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Derren Brown - Mind control 3.

 
  

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NotBlue
20:23 / 01.01.02
Amazing. Assuming this is not a fix how the heck does this guy do it?

Basically a guy who tells what people are thinking, primes and manipulates then reads them, and frighteningly, mass hypnotises an entire shopping centre to put their arms in the air, entirely via the background tannoy. And claims on losing tickets at the dogtrack, like I said, amazing.

Does anyone know of any literature/online resources about this kind of stuff?
 
 
NotBlue
20:39 / 01.01.02
End of the program answered my question a bit, for those interested - http://channel4.com/mindcontrol
 
 
Bear
07:20 / 02.01.02
Glad someone else watched it - I've seen them all now and think he's pretty damn amazing, I'm very interested in NLP and stuff along those lines... anyone see him on Richard and Judy

The bit at the dog track was amazing and would be very handy
 
 
The Strobe
08:20 / 02.01.02
I saw him on R&J. Was very impressed.

But to my mind he's a superb con-man, in the best possible way.

What he's doing he's obviously done a lot of practice at. He just knows how people work. I watched some of last night's program very carefully, and he's not pulling any tricks, and he's NOT reading people's minds. He's reading their bodies, all the little giveaway tics and touches we have. Damn clever guy.

It's not about what's true, as the dog ticket thing proves; it's about what you THINK is true. And you can make people believe anything. I mean, the toothache thing wasn't very impressive to my mind. If someone tells me about, say, their ingrowing toenail, all my toes and fingers just curl up. Instantly. In a split second. Even if they were lying, I'd have curled up - I've actually done it now. It's no great trick; it's how the human mind works.

His shopping centre trick, people raising their hands? Clever, but just good use of voice manipulation and the fact we never as humans actively listen to tannoys, but somehow they seep in.
 
 
Bear
08:25 / 02.01.02
Oh yeah its all about reading people but thats what I find so interesting, like the blind guy it was pretty obvious he was telling him what to think Sandlewood/Candle kind of proved that, well at least I think thats how he does that - on R&J he made that guy think of an elephant and that little trick kinda shows that Mr Uri Gellar is probably just a big fake doing the same thing... just imagine some of the stuff you could get away with if you had that power
 
 
T*M*U*M*A
10:46 / 04.01.02
the bit at the dog track had me in stiches..

i mean .. he made almost 200 quid on dogs that came last..

that is a talent i think we'd all like to have.
 
 
NotBlue
15:17 / 04.01.02
Forget the dog track, the guy could (maybe does) charge a FORTUNE to teach that to high level corporate suits.
 
 
Bear
11:13 / 23.04.04
Just thought I would bump this since Mr. Brown is on again tonight on Channel 4, he is my master he made me bump it. Saw him live last month and he was very good he does seem to have some issues with Spiritualists though...
 
 
Morlock - groupie for hire
16:15 / 23.04.04
Yeah, I don't catch the rpegrammes very often but I always enjoy them. One favourite of mine has him sitting on a tube train chatting to a passenger, and some how makes him forget which stop he's going to.

Of course they are tricks, reading body language and exploiting all the little mental loopholes people have, but that's what makes it fun, as far as I'm concerned.
 
 
FinderWolf
20:04 / 23.04.04
OK, you crazy Brits, what's a "tannoy">? Is it like the loudspeakers in stores that play the background music or store announcements?

How exactly did he get everyone to raise their arms? Sort of subtle commands to in the background radio/muzak? Were people aware that they were doing it, or did he get them all to just feel like stretching?
 
 
Spatula Clarke
21:35 / 23.04.04
Yeah, loudspeakers. He'd been announcing a special offer of some sort, then - iirc - said "now," or something, and the arms all shot up. People walking about, people sitting down, people talking to each other, all just stuck one arm up in the air and didn't seem to be aware of what they were doing until it was already done.

His stuff's enjoyable when he explains it, like when he was playing Blackjack at the casino in the one episode. Otherwise, he's got a tendency to come across as a bit of a smug twat.

Not that I wouldn't be a smug twat if I could pull it off, though.

The most entertaining thing I've seen him do was the pickpocketing through misdirection at the train station - taking watches off wrists, removing peoples' ties from around their necks (!) - the state of complete confusion he was creating was absolutely hypnotic.

Shame about the cheap, horrible Russian Roulette stunt - the most interesting part of that was undoubtedly the lead up, where he was doing the smaller tricks (drawing precise copies of peoples' self-portraits without having seen them, for example).
 
 
Benny the Ball
10:22 / 24.04.04
I quite liked the russian roulette programme.

I was forced to work overtime last night so missed his new programme, any good?

I loved thew advertising exec stunt from the last series, where he 'predicted' their campaign for a taxidermists. Supurb when they showed back how much the two execs had been manipulated in the cab ride over.
 
 
FinderWolf
13:24 / 26.04.04
So I guess there had been subliminal suggestions for people to put their arms up before he hit the trigger word 'Now'?
 
 
Bear
14:03 / 26.04.04
Yup he talked over the loudspeaker quite awhile before giving the final instruction, I've read some of his stuff and he uses various techniques like hypnotism/nlp and plain old magic....

So did anyone watch the show on Friday? My memory of the show is a bit hazy but I think overall it was very good, Stephen Fry looked very impressed and I love the last trick with him playing chess against the 9 experts, continues next week (on Sunday I think?)
 
 
Spatula Clarke
14:18 / 26.04.04
I didn't watch it, but I'm sure I've seen him do the chess thing before. Is it where he makes one move on one table, then goes to another and makes a move, then another, and so on?
 
 
Bear
14:44 / 26.04.04
Yeah that's it, very clever memory trick by itself but at the end he also guesses (with one mistake) the number of pieces left on each board after the end of every game...
 
 
Pan Paniscus
14:48 / 26.04.04
Is it where he makes one move on one table, then goes to another and makes a move, then another, and so on?

Yeah, he explained how he did this one. He uses 9 people, pairs 8 of 'em off, with one playing black & the other playing white, and identifies the weakest player who he leaves seperate. Then he just copies the moves in each pair, so those 8 players are effectively playing against each other. This means he only has to play and win one game 'for real' (against the weakset player) to come out on top overall. That's just a fairly straightforward memory feat, but what was really impressive was he predicted how many pieces each player would have left at the end of their games. He didn't tell us how he did that though...
 
 
Pan Paniscus
14:49 / 26.04.04
Damn, beaten by the Bear.
 
 
ghadis
15:32 / 26.04.04
Quite like Derren Brown. I think where he is interesting is in that where as people in the past did this kind of thing and tried to pass it off as 'spooky supernatural stuff' he does the same show and passes it off as 'clever, NLP, psychological hypnosis' stuff.

I'm not saying that he doesn't use some of these techniques but a lot of it is old fashioned con/stage tricks. His 'gimmick' is that it's psychological. Doesn't make him any less fun or entertaining though of course.
 
 
Bear
06:25 / 27.04.04
Yup he blends everything together very well - would recommend his book Pure Effect if you want some insight on the various methods he uses (including how to do the trick he did on Stephen Fry) but it's very advanced so I wouldn't buy it expecting to amaze people unless you have some magic experience...

Looking forward to see what he does in the next show.
 
 
Bear
09:05 / 27.04.04
On a side note he's coming to London in June would anyone be interested in going to see his show? I just saw him live last month but wouldn't mind seeing him again as I imagine the show will be quite different.
 
 
Regrettable Juvenilia
13:20 / 24.05.04
I find the way he speaks very relaxing. Is it possible to purchase audio tapes of Mr Brown telling meandering stories which contain subliminal messages that will boost my confidence and competence?
 
 
Bear
14:37 / 24.05.04
I'm afraid not, I could knock you up a tape myself if you like my beautiful Scottish voice is almost as good I'm sure.

I've been a bit disappointed with the show to be honest, there's a couple of nice tricks but each show is too similar.

Will be interested to see this live séance on the 31st he did the same thing at the gig I went to and it worked really well.
 
 
Smoothly
17:57 / 31.05.04
So, everyone got their empty glass, candle, pen & paper, and letters of the alphabet together for tonight's séance for sceptics?
 
 
ONLY NICE THINGS
18:49 / 31.05.04
The crazy fool! Has he not seen Ghostwatch?
 
 
Ganesh
20:35 / 31.05.04
I think he's incredibly talented - but the Russian Roulette farrago makes me question the 'no actors or stooges' disclaimer.

As I speak, Xoc is making alphabet cards for the seance. Now all we need is Sarah Greene.
 
 
Eloi Tsabaoth
21:13 / 31.05.04
Taking 12 susceptible people, putting them in unpleasant circumstances with a lot of cameras and letting their caveman lizard impulses drive them crazy? Why does this sound familiar?
 
 
Spatula Clarke
21:24 / 31.05.04
Twelve people who've never seen his show before, either. He's not only done this three objects w/ glow-in-the-dark paint thing on C4 before, but also shown *how* it's done.
 
 
Ganesh
21:35 / 31.05.04
Has he? I'm not that familiar with his previous stuff. I'm assuming he's going to end the show by telling us the 'suicide pact', etc. are all fictional, and it's entirely down to the power of suggestion.

Have to say our glass resolutely failed to move. Seemed for a second or two like it might drift toward 'N' but it seemed kinda stupid for a spirit to tell us it wasn't there. I was also thinking of Keith and wrote 'LIVERPOOL' on my bit of paper. Guess neither of us was suitably suggestible.
 
 
Spatula Clarke
21:49 / 31.05.04
Yeah, he did pretty much exactly the same stunt - a ball, a cup, lights turned off - then showed how it was done. Iirc, it turned out to be a cameraman with a fishing rod.

That's what I find entertaining about Brown, the explanations. Finding out how much we're prepared to fool ourselves and how open we are to suggestion is much more interesting than the trick itself, and kudos to him for realising this. I do wonder exactly how much longer he can continue making a career out of it, though.

I ended up with Lisbon. If anyone's recorded it, play the bit where you're supposed to pick a photograph back a few times picking different ones to start off with - it just looked like the old "what number am I thinking of?" trick, but I'd be interested to know if that's actually the case.
 
 
Smoothly
21:51 / 31.05.04
How disapointing. Our glass didn't budge an inch and neither of us thought of Jane. I assume we were supposed to be directed to her picture with his instructions to pick a random colour picture, move to the nearest black and whte one, take the next diagonal... etc. I assume that's a variation of 'Think of the year of your birth, divide by 10, add 280, subtract your age in years and your're thinking of 2004 (or whatever)'. I'm obviously rubbish at following directions.

Hmmmph, I wish I wasn't so immune to this sort of thing.
 
 
Eloi Tsabaoth
21:53 / 31.05.04
But wait... I wrote 'Leicester'... They're all L names!
REDRUM
 
 
Ganesh
21:54 / 31.05.04
"Wow! I was thinking of seven too!!"

I suspect it's a combination of that, and selecting a face that's the right level of symmetry/attractiveness as well as placing it in the optimum spot in the arrangement.

I'm assuming he's previously screened out those individuals who, like BB's Kitten, are too oppositional, or insufficiently suggestible, or whatever.
 
 
Smoothly
21:54 / 31.05.04
it just looked like the old "what number am I thinking of?" trick

Fuck-king hell! Randy, I read your mind!
 
 
ONLY NICE THINGS
21:56 / 31.05.04
Round and round the garden,
Like a teddy bear....
 
  

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