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Underground > Books, Criticism & Writing >

Dan Simmons

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15:25 / 15.06.05

I'm currently reading Dan Simmons' epic Carrion Comfort and I am also patiently waiting for the paperback of Ilium.

This guy seems to have his finger in almost every literary pie except the bland "social novel" pie and the "dysfunctional family, but we still love them" pie. Simmons has won a slew of awards, most notably for his novel Song of Kali.

Dan Simmons is also the author of the Hyperion Cantos. The covers being right here:

Here's a picture of him with Stephen King:

(That's Dan on the right)

Anyway, so I'd like anybody and everybody to discuss the extremely talented and award-winning author Dan Simmons

STOATIE LIEKS CHOCOLATE MILK

19:52 / 15.06.05

The Hyperion Cantos are among my favourite ever science fiction- I thought they were losing it a bit by volume three, but hang on in there and they REALLY get going again in a major way before the end of volume 4.

The only horror fiction I've read of his was Children Of The Night, which was just awful, imho- it just seemed terribly cheesy, and not even as well-written as I know he's capable of. (Maybe I was in the wrong mood and need to give it another go). I'm tempted to give Song Of Kali a go, but worried it'll be like Children Of The Night.

Ilium I liked a lot- not as much as the Hyperions, but it had some glorious ideas in it, and I've just bought the sequel, Olympos, which I intend to get stuck into in the enxt few days.

But Hyperion, man... what's not to like about those? They're epic, funny, heart-breaking, stirring, thought-provoking... everything a big SF series should be. They're utterly wonderful.

Keith, like a scientist

04:27 / 16.06.05

mentioned this in the other topic, but i just finished the Cantos, and would say that I like the last two a lot more than first two.

I think Aenea was maybe a bit TOO messiah...but didn't bother me too much. My big problem is the typical anime lynchpin plot point...er, not sure if spoilers are ok, but i would like to discuss the Hyperion concept with some people...

Keith, like a scientist

17:20 / 07.07.05

i'm almost finished with Ilium, and I feel like this series of books is going to need it's own thread for discussion. I've gotta say I'm really impressed with it, so much that I guess I'm gonna have to buy the Olympos hardcover right away.

00:21 / 08.07.05

I have only read the Hyperion books and one of his Horror books.

I loved the Hyperion series, but the quality starts going down after the first book. I never finished the horror one. Can't remember the name, but it starts with some kids going around in bikes, and then someone gets killed inside a school, and by then I was already snoring so that's as far as I went.

15:10 / 08.07.05

It's called Children of Night. Yeah, it's not the greatest horror novel ever written.

15:13 / 08.07.05

If you're going to read his horror stuff, read Carrion Comfort, which is this 900 page monster about a hidden war between humans who have the power to control people with psychic powers. It's very epic and very massive. If I were a Hollywood producer pitching it, I'd say "It's John LeCarre meets Stephen King meets Neal Stephenson"

The other horror novel by Dan I'd recommend is Song of Kali, which was the first novel to garner the man a boatload of awards.

Keith, like a scientist

15:26 / 08.07.05

damn. Carrion Comfort sounds cool as hell.

It's horror, though? Sounds more SF.

Sjaak at the Shoe Shop

07:08 / 13.07.05

I tend to agree with Juan, that the Hyperion cycle goes down a bit towards the end. I mean that it starts off conceptually very strong, both on a grand scale (Ousters vs 'traditional humans' is a nice touch, adapt yourself or your environment, and also touching on the question 'what is humanity? is there a stagnant benchmark) and on a small scale on Hyperion, with the Shrike, Mad King Billy etc.

Its been a while since I read the Endymion books, I still recall that although enjoyable they were not so impressive. The bit that really hurt was the Frank Lloyd Wright references, architecture can be interesting but IMHO that did not really live up to the standard of the rest of the series, and felt out of tune.

From the awesome Shrike to Frank Lloyd Wright, a mere mortal, that more or less sums it up for me.

I read Illium and enjoyed it, I just hope the story is not going to wander off in the sequel. which is not available yet here, unfortunately.

Keith, like a scientist

12:21 / 13.07.05

i enjoyed the Endymion books because i felt more humanity and personal connection than I did with the often distant and cold Hyperion books. Raul was an interesting, very real, person. the Hyperion characters all seemed to be quick sketches of 'cool' characters that left me now really caring much about them.

Ilium is like the Endymion books in that aspect. the characters come alive, especially Hockenberry.

of course, it both instances, it's because of the first person narrative. Olympos is shirking that perspective, unfortunately, but it's still retaining my interest.

16:35 / 14.07.05

I made a mistake earlier. I wrote that the book was called Children of Night when it should read Summer of Night.

20:31 / 14.07.05

That would explain why the title of my copy of the book roughly translates to English as Scary Summer.

STOATIE LIEKS CHOCOLATE MILK

08:29 / 15.07.05

Yes, I thought that description didn't really match with my memories of Children Of The Night, which begins with a kid being adopted from post-Ceaucescu Romania.

15:00 / 15.07.05

Children of Night is Dan Simmons' attempt at the vampire while Summer of Night is his sort of "IT" type book. Growing up and facing evils, etc.

02:30 / 17.07.05

The Shrike is a favourite at the Spacebattles V.S. forums (you know, where they discuss the Big Questions, like if pirates and ninjas fought on a pirate ship, who would win, and could a dobermann beat a dobermann's weight in chihuahuas?), where is is generally understood that the only guys who could kick its ass are Son Goku and Pre-Crisis Superman. Pointy, pointy.

Keith, like a scientist

02:23 / 01.08.05

i finished Olympos a couple weeks back. anyone care to discuss this and Ilium? I confess some of that shit went right over my head. I think I "got" the story, but it's quite dense, and I feel like there may have been aspects that I completely haven't figured out.

21:24 / 05.08.05

I actually quite liked Summer of Night, mainly for the whole stuff taking place in the cornfields, which I thought was very well writen, and also for the moment when one of the kids goes down into the flooded basement and a body floats up and hits him, opening its eyes just as his torch dies. I thought it was almost cinematic in its style, but was a little overlong. Haven't read it for about twelve years or something so might be wrong.

12:02 / 22.08.05

Ilium/Olympos: I feel like there may have been aspects that I completely haven't figured out.

I'm with you so far on that. Admittedly, I've only read Ilium so far but that was such a hotch-potch of ideas that I couldn't decide if it was clever or flawed. If Olympos goes any way towards deciding that then it'll be worth the admission price.

Keith, like a scientist

13:06 / 22.08.05

there is a lot of science/pseudo-science, and science has never been my strong suit, so I'm sure I missed a lot of the technological stuff in the storyline.

overall, i loved the story and the characters...and mostly understood it, but i just have this nagging feeling i missed some of the more subtle stuff.

Sjaak at the Shoe Shop

10:37 / 23.08.05

Just finished Olympos, I liked it. Much is left unexplained, which is fine by me (actually I like that), but I also feel there are a couple of possible flaws. Especially towards the end, and the epilogue part seems a bit off.

So all in all I enjoyed it tremendously but the aftertaste was turned a bit sour. To name a few:

WARNING!! SPOILERS!!

Hockenberry talking to Mahnmut about his space travel with the moravecs to Mars.

the ancient greeks able to fax (in the epilogue) while this should only work for the 1 million people stored in the databanks

Ending with a 21th century capitalist/democratic society actually based on money (with Hannah the first millionaire..)

And why was Harman sent across the Atlantic breach? What was the point of him discovering the sub? Only to bring back the knowledge of the human race trying to destroy itself? doesn't make sense to me.

Also have quite a couple of questions about the QT stuff. Apparently time travel is not possible, but Braneholes were found to other universes that could be found as they were already 'imagined' by writers. So if I understand correctly the terraformed Mars was exchanged from another universe?? This should cause a disturbance much bigger than what the Moravecs are worried about..

Also the Moravecs pinpoint the center of quantum activity near earth. But who or what then? The only candidates are Prospero, Sycorax, or the fax network. And faxnodes can remain operational without problem. Or is it Setebos? but what disturbance does he cause?
Voynix activity is attributed to Setebos, but that starts way before Setebos is coming to earth, but immediately after the fall of the space station?
Etc

So maybe many of the explanations provided in the book are not correct (as they are given by various persons such as Prospero who may well be lying, or Orpho who may be interpreting incorrectly). But somehow I don't have the feeling that is the case. Or am I completely mistaken?

15:41 / 24.08.05

Weird this should get bumped just as I finished Endymion, started Rise of Endymion.

They're not nearly as satisfying as the Hyperion books -- I keep getting the feeling that some of the stuff is just Simmons copying out whatever "brainy" books he happens to be leafing through at the time -- Teilhard de Chardin's theology, quantum physics texts on Planck-length space, the procedures for electing a pope, whatever else.

He does combine them rather well... it's quality space opera, no doubt. I just haven't quite gotten that "literature" feel from these books. Yet, I should say -- I've only started RoE, and am still in the "catch-up" bit in the beginning.

Loved the application of the cruciform resurrection parasite to faster-than-light travel. Makes me wonder if there'll be black holes transited in this book.

01:25 / 27.09.05

Olympos is getting Simmons' best reviews of his career/
Where does he go from here?/
Why, he writes a novel called The Terror/
Could that title be any rarer?/

Keith, like a scientist

02:40 / 27.09.05

I preferred Illium as a novel, but both books together form one incredible story.

01:47 / 12.10.05

I'm about two hundred pages into Rise of Endymion now and I have to say - I'm bored. The precursor to this, Endymion was much more fun to read. Both of them, however, do not hold a candle to The Fall of Hyperion which I read in three days. It was one of the fastest reads of my life. (The fastest, believe-it-or-not, was Airframe by Michael Crichton. I was, like, sixteen. What did I know?)

Can't wait to start Ilium after this. I hope to receive the hardcover copy of Olympos for my birthday coming up in a month (WISH)

14:58 / 12.10.05

Rise of Endymion does suffer from a lot of wishy-washiness, but it ends really well, I thought.

15:36 / 12.10.05

Airframe? oy.

STOATIE LIEKS CHOCOLATE MILK

17:29 / 12.10.05

Yeah, stick with Rise... as grant says, it gets fantastic by the end. Agree that The Fall Of Hyperion is the best of the bunch, though.

04:04 / 01.11.05

Yeah, I finished Rise of Endymion. Can we discuss? I'm still a little confused on the origin of the Shrike, the origin of the labyrinths and the Technocore's ultimate fate.

But I liked the ending.

So, can anybody help me?

19:57 / 01.11.05

SPOILERS:
Ultimates have won -- they designed the Shrike and the labyrinths at some future point (or distant point in space -- the time travel thing might be irrelevant) to shelter & guard the nascent Messiah and help spread her freaky DNA/mental signal through all the occupied planets. Other Technocore elements may have tried to hijack the tech or outdo it with the Nemes-type anti-shrike constructs, but they didn't succeed.

20:56 / 01.11.05

I was flirting with the idea that Nemes and her siblings were Shrikes...

02:43 / 18.11.05

Just finished Ilium today. Man that was exciting. At the very end when Zeus says "Any last words before I make your species extinct" and Achilles looks back over his army of Greeks, Trojans, moravecs, scholics, and he turns back to Zeus and says, "Surrender and we'll let you live as our servants." Oh the huevos of steel, my friends. I am starting Olympos after I finish typing this.

I'm a hundred and fifty pages into Darwin's Blade, which is about a vehicular accident reconstructionist who is being pursued by the Russian Mafia. It is terrific. Simmons has the gift of being able to make any science or concept easily understood and within context. In this book, the amount of detail concerning physics and vehicles and weapons and everything is astonishing, but never does he make it seem like a textbook - it always flows.

Keith, like a scientist

03:54 / 18.11.05

Just finished Ilium today. Man that was exciting. At the very end when Zeus says "Any last words before I make your species extinct" and Achilles looks back over his army of Greeks, Trojans, moravecs, scholics, and he turns back to Zeus and says, "Surrender and we'll let you live as our servants." Oh the huevos of steel, my friends. I am starting Olympos after I finish typing this.

The actual quote is even better, so I'm typing it here:
"Surrender now," says Achilles, "and we'll spare your goddesses's lives so that they can be our slaves and courtesans."

It's just, like, Rock On, you macho man, Achilles. Stick your finger in the air!

Yeah, sure, it's totally macho and pretty misogynistic (er...deigynistic?), but fuck, screw Zeus!

I was extremely exhilarated by Ilium towards the end. Olympos didn't quite live up to it for me, but post back when you've read that one! I'm curious to hear what others think of it.

13:25 / 12.01.06

THE TERROR Sells to Little, Brown. Slated for Jan., 2007, Publication

Click here for Chapter One.

15:14 / 06.04.06

Hyperion ranks with 1984 for me. Fall of Hyperion seemed to loose some of the original's impact even if it is supposed to be the second half of a long novel. Will get to the Endymion books later. Galactic civilization, AIs and messaiahs.
Have tried the Summer of the Night but misplaced the book. It was interesting so far. Rural children horror.
Have read Carrion Comfort. Interesting but a bit over-rated for its length. Vampire society legacy.
Have read part of his first short story collection. The AIDS horror story is unforgettable.
Have read Hollow Man. Short but effective novel with a seemingly misplaced horror chapter in this SF novel about telepaths.
Have his nonfiction astronaut novel that I haven't started.
He is my favorite writer. Will read all his works given time.

15:44 / 06.04.06

Mind telling us why you love Hyperion so much?

Also, as some people attest above, Endymion is better in some ways than Hyperion. It's a lot tighter as a novel (even though it's two) and it overturns quite a bit of what happens in Fall of Hyperion. But in a good way.

Personally, I thought Hyperion moved slow and Fall of Hyperion moved like a freight train. It was one of the quickest reads EVER for me.

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