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Judith Butler is like *so* 1992...

  
  

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Goodness Gracious Meme
12:36 / 28.01.02
like, totally, dude

right. time to pick the brains of the proper theory bitches.

gimme contemporary queer/tran/bi/gender theory and gimme now... or stuff on boundaries, communities etc. sorry this is vague but those of you who've seen me rant probably have an idea of what I'm getting at...(got some birthday money coming up and want some of the good stuff)

and btw, does anyone round here rate Peggy Phelan (not as much as me, probably, but IMHO people out there should be reading Unmarked: the politics of performance and Mourning Sex erforming public memory)

c'mon. hit me...

[ 28-01-2002: Message edited by: Lick my plums, bitch. ]
 
 
Jackie Susann
09:08 / 29.01.02
Well, nobody has replaced Judith Butler in the sense of being The Big Name In Queer Theory the way she was a few years ago. But she's been criticised from enough angles to thoroughly displace her from that position (i.e., the brilliant Eve Sedgwick & Adam Frank intro to their Sylvan Tomkins collection, which utterly slags off Butler despite barely mentioning her). Not to mention her unbearably tedious prose style...

My main recommendation is Elspeth Probyn's 'Carnal Appetites' (possibly called 'Carnal Identities') about rethinking sexual politics/identity in terms of food and eating - yet much better than that sounds. It is very well argued, and beautifully written in places. The theoretical background is mostly Foucault/Deleuze (a combo i like).

Others I would suggest are William Haver's 'The Body of This Death' - unbelievably densely written, often incomprehensible, but again, beautiful. Kind of Derridean but I won't hold that against him - it's a pretty small book with incredible scope, about AIDS, Hiroshima, Nagasaki, death, epistemology, literary criticism, sex, and history. William Haver is so sexy, I have a totaly theory-crush on him.

Jose Esteban Munoz - 'Disidentifications' - incredible book about queer performance artists of colour, includes discussions of their performances as well as theoretical implications and identity/community politics.

Judith Halberstam 'Female Masculinity' - combining historical research, theory, lit/film crit with ethnology; already some kind of classic because her writing is just so damn likeable.

Samuel Delany - 'Times Square Red, Times Square Blue'. Two long essays, one about all the sex he's had on Times Square (fantastic!), the other more theoretical one about urban planning, gentrification, public sex, and the (then) planned development of Times Square into yuppie disney.

Alternately, if you want big 'continental' up'n'coming star on 'community' I reckon Agamben's 'The Coming Community' - slim but very thought provoking and getting name-dropped in all the right places. Although one guy I spoke to thought Agamben was passe, so what do I know? It isn't queer, but on the other hand the central theory is 'whatever', which is really kind of camp...

None of these are terribly new, I can't think of anything that came out in the last year. But I am now a rapidly obscelescing ex-theory bitch so...
 
 
Disco is My Class War
09:08 / 29.01.02
Yeah, what Crunchy said. Also check out a fantastic but expensive book called The Eight Technologies of Otherness -- edited by Sue Golding, among others (or maybe it's just edited by her.) It's a crazy collection of essays around the themes of identity, sexuality, race, gender... some pretty amazing stuff.

Also check out Sue Golding's essay 'Sexual Manners', whch Crunchy can give you a reference for (I only have a photocopy of it with no biblio details.
 
 
Jackie Susann
09:08 / 29.01.02
'Sexual Manners' is in an early 90s collection called 'Pleasure Principles', which is very good and also features contributions from Del LaGrace (then Della Grace). Another really good essay of Golding's is 'Pariah Bodies', in 'sexy bodies' edited by Liz Grosz and, I think, Elspeth Probyn - but I wouldn't buy the collection just for that essay.

'Eight Technologies' is definitely very good, with great pieces by (for example) the aforementioned William Haver, Kathy Acker, Vron Ware, Cathy Opie, Paul Gilroy, Zachary Nataf, Joan Nestle, Alucquere Stone, etc., etc. One of its subtexts is definitely 'Judith Butler is passe', although nobody actually says that.
 
 
pantone 292
19:11 / 30.01.02
oh my god. oh my god. *smack* well, Derrida is *so* 1967. Deleuze & Guattari are *so* 1972, and those two are dead so doubly doubly forgettably buried...

Antigone's Claim anyone? Contingency, Hegemony, Universality?

Halberstam is just *so* thin. cute, nice, likeable, but thin. and positively anti-theory.

Agamben half mystifies and half fascinates me - 'the coming being is whatever being' - this I like, a lot.

8 technologies as a collection I do rate - read Adrian Rifkin for subtle erotic well written loveliness [ and see his book on Ingres for queering art history]. But i also think that johnny publishes a lot of people s/he likes whatever they write - check out hir Jan van Eyck journal for a lot of the same names.

For exquisite prose get Denise Riley the Words of Selves: Identification, Solidarity, Irony
 
 
Jackie Susann
20:39 / 30.01.02
Really, I think Derrida is more mid to late 80s - surely that is when his star was at its brightest in the anglo-american academy? Only to fade for the Foucault boom, which is now in remission; Deleuze and Guattari are, like, five minutes ago. Now is the time to get on the 'I was over them first' bandwagon.

You are so mean! I don't know how you can say Halberstam is 'positively' anti-theory. What about the theory-dense 'Posthuman Bodies' collection she co-edited, or the border wars chapter in Female Masculinity. Just 'cause she's not writing jargon-junk for ivory towers...
 
 
Disco is My Class War
22:19 / 30.01.02
In this neck of the woods, Guattari *by himself* is making a comeback, Bluestocking. But then, maybe that's just in my circle of ex-university kids. I haven't been to uni for two years now; I have no idea what's going on, except that some close friends are *very* into Bataille and think his stuff about general economy holds the solution to a lot of different issues. (hey medea!)

And Halberstam does theory, I'll have you know *grin*. It's just... uh.... strategic specific and molecular.
 
 
Cat Chant
06:39 / 31.01.02
Well, I don't do contemporary (apart, of course, from Judy B's 2001 book Antigone's Claim, which is also far easier/nicer prose than some of her earlier stuff), so I'm just going to recommend Cixous "Sorties" (on two types of bisexuality) and probably "Neuter" as well, though I haven't read it yet.

Oh, and Rosa: there are a few hardcore Batailleans here on Gauda Prime, too, but I suspect it's becoming rather 1999.

[ 31-01-2002: Message edited by: Deva ]
 
 
Haus about we all give each other a big lovely huggle?
06:54 / 31.01.02
quote:Originally posted by Rosa d'Ruckus:
In this neck of the woods, Guattari *by himself* is making a comeback, Bluestocking.


Ah....but what happens when he meets his former friend and tag team partner DeLeuze at Summerslam for the Intercontinental Championship?

This thread is so making me feel like the village idiot - so much ineffably cool stuff to read, and only the sputtering light of my firefly brain to read them by.

However, I would liek to say that, theory neophyte though I am, I thought Phelan's Mourning Sex was fantastic. It seems Butlerian, or post-Butlerian I guess, but the way performativity is embedded in the theory makes for incredibly readable and involving text. Basically a series of juxtapositions on the theme of trauma, the text itself becomes traumatised - the meditation on Holbein's Ambassadors and the Rodney King beating, from the point of view of a bereaved woman, is very cool indeed.

God, my critical lexicon reduced to "cool". What does the panel recommend for blithering eejits?
 
 
pantone 292
06:54 / 31.01.02
*here comes another burst of hastily scrambled together stuff*
re: dates, am being sarky cos my buttons are being nudged! 1967 = french publication of derrida's of grammatology, 1972 = french publication of d=g's anti-oedipus, was relating that to 1992 as in between publications of Gender Trouble and Bodies that Matter - yes, course i recognise that as judy fever time but wasnt such a lot of that based on the voluntaristic misreading of performativity? [i.e. so i can change my gender like i change clothing in the way i which i want to, as i say so]
i hate the fashionability of theory as way of dissing stuff! I can't even explain my love of Judy since the one thing that I don't like about her writing is that I don't find it erotic. Whereas I do find Derrida erotic. D+G I haven't properly read....giving me massively negative points here i guess,having been put off by the lumpy prose of Anti-Oedipus...though possibly tempted down Deleuze lane by such lines as
'there is always another breath in my breath, another thought in my thought, another possession in what i possess, a thousand things and a thousand beings implicated in my complications.' from The Logic of Sense.
sadly havent read phelan though have purchased her at last.
halberstam's collection i also havent read - but have heard her speak several times and read bits of FM. I really worry about the inside/outside, theory/practice divide! Though it isn't a 'proper' divide - theory always practices, practice is inevitably theoretical. I can't help it - I love theory! theory *matters*. More later!
 
 
sleazenation
10:08 / 31.01.02
OK, to remodel Plum's orginal question a bit, where does one (aside from here) go for news on theory post uni. There was a cool old zine called theory slut, but i haven't seen much of it recently
 
 
pantone 292
11:20 / 31.01.02
theory slut sounds great.
culture machine is quite good, if not so sexy sounding
have lots of similar type links chez moi
 
 
Goodness Gracious Meme
13:05 / 31.01.02
v.good question Sleaze, think mine's partly about how to keep in touch with this stuff when you're (way, in my case) out of academia/not around any related fields and almost permanently have no money?... how to keep up?

wow. thanks people - lots for familial present lists... and was mainly being silly about the 'so '92 malarkey'...

Crunchy, have been peering at the Munoz longingly in bookshops for ages. maybe i'll splurge... And actually have read the William Haver thing, agree about the scope, found it hard to believe it wasn't some 1000-page doorstop.

Like the sound of the 'eight technologies' thing very much...

And 'Sexy Bodies: the strange carnalities of feminism' is indeed Grosz/Probyn and patchy, as i remember...

quote: I really worry about the inside/outside, theory/practice divide! Though it isn't a 'proper' divide - theory always practices, practice is inevitably theoretical.

Absolutely - IMHO there's not much point to either otherwise... the inside/outside thing I only really relate to in terms of being inside/outside 'the academy' with the access/resources/context/arguable lack of distance/contacts the one or the other position may provide.

(says plums-who took an excusably long time to seperate being a theory bitch from being an academic in her own head.)
 
 
pantone 292
20:28 / 31.01.02
australian humanities review
cultronix

ctheory
hope i'm not just repeating already seens, i quite like 'em...
i know you're teasin' 'plums...

[ 31-01-2002: Message edited by: Out of the Bluestocking ]
 
 
Disco is My Class War
22:00 / 31.01.02
'Judy Fever'. It sounds like such a *horrible* way to die.

Blue, I was being ironic and self-deprecating with the faddery stuff too. And I'll bet Crunchy was, too. People take these fads awfully seriously, and it's so stupid when you realise that half the people doing PhD's using, say, Deleuze as their primary theoretical ground were only doing so (this was when I was at uni, maybe it's just about stopped now) because it was cool to do so; the Deleuze kids at my uni were a rebellious little vanguard who took themselves far too seriously, myself included.

Anyhow, the reason I like Jack Halberstam -- and Jacob Hale, too, in different ways -- is that they attempt to mesh personal experience with theory in a way which bypasses the academy's distanciation... The worst theory is an excuse to distance oneself -- cf. Baudrillard, sometimes -- and the best theory, to me, has the ability to be self-reflexive and create a feedback loop whereby 'personal experience' is interrogated as vigorously as 'critical analysis' or 'theoretical postulations'. At least that's one sign of my favourite kind of theory. At the opposite extreme is the example of an acquaintance of mine who's doing her Masters about zines and zine culture. her supervisor told her *not* to do her own zine, because that would mess with her objectivity. *sigh* And we thought that idea had gone out with FR Levis or Levi-Strauss.

Also, yeah, let's debate the meaning of the word 'theory'. Because I am interested in praxis, or a definition of theory which allows for various practices -- activism, organising, not just writing but creating and naming spaces in the world, and performance -- as a process of ideas-making. If that's not theory, what is?
 
 
Jackie Susann
02:50 / 01.02.02
Theory = ideas + jargon.

Anyway, just to backtrack and justify, the "like so 1992" thing came up when Bill (jokingly) accused the people he was arguing with of just trying to be trendy Butlerians, hence my if-we-were-trying-to-be-trendy-we'd-do-better-than-Butler blurt. And yes, it is annoying when people dismiss theories/writers as fads (esp. since anything can be made into a fad if you don't like it) but on the other hand, it is annoying when academics act as if their judgements are pure, not based on social forces (including intellectual fashions).

Meanwhile, *any* argument about theory/practice (whether it's: theory first, practice first, inevitably interconnected, whatever) is, I reckon, a diversionary tactic justifying (in the guise of analysing) the speaker's personal preferences. it's just a way of confusing definitions - obscuring the institutional production of 'theory' by identifying it simply with intellectual activity as such, or vice versa, etc. god, talk about vulgar marxism.

bear in mind my cynicism is largely defensiveness (and at least somewhat it-is-really-hot-today-and-i-have-a-chip-on-my-shoulder)
 
 
Medea Zero
02:29 / 03.02.02
I guess its not really queer stuff but if you're talking citizenship and community stuff, I'd look around at some other stuff. Jean-Luc Nancy's [yes, its true, I have a Nancy fetish] The Sense of the World and The Inoperative Community both dedicate a lot of space to the kinda things you're looking at. And, as people have pointed out, Agamben is *really* good for this stuff too ... I'd also be inclined to look at stuff like Balibar's recent article "Outlines of a Topography of Cruelty: Citizenship and Cruelty in an Era of Global Violence" in Constellations 8:1 (2001) pp. 15-29. And, of course, as Rosa has already suggested I recommend, Georges Bataille's The Accursed Share volumes 1, 2 and 3; particularly volume 2, which is titled 'Eroticism'. He rocks. And, yeah, another [recently - sob ] dead french dude: try looking at Bourdieu's stuff on citizenship, habitus, etc.

As for Butler ... yeah, maybe a little 1992. But no-one's kinda surpassed her, yet; although Halberstam gets huge points for genderfucking, theoryfucking spunk. I have recently discovered Excitable Speech and I almost like it better than Bodies That Matter , which I really love.

As for bad early 90s theory; Grosz, anyone?????

Sorry this is vague; my brain is in storage ....

[ 03-02-2002: Message edited by: Medea Zero ]
 
 
laughing boy
09:55 / 12.02.02
Excitable Speech kicks all ass. But Epistemology of the Closet (Sedgwick) has just gone out of print, which makes no sense at all.

And I quite like Grosz because she made Lacan slightly more understandable in her book - don't quote me - An Introduction to Lacan and Feminist Theory. The recent collection of transaltions from Lacan's 'Ecrit' is really good, if a little hard core. Mmmmm... French psychoanalysis...
 
 
Disco is My Class War
09:55 / 12.02.02
French Schmench. But you're telling me that Epistemologies has gone out of print, which I simply cannot believe. What about Tendencies, does anyone know? (Tendencies is a pretty fantastic book of essays, the best being Eve's essay on Michael Moon and white glasses. Actually in some ways I think it's nearly as useful as 'Axiomatic', which is the intro to Epistemologies of the Closet.)

Oh, excuse me, I'm theorybitching again.
 
 
alas
00:21 / 13.02.02
I like the journal Critical Inquiry--in the US it's $38/year, which might be a little steep? (I'm seemingly only precariously attached to the Internet tonight, or I'd link--they're published out of the U Chicago P); there was a special issue on Intimacy that was wonderful I think, edited by Lauren Berlant a few years ago (now out in book form) with (along with a funky essay by Sedgwick about loving her therapist), an essay entitled "Adultery" by Laura Knipkis (or smtg?) which I've been thinking about because of the love thread...

re: connection to daily life: last night I read an essay by Baudrillard translated into English reprinted in the February issue of Harper's Magazine--it was originally in Le Monde, called "L'Esprit du Terrorisme." (Surely it's been reprinted elsewhere?) It's a pretty breathtaking take on 9/11 from a theory slut (gotta luv that term) perspective ....
 
 
laughing boy
15:21 / 14.02.02
".. But you're telling me that Epistemologies has gone out of print, which I simply cannot believe. "

Well, I'd love to be proven wrong. But when I tried to order a copy in my local bookshop I was told that the American publishers said it was out of print. Boo, hiss. So now i'm photocopying a copy from the library.

Oh, and I remembered about Rae Langton, who writes about pornography and speech act theory. She's great, she is.
 
 
pantone 292
20:23 / 15.02.02
Butler is in LONDON March 8th 5.30 in uni of london...cannot remember where... pm me and i'll see if i can find the address, she's talking on 'Violence, Mourning, Politics'
 
 
Jackie Susann
05:27 / 18.02.02
When/why did mourning become such a hot topic for big name post-structuralists? When Derrida came to my uni a couple of years ago, he spoke on mourning and forgiveness. (Not trying to name drop, I think Derrida is a boring shit.) Does anybody else think this is a trend that's been developing for a few years now and want to speculate on why?

And, dare I ask, did Plums pick up any of the recommendations? Which one(s)?
 
 
pantone 292
15:30 / 18.02.02
Judith Butler on Friday 8 March at 5.30pm in
> Cruciform Lecture Theatre 1 at University College London (entrance
on Gower Street). The title of the lecture is "Violence, Mourning,Politics". If you would like to attend, please email
> lorna.mcconville@sagepub.co.uk by 21 February 2002.
them's the details...

Antigone's Claim [2000] has a lot in it to do with public mourning and the state in light of non-state recognised kinships, esp. in the context of people dying from AIDS related illnesses. I haven't read Phelan's Mourning Sex. UK journal parallax is doing an issue next year called Mourning Revolution, btw.
 
 
Goodness Gracious Meme
14:48 / 21.02.02
Thanks, blue... think i might well try and get to this...

Oh and Deva, I didn't express myself very well, as per, I meant recently-written stuff, ie for someone who's been out of touch with the whole academic thing for for a few years, rather than stuff with a contemporary focus (which reminds me, the Rifkind/Ingres thing is indeed fab if anyone wants queered arthistorical practice). Sorry if unclear.

With my two-second attention span (and newly tiny bank balance), I'm now obsessing over a bunch of counselling and pyschotherapy theoretical texts, so am all a-dither. But think I might spring for the Munoz, as it sounds too good to leave, as does the 8 technologies thing, as do loads of the others..1.. grrr.
 
 
Lugue
18:03 / 25.04.09
So: assuming there may yet be anyone around who cares: regarding queer and feminist theory specifically, would anyone be able to tell me what's popped up in the last few years that's been particularly productive? My college is stuck in the past (my teachers were programmed in structuralism and then moved on to nothing in particular). Which means I'm resourceless as far as growing in these directions go. Speak to me (if there's more here than dust and DEATH).
 
 
oryx
19:05 / 27.04.09
For queer with a Lacanian bent, try Tim Dean's On Sexuality.

Leo Bersani is a bit 90's, but worth a read if you havent already.

Lee Edelman is a bit mavericky, but his book No Future is quite an interesting provocation.

There's an anthology coming out later this year called Queer in Europe (pub. Ashgate, I think), which might also be of interest.

If I think of anything else, I'll come back to the thread.
 
 
Lugue
20:21 / 02.05.09
No Future seems appealingly insane. More importantly, it's not, or doesn't seem to be, exclusively centered on contemporary issues. I think I'm leaning towards (re)readings of representation(s), specifically, so it might be an investment.
Can do without psychoanalysis, though.
What's Bersani's deal?

And thank you.
 
 
oryx
20:02 / 09.05.09
Bersani's take on queer focuses on homosexual men. See if you can get a hold of his essay "Is The Rectum A Grave?" as its very good. He argues that because of AIDS the homosexual male body has become a site for the dissolution of the self.

If you read it, let me know what you think.
 
 
Shrug
15:00 / 14.05.09
I found Thomas Yingling's "AIDS in America: Postmodern Governance, Identity and Experience" a good companion piece to Bersani's "Is the Rectum a Grave?"
Douglas Crimp and Simon Watney might be worth a look in too.
 
 
Lugue
18:45 / 14.05.09
I won't be able to get my hands on any of it soon - but thanks, to both.
 
 
Disco is My Class War
09:29 / 15.05.09
Heather Love is great. And so is Ann Cvetkovich. And Lauren Berlant. Also Adi Kuntsman, who just released their first book I think. Check em out.
 
 
Lugue
12:47 / 15.05.09
And thanks, again!

But: there's at least three people dropping suggestions, which I wasn't even expecting, so I'm wondering: can (any of) you maybe explain a bit further how and why you find these people of interest? What's of use in them? What uses have you made of them? What sets them apart? Are there particular general trends and themes you find interesting? What's working, what's not?

If you don't want to drop a word here in the tomb, you can pm. I might do so, actually, if any specific questions pop up after I've had the time to look around. It's not lazyness - I understand I can probably get the gist of things online; I'd just like context, your context.
 
 
Shrug
23:27 / 27.05.09
There's some discussion on the Yingling piece here, back when I was having much trouble deciphering a certain passage.

Hmmm, honestly, I haven't kept current with my queer theory reading and a lot of it seems to have slipped out of my head, as regards the Crimp, Watney, Bersani pieces, but I do remember finding them very interesting and very applicable to much literature and film I was reading/watching at the time. I think it may have been Crimp and Watney who having been in a relationship opened up much theoretical back and forth between each other. Although, on that I may be mistaken, it's been a while. There seemed to be (maybe in the Crimp pieces I read) much interesting work on the photographic, general media representation of people with AIDS / HIV.... if I said anything else it'd be beyond grasping, however.
 
 
Lugue
20:50 / 22.06.09
Thanks, I'll pocket that for Summer. None of this seems linked to masculinity (or femininity, or otherwise), not directly concerned with it at least, which is a shame; I was hoping for something a bit more entangled in gender. Well, since this place is more than dead, I might as well say: if there's anyone around that knows of online spaces where this kind of stuff can be (better) discussed - genderisms and queerisms, basically - then feel free to drop me a word (I don't expect you to - but hey, faith).
 
  

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