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The Avengers

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12:08 / 01.07.04

So then, The Bendice is about to revamp earth's mightiest heroes, and he's going to start by killing a few. Me, I like a lot of The Bendice stuff - Ground-breaking it ain't, fun it often is - and for some reason I really, really want to like this.

Anyway, the first 23 pages of issue 500 are online now. Go have a look.

12:17 / 01.07.04

It's making me want to buy Avengers... which I've never wanted to do before.
I liked the Ultrons. I liked the wanton death and the orchestration of the attacks on the Avengers. I even liked the dialogue which many out there don't, sheesh fanboy knee-jerk reactions are funny.

12:24 / 01.07.04

I try not to read them (fanboy reactions, that is), they just irritate me.

Spoilers

Yeah, the Ultron's were good, weren't they. I love Ultron. Wonder who's orchestrating this? My Money's on Kang. I hope it's Kang.

13:04 / 01.07.04

so he actually makes something happen in one of his plots, amazingly the story is actually moving along like it hasn't swallowed a bottle of mogadon, it all looks fine, and

TWO double page spreads of avenger mansion blowing up. TWO. what a moron.

13:34 / 01.07.04

Yeah, I have to agree. Muchly wasted space. I wish The Bendice would stop with the slowness and lack of density.

Ulty Spidey's better than ever, however.

C'mon, even you had to enjoy all those grinning Metal Mickey's.

14:12 / 01.07.04

yeah, loved the ultrons (ultra?) and the What If? vibe where people are dying left and right. just hope some of them stay dead, esp. lang whose presence only ever robbed us of the hank pym and wardrobe of amazing costumes! book that we all should have had years ago. and the vision melting was ace.

14:16 / 01.07.04

Well, The Bendice has said in interviews that he intends for a whole bunch of Avengers to get, and stay, dead.

14:22 / 01.07.04

that's good, although the huge team roster is part of the fun, and it aleways seemed to me that it was a running gag in the avangers that characters would frequently disappear beneath a laser blast and get a tearful 'he's dead!' from the wasp before reappearing two pages later.

got a nice load of classic-era avengers recently, all roy thomas, englehart, neal adams, perez and stuff - want me to bring them round tonight?

14:24 / 01.07.04

Yep.

14:54 / 01.07.04

This looks fun, nothing earth-shattering or making me scream with delight. Hawkeye talking about which bad girls he'd like to bag was sort of silly (someone on some message board pointed out, quite astutely, that Chuck Austen had Hawkeye and Cap talking like this in an AVENGERS issue and everyone said it sucked, now Bendis does this and most Bendis fans will praise this character bit). I thought it was silly when Austen did it and it's silly now that Bendis did it, even though I pretty much can't stand Austen's stuff and overally I really like Bendis' stuff.

Finch's art is really great, nice and slick.

I feel like we've already seen a "Holy Shit, Ultron kicks ass in a major way" with Busiek & Perez most recent Ultron story...but this is still ok.

I want to know how the corpsified Jack of Hearts comes back to cause what appears to a major explosion. Wasn't he full of radiation? I thought it would be nuclear explosion when he died/blew up.

I could deal with the Vision being dead and gone for a while. I could definitely deal with Ant-Man being dead for a while. Funny how Bendis faked us out on killing Scott Lang in the final issues of ALIAS and now he really kills him for good.

17:19 / 01.07.04

Wolfy, I've always seen Hawkeye as a ladeez man. Who gives a shit if another writer couldn't pull it off, doesn't mean to say that Bendis can't.

Frankly, Bendis, like any writer, is going to take a bit of what he likes from continuity and gloss over the rest.

Also, this is jumping on point, it doesn't matter if we've seen Ultron recently, the guy is a fucking big gun and deserves a place in any definitive Avengers' story-line.

Bring on Kang.

17:58 / 01.07.04

This actually looks like a lot of fun, in a "blowin' shit up real good" kind of way. I'd mostly quit buying monthlies, but I've been relapsing lately into picking up random punch-fests just for fun, and this looks like a splendid example of the genre. One for the list, for sure.

17:58 / 01.07.04

Don't forget this is only half the issue.... it's double sized. So I can forgive the extra double page splashes of the mansion blowing up. Again.
Especially as they looked so purdy.

11:40 / 02.07.04

It looks like another "Nothing will ever be the same!" story....

Which means that, in a couple of years, another writer will do a story "returning the Avengers to their glory". I think I'm through with Marvel for a while....

11:55 / 02.07.04

No? Really? Shock Horror!

Fer God's sake, of course it'll all change again, we are talking about sooperhero comics, afterall.

Enjoy the story (or not) for what it is, not what it will be when a new writer takes over in a couple of years time.

Anyway...

Who would know that these are the worst things that have ever happened to the Avengers – and are all happening again? Who would know that, and how could they do it? That’s the question.
~ The Bendice

Kang would, and he could.

12:05 / 02.07.04

Reading the interview with Bendis and Quesada has made me even more intrigued and glad that it'll only take three issues to conclude (hardly a tax on my wallet). I don't think I'll join for the long haul but just one story should be fun.
I'm also liking the Scarlet Witch theories I've been reading, all her chaos magic and probability altering could be causing this. Unlikely but my preferred theory so far.

12:07 / 02.07.04

i'm sold on this

i never even LIKED the avengers as a mutant mad teen, but the older i get the more interesting they seem (maybe thanks to the ultimates) and this looks like a full on balls to the wall adventure

also been meaning to check this new kid bendis out. any other recommendations?

a

12:32 / 02.07.04

Hmm, haven't heard the Scarlet Witch theories, but I'd be surprised if it wasn't a proper baddie behind all the shenanigans.

This is a jumping on point, afterall. People will be expecting a classic super-villian.

Although DC were happy to fob everyone off with Ssshhhh, or whatever his name was, on Batman, so...

Nah, Bendis likes his stories all classic, like.

12:49 / 02.07.04

Scarlet Witch: the basic idea is what goes around comes around. You take lots of good luck now, expect lots of bad luck later. Apparently Byrne touched on this in AWC but no-one's ever really followed it through.
It's much more agreeable than the Hank Pym = villain speculation and a tad more enticing than Kang again. Although Kang, again, using Scarlet Witch would be fun.
I expect there will be plenty of twists and turns before this is all over but I think the biggest hint is that all these events have befallen the Avengers before, just not on the same day.

13:14 / 02.07.04

loki's more likely than kang i think - he's their first anatagonist remember

13:34 / 02.07.04

I dunno, he's more your classic Thor villain than your classic Avengers villain... but I've never really paid much attention to The Avengers before so I could be completely wrong.

13:40 / 02.07.04

not taking the piss but yeah you are, loki was the bad guy way back in avengers 1. his machinations are directly responsible for causing earth's mightiest heroes to assemble, but he's the trickster god of fire and in this respect is just pushing mankind a bit further along the evolutionary superhighway. marvel're trying to amp loki up to be one of their superbads after years of neglect, and this would be a good opportunity to do it.

13:56 / 02.07.04

Aah, but way back in Avengers 1 (I presume you mean vol1 too) is a long time ago and unless there's a constant threat from him to the Avengers he still doesn't count.
I have loads of silver age Thor comics so I guess I just can't shake the image of him being Thor's personal rival as opposed to The Avengers' group nemesis.

Anyway...

Someone somewhere else mentioned a revamped Masters Of Evil... which is quite Bendis-ian.

14:01 / 02.07.04

oh yeah no reason you shouldn't think of him as a thor baddy - after all that's what he's been for hunnerds of years. masters of evil would be good too, but something tells me loki could be the one, just for the disassembled reloaded to basics flava they're going for lately

wasn't loki the baddie in sandman as well? i love sandman, sandman's amazzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzz
ing

14:05 / 02.07.04

>> Wolfy, I've always seen Hawkeye as a ladeez man. Who gives a shit if another writer couldn't pull it off, doesn't mean to say that Bendis can't.

You've got a good point - I was thinking about this and it makes sense. Clint is the kind of guy who's talk about stuff like that. And this was a little better than Austen's scene.

I second that emotion about 'blowin' up stuff real good'!

03:24 / 03.07.04

Loki kind of created the Avengers and it would be cool if he orchestrated this whole plot. I could see another classic Avengers villian, The Grim Reaper, using his weirdo voodoo powers to bring back Jack of Hearts. Seems ok from the preview.

08:19 / 03.07.04

Nah, the Grim Reaper's not big enough: I haven't heard of him.

So there.

Scarlet Witch theory sounds interesting, but remember Bendis has pretty much said that there is deliberate intent behind all the disassemblage (check out the quote above).

I agree on the Loki thing. Whilst it isn't totally out of the question, I feel his association with Thor dilutes his status as a top rank Avengers' Baddie. Then again, Lex Luthor makes a good JLA antagonist.

Kang has a blue face.

10:08 / 03.07.04

I really agree with bendis when he says the avengers have worst Marvel characters. I mean, no offense to the fans and I know worst isn't the right word (maybe unknown), but these are EARTH´S MIGHTIEST HEROS. they should have the ones people love the most. Marvel's big guns. Then again I may be wrong. But, still, it looks like a lot of fun, without trying to me "revolutionary stuff". The kinda thing i love the most nowadays. Just fun.

>> Wolfy, I've always seen Hawkeye as a ladeez man. Who gives a shit if another writer couldn't pull it off, doesn't mean to say that Bendis can't.

I think the problemwith Auten were: a) captain america would never have that conversation; b) Austen has a really hard time making simple, normall and likeable speeches.

10:08 / 03.07.04

I really agree with bendis when he says the avengers have worst Marvel characters. I mean, no offense to the fans and I know worst isn't the right word (maybe unknown), but these are EARTH´S MIGHTIEST HEROS. they should have the ones people love the most. Marvel's big guns. Then again I may be wrong. But, still, it looks like a lot of fun, without trying to me "revolutionary stuff". The kinda thing i love the most nowadays. Just fun.

>> Wolfy, I've always seen Hawkeye as a ladeez man. Who gives a shit if another writer couldn't pull it off, doesn't mean to say that Bendis can't.

I think the problems with Auten were: a) captain america would never have that conversation; b) Austen has a really hard time making simple, normall and likeable speeches.

Our Lady Has Left the Building

10:53 / 03.07.04

The Avengers are like the pre-Morrison JLA with the disadvantage that you can't really pull out the key Marvel characters to make the best Avengers like you can with the JLA. With the exception of Captain America and maybe Thor for sheer power, everyone else is automatically a second-stringer.

17:08 / 03.07.04

It's hard to put Marvel's big guns in the Avengers. Spider-Man is a geek who's supposed to stay poor. The Avengers pay you. Peter Parker living in a mansion? Yuck. And Hulk's a psycho, who wants that guy on a team. Wolverine's in 7 different books already and kills too many people. Avengers has always kind of been like the Detroit era JLA.

17:54 / 03.07.04

17:47 / 04.07.04

What's all this about Spider-Man joining Avengers? I've also read theories about Wolverine joining too. Then, there's this Guess-the-new-Avengers-Team contest by Bendis.

Matthew Fluxington

18:08 / 04.07.04

The Avengers doesn't need to be like Morrison JLA, and really, neither does the actual JLA (which was infinitely superior during the Giffen years with its loser superheroes.) The Avengers isn't really an all-star team so much as they are the Acceptable Face Of Superheroics. They are the status quo guys, the All-American good guys. They are the Republican super hero team. They are like a sports franchise. Millar has it right in the Ultimates, for the most part.

Matthew Fluxington

18:27 / 04.07.04

Here's my idea of a perfect Avengers team:

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