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Has anyone here ever been to therapy?

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08:41 / 04.02.07

Has anyone here ever been to a psychologist or a psychiatrist? Did you get anything out of it or was it a waste of time? Is it even an option for someone without insurance? I've been getting really sad lately, and this sadness has been coming more often and instead of getting used to it it just seems to get worse. I kinda feel silly because i know a lot of people have real problems and i dont really have anything to make me feel this sad, it's just there. And im kinda scared theyd give me some drug that would make me not me.

09:05 / 04.02.07

Have you thought about writing a screenplay or something instead, Dangermouse? Unless you're genuinely having trouble with functioning socially, I don't see the percentage in paying a psychiatrist to sit there and pretend to be interested in your vague feelings of existential disquiet. It's all right to feel sad as you get older - it's the human condition, and at least you're feeling something; what I'd suggest you do now is channel it somehow, oh king of Barbelith, instead of indulging in all this morbid self-attention.

Would be the 'tough love' approach, in any case.

09:36 / 04.02.07

Yeah it does seem kind of like ego stroking. Which i have no problem doing online but not so much in the real world. I can imagine being laughed out of the room visiting one of those therapists. I imagined we'd get stronger as we got older not sadder. Ever breakup with a boyfriend or girlfriend you were madly in love with as a teenager? Its that kinda melodramatic cant eat cant sleep kinda feeling but with no real cause. I think i might take your advice and just try to channel it. Maybe just work a lot and pick up extra shifts and keep busy.

10:02 / 04.02.07

We get stronger and sadder, I think. Imagine yourself as a melee weapon that's being repeatedly hammered for a bit, and then shoved back into the fire at the blacksmith's of mortal experience. You may end up becoming Excalibur, or you may end up not becoming Excalibur.

With this idea on board though, everything makes perfect sense.

But don't try harder at the office, FFS, Dangerfield - you've got your own work to do.

Closed for Business Time

10:13 / 04.02.07

I second that Granny. I'm seeing that tactic not work too great with my SO's grief - she lost her mother 2 years ago almost to the day. She's been working a lot, always busying herself, then spends the nights beating herself up for not taking the time to acknowledge and work with her guilt, grief and general feel-shit-ness.

So Jack, it will take your mind off things, but chances are it'll just strike back harder. Empire-style.

10:20 / 04.02.07

Well, I think it needs to be said that you are having a rough time of it, no therapist worth their salt would laugh you out of the room, true depression or no. Therapists are there to help us through rough times, it's their job!

While I think Alex has a point - channeling your energies may be a good thing to do - you should consider trying to talk to a professional. Sure, therapy can function as ego gratification, but that's bad therapy. A good therapist will make you work and will take you to some uncomfortable places, and will help illuminate any serious problems (like genuine depression) you might have, or might develop.

10:21 / 04.02.07

!Hugaking!

10:23 / 04.02.07

Well, I think it needs to be said that you are having a rough time of it, no therapist worth their salt would laugh you out of the room, true depression or no.

Not if you're paying them to find a "true" diagnosis, no.

10:28 / 04.02.07

Fucksake, Ganesh. Point made, sure, and yes it probably is good to keep in mind that mental illness is slightly more nebulous than I allowed for in my last post, but I'm just trying to help Jack feel a little bit more empowered to seek out some help should he need it.

Not in the Face

10:40 / 04.02.07

Has anyone here ever been to a psychologist or a psychiatrist? Did you get anything out of it or was it a waste of time?

I have and yes it did help. It was to do with how I was handing personal relationships and I think it was extremely beneficial - having someone to talk to and discuss matters with without having to consider how it then impacts on your relationship with them (because you never seem them outside th emeeting) I found extremely useful. This was a counsellor rather than a psychiatrist but their advice on how to engage with people on more positive note was really useful as well.

However I also wanted to change, recognising that my previous modes of nehaviour were, well just crap really and I think that probably key, otherwise you're just talking. It can be great but only goes so far.

I kinda feel silly because i know a lot of people have real problems and i dont really have anything to make me feel this sad, it's just there.

I think if its a problem for you then its real. Other peoples might be more dramatic or disturbing to their life, but they're not your problems, so you shouldn't feel inhibited by contrasting yourself with them

STOATIE LIEKS CHOCOLATE MILK

10:44 / 04.02.07

I've been to counselling for both depression and alcohol dependency, and I found it immensely helpful. However, the first alcohol counsellor I had was rubbish- if you go, and it doesn't seem to be helping, it may just mean you've got the wrong person. Happily, the second alcohol counsellor I saw was absolutely brilliant, and going to see her (even after having been put off by the first guy) was definitely one of the better life decisions I've ever made.

11:13 / 04.02.07

Oh, sorry, Jack, to answer your question I saw a psychologist for 18 months to help with my depression and chronic anxiety. My counsellor was great and the process helped a lot.

Like the Face Man says, your problems are your problems, and if they feel bad to you, they are bad.

11:27 / 04.02.07

Fucksake, Ganesh. Point made, sure, and yes it probably is good to keep in mind that mental illness is slightly more nebulous than I allowed for in my last post, but I'm just trying to help Jack feel a little bit more empowered to seek out some help should he need it.

Fucksake, Boboss. I'm making more than the one point here, regarding your last post. First, there's the "true/genuine depression" thing, which phrasing itchyscratches somewhat, then there's the "it's their job!" thing which may or may not be true, depending on the context within which healthcare/therapy is provided (the role of a psychiatrist within the NHS, for example, is arguably not simply to help people through "rough times").

Finally, although you highlight "good" and "bad" therapy, I think that, in your enthusiastic empowering, you underemphasise the fact that seeing a therapist might not be the best solution here, as Alex's Grandma has suggested. There's an increasing tendency, in the western world, to frame any situational or existential unhappiness in (at least semi-)pathological terms, whether or not this is helpful. I think it's important to be aware, as the flipside of empowering someone to seek out therapeutic help, that that therapeutic help may not come without a skew or bias - particularly if one is funding it.

Disco is My Class War

11:30 / 04.02.07

I've been to counselling for depression and general lack of coping skills. I gotta say, Grandma's 'tough love' approach leaves me cold. Feeling depressed all the time for 'no reason' is a sign that your life skills aren't working for you and that it might help to change them, not that you're being self-indulgent. Not everyone learns those skills automatically; some, or most, people learn really fucked-up life skills. If you choose, you can re-educate yourself by paying someone to teach you. 'Channeling' your angst can be great, but it doesn't necessarily change the skills you have to cope with feeling like crap. You might write a terrific novel and still feel like shit.

If you decide to actually get therapy, shop around for different styles. There are plenty of therapy 'models' that don't see medication as any kind of solution. And lots of therapists practice using a combination of therapy styles. In my experience, the ideal combination was someone who does both Gestalt and Cognitive Behavioural Therapy. They seem kinda light years apart, but I like that the therapist I ended up seeing was intellectually complex enough to want to marry two really different methods. Gestalt therapy is hard to describe, but it's sort of about encouraging the person-in-therapy to figure out precisely what every experience or demon means to them (rather than the therapist making interpretations). It focuses a lot on body stuff -- how you might sit or breathe when you remember or relive a particular thing, and what that might means. IMO, Gestalt therapists are usually quite open-minded and willing to treat clients as an individual with really individualised responses to situations, ways of dealing with life -- which is good in the longer term, and helpful for digging up past nasties. The CBT technqiues mean you will immediately start to learn relatively simple skills for dealing with feeling crappy on a day-to-day basis -- hopefully, improvement in the short term.

Therapy can be really fucking confronting. For me, it's been totally worth it. And I have no idea about insurance and costs in the US but good luck. If you're on a low income, you might be able to find someone with a sliding scale.

12:10 / 04.02.07

And I completely agree with all that. I know there's an increasing tendency, in the western world, to frame any situational or existential unhappiness in (at least semi-)pathological terms, whether or not this is helpful, and I think that's potentially worrying, but might I suggest that a terse one sentence post perhaps isn't the best way to bring this stuff to light, particularly given that you've just taken me to task for my lack of thoroughness when addressing these issues. Also, there had been a marked lack of empowering (to see a therapist) going on in this thread, so I think it's okay to have given it a go, taking into account the fact that might Jack actually need to get some help - something none of us can know for sure over a broadband connection.

Sorry for the snarkiness, however. I'm really tired and feeling a bit under it today, and as a result my first response to itchyscratchiness was to bite back, which was a bit silly really.

12:10 / 04.02.07

x-post

12:23 / 04.02.07

I think that's potentially worrying, but might I suggest that a terse one sentence post perhaps isn't the best way to bring this stuff to light

It's arguably marginally more useful than initiating a purportedly constructive dialogue with "fucksake". Alex's Grandma made a number of those points before I did, and I (like to) think my terse one sentence post nonetheless communicated the somewhat obvious point that someone paid to find and address psychopathology may have a vested interest in finding and addressing psychopathology - and the question of whether or not thinking in those terms is helpful is not necessarily a straightforward one.

But you've acknowledged that, and I appreciate it. I suppose I'm a little wary of what I perceive as somewhat polarised attitudes toward the whole issue of therapy here. If we're not decrying shrinks as charlatans or Harmony House agents of social control (looking at you, Temple) we're almost unequivocally recommending therapy without knowing very much at all about the individual in question, their situation or the type and nature of healthcare available to them.

It's fine being empowering - and yes, I can see that you felt there was a paucity of empoweringness in the thread - but let's remember we don't actually know much about Denfled's circumstances beyond his first paragraph.

12:28 / 04.02.07

Actually, I don't think the Temple's been anti-psychiatry for some time. Scrub that.

12:34 / 04.02.07

(looking at you, Temple)

whereabouts?
don't feel a need to catalogue it all.
five or six links to the biggest examples would be cool.

12:35 / 04.02.07

See my most recent post, Toksik.

12:36 / 04.02.07

timing is comedy.

12:37 / 04.02.07

and again.
man, apologies for the cross psots.
my browser must be refreshing in a pool of mud and molasses.

12:42 / 04.02.07

You might write a terrific novel and still feel like shit.

Fair enough, but having written a couple of things that have yet to see the light of day on a professional level, I can honestly say I felt great afterwards. For a while, anyway. Had they been internationally successful (and I suppose the jury's still out on one of them, maybe, possibly,) I'd have been pretty much intolerable re: the loving life thing, I'm sure.

Unless you have a defined worry that you need to work through ie, one that's actively interfering with your ability to cope on a day-to-day basis, therapy seems a bit contra-indicated, in terms of time. money, etc.

Feeling like shit is a rational enough response to the modern world, surely? Up to a point, feeling positive all the time, for all it's arguably the Holy Grail of certain aspects of the alternative therapy movement, would be a mistake.

This is clearly terrible advice if you're actually incapacitated, Penfold, but if you're just feeling a bit down about nothing in particular (though I'd be willing to bet it's got something to do with recent events in Thailand,) I'd be inclined to be a stand-up guy, damnit, and get on with my creative work, were I you. Or at least, I'd give it a shot - if it doesn't turn out too well, by all means then thuh-row yourself on the mercy of the psychiatric profession, but I'd avoid that as an option if at all possible.

As with the dentist's, never go unless you really have to.

This, of course, courtesy of the Homer Simpson school of psychology, which, while not officially recognised by anyone anywhere, still has merit, I feel.

12:44 / 04.02.07

If we're not decrying shrinks as charlatans or Harmony House agents of social control (looking at you, Temple)

Temple being a person or the forum? I ask because my reading of the Forum of late has seen many folks suggest therapy as a valid option. If not please let me know as I find that extremely troubling.

When I was a young rebellious thing there were a whole crop of therapists in my life. Some were horrible and some did manage to wrangle my ass productively. I personally have found that the key to improving my state of well being has been invested support from other people. Sometimes I haven't had a community or a functional family and it was pivotal to have that investment and support from a therapist.

As an adult I find when I'm having difficulties I really do need a sounding board. It isn't always appropriate to share really burdensome things with people in my daily life or to involve them in conflicts with other people. For this I do recommend people who can listen and give advice or just listen. I think this role is often filled by pastors, bartenders, hair stylists, and friends in faraway lands.

There are people that use art very well to process stuff and others that need an interactive conversation. In this sense a therapist isn't so much for handing down a life plan and a prescription as much as just being an appropriate person to discuss aspects of your current state of mind with.

Less searchable M0rd4nt

12:56 / 04.02.07

To be fair to 'Nesh there did used to be a fair old whack of anti-psychiatry feeling around those parts. It's got a lot better; in recent years there's been some interesting discussion of the way various magical practices relate to psychotheraputic processes, and classic topics like the "magic as a maladaptive coping mechanism" thread. Every so often we still get someone touting the old "kerayzee people are teh SHAMENZ!!" line, but they've become a lot rarer.

13:05 / 04.02.07

Temple being a person or the forum? I ask because my reading of the Forum of late has seen many folks suggest therapy as a valid option. If not please let me know as I find that extremely troubling.

Assuming you posted before reading my subsequent comment or Mordant's.

13:13 / 04.02.07

i'd still appreciate links to what you felt were the most outlandish claims, but i guess it's not as pressing if you don't think it's a current issue.
i reckon it'd still be interesting, though.

13:18 / 04.02.07

ooh a flurry of x-posts!

glad to hear the forum has improved.

13:19 / 04.02.07

I don't even know if they're within this incarnation of the board, Toksik, which gives some indication of how long ago I'm talking about. I just remember a time when it felt like every other Temple post was critical of teh reality tunnels imposed by teh shrinks. Mind you, this was probably the same time I was being hassled by Laila and others, so I was likely feeling quite beleaguered generally.

As I subsequently appended, the anti-psychiatry slant hasn't been a Templey thing for a long time. If anything, discussion there is more nuanced there than elsewhere.

Less searchable M0rd4nt

13:27 / 04.02.07

I definately recall anti-shrink stuff since I've been here; maybe pre-namechange, when it was still The Magick. More recently there's been stuff like the Videogames and the Overmind thread, which, whilst not actively anti-psychiatry, did veer onto that kind of territory.

ONLY NICE THINGS

13:36 / 04.02.07

I don't even know if they're within this incarnation of the board, Toksik, which gives some indication of how long ago I'm talking about.

It wasn't unique to the Temple; the Head Shop has also had its share of anti-psychiatry, although often more targeted - that is, people who were angry with psychiatrists for denying them what they feel is the right treatment. I believe that post-boardquake examples do exist, but we all seem to have reached a stage where they don't need to be produced, I think.

Less searchable M0rd4nt

13:40 / 04.02.07

And the Lab, too. Mark you, IIRC a lot of the anti-shrink voices being raised in those fora were sort of Temple-based. Could be misremembering here, mind.

13:51 / 04.02.07

we all seem to have reached a stage where they don't need to be produced, I think.

if you say so.
i am still interested, as i said, but i suppose it depends how you define "we all" and "need".
i'll be okay if they don't get linked, if a little dissapointed.
i suppose i can always google them up for myself, if i get a free hour.

13:57 / 04.02.07

You can indeed.

13:58 / 04.02.07

yes.
yes i can.

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