05.10.05
If runes were used to support houses, that might explain the lack of horizontal lines.

Also: Verticals and diagonals are easier to carve. Downward strokes can be used in each case. Interestingly I've always felt a strong energy flow in the runes along those directions: they seem to beg to be written or traced top-to-bottom.
 
 
Quantum
14:13 / 05.10.05
I thought you were *only* supposed to do them top to bottom?
 
 
Less searchable M0rd4nt
14:16 / 05.10.05
Yeah, that seems to be what the books say--but even when I was starting out as a kid and had nothing but Tolkein and one chapter of some shitty remaindered flff-text to go on, I still found I wanted to draw them top to bottom. It's a sort of instinct, I think; they seem to pull you that way.
 
 
grant
14:30 / 05.10.05
That bindrune reminds me of 1. wicker-making (and probably thatching/weaving/whatever else) and 2. the feng shui square, which is a grid divided into nine portions.
 
 
Sekhmet
15:26 / 05.10.05
Is there any other "version" of that bindrune?

I know whan I sat down and tried to create one, that grid-butterfly shape is exactly what I ended up with. I suppose you could make something else if you wasted some extra lines, but I think that really is the simplest form of the whole-futhark bindrune.
 
 
Less searchable M0rd4nt
15:40 / 05.10.05
I suppose you could sort of collapse it down, so that no line is duplicated--verticals on top of verticals, diagonals on top of diagonals. Then I guess you'd end up with that alternate "snowflake" form of Hagalaz (see here).
 
 
Sekhmet
16:36 / 05.10.05
But that wouldn't accomodate, say, sowiluz, or berkana, unless you're actually taking the runes apart...
 
 
Sekhmet
17:56 / 05.10.05
Never mind. I think I see what you mean, having re-read your post a few times...

If you're going that far, though, you might as well collapse them all into their basic component - the straight line.

Isa as a bindrune. Imagine it.
 
 
Less searchable M0rd4nt
19:45 / 05.10.05
Everything, all the potential of the other signs, frozen into a single stark line, like a crack in the ice. Ooo.
 
 
Sekhmet
20:47 / 05.10.05
Another thought: All the runes are formed out of upright staves (isa) and/or some combination of diagonals (part or parts of sowilu).

Isa + sowilu = ice + fire = Niflheim + Muspellheim... Being begins in Ginnungagap...
 
 
Unconditional Love
21:03 / 05.10.05
i just had a shock wolfsangel

I was looking for more info about bind runes, i took the original name from a hakim bey piece, but this certainly puts it in a different light.
 
 
Unconditional Love
21:14 / 05.10.05
Another example of a bind rune that allegedly contains the other characters.

Call me superstituous but i aint changin my name back to that when i get the chance.
 
 
grant
16:05 / 11.10.05
You might be interested in this Northumbrian rune I came across and stuck in the Anglo-Saxon rune thread.

It's Gar, and some folks say it contains all the others in it.
 
 
Less searchable M0rd4nt
08:09 / 12.10.05
Gar really pings for some reason.

Actually it may be very helpful for a project I've got on the boil at the moment: trying to find a Northern-trad substitute for the LBRP. I <3 the LBRP and I was doing it pretty much every day at one point, but I've been politely dissuaded from doing so at the moment and sent off to find a rune-based alternative. Gar might be the nucleus I've been looking for.
 
 
Less searchable M0rd4nt
18:00 / 12.10.05
(Actually, I'm really fucking fed up with this whole "stop using the LBRP and do something with runes instead" kick. LBRP-a-likes are never as good as the real thing. It's like trying to use a flint handaxe when you've got a perfectly good chainsaw in the garage.)
 
 
rising and revolving
18:38 / 12.10.05
What are you looking for? I mean, are you looking for a Northern way of marking the opening/closing of rites, or a purification, or a multipurpose banishing / invoking? Do you use the invoking forms of the LBRP? How about the BRH?

Gah, this sounds like badgering, when really I'm mainly curious - and wondering what the gap is in your current practice (which seems pretty solid) that needs an LBRP (or similar).
 
 
Less searchable M0rd4nt
19:43 / 12.10.05
It's difficult to describe exactly what I got out of it... something like a quick jog in the park and a nice hot shower for the spirit. During the periods where I've used it regularly, it seemed to get my psychic muscles in tone and keep my head clear of fuzzy stuff.

The guys I'm working with at the moment don't like being banished and look at me funny if I try, but I was hoping to maintain the rite as part of my secular practice.

(Of course, the problem with that is that I essentially don't have a secular practice anymore. My magical life has been pretty comprehensively glomphed.)
 
 
Unconditional Love
20:52 / 12.10.05
Gungnir (Scandinavian) (from gunga to swing)

In Norse myths, the spear wrought for Allfather Odin by the giant-god Loki and the dwarf Dvalin. The name seems an allusion to alternating opposites, such as activity and rest, or spirituality and materiality.

Gullveig (thirst for gold, wisdom) was transfixed on it and burned, "thrice burned and thrice reborn, again and again, yet still she lives." It was then that Odin hurled his spear into the throng of gods, thus instigating the war in heaven which caused the aesir (active gods) to be ousted from Asgard, leaving the vanir in possession of their heavenly abode.

The vanir are "water gods": cosmic deities having reference to the mystic void, the waters of space. The vanir do not participate directly in our system of worlds, whereas the aesir are the creative powers in our universe and dwell in its globes, seen and unseen.


Pulled from a theosophy dictionary.

Gungnir, the spear of Óðinn, the weapon of consciousness, is vibrations, all-natural comencement of a creation
 
 
Less searchable M0rd4nt
21:14 / 12.10.05
Beg pardon, but this: It was then that Odin hurled his spear into the throng of gods, thus instigating the war in heaven which caused the aesir (active gods) to be ousted from Asgard, leaving the vanir in possession of their heavenly abode.

The vanir are "water gods": cosmic deities having reference to the mystic void, the waters of space. The vanir do not participate directly in our system of worlds, whereas the aesir are the creative powers in our universe and dwell in its globes, seen and unseen
--is a crock of shite.

Nowhere in the lore does it say that the Aesir got kicked out of Asgard by the Vanir. They swapped a few hostages, there was that unfortunate business with Mimir, and then they made up. The Vanir Njord, Frey and Freyja all live in Asgard alongside the Aesir.

The Vanir are not "water Gods." This is an unfounded bullhit attribution made by people who want the Northern cosmology to map neatly onto the model they happen to favour. The Vanir represent the interface between humans and the world of growing things; historically and in legend, they are associated with farming, animal husbandry, and fishing. They could not be any more intimately associated with our "system of worlds"! Good grief.
 
 
Sekhmet
12:45 / 13.10.05
Maybe a theosophy dictionary isn't the best place to be looking up Northern trad references...
 
 
Unconditional Love
18:44 / 13.10.05
your very right it isnt, those two were the only links not repeating info already given by others. The water stuff sounded very made up as did the vanir stuff. in retro spect it wasnt approproate.
 
 
Less searchable M0rd4nt
15:24 / 14.10.05
(Sorry if I came off as scratchy there, I was in a funny mood.)
 
 
Unconditional Love
17:29 / 14.10.05
No problem, it made me stop and think, about my addiction to googilism cut and paste and links. Not getting much done at the moment and i have other things that i really should attend to, so its very timely.
 
 
Less searchable M0rd4nt
06:06 / 19.11.05
I was just wondering if anyone had done any more work with the runic spirit-house concept. Bard? Anyone?
 
 
Bard: One-Man Humaton Hoedown
04:02 / 20.11.05
Did some work with it tongiht. Got MUCH better results.

I started by laying out an offering (bread, fruit, honey, wine, pure water, milk), and basically inviting the goddesses that I normally deal with (Brigid, Minerva, Athena to a lesser extent mainly because I haven't had any big moments with her as with the other two) to ask them for their blessing and assistance. Not something I normally do, but I had this feeling that it was appropriate.

I laid out six runes in total, in order: hagalaz, sowulo, mannaz, perf(p), ingus, kenaz. I drew them randomly from the bag, becuase I was really trying to get a random interplay rather than a tight formation. According to the book I have here, though, 3-4 of them are directly related to healing, and apparently hagalaz CAN be used for healing IF its healing through destruction.

The first three were in a triangle in the "center" of the house, and seemed to sit there pretty firmly. The house seemed to waver a bit around them, but the runes themselves remained firm.

Perf(p, not entirely sure what the letter is) was placed next in a seperate area at the bottom, with several sticks hovering directly over it. The minute it was in place the house seemed to firm up and stop moving. It was interesting to note that the "roof" near hagalaz was still a bit insubstantial, as if it was barely containing the rune.

I then formed a "room" off to the left, in which I drew ingus and kenaz. The house became pretty solid then, and even the "roof" over hagalaz firmed up and stopped wavering. Everything seemed to click together pretty well, though I kept getting the impression that hagalaz was the "alpha" rune in the bunch. Not entirely sure why.

I have a few photographs of the whole thing at its completition.

Gave thanks where thanks was due for assistance, and that was that.
 
 
Less searchable M0rd4nt
06:50 / 20.11.05
I take it you drew the runes you used at random rather than selecting them specifically? Interesting combination.
 
 
Less searchable M0rd4nt
07:22 / 20.11.05
Also, I'm interested in the Goddesses you invited in to assist with the working. I'd certainly support the idea of working with the Goddesses that you've already built a good relationship with for the time being, even if they're not directly connected with runic magic. If you're planning to work with the runes in a deep and long-term way, though, it might be wise to consider approaching one or other of the associated pantheon at some point.

Odin is the obvious being to petition for aid with the runes, of course, but if you're more accustomed to working with female deities you may want to approach Freyja instead. She's also very wise in magic and runecraft. (Hela, too, but you're probably better off waiting to see if She comes to you rather than you going to Her.)
 
 
Bard: One-Man Humaton Hoedown
16:44 / 20.11.05
So far my general practice for seeing which deities were interested in working with me has been to let them come to me. I've told the Brigid story several times, and Minerva decided to whack me upside the head when I was in Bath.

But you ARE right, Mordant. I should make an effort to contact one of the Aesir related to the runes.

If I may ask, what's your iterpretation of the runes I drew? Yes, I did pick them out of the bag specifically.
 
 
Less searchable M0rd4nt
14:05 / 22.11.05
If I may ask, what's your iterpretation of the runes I drew?

To kick off: I'm interested that you drew Hagalaz and that you relate it to healing-from-destruction.
I hadn't really looked at that angle much, since this rune is associated very strongly with destruction in my mind--I guess, however, that it could be employed to create a form of catharsis. In divination Hagalaz can presage destruction and in magic it can be used to create powerful negative effects, but it's not an "evil" rune. There are no "evil" runes. It's more of a force of nature: big smashy hailstorm trashes your harvest, but it didn't do it on purpose (and also melts into fertilizing water).

More to come...
 
 
Bard: One-Man Humaton Hoedown
20:21 / 22.11.05
It was pointed out in one of the rune books I have, and when I think about it a LOT of modern western medicine is based on healing-through-destruction. Surgery, chemotherapy, radiation therapy, antibiotics its all directly attacking the disease from an exterior destructive source.
 
  

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