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Osama Video Probably Fake -evidence

 
  

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Jackie Susann
20:19 / 25.12.01
quote: Just a small point but even if Osma Bin Laden isn't responsible for this bombing he's already been convicted in a US court of law of planning the first World Trade center bomb.

Sorry, can you provide a bit more information? I am under the impression the earliest WTC bombings were carried out in the early 70s by people involved in the Weather Underground, while the towers were still under construction (as discussed by Andrew Ross in the essay 'Blowing Up The Big Apple' - written at a time that title wasn't grossly inappropriate, I should add.)

Meanwhile, Dao, arguing that nobody could provide a 'right course' for the last few months strikes me as fairly facile; as if the only basis for ethical action was absolute correctness. The US government's apparently intends to use a spurious 'war on terrorism' as an excuse to wage war against a whole set of middle eastern governments hostile to the interests of western capital. You don't have to know what 'the' right thing to do is, to say that's the wrong thing.

Meanwhile, your US-centricity is unbelievable - the important thing is what's happening to civil rights in the US? I suspect some Afghanis might disagree with you, there, not to mention Pakistanis and Iraqis, or even westerners in the UK, Australia, etc. who are facing similar attacks on civil society.
 
 
Naked Flame
09:10 / 27.12.01
From my now-out-of-date NYC guidebook:

quote: terrorists... set off a truck bomb in the underground parking garage on Feb 26, 1993, killing 6 people.

If you want to do some more digging there's an archive here that has plenty more.

Newsflash. There's another tape now.
 
 
Lionheart
09:10 / 27.12.01
http://dailynews.yahoo.com/h/nm/20011226/ts/attack_video_dc_4.html

I really like the last sentence...

quote:``I don't know if it's real, if it's new, if it's old,'' said Richard McGraw, a senior Pentagon spokesman.
 
 
Rev. Wright
10:12 / 27.12.01
I think this thread may take another turn if you are aware of the lastest video release from Bin Laden. I saw it this morning and have to declare that the man in this latest video looks very little like the one in the 'evidence'.
Two points on the clip;
Why would a media propogandist such as Osama, let an individual with a camcorder film him. Especially as he is aware of the coming war. Reports of a complex and successful video message delivery service, by Bin Laden, also confounds this idea.

The coalition is using footage that they can't substanciate, whilst also giving press releases that contradict on whether they know where Osama is or not. This has been occuring in teh press in the UK constantly. With such an amount of disinformation, how can anyone who is media aware, trust the information/evidence present to them?

In ten years time we may get an angle on the motivations behind the events this year and since 1992. OIl, Politics, Religion, Power?
 
 
Naked Flame
13:56 / 27.12.01
Fascinating. A US official casting doubt on the veracity of a tape in which Bin Laden explicitly states his responsibility for 9/11.

I don't quite know what to make of that. But it's interesting that they choose to vouch for the authenticity of the 'candid' tape and not what appears to be a direct statement by UBL. I wonder if that has something to do with UBL's explaination of the purpose behind the attacks...

Israel is looking more and more like the crucible of world disaster/peace. Depending on which way it goes.
 
 
Sharkgrin
16:35 / 27.12.01
Fascinating. Heh.
I think its fascinating nobody is even debating the authenticity of the Al Jazeera-released tape, but will put anything by 'found' by the US under a microscope. 'Conspiracy' is this year's black.

Before the another episode of the 'When Alternative Police/Nazi's Attack!', can appear on the Animal Channel, I'll point out:

1 - Ol' Dirty Ladin is a master of media manipulation. He releases two-perfectly timed video tapes from wherever, by double-monkey-secret courier, past CIA dupes, to an Al Jazeera flunky, to be released at specific dates and times.

2 - Ol' Dirty Ladin specifically bombs the Africa embassies in Aug, 98, to rid the US military influence of Saudi Arabia, NOT AT THAT TIME to releive the Palestinian effort. In that time, Pres. Clinton basically offers and support the building of the Palestinain mini-state:
.Citation # 1
Citation # 2
Citation # 3

3 - When the Al Jazeera releases the first 9/11 tape, Ol' Dirty Ladin wanted the US military influence of Saudi Arabia first AND US to stop backing, Israel. Oops, I forgot to mention their is still unrest brewing, over the last year.

4 - In the latest video, Bin Laden mentions a lot about American attrocities but but only mentions a specific current event in Afghanistan, the mosque, I beleive.IMHO, Ol' Dirty Ladin knows a damn thing about the country he dragged in to this mess.

Summary of the above: Bin Ladin might not like Americans in general and maight not object to killing innocent people (regardless of nationality) to demostrate this (unless African citizens walking the street near the embassies don't count as people, much less those arrogant, conniving Americans, scheming up in their diabolical skyscrapers).

When the heat is on, Ol' Dirty Ladin throws in an unrelated, but currently-volatile side issues into the demands, (which by the way, other US Presidents had busted their asses to make progress through).

Clearly, the Dark Lord 'W' created Ol' Dirty Ladin as a digital image back before August, 1998, ran him through a Washington-think-tank, and forgot to keep the list of demands consistent, and also forgot to inform Pres. Clinton of the current World Domination Project. The Dark Lord 'W' obviously can mainlpulate the Al Jazeera network , and sponsors many of the Al-Quaeda cells, since at least 1998.

Either that or Ol'Dirty Ladin is a violent demagogue, who is a wishy-washy thug who just wants to start a fight w/ the US, using any handy issue he can.

Right now, I am manipulating a flash-animation cartoon using cut-outs of the Dark Lord 'W' using a sock puppet Bin Ladin threatening to bomb innocent people if the US doesn't de-crimnalize cocaine and drunk-driving.
 
 
The resistable rise of Reidcourchie
17:44 / 27.12.01


[ 27-12-2001: Message edited by: The resistable rise of Reidcourchie ]
 
 
The Natural Way
11:23 / 28.12.01
When OBL talks he uses his hands signs to emphasis his words or the topic or he closes a topic with his hands, this man was a bad lip singer, not enough Kareoke I guess.

Was that a joke?
 
 
Naked Flame
12:18 / 28.12.01
Sharkgrin- i like your explication of the alternative readings of the situation and I share your apparent disdain for conspiracy... but US officials have been casting nasturtiums on the validity of the latest tape. Which is still very very curious.

I'm not into conspiracies. I think the world is essentially too chaotic for a simple explanation to survive scrutiny. But I'd like to know a little more about the complexities in this one.
 
 
DaveBCooper
12:50 / 28.12.01
I'm reminded of 'Monty Python and the Holy Grail'...

"Well, yes, we did do the nose... and the hat."

DBC
 
 
Jack The Bodiless
13:49 / 28.12.01
'Casting nasturtiums?' That's my line! You're stealing my lines! Bad Flame...
 
 
Naked Flame
15:54 / 28.12.01
My Mum says it. And she's bigger than you. So there.
 
 
STOATIE LIEKS CHOCOLATE MILK
19:38 / 28.12.01
Yeah... heard 'em on the radio this morning saying Rumsfeld doesn't believe the new tape... wondering why. Is it cos it's fake? Is it cos they're gonna tell us he's already dead? is it cos he IS already dead? Is it... a million and one other reasons?
Seems weird. Dunno why, and not necessarily suspicious. Probably, but not necessarily.
Off-topic question #1- why is the whole India/Pakistan thing getting, like, THIRD billing in the news?
Off-topic question #2- Do you realise how much bigger MY mum is than yours? And she's been saying "casting nasturtiums" since before I even knew what "aspersions" were!
 
 
Sharkgrin
11:33 / 29.12.01
Flame, I don't know what nasturiums (hanging garden plant with red and yellow flowers?) mean in this context, but you are dead on about the complexity of this.
I have no illusions about the Dark Lord 'W' using role-playing game language, like 'good vs. evil' and 'dead or alive', to not address the oil problems or the simple need for revenge.
I just don't think it's productive to burn a lot of mental energy and, more importantly, emotional energy, into constructing elaborate conspiracies. 'Cause I failed Ominscience 101 back in school, I will never abosulutely defend my position.
I do beleive that if Ol' Dirty Ladin is egocentric and believes in himself to a fault - if the US-knabbed video tape is not actually him, I predict Ol' Dirty Ladin will claim its a fake; if it is his own image, then he will not address it. Stay tuned to the Al-Jazeera network.
Good vs. Evil? More like two spoiled sons of super-rich oil beneficiaries slapping their 'power and influence' dicks on the Middle East table.

[ 29-12-2001: Message edited by: Sharkgrin ]
 
  

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