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What do you want?

  
  

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electric monk
18:38 / 07.11.04
1. I post (& lurk) because I need a sounding board and a working group and the Temple is the most agreeable interactive source I have found.

2. I expect to bring to myself a sense of completeness, and to become more useful in my community.

3. I'm not playing. Even so, sometimes I gotta laugh.

4. I expect to get a more well-rounded view of existence and it's inner workings.

5. I think it's leading to a view of reality from a "higher" perspecitve.

6. Yes, I do practice what I understand to be magic.

7. I persist because it works for me.

8. I am absolutely trying to prove something to myself.

9. Yes, I am satisfied with what I have understood to be verification.

10. I feel confident that I will know what to do when the time is right.

11. Yes, this work will most likely last the rest of my life.

12. In 20 years? Perhaps reading Tarot cards for a steady stream of customers. In 50 years? Perhaps I'll have crossed the Abyss.

13. My goals are to raise a family, and to benefit my community.

14. I use magic to balance and improve myself, and to aid others. I believe this will help me attain my goals.

15. The only concrete evidence I have is myself. I am happier now than I was before I started practicing. I am also better prepared for challenges.

16. I believe magic has an important part to play in my future, and that it will be brighter because of that.

17. Magic is my spirituality. It will be part of what sustains me through what may come.

18. I honestly don't know.

19. See here

20. Coming out as a magician to my co-workers.

21. What I want is for each one of us to accept that beliefs can only ever be a personal relationship between one person and the Divine. No one has a right to judge another's belief.

22. See #19
 
 
SteppersFan
19:36 / 07.11.04
The "the pretend its not a part of me and it will go away approach to life" is precisely what I was not advocating.

I objected to:
"one should constantly be dealing with the worst aspects of one’s self"

... with the emphasis on the word constantly. And, I think, worst. You've rolled back your position somewhat, but my critique of the original proposition still stands.

In any event, I think the idea that it's somehow magickally empowering and psychically strengthening to fantasise, whether constantly or not, on the rape and murder of children, is absolute tosh. It's not going to be therapeutic. It's not going to bring out inner fears and anxieties or the rejected self. And if that's what one's magical objective is -- and it's a good one -- there are lots of much better techniques that will facilitate it.

Fantasising about the rape and murder of children sounds like Whitehouse fans proving how Cold, Hard and Black they are. Think about it: are these fantasies really the best, most productive thing you can put your magical desires? Is that really what you want to bring into your world?

It's not, is it?
 
 
Boy in a Suitcase
20:26 / 07.11.04
So why are you posting here?

Addiction. I came to the age of intellectual curiosty/outsiderdom shortly after AL Gore invented the Internet and was convinced that we were all going to shortly enter thee Mondo post-historical tantrik megaliberation of endless sex with PVC-wearing babes with blue hair and Vin Diesel-style boddhisatva warriors. Despite all the evidence to the contrary I still can't quite shake this early sexual identity formation. ALso, it is my firm conviction that magick only becomes "real" when it is being discussed by two or more people who have individual experience of it (chew on that - "wherever three or more of you are I am among you" or summink like that) - actually this is best left as an unspoken assumption. The chatter can be distracting. It is us. I hardly ever post to Barbelith outside the Temple but come around because I have several friends here who I value conversation/presence with in real life and want to see what they're up to in the "public occult sphere."

What do you expect to accomplish with all of this magic and spirituality bullshit?

I want to be invited to the best party with the smartest, coolest and best-dressed people on earth. I want to define my life in the most exciting terms possible. Succeed beyond all expectations at Man's Cosmic Game. Avoid boredom. Get high without having to pay $$. Be More Human. Meet aliens.

What the fuck are you playing at?

Man's Cosmic Game

Where do you think it's leading?

Truth in Silence

What do you expect to get from it?

A fun ride

Do you practice something that you call magic?

Magic is a type of life you lead. End of story.

Whatever you focus on shall be seen.

Why are you persisting with it?

THE RESULTS. Also, it is impossible to give up. (Sleight-of-mind principle of "when you're not focusing on it is when it happens.") And the fucking horizons keep expanding and I keep realizing what an uneducated iidjit I am at the whole biz.

Are you trying to prove something to yourself?

Yes. "I'm special - right? Right? Riiiight???"

Have you already proven something to your own satisfaction?

Absolutely. Not so much the reality of magic but the irreality of everything else in comparison.

If so, where do you now intend to take it?

Aleister Crowley said that even the best magician is just an artist-in-training in "Eight Lectures on Yoga," interpret that how thou wilt but I want to engage in a process of mastering and then continually moving away from the schematics and "rules" of magic into a free-flowing art that it is no longer necessary to call magic. Ultimately I'll probably end up writing children's books since this would IMO be the ULTIMATE expression of the "alchemical conspiracy," and I am thoroughly convinced that a lot of people have thought of this before me (see Norton Juster, Lewis Carroll, "On Beyond Zebra" and other occult headfuck Dr. Seuss books, etc etc etc etc).

I want to take it to my own peak and happiness.

Are you here for the long haul?

Magic seems rigged to self-destruct but will re-ify at higher levels. But I endure to the end mothafucka, it's true.

Where do you see yourself being, as a magician, in 20 or 50 years?

Sitting on top of a better world.

What are your goals?

That would be telling.

Do you believe that your actions as a magician further those goals in any tangible sense?

Absolutely.

Can you point to anything concrete in support of that belief?

My life.

Do you believe that magic, and related subjects discussed in this forum, have a role to play in nudging the world towards a brighter future than the one we seem to be rapidly heading towards?

Absolutely, but a balance needs to be struck somewhere between the "everyone is a magician" falsity and the post-doctorate complexity level.

What do you think that role might be?

The magician role needs to be redefined in a global sense for the 21st century, largely as the person who is entrusted with the PUBLIC (not covert) duty of constructing positive meaning for the race. Rupert Murdoch, for instance, is currently one of the best of the visible magicians on the planet, but we can do a lot better than that.

How do you think it might play out?

Global economy collapse. We are in for fucking rough times, with the transition from global power away from America to the EU and China in the near future, and this needs to be done as bloodlessly as possible. I fucking hate the word "paradigm" but humanity needs to discard the ideas of "natural" and "unnatural" both and reify the belief that there are no boundaries on anything.

What are the small steps?

Snatch the minds of the children like changelings. Set positive examples using your own lives as living sigils.

What are the long term goals?

Peace love and fuck. Sustainable growth combined with nonphysical interstellar travel.

What do you want to happen?

I need a girlfriend.

What are you going to do about it?

Buy some nicer clothes, finally get a cell phone and make a point to go out more. Also, finish my book.
 
 
vajramukti
20:59 / 07.11.04


try lavalife dude.

" post-simulationist thelemic demigod in waiting seeks scarlet woman/sk8r grrl for freaky styley and riding out the eschatonic collapse of western civilisation "

worked for me, anyway...
 
 
Gypsy Lantern
21:06 / 07.11.04
I came to the age of intellectual curiosty/outsiderdom shortly after AL Gore invented the Internet and was convinced that we were all going to shortly enter thee Mondo post-historical tantrik megaliberation of endless sex with PVC-wearing babes with blue hair and Vin Diesel-style boddhisatva warriors. Despite all the evidence to the contrary I still can't quite shake this early sexual identity formation.

Love it.
 
 
vargr
00:26 / 08.11.04
Q: So why are you posting here?

A: The Temple is probably the most cohesive and interesting online place I've found to inflict my megalomania upon.

Q: What do you expect to accomplish with all of this magic and spirituality bullshit?

A: I hope to gain a better understanding of the origins of well, everything. If it wasn't random chance, and there was intent in creation, why? Also, having come to believe that reality is subject to manipulation, I want to know how to do it.

Q: What the fuck are you playing at?

A: Currently, I'm coming up with ideas to spread my particular version of reality, hoping to juice up the drive to change this

world to make it a little more hospitable to me and those I give a shit about.

Q: Where do you think it's leading?

A: I'm keen to learn that myself.

Q: What do you expect to get from it?

A: Sex, drugs, enlightenment, or some combination of these.

Q: Do you practice something that you call magic?

A: Yes.

Q: Why are you persisting with it?

A: Because sometimes, despite my own skepticism, it produces measurable results. They could all be coincidence, but that's not as gratifying to my ego as thinking that it was me.

Q: Are you trying to prove something to yourself?

A: Yes. That I am not powerless in this world.

Q: Have you already proven something to your own satisfaction?

Yes.

Q: If so, where do you now intend to take it?

A: Every success leads to more confidence that it works. Every failure can easily be blamed on some outside factor to rationalize it away. Ok, that last part was not entirely serious.

Q: Are you here for the long haul?

A: 14 years so far. Of course tomorrow I could scrap the whole thing. But what would I do with all of these books? If I got rid of them, my house would be far too bare.

Q: Where do you see yourself being, as a magician, in 20 or 50 years?

A: That depends on a lot of factors. I could be dead, in a civilian interment camp, or figurehead of a budding media empire. Of the bunch, I'll look toward the latter. It worked for Richard Metzger.

Q: What are your goals?

A: I want to learn better ways to articulate my needs and wants, so that I can more effectively translate them into mechanisms to attain them. Eliminating intellectual control from society is also right up there, but that's a long-term project.
I suppose that if I were to say that I want to immanentize the eschaton, that would be cliche'.

Q: Do you believe that your actions as a magician further those goals in any tangible sense?

A: Yes. Whether magic is a numinous force, or purely in my own head, the mental, physical, and psychological benefits that have resulted from doing magic are very real to me.

Q: Can you point to anything concrete in support of that belief?

A: I've got a better outlook on life. I've also lost over 25 pounds and am in better physical condition than at any point in

my life. So far no luck with the cigarettes though.

Q: Do you believe that magic, and related subjects discussed in this forum, have a role to play in nudging the world towards a brighter future than the one we seem to be rapidly heading towards?

A: Yes I do.

Q: What do you think that role might be?

A: Even individualists like to know that somewhere out in the world, someone is sympathetic and understanding to their way of thinking. The ability to communicate with others of like mind or intent can be a morale booster. People who are more confident in their ideas, having received positive reinforcement are more likely to defend them and espouse them to those who do not believe as they do. This spreads these ideas. On some minds, there will be no impact, but on others, the seed may germinate and become assimilated.

Q: How do you think it might play out?

A: It'll either work or it won't.

Q: What are the small steps?

A: Forge ahead.

Q: What are the long term goals?

A: Change the way that humanity conceives reality. It's not a zero-sum game.

Q: What do you want to happen?

A: Ok, this is the biggest cliche' of all, but bear with me. I just want everyone to get along. I want an end to assholes killing each other in the name of their invisible friend in the sky, or any other of the myriad reasons that humanity seems to be so adept at using to justify eradicating one another. I want to be able to do what I do without interference from society, as long as I'm not doing anything that infringes on the right of anyone else to do the same. Yes, there is still a smoldering ember of idealism somewhere inside this blackened armor of misanthropy and cynicism.

Q: What are you going to do about it?

A: That would be telling.
 
 
Skeleton Camera
05:39 / 08.11.04
I'm not going to go through these one by one...

I'm into all this stuff because of several spontaneous experiences that convinced me the world was a much bigger, more vital, more invigorating, and more scary place that I had ever previously experienced.
I'm just now getting to a point of accepting just how I fit into all that. It seems to be called "growing up" for the most part, but using the magical framework has made it an easier transition and provided a context for a great deal of personal trauma and pathology.
Along the way, though, I discovered that there really is a palpable, interact-able (?) life to just about everything, that I wasn't crazy or a poseur for the duration of my adolesence, and that there are definite entites that exist and will have relationships with you if you're open to it.
The experience was simultaneously an expansion and contraction.
All that said, what now? Yes, magic makes a difference. It makes a microcosmic difference, but that's all the more reason to do it and to get others doing it (or realize they're doing it). Just the action of it, in and of itself, occurring is part of our "brighter future." I don't know if that term even applies anymore - bright or not, we have a future. We are a future. And we better come to terms with that real fast.
Magic helps, I've found.
Part of being a magician (or WHATEVER YOU CALL IT) is accepting that it helps and convincing others it does. If public opinion shapes reality, even on the most basic level of how volks make decisions, then influencing public opinion is very important.
I am an "artist" and a "shaman" and "witch" and however many other terms may be applied but what that means is that I am engaged in the world very consciously, on multiple levels, and am using that engagement to further what I perceive to be important.
In that tangent, then: first off, "I" is not important. Which paradoxically interweaves with the ego-structures we use to function. We need space in which to create. Creation and destruction are inseparable - the question is one of scale. Making space in which creation (multiplicitous processes) may take place is paramount. I see it in the clouds, in the fluttering leaves, in my own ability to write this. It can be eliminated; it should be reinforced and fought for when necessary.
We function as cells. I can't stop this stuff even if I try. With proper re-imprinting perhaps...but as of now, if I try, I get physically ill and my head backs up. That's just me.
I am going to continue making fun, making love, making art-work (if you can call it that, because it just seems to be, er, "being" (or becoming) in reality at this point), connecting people, feeding people, helping people when I can, biking a lot, loving Autumn, burning candles, playing with the cat, working at the soup kitchen, talking with you folks, getting some sleep, and empowering myself.
Gotta keep the hair red, too. Good stuff.
 
 
Gypsy Lantern
14:01 / 08.11.04
So why are you posting here?

Because, on a good day, I think barbelith is the best place for open minded and intelligent discussion of magic, spirituality and related subjects on the web. I value that and want to support it, contribute to it, and try to do my bit to make it an engaging forum. A lot of the time I think of this forum as a space where I can road test various ideas and thought processes that I've arrived at myself, within the wider public occult sphere. See what the response is, try to look for my own blindspots, see if my ideas will hold up to scrutiny, refine them, get a better understanding by exposure to other people's view points. I value interaction with a lot of the people who post here, and enjoy the sense of community that interaction gives me. I'd like to see old voices that don't post anymore return to the fold, and new voices delurking and carrying the debate on to new and interesting places.

What do you expect to accomplish with all of this magic and spirituality bullshit?

I want to be happy. I want to enjoy my life, be empowered to overcome life's obstacles with good humour, transform the darkness into love, do whatever I can to help the people I care about do the same.

What the fuck are you playing at?

None of your fucking business. Let's have less of the attitude, eh?

Where do you think it's leading?

As far as my personal practice and involvement of magic goes, it does appear to be leading somewhere. When I think about where I was at five years ago, in terms of understanding, ability, and 'conaysans', I think I've developed loads. I want to keep on with that and continue trying to up my game.

What do you expect to get from it?

Putting aside for a moment the persistant image of sci-fi sex practices with blue haired PVC clad witches, I want to be happy. I want to be the best that I can be at the things I have a talent for. Because if I'm doing that, I reckon everything else will take care of itself.

Do you practice something that you call magic?

I'm not practising at anything mate, I've turned professional. But the truth is more that the magic works me, rather than me working the magic. It's a dynamic process of engagement with the universe, a communication I am involved in, a dialogue that I am a part of.

Why are you persisting with it?

There isnt really a plausible alternative. You can never go back. It's been a rough ride in places but I'm stronger for it. I want to see what else there is. I want to see how far I can go.

Are you trying to prove something to yourself?

I'm trying to prove that you can make a decision about the sort of life you want to live and then try to live it, despite the odds. I'm trying to prove that through persistence, bravery, honesty and ingenuity, you can remake the world, remake the reality you inhabit, into something brighter and more fulfilling. I'll let you know how it turns out.

Have you already proven something to your own satisfaction?

You never can. Even when completely mad stuff happens in front of me, there's always the nagging doubt in my mind that I might just be delusional. That it all might just be in my head. That I'm kidding myself. But I think this sense of doubt and scepticism is an important thing to have in the bag of tricks. It's good to always question what you're doing. And ultimately, if the processes I'm engaging with are helping me to develop as a person, overcome hardships, and make my life better, then that is an end in itself however I choose to frame it.

If so, where do you now intend to take it?

Like James Brown, I'm gonna take it to the bridge!

Are you here for the long haul?

Aye, cap'n.

Where do you see yourself being, as a magician, in 20 or 50 years?

I don't like trying to predict so far ahead into the future. I've got no idea what will happen. But I hope I'll have put the effort in and become better at the things I enjoy doing.

Do you believe that magic, and related subjects discussed in this forum, have a role to play in nudging the world towards a brighter future than the one we seem to be rapidly heading towards?

Yeah, I think so. But it will be more of a peripheral thing, it's a part of the puzzle not the whole deal. However, I think that notions of a supercontext, the idea that everything will work out in 2012, that reality is an evolving larval being ready to hatch, and so on, are just a frightened marginalised counter culture's versioning on the Christian fundamentalist's apocalypse scenario. It's an excuse not to do anything, or engage with what's going on around you, or take any responsibility.

What do you think that role might be?

I think I'm largely on the same page as Boy in a Suitcase with this:

"The magician role needs to be redefined in a global sense for the 21st century, largely as the person who is entrusted with the PUBLIC (not covert) duty of constructing positive meaning for the race."

The details still need to be worked out, but that's why we're all here.

How do you think it might play out?

I think the next few years are going to be rough as fuck. You could look at it like a hoodoo uncrossing or psychic detox, things have to get worse before they get better, all the crap is going to have to be flushed out of the system. But hopefully, we can all do what we can to get through the darkness, support one another, keep focussed on our priorities, keep doing the things that we are best at, maintain faith in all the good aspects of humanity, and try to still have the good times wherever we can.

what are the small steps?

The small steps are different for everybody. I find a lot of interpretations of Thelema quite annoying, but I have a lot of time for the idea of the True Will. Finding the purpose at the core of your being and then following it, doing the things that you are best at doing, the things that only you can do. I think it's important to try and engage with that. I reckon I have a broad idea of what that might mean for me, and I'm going to try my best to crack on with it.

what are the long term goals

Take care of the pennies, and the pounds will take care of themselves.

What do you want to happen?

I want to be happy, and I want the people I care about to be happy.

What are you going to do about it?

Keep on, keeping on.
 
 
Boy in a Suitcase
21:31 / 08.11.04
Clarification. I want to be part of a living tapestry and live up to the inspiration I received from my heroes by living a life like theirs and doing it even better where possible.

"Teenage dreams, so hard to beat..."
 
 
Unconditional Love
00:20 / 09.11.04
personally its not what i want to bring into the world or myself.

having said that it seems to of worked for fabulous mr meaningless.

"By bringing it up to the surface, exposing it to the light of investigation, and exploring it thoroughly until it no longer bothered or troubled me. I can definitely say that a lot of that irrational hate has been cleansed from my system, and it’s not the turn-on it used to be."

i recognise some of whats being said in the above, and from what i can tell it was done within the confines of his own imagination in a ritualistic fashion, i am not suggesting that everybody should have a go. but if that has helped him with an irrational hate or fear, which he states it has i dont see the problem, its not gone further than the self that is dealing with it and i see that as healthy.

if you were doing it all the time then i agree indulging the most taboo areas of the human psyche could be seen to serve as nothing more than self gratification, as to how dark you were,etc etc.

but i think the above few lines make it clear that that wasnt the final result.

i am intrested to know what techniques you would recommend?
 
 
Z. deScathach
04:48 / 09.11.04
I post here, (although I've been known to disappear from time to time), because I find the best conversation on magick and politics on the net right here. In terms of magick, I don't know how in the hell it does what it does, I'm not even totally sure that it works, but I've seen some pretty weird shit. Also, I've noticed that life does tend to conform to expectation. As far as where I'll be in magick in twenty to fifty years, I'll probably be dead, unless nanobots or genetic therapies are developed to counteract aging, (oh happy day.....). I've practiced magick for about a quarter century, so I'll answer that question backwards. What I see magick as and what I believe it does has changed utterly over those years. I find that morality means a lot less to me now, where correctness in realizing intent means a lot more. I practice magick because it makes me feel completely alive. The changes in my viewpoint of magickal practice is what really brought me to Barbelith. I got desperately tired of all the moral arguments and general bad feelings. If I had seen one more argument over a "love spell", I would have surely shot somebody. I find intelligent argument and conversation here. That's refreshing. Not only that, but arguments tend to be dealt with effectively. That's refreshing. When I read this in the Barbelith FAQ: "Castings: Please do not work magicks upon other board members without their express permission. Violations of this rule may be met with the efforts of group workings performed by the members of this board to enforce this rule. You have been warned!", I thought, "AT LAST! Someone, who's got it right!" The level of magickal warfare on other boards has become quite frankly assinine. I posted about my magickal desires in another thread along the same lines, I'll repost it here. "I want to be a force of nature with a void at it's core, and a gentle breeze blowing through all of creation". That is what I wish to get out of magick.
 
 
Seth
09:08 / 09.11.04
I didn't particularly choose this life, I was born into it. My parents', and specifically my father's spirituality has exposed me to ritual, divination, healing and possession/embodiment phenomena all my life. There was no real moment at which I decided it was right for me, and I still question whether it is right for me. Hopefully I'll never stop asking that. What some people call magic has been the background radiation of my entire life, sometimes stronger, sometimes weaker. Considering my parents would never had met had it not been for my Dad's bludgeoning, bloody-minded take on prophecy and mysticism... kinda leads you to constantly ask all kinds of questions about reality, free will, and what context you have for your beliefs and actions.

It's hard to say whether my ongoing involvement is really my choice or not. I also can't say what I want from it. It certainly adds a lot of adventure and fun to life, scares the shit out of you, and teaches you interesting stuff about the world and yourself. I guess if I'm to be honest I'm searching for meaning, trying to make sense of who I am and why I am that way (as well as understanding the world, the two are the same thing anyway), which is also why I still regularly think of all of this magic stuff as either misguided, incomplete or a load of nonsense. To paraphrase Einstein, you can't solve a problem with the same thinking that led to the problem.
 
 
Sean the frumious Bandersnatch
11:23 / 09.11.04
I don’t practice magic, not really. I consider myself more an "occultist": I like to know things that most people overlook, like the secrets of religion, or how the occult influenced the US. I study the quaballah, dealt with a few “gods”, and have attempted hypersigils.

To be honest, I don't know if magic really works, or if it's just psychological conditioning or whatever. Still, I do believe that knowledge of magic is important. It helps with my understanding of art, writing, history, politics, and psychology.

Like many others, I found Barbelith after I finished the Invisibles. I lurked for a while, lost my password, left the site, rediscovered my password, and returned to the site not too long ago.

I come to Temple to learn. I'm interested in how the occult affects other people's lives. I want to know more about NLP and Voodoo. Sure, sometimes I don't understand what you people are talking about, but that's “the kind of mysterious shit I like best”.

Where is this leading to? Well, best possible scenario, I am discovered by the Shadow Elite, the secret lords of the earth, who teach me that humanity is a schizophrenic hallucination produced by a giant talking brain known as GAIA, which resides deep in the center of the earth. I help them destroy the environment, which is their path to attacking GAIA and thus preventing it from waking up on 2012, which would cause all of humanity to disappear!

But, y’know, I’d settle on being able to actually finish writing a fucking novel.
 
 
--
02:15 / 10.11.04
I'm not going to bother addressing any of 2stepfan's complaints, only because they're totally unrelated to this thread. I will at the moment, however, say that I do disagree that one shouldn't constantly wallow in negative mindframes. I'm pretty sure GM would say the same thing.

Back on topic, I'd have to say that I liken myself to what Boy in the Suitcase is saying, as I like to imagine myself as part of some grand lineage that stretches far back in time... I look back on all those that came before me and I ask myself "How can I top this?" Often times the task seems very tiring as these individuals have accomplished so much. Fortunetly, the world still sucks, despite what they've accomplished, so there's always work to be done.
 
 
Bard: One-Man Humaton Hoedown
18:54 / 10.11.04
Where is this leading to? Well, best possible scenario, I am discovered by the Shadow Elite, the secret lords of the earth, who teach me that humanity is a schizophrenic hallucination produced by a giant talking brain known as GAIA, which resides deep in the center of the earth. I help them destroy the environment, which is their path to attacking GAIA and thus preventing it from waking up on 2012, which would cause all of humanity to disappear!

That sounds like a kickass idea for a comic book, to be honest. Or possibly a Thompson-esque novel. You could call it "Fear and Loathing in the Illuminati (or How I Saved the World From Itself By Blowing It Up)"
 
 
Quantum
14:27 / 11.11.04
NO TIME TO READ THREAD STOP AM SEEPING BACK ONLINE STOP EXPECT FURTHER MANIFESTATIONS SOON STOP PLEASE CHECK OUT NEW THREAD ON QUANTUM PROJECT ON SOUL SURVIVAL STOP IN ANSWER AM HERE TO GET SOME OF YOU PEOPLE TO CONTRIBUTE TO MY NEW PROJECT AND BECAUSE THESE ARE MY PEERS FOR BETTER OR WORSE STOP QUANTUM
 
 
SteppersFan
19:48 / 11.11.04
i am intrested to know what techniques you would recommend?
Just looking into yourself and finding the bits that hurt or are frightening and gently -- gently -- bringing them to the surface by focusing on them. And then slowly let self-compassion and self-forgiveness percolate through the dark bits. Until you have the strength to touch yourself. Not push or hit - but touch. It's going to be veeeery delicate in there.

Add magic to taste. Intention is the key. Getting help from ancestors and focusing on how your belly feels are useful.
 
 
Gypsy Lantern
21:25 / 11.11.04
I think this whole sub-discussion that Sypha and 2 step are having is worth having a new thread about.. It's an interesting subject and I cant remember it really being covered anywhere else on here.
 
 
--
01:45 / 12.11.04
Well, more like the subject wolfangel and 2stepfan are having... I might elaborate on a new thread in the future though.
 
 
Skeleton Camera
03:40 / 12.11.04
Ow, my tangent!

"ALso, it is my firm conviction that magick only becomes "real" when it is being discussed by two or more people who have individual experience of it (chew on that - "wherever three or more of you are I am among you" or summink like that)"

Meine freunde und ich recently held a group shamanic working in an abandoned military bunker off the coast. It was my first time performing magic with a group that wasn't a pre-established coven of nutjobs. Fortunately we are now just that.

My most powerful magical experiences have occurred with a group. Theory-wise, I see magic as always existing as a phase state, as flowing through the edges and the cracks. It exists between establishments and plays a role in their definition.
 
 
Unconditional Love
20:22 / 12.11.04
i agree a seperate thread is in order your honour, but the jury seems to be out at present. take that wig off please.

a thread discussing those darker moments and ways to deal with them. no idea what it should be called.
 
 
ONLY NICE THINGS
22:52 / 12.11.04
Actually, I believe there already is one. It was started by Sypha Nadon about a year ago, I think, and concerned conquering one's dark thoughts by fantasising about wrong sex. Scroll down a bit and you should find it.

This may also hold some interest.
 
 
Madman in the ruins.
16:27 / 14.11.04
So why are you posting here?
Have been here since the Nexus-hard habbit to break.
What do you expect to accomplish with all of this magic and spirituality bullshit?
Short answer to be a better preson.
What the fuck are you playing at?
I dunno but its a hell of a ride. I fully expect to fuck up along the way .
Where do you think it's leading?
My eventual spirttual evolution.
What do you expect to get from it?

Do you practice something that you call magic?
Oh yes.
Why are you persisting with it?
Cos it works.
Are you trying to prove something to yourself?
Ermmmm no.
Have you already proven something to your own satisfaction?
Oh yes.
If so, where do you now intend to take it?
Well I want to be
Are you here for the long haul?
Yes thats called life, I reckon I've got another 50 years.
Where do you see yourself being, as a magician, in 20 or 50 years?
Myabe a litte more well known and a hell of a lot more accomplished.
What are your goals? not sure at the moment, I know what I don't want tho..
Do you believe that your actions as a magician further those goals in any tangible sense?
Yes.
Can you point to anything concrete in support of that belief?
Yes. See "MY evocation experice" on Barbelith and I might let you look at my personal diary.
Do you believe that magic, and related subjects discussed in this forum, have a role to play in nudging the world towards a brighter future than the one we seem to be rapidly heading towards?
Yes and No. Take the recent US election, I thik there were Magi on BOTH sides.Magiccs biggest enemy is magicians.
What do you think that role might be?
Spirtiual and intelectual evolution.
How do you think it might play out? I think we are seeing the results of the age of Hours. or GM's Bungee powerd spell, With Magic getting a better press than in the past 100 years or so.
What are the small steps?
Everone who preactises and accomplises someting works towards agreater "good"
What are the long term goals?
Of the World-Not blowing itself up/poisioning itself and of us as a planet evolving.
What do you want to happen?
What are you going to do about it?
 
 
Less searchable M0rd4nt
12:30 / 18.03.06
I want leverage, a bit of an edge; a way to stick my thumb on the scales of this wicked world, a Vulcan nerve pinch for when the big guys just won't let up, a Jedi mind trick to sneak past the stormtroopers, half a prayer in a crooked game. I want a radioactive spider-bite. I want to be the radioactive spider. I want to roll up my sleeves and get my hands dirty and have magic under my fingernails. I want a hut at the edge of the village with a kitchen full of suspicious herbs.

I want a way to make life just a little bit better, for me, for other people. I want to be able to fix the things that can't be fixed because they're too big, or too complicated, or because nobody else will admit that they're even broken.

I want Gods. I want Devils. I want nymphs and dryads and naiads and fairies; I want trolls and giants and things with wings and the Dweller under the Sink. I want stuff I don't even know I want yet because it's so far beyond my tiny comprehension that my eyes would melt if I thought about it too long.

I want something amazing to happen.
 
 
Dead Megatron
13:09 / 18.03.06
I was going to post something really original, but the truth is Mordant already said everything that was going through my mind.I just want to put an extra emphasis in the following line:

I want something amazing to happen.

God, I want so much for something amazing to happen. Even if it's risky. I want to see the skies turn red, I want to live in a world with dragons, I want a world of heroes and sorcerors. I want to see what's behind the curtain.

Plus, I want to put myself to the test. See if I can overcome my limitations and evolve, in a bit of a niezschean way, except with compassion.
 
 
Kit-Cat Club
13:12 / 18.03.06
I want something amazing to happen

Something amazing is already happening - all the time.

Illmatic, too lazy to log out of Kit Kat's account.
 
 
Gypsy Lantern
13:30 / 18.03.06
Mordant: I think you've just written the opening paragraph of your book on direct contact deity magic.
 
 
Quantum
18:53 / 20.03.06
Finish it quick MC so I can get a copy!

I want magic to be normal. I want TV shows on gnostic visualisation techniques, Qaballic hopscotch in school playgrounds, Bats Blood ink in Sainsburys and proper consultant's rates for divination and blessings etc. so a magician can make a living from magic without starving.

Why do I post here? To learn more and share what I know. And because you are funny people who know jokes about Abaddon.
 
 
*
23:50 / 20.03.06
I wonder if the reason I don't post in Temple as much as I used to, and I'm not as actively muhjookuhl as I used to be, is because I've lost sight of what I want.

My wants: Love, which I've decided will surprise me, or will not happen at all. Financial security, which I've never been successful at using magic to achieve— I think there's a certain mental block involved. To have all my less pleasant tasks out of the way so I can give more time to the pleasant ones— I've yet to successfully use magic to clean the gutters, either. As for enlightenment— I'm not sure what I used to mean by this. I'm not sure anymore how it was possible to want something that I had no idea how to recognize.

Maybe I'm at a lower vMeme than everyone else here.

Here we go: I want to be inflamed with desire again. I want to live to a higher standard again. But maybe I don't actually need this.
 
 
Seth
10:26 / 21.03.06
Something amazing is already happening - all the time.

Except that one time. You remember?

We were just kinda sitting around and... ah, forget it. It's not important.
 
 
kidninjah
15:28 / 21.03.06
Nice thread; glad it got bumped back. I'd been wondering what I was getting into with magick these last couple of weeks. Total newbie, mighty skeptic here...

Many many many years back i read ghost & witch stories, beleived in faeries, and santa clause (tho' not very strongly 'cos when i learned that secret i really wan't upset or suprised - the faeries took a little longer to leave my concious sense of the here & now).

Many many years ago I got into sci-fi, and then sci, and I studied hard at physics and biology. Chemistry was ok too but maths was a bugger. I always knew there was more to learn, but at GCSE and Alevel I felt settled that the world was material. But i never forgot the ghosts and witches.

Many years ago I read Robert Anton Wilson who would write about magic and physics in parallel, who spoke of yogis and magicians, physicists and snake charmers as if they shared common knowledge and weren't the compartmentalised, disparate groups my education had me beleive. I vowed to get more into what I now saw to be "the world"... to drink in religons (plural), to surf on energy, to breath exercises, to dance with physics...

So a few years on, havning not done anywhere near as much drinking, surfing, breathing or dancing as I had planned, I made a change and all hell broke loose. Drugs, parties, a lot of thinking, and some strange coincidences later I feel a bit lost. I've learned a little, seen a bit more and still hope to make my life and that of those around me a bit better, but it's harder than I thought for.

I'm reading temple because the people make sense and are usually funny. Plus, when I get pissed off and wonder if it's all a load of clap-trap, I go two stories up and there's music, science and politics to get my teeth 'round as well. Great.. the world in a nutshell.

To me, life should be lived in ways that reflect how it works and what it can do. Actually, it's impossible not to be this way, but it's nice to be aware of it. Just like an understanding of polution makes me feel glad about taking the bus to work, or the genius of an aqualung gives me the freedom to play at being a fish, I'd like to know more about how, if at all, magick can help get things done, why there's all these thousands of books about it and perhaps how it works (as the scientist/engineer in me takes a look at this stuff too).
 
 
Sam T.
12:45 / 22.03.06
Love this thread. It's a very nice intro thing for lots of posters, and Gipsy questioning is simply awesome. I waited a bit, because it is hard to say something after what Mordant said...

Been a total sceptic for such a long time. I was always interested in the fringe (hypnosis, consciousness modification, etc...), but never, ever gave thought to all the 'supernatural' things, which were for me only old wife tales.

Then one day, a few years ago, it hit me. Hard. I'll spare you the details but it involved first a very vigorous mental shake up, and after that extreme life threatening happenings and modification of those happenings.

This of course got me thinking. I later tried informal experiments which gave out outstanding results (a bit the equivalent of the universe shouting in you ear: "OF COURSE IT WORKS, DUMBO!").

From then on, I needed documentation, so I read some tons of books. Incredible, truly, the output there is in this field. From then on, I couldn't rest until I somehow managed to crack the whole thing up. The hacker mindset, you might say.

How does it work? How can you deviously hack up the thing so it will do what you want of it? Find the little crack in it, and then pry hard. All the Chaos Magic literature was very important to me in this respect, or rather in its lack of respect of the tradition.

Now, you know what I'm bothering you all with, those days...

What do I expect of this board?

To know if I'm either 1) On crack 2) mostly right.

And of course to share learnings, and make the whole thing advance.
 
 
Evil Scientist
13:42 / 22.03.06
What am I looking for?

Proof, tangible evidence. Quantifiable effects that aren't the product of observer bias and self-fulfilling prophecy.

Because if magic was real then it means people the world over are missing out on something incredible that they could use to improve their lives and the world around them. Because, despite my personal belief that humans should stop relying on psychological crutches, I'm open-minded enough to accept that I might be wrong.

I'm here because I like to provide a counter-point, a voice that asks "Why?" and "How?" and keeps on asking, and isn't necessarily going to be satisfied with the first answer it recieves.

I'm not a magician, but I'll listen to them.

I'm here because Temple's full of smart, intelligent, funny people who believe something completely contrary to what I do about how the world works, and talking to them is always fun.

I'm here for the long haul.

Mwoo ha haa.
 
 
Scrambled Password Bogus Email
15:10 / 22.03.06
Cuddly Scientist - Can you define 'self-fulfilling prophecy' please?
 
 
Evil Scientist
13:41 / 23.03.06
Hello you sticky Honey Money$hot-type person you. How's tricks?

Self-fulfilling Prophecy.

A self-fulfilling prophecy is when a person with belief of future events alters his behaviour in a way that ends up causing these events. (from the wiki).
 
  

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