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Underground > Film, TV & Theatre >

I Fucking Hate 'Friends'

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Haus about we all give each other a big lovely huggle?

12:31 / 28.01.02

...says, we find ourselves stopping at once again, the man who has some great ideas for making Rogue a really psychologically interesting character.

It could be that tastes vary between individuals rather than being right or wrong.

Or, you know, you could be wrong.

12:32 / 28.01.02

Oh dear Flux, I'm afraid I'm going to have to stake you now...

Buffys great, its fun ! nice little funny lines...and eh Sarah Michelle Gellar and Eliza Dushku - why would you need anything else - ever !

12:34 / 28.01.02

mazarine: a sprog (or sproglet, if i'm feeling charitable) is a small child.

Matthew Fluxington

12:43 / 28.01.02

quote:
...says, we find ourselves stopping at once again, the man who has some great ideas for making Rogue a really psychologically interesting character.

I'm not sure why this would be different (or worse) than searching for the deeper meaning of Buffy The Vampire Slayer. Your second point is obvious and well taken...but I was speaking for myself, it should be noted. I'm baffled by the rest of you...

Sarah Michelle Gellar and Eliza Dushku - why would you need anything else - ever !

How about that one who was also in the American Pie movie?

!!!!KINDA SORTA NOT REALLY SPOILER ALERT!!!!!!!!

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...and say, why was it that when I watched the last few minutes of a recent episode was the red haired girl who is apparently a lesbian having a huge crush on some guy? Did the UPN tell them they couldn't have lesbian characters anymore?

[ 28-01-2002: Message edited by: Flux = Pop Cultural Ninja ]

12:47 / 28.01.02

quote:Originally posted by Flux = Pop Cultural Ninja:
re: Buffy vs. Friends

Oh, I think Friends is far better than Buffy...I really strongly dislike Buffy, and I'm really baffled what the lot of you folks, who are otherwise quite intelligent and tasteful, see in it. It's fucking awful! It's an artier Saved By The Bell or Beverly Hills 90120 with vampires, for fuck's sake....

Dude! That is, like, so short sighted and not true and..

..oh my god, I think It's reached the brain.

Regrettable Juvenilia

12:51 / 28.01.02

quote:Originally posted by Flux = Pop Cultural Ninja:
I'm not sure why this would be different (or worse) than searching for the deeper meaning of Buffy The Vampire Slayer.

Er - I think that's the point, Flux mate.

quote:...and say, why was it that when I watched the last few minutes of a recent episode was the red haired girl who is apparently a lesbian having a huge crush on some guy? Did the UPN tell them they couldn't have lesbian characters anymore?

Two points: firstly, it could well have been a repeat. Secondly, Willow was involved with a guy (or two) before she started seeing Tara - it's never been explicitly stated that she'd never be interested in guys again. Just that she happens to be in love with and in a relationship with a girl now.

12:52 / 28.01.02

The fact that its got Wicca lesbians in the first place has got to be a plus point though...

12:55 / 28.01.02

quote:Originally posted by Flux = Pop Cultural Ninja:

...and say, why was it that when I watched the last few minutes of a recent episode was the red haired girl who is apparently a lesbian having a huge crush on some guy? Did the UPN tell them they couldn't have lesbian characters anymore?

Probably a rerun, and I don't know about the UPN, but I'd be thoroughly appalled. Anyway, I must wave the flag of threadrot.

I'll admit to also not having watched Friends in a while, but I agree, it is rather like watching a game of Party Quirks, except less fun, because we already know what all the quirks are, and have for 7 seasons, or however the hell long that show's been on.

Matthew Fluxington

12:56 / 28.01.02

Two points: firstly, it could well have been a repeat. Secondly, Willow was involved with a guy (or two) before she started seeing Tara - it's never been explicitly stated that she'd never be interested in guys again. Just that she happens to be in love with and in a relationship with a girl now.

oh no, it wasn't a rerun. It was a brand new episode. That's right, you get them a little later than we do... it was something like their was a good version and an evil version of the red haired girl, and then they killed the evil version, and then they were back at college, and Buffy asked her if she wanted to go out that night, and she says no, but then some cute boy asks her out and she gets all bubbly and supergirly and says yes, because, y'know, he's hot. It was just some random guy, and not her exboyfriend, the guy from the Austin Powers movies.

12:57 / 28.01.02

[stirring] So 'Buffy' allows its characters to really develop? And dead people stay dead? [/stirring]

Regrettable Juvenilia

12:59 / 28.01.02

Flux, I don't wanna say "that's a repeat and I can tell you specifically the episode title, and you're incompetence herein suggests maybe you haven't been paying proper attention because you have a preconceived dislike for the show, and are twisting reality to fit your argument".

But I just did.

13:00 / 28.01.02

That was a re-run. It was from a few years ago .. I believe that particular episode nearly made me have a heart attack..

Regrettable Juvenilia

13:03 / 28.01.02

Also features the best bit of foreshadowing ever:

WILLOW (on evil Willow): I'm all skanky and evil. And I think I'm kind of gay.

BUFFY: Don't worry, Will, what you're like as a vampire has nothing to do with what you're really like.

ANGEL: Actually -

(Buffy shoots him a look.)

- That's a good point.

Haus about we all give each other a big lovely huggle?

13:09 / 28.01.02

Oh, and Flux - you know that "You guys get them later than we do"?

a) Seth Green left the series 2 and a half years ago.

b) If this had not been a mistake on your part, that would have been a big fuck-off SPOILER. Y'know, like finding out that Cassie Nova makes Gladiator her sex-slave in the next NXM.

Matthew Fluxington

13:12 / 28.01.02

quote:Originally posted by Flyboy:
you haven't been paying proper attention because you have a preconceived dislike for the show, and are twisting reality to fit your argument".

I wasn't using that example to push any argument, I was trying to understand something that made no sense at the time.

I don't have a preconceived dislike for the show: I've seen the show enough times over the past few years, I've tried watching trying to get what it is that people whom I would otherwise consider intelligent and tasteful see in it, and every time, it's just horrible sub-90210 crap with bad supernatural stuff thrown in. I really can't see what's so great about it.
The same thing goes for the X-Files...I've never been able to figure out anything particularly good about that show.

Oh and Ganesh: didn't Buffy get resurrected this season? Don't pull that "well folks stay dead on Buffy unlike Jean Grey!" with me...

Matthew Fluxington

13:15 / 28.01.02

quote:
Oh, and Flux - you know that "You guys get them later than we do"?

a) Seth Green left the series 2 and a half years ago.

yeah, I know. I have a subscription to Entertainment Weekly, Haus. I knew that it wasn't going to be a huge shocker or anything.

Haus about we all give each other a big lovely huggle?

13:23 / 28.01.02

quote:Originally posted by Flux = Pop Cultural Ninja:

yeah, I know. I have a subscription to Entertainment Weekly, Haus.

Wow. I never actually saw somebody shoot themselves in the foot before.

And, one more time for the special child. For those in the UK without satellite television, your "revelation" two posts back is a SPOILER. If you did in fact see a real "new episode", and not "Dopplegangland", what you posted previously was also a SPOILER. Which should not be something somebody visiting a "Friends" thread should need to worry about. I know some of the slower children have had trouble with this concept before, but we poor post-colonials ask only for your clemency.

Matthew Fluxington

13:27 / 28.01.02

Well, I can assure you that it will not be happening again in the future. Would it make you feel a little better if I fixed the post? and maybe bought you some ice cream? Dry yr eyes, man.

13:29 / 28.01.02

It seems these days every thread's got a Buffy spoiler thrown in for luck, its bad enough I cant go into most buffy threads (although I am really tempted at times)...

It now I only have bbc 2 for my fix and its well behind....so no more future buffy talk

Haus about we all give each other a big lovely huggle?

13:31 / 28.01.02

Ahem.

Fluxy Baby, I watch the new stuff on satellite, and know the plots of the upcoming series. I was spoiled long before you came along (as I said only last night). I am expressing concern for others. There is no "I" in team. Or indeed any "empathy" in "slow child".

Matthew Fluxington

13:40 / 28.01.02

Well, surely you can make a better argument for forgetfulness or even ignorance than a lack of empathy, because in the initial 'spoiler' post, the fact that the shows air at later dates in UK had slipped my mind, and the show had already aired...I wasn't trying to spoil anything for anyone, honest.

Haus about we all give each other a big lovely huggle?

13:58 / 28.01.02

Let's talk about Friends.

Which, actually, I think resembles "saved by the bell" far more.

First up, everything takes place in one of about three locations - Monica's flat, Chandler's flat, Central Perk.

Second up, everythng is restored to good order at the end of the episode.

Third up, like Slater's Hispanic qualities, ethnicity in Friends is played for laughs. Ross and Monica's parents are a domineering mother and a nebbishy, inept father straight out of (more cross-pollination) American Pie. Joey's family have huge broods, the men have hairy shoudlers and the women are strong, healthy, and indistinguishable. All are libidinous, except for mommas, who are great cooks.

I see a thesis developing here.

The Natural Way

14:04 / 28.01.02

This is the trouble w/ Buffy.

It really, really is good, but some people don't see it. I'm not sure it's easy to get into on 1st viewing (took me agesssss), but, given time, it kinda....*unfolds* on you and BAM! "Shit, this is actually quite groovy..."

I'm sceptical when people say, "I tried it, but I didn't like it..." because that's exactly what I said... And then I sat down, watched a few of the tapes, and realised I hadn't been paying that much attention afterall and that a great many things that are cool about the show only reveal themselves when understood in the larger context of the story/series.

But, the trouble is, I can't be arsed to go into any of it.

Except to point out that its politics are so much more progressive than Friends (etc.) it hurts. And Willow is not a fucking bubbly airhead that loses it around boys. Flux, all that tells me is that you really don't know the show.

What an utterly useless post.

[ 28-01-2002: Message edited by: Sgunnice Runcheon 'n' ]

Matthew Fluxington

14:06 / 28.01.02

On the formulaic nature of mass market American entertainment?

I'm not challenging anything that yr saying, you're correct - it's just that it seems like a redundant point...

Darryl Strawberry

14:17 / 28.01.02

I've got a bone to pick with the Cultural Elite in Hollywood. Why are there no white people on UPN, aside from those crypto-communists on Star Trek? Why don't I see anyone who looks like myself when I enjoy Moesha?

What happened to the good old days, with racially balanced shows like Benson, or Webster, or Diff'rent Strokes ? Can't Chandler and Monica adopt Emmanuel Lewis or Gary Coleman? Or can't Bernie Mac leave his own show and become a Nanny for Rachel's upcoming baby?

[ 28-01-2002: Message edited by: Rush Limbaugh ]

Matthew Fluxington

14:18 / 28.01.02

It really, really is good, but some people don't see it. I'm not sure it's easy to get into on 1st viewing (took me agesssss), but, given time, it kinda....*unfolds* on you and BAM! "Shit, this is actually quite groovy..." ...a great many things that are cool about the show only reveal themselves when understood in the larger context of the story/series.
[/QUOTE]

Ah, I understand how that is. Most everything I really like is kinda like that...

I don't really deny that there could be something great about the Buffy show, I just don't see it, and I don't really care enough to sit through a bunch of episodes to suss it out...the surface qualities really irk me...

Regrettable Juvenilia

15:27 / 28.01.02

The disturbing thing about Friends to me, and I'm sure I'm not just imagining it, is that I'm sure that it wasn't always such a deeply nasty piece of work. I mean okay, so it was low-income people living in high-rent flats, all pretty and white etc etc, but if you ignored the sets, it had a kind of 'help, my life isn't what i thought it'd be' vibe that was a bit appealing. And it was funny, for a while. It was never great, but it wasn't *evil*.

But then something went wrong. I'm not sure Haus has the seasons right, but basically, not long after they got Rachel and Ross together, the show seriously started to lose steam, at which point it might have either just wisely stopped, or died a slow and painful death.

Instead, the tactic the show's writers seem to hit upon to keep those ratings up is to turn it a programme that displays some of the nastiest little entrenched bigotries its audience might have. Not only did Monica become horribly skinny, but the writers decided to make this a joke, and a joke that tries to justify her appalling current condition by saying "ah, but she used to be FAT! see? see?". It's not just fat-phobic: it's anything-other-than-skeletal-phobic. Instead of some quite sweet and subtle jokes about his relationship with Joey, Chandler gets "ha-ha, everyone thinks he's GAY! but donm't worry, he's not". Don't even get me started on the oft-repeated trans-phobic stuff... that seems to be a particular obsession.

And it just seems to carry on being successful... Terrifying.

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