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Writing Practice

 
  

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fidrich
00:59 / 12.04.03
The main idea behind this thread comes from the "Why Study Writing" thread over in Books (apologise for my lack of net-savvy; I have no idea how to link it). Nick says: [i]...what separates the pros from the amateurs is discipline.

You write even when it's no fun. You write when you'd rather be sunbathing. You write when you'd rather be having sex. You write when you're grieving and when you're so happy you can barely stop laughing. You wake up in the middle of the night and you do get up and write it down, because it won't be there in the morning. You meet the deadlines and you do the work.

Anything which can help you with that is good.[/i]

I'm assuming that I'm not the only one here that is unable to go do a Creative Writing course at college or whatever, and I'm also assuming that there'll be a few more bodies out there who'd appreciate a bit of help in the self-discipline department. So, here's the idea: how about a web-based writing-group type thing? Say once a week an assignment is posted - a certain quota of words on a certain subject in a certain style of writing - and at the end of the week the participants post their results for critisim.

Now, I have absolutley no idea how this would be done, in a practical sense. I don't think it would be possible to use Barbelith; I think it would become too clogged. A mailing list maybe... And as for who would set the assignments, I really like the idea of it being a rotated responsibility - that way, everyone gets a shot at writing on a topic they're really into - but once again I have no idea how it would be done... Which of course is why I'm appealing to all you indgenious creative types for feedback etc.

Has anything like this been done before? Is there anything like this floating around in cyberspace already? If not, is anyone interested in creating it?

-fid
 
 
The Apple-Picker
01:55 / 12.04.03
You can find things like this online. Writing groups are everywhere. You can browse these writing groups at Yahoo! Groups for something that might suit you. You'll find some writing groups that are like online workshops and some writing groups that just dole out prompts and some writing groups that do both and more. Outside of that link to that category, Yahoo! Groups has more specific writing groups tailorted to genre: literary fiction, history, sci fi... lots of stuff. Then, of course, through Google you can find more writing groups online.

The website for Writers Digest Magazine, which I believe is here, offers a new writing prompt daily.

But if you want to try to start a writing community with members culled from Barbelith, you can start recruiting in this thread. There are several ways to create an outpost of Barbelith writers with groups on Yahoo! or MSN or wherever else, but a mailing list would work just fine (I think better), too, if you just want to circulate assignments.
 
 
straylight
04:13 / 12.04.03
If you do sort something like this out, I'd definitely play. A friend of mine once tried to set up a sort of writing-prompt diaryland page, where five or six of us would be given a (non-diaryesque) topic and she would post the varied responses, but it sort of died a quiet death. I think one key thing about an online writing group thing would be making the level of participation highly variable; i.e. make everyone's pieces readable by the group, but don't require that they be read. That sort of thing, so that everyone can participate to the level they choose. I love the idea, though, of everyone having a turn at a topic. It seems like it could be very useful to those who are working on novels or whatnot; if they have a troublesome point of some sort, getting a whole handful of opinions/pieces on it could be very interesting.
 
 
Olulabelle
18:13 / 12.04.03
I would also be keen to join a Lith based writing group and I agree with straylight that the idea of each person setting a topic in rotation is a really great one.

I respect the views and opinions of my fellow Lithers, and I know that often in other writing groups the backgrounds and viewpoints of the members differ so much it can lead to tension unrelated to the writing critiquing. A brief example of this played out in a writing group I once belonged to; Another member wrote a short, fairly uncomplimentary piece on the subject of single parenting and the whole thing degenerated into a flurry of in-fighting and personal attack, which was a/unhelpful to the writer, and b/somewhat tedious for the rest of us.

However, obviously we at Lith are beyond such things. (*Ahem.* What can you mean? Of course we are.) So I'd like to think we could all help each other in a truly constructive and apolitical fashion.

Hmmm. So...er...to clarify, that's an 'I'm in' from me.
 
 
Olulabelle
19:42 / 13.04.03
Bump.

Come on, there must be others who are up for this...
 
 
The Apple-Picker
22:42 / 13.04.03
Since I didn't really express it: yes, I'm a joiner.

It's snowballing. Y'all can't help yourselves. Join. Join. Join.
 
 
adject
00:12 / 14.04.03
I would be interested in this. I took a writing studio for a couple of months and writing regularly (an hour a week) helped me finish one story and start another one. I have not been writing regularly since and although I'm working on other projects, I'd still like something to keep me writing.

I like the idea of varying levels of committment though as I tend to get very busy during the summer (which is fastly approaching). Would this be fiction only? Is anything determined yet?
 
 
The Apple-Picker
13:16 / 14.04.03
Nothing's determined yet, as far as I know. I think, as suggested, the assignments would vary by the person to give them, so some would probably have to do with fiction, some poetry, some....

I think that this would probably be a pick-your-own-commitment level thing. If set up the way that straylight envisions, it seems like we'd have a rotation for who gives assignments. Anyone who wants to put a piece out there for comment could feel free to do so, but no one is obliged to comment.
 
 
fidrich
09:19 / 18.04.03
Yes! This is great!

The commitment level thing is cool, I know not everyone is able to do the same amount. However, may I ask if anyone would be my Arse-Kicker? All you'd have to do is send me an PM/email every now and then saying "Jesus Christ, hurry up already!" (or equivilant). My Internal Arse-Kicker seems to be on holiday, or perhaps in a coma.

Now... If it were a mailing list, would we still be able to read-critique each others work? Do we WANT to be able to read/critique each others work? I'd like to have mine commented on, but whether or not I'll think of anything valuable to say about anyone else's is another matter... And there's the fact that I'm not entirely sure how to set up a mailing list. A yahoo! group would be easiest, I think - but all those ads are so bloody annoying.

Thinking about how we would organise this - how would the rotation work? Perhaps we start the group with a thread in which everyone states their subject and that, and we simply refer back to that each week? And what about duration - do we want this project to last for a set time, or to go on indefinately (what ties in with the number of writers we have - if we have more writers than weeks, who gets to make assignments and who doesn't?)

I imagine the assignments would probably be laid out something like this:

Title: (Or first sentence, scene, whatever)
Style: (Fiction, Non-Fiction, Poetry, Drama, whatever)
Word count: (Optional)

Or, y'know. Whatever.

Ideas! Thoughts! Comments! Recruits!

-fid
 
 
adject
17:00 / 21.04.03
As for method of transmission, I have a webserver where we can run a mailing list if we want to. (I can set it up and all that stuff). No ads.

I think setting a duration for the first "round" might be good only because it will help keep people focused and if people decide they want to continue doing it after that first run (a month or two? writing something every week?) then they could.

Fid (can I call you Fid?), your proposed format seems fine to me, though I am a little wary of word counts. (Not that I'm not talented in the land of Extreme Verbosity, but the less pressure there is, the more I feel free to just write.) That's just my opinion though.

-amy
 
 
Shrug
20:15 / 21.04.03
This sounds promising, I too would like to join.
 
 
Jub
15:06 / 22.04.03
Fidrich - well up for the web-based writing group type thing. Will be sending you a kick up the arse soon!
 
 
fidrich
15:47 / 24.04.03
Adject, that's truly wonderful. I'll love you forever if you could set a mailing list up for us. And I know what you mean about word-counts - my rather crap computer won't count for me, and the thought of sitting and counting each and every word of a short story once a week isn't particularly appealing, even though I do find them quite useful.

So far we have seven participants (myself, Jub, _MatterArisingandtheUnsocialActivities, Adject, The Apple-Picker, Oluabelle and Straylight). Let's say that the group eventually consists of eleven people. Do we decide to taylor the duration of our first "round" to fit with the number of writers - so each person can set an assignment - *or* do we have a shorter round with a few people not getting a turn at the assignment gig? I'd imagine those people get priority over the others in the next round (if there is one).

I think we should leave this "open" for a little while longer to see if more kids wanna play. Those people'll be our final group for the first shot and then we can get started.

-fid (and yes, anyone and everyone is permitted to call me fid )
 
 
adject
18:28 / 30.04.03
Cool... leaving open it is. One question though, what should the name be? (so's I can set up the mailing list & whatnot).

thanks!
 
 
Murray Hamhandler
20:39 / 30.04.03
Well, my summer break's coming up, so I'd have time to join the merry band. I was planning on giving my writing self a boot in the pants this summer anyway and it would probably be nice to have some criticism tossed my way.

So...I'm in, then, I suppose.
 
 
The Apple-Picker
11:47 / 01.05.03
Your enthusiasm is so refreshing, Deric.
 
 
Ethan Hawke
12:03 / 01.05.03
I believe I would be interested, although I'm notorious (in my mind) for abandoning this sort of thing once it gets started.
 
 
gingerbop
21:16 / 01.05.03
Quite possibly i would like to join- I would like to retain the ability vaguely write, even if its a bitty pants. And after exams. (3 weeks) But tis a groovy idea- i like. I'd hate to write in college etc, i just cant do it with anyone i want to speak to around me.
 
 
Bomb The Past
13:18 / 02.05.03
Count me in.
 
 
We're The Great Old Ones Now
16:55 / 02.05.03
Let me suggest that the end of your curriculum be the writing of a long-form piece of work: a play of not less than one hundred minutes' duration, a film script, or a novel.

I propose this because it seems a shame to put so much effort into something which is 'just practice'. Most such works are learning experiences. That doesn't mean they're not also grown-up pieces of work.

So I'd suggest that you move quite rapidly from short-exercise work to planning and executing, with as much or as little of each other's help and encouragement as you each want, the actual real thing. Not everyone has to go all the way, of course, but anyone what actually wants to be a writer, whatever that actually means, could take heart from the fellow strugglers. It's an immense help to know that the person next to you is working really hard - gets you determined to work harder...

So... why not lay out a curriculum which goes in a few weeks from finger exercises to concerto? Then you've got a serious mountain to climb, but also at the end of it you have something which is worth the effort, rather than a lot of short pieces which are "great but... ...?
 
 
Murray Hamhandler
17:16 / 02.05.03
Your enthusiasm is so refreshing, Deric.

Heh. Yeah. Sorry. Severe tooth pain will do that to a body. I promise to be more excited after I get my wisdom teeth yanked.
 
 
The Apple-Picker
17:21 / 02.05.03
Yikes. I did that. All four. My sympathies.
 
 
We're The Great Old Ones Now
17:48 / 02.05.03
They used a bonesaw for mine. But I had lovely drugs and it was all over quickly - I was out for the op and recovered with due speed. No fun, but no real big one either.

Did you guys have feelings on my rather huge suggestion?
 
 
slinkyvagabond
22:41 / 02.05.03
I wouldn't mind, after my exams (2 weeks). The idea's a little terrifying but it's been so long. I miss stories.
 
 
The Apple-Picker
15:42 / 03.05.03
I think it's a brilliant suggestion. But I think we should keep the "finger exercises" going even while we plan and execute our mondo tasks, as a sort of warm up.
 
 
The Apple-Picker
15:49 / 03.05.03
Also, I should note that I think that having a lot of short pieces that are "great but..." is just as worthwhile to me as having written a novel. I just used the words "warm-up" because if a novel is a marathon, then the 5 or 10K of a short piece is a warm-up.
 
 
Phex: Dorset Doom
19:09 / 03.05.03
Okay, I'm in.
So far we have....
Myself, Fidrich, Apple-Picker, Straylight, Olulable, Adject, MatterArising, Jub, Dericgeneric, T.O.D.D, Nick, Gingerbop, Dead Flower, Slinkyvagabond: that's thirteen (apologies to anyone I missed.)
Should we put a cap on the number of joiners, say twenty or fifteen? Just for the sake of logistics, and so we have enough time to read and digest everyone's pieces (latecomers are free to start their own groups)
Also, who's going to be setting the assignments? Will they be weekly? Monthly? The most equitable way would be for us to pick a name from a hat, or maybe work out the alpha-numeric value of everyone's online-name and go from highest to lowest or vice-versa.

Nick, I like the idea of a magnum opus at the end of it all, when each member has had a go being chairman, which gives the whole thing the vibe of a training montage from a kung-fu movie.
 
 
Phex: Dorset Doom
19:10 / 03.05.03
Damn my artistic-left-brain bias!
Fourteen people, it's FOURTEEN.
 
 
Less searchable M0rd4nt
19:46 / 03.05.03
I'd like to tentatively put my hat in the ring for this. I'm not around as much as I used to be so my input might be a bit sporadic, though.
 
 
gingerbop
14:26 / 04.05.03
The 'novel-at-the-end' would be fine, but there'd be no way i could do such a big thang; but see what you mean about "good, but.."
 
 
Char Aina
14:38 / 04.05.03
i'm down.


we should definitely make a barbelith book, and then use our collective might to release it. even if it flops, it would be one for the archives, no?



also, i will play, but i warn you of my writing chops; occasionally i rule, occasionally i suck, often i am uninteligible.

but you knew that.
 
 
We're The Great Old Ones Now
16:12 / 04.05.03
I'll try to participate as much as I can, but... this is already what I do for a living. So I have a new script to write over the next two months or so, and may not be able to play properly, as it were.

Gingerbop - whyever not?
 
 
Murray Hamhandler
17:39 / 04.05.03
Right. I'll be significantly less busy over the summer than I have been during the school year, but the posibility exists that I may have to work full time, which would reduce my free time slightly. Plus, I'm already going to be working on art for at least one Jenny Everywhere tale (for impulsivelad). So I may not be able to contribute as much as I would like to.
 
 
Mr Messy
09:35 / 05.05.03
Hmmm. None of you know me, I've just been listening in over the last week or so, but I'd love to join in with this. Are strangers welcome?
I've felt inspired to write recently, but have only managed 3 pages over the last 3 months! I definitly could do with some discipline and structure.
Also have big travels planned later in the year, and the web-based thing fits perfectly with having no fixed abode.
 
 
Char Aina
16:14 / 05.05.03
i like strangers.
i'm sure they all feel the same way.
 
  

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