BARBELITH underground
 

Subcultural engagement for the 21st Century...
Barbelith is a new kind of community (find out more)...
You can login or register.


Robin Hood, Robin Hood...

 
  

Page: (1)2

 
 
■
22:11 / 22.09.06
I had a shufti through the threads and was a little surprised this hasn't been opened already. I know we've referenced it in the Who S2 thread, but as it starts two weeks tomorrow, I thought I'd carve out a little clearing for all us Merry Persons to sit down and have a chinwag about what we expect from this project.
Me, I was hoping (yes, past tense, you know the drill, and I'm behaving) for something along the lines of the 1980s series ("the hooded man, Bwam Bang"), perhaps updated to take account of the longer narratives we now expect from drama series. I'm now inclined to hunt down those series so I can do a decent comparison.
However, as RTD saw fit to jettison (albeit respectfully) the Who formula to great success, do we think they will try something with as much rich mythology as the Carpenter version, or will it be a straight romp?
So, in case you missed it, the big question is: "What do YOU want from Robin of Locksley?"
 
 
Kali, Queen of Kitteh
13:09 / 23.09.06
"What do YOU want from Robin of Locksley?"

I want him wearing Tennant's suit.

Sorry, sorry, that's the hangover talking.

I've read about this. Looks fairly decent. I may download episodes if you guys say it's any kind of good.
 
 
miss wonderstarr
17:19 / 23.09.06
I saw a trailer for it in front of An Inconvenient Truth today, of all things (in the cinema) and clearly it's going to be the sexy, cheeky, rough-diamond approach. Robin shoves his way out of a castle cell, addressing us a bit like a better-fed Renton: "Some people say I'm a liar, a thief, good-fer-nothing." [along these lines] The quiver on his back is kept out of view until later shots ~ indeed, he could almost be a present-day charismatic ruffian. "I don't go lookin' for trouble" [puts a flaming arrow to his bow, aims at a group of Nottingham soldiers] "It comes looking fer me."

Do you like my approximation at his accent! My version is rubbish but it is, unusually and perhaps for the first time on screen, a Northern accent. I assume, something like a Nottingham accent.
 
 
miss wonderstarr
17:39 / 23.09.06
Also, it looked immmediately as though it had top production values and cinematography (oddly, within maybe five seconds of the start I was immediately reminded of the "Tooth and Claw" Doctor Who episode for some reason... the opening, with the monks. Perhaps because it was set in a castle.)

My overall impression: it looked like it was going to be quick, modern, charismatic, witty, with killer lines and moments. I would previously have posted on here that I'd like a Classic Hood, like the 1970s one, with all the iconography intact, and this one is clearly going to play around with the familiar ideas and images... but, to be fair, I was sold on it very quickly by that trailer.
 
 
miss wonderstarr
20:38 / 05.10.06
Nobody seems very excited about this but I'm a bit "stoked" despite myself. Adverts on the sides of buses are really playing up the hoodie angle ~ Robin as young, soulful-eyed, misunderstood but cheeky gangsta gazing up sadly, smoulderingly from inside his shadowed cowl.

I saw a Maid Marian teaser tonight, echoing the line of the original Robin one (they call him... some say he's... he doesn't go looking for trouble, and so on) but this one seemed to have almost a wire-fu thing gong on: huge balletic battle-leaps, and exaggerated sound effects as Marian apparently pulled knife-clips out of her hair... again, interestingly, picking up on my very early, instant impression that this looked like the battling-monks sequence in Doctor Who.
 
 
Kali, Queen of Kitteh
20:48 / 05.10.06
When is this airing?
 
 
■
22:20 / 05.10.06
Given it's officially Friday GMT, that would be tomorrow night. Oh, be stoked, but keep your powder dry.
 
 
STOATIE LIEKS CHOCOLATE MILK
22:29 / 05.10.06
I'm cautiously interested. I lvoed Robin Of Sherwood, and it's gonna take a lot to beat my childhood memories of that. It's also giving Keith fucking Allen a paycheque, which is all kinds of wrong. But I reckon I'll probably enjoy it despite myself.
 
 
Suedey! SHOT FOR MEAT!
00:23 / 06.10.06
I think this looks all kinds of bad and they've merely made Robin some standard cheeky indie lad. I keep expecting him to be rocking a studded belt.

Even the Radio Times said it was lacklustre, and they get excited about everything.
 
 
miss wonderstarr
07:20 / 06.10.06
I loved Robin of Sherwood (Praed season mostly) and the TV Robin Hood before that (The Legend of Robin Hood, 1975? not sure) so I felt quite resistant to the idea of a cheeky contemporary reworking, but for some reason the teasers have won me over as an alternative Robin. Maybe there's no point in doing the legend all over again with the same classical approach but better production values. You could do a grubbily realistic Robin without the modern nods this one seems to feature ~ you could try to keep it more strictly period, which this one seems not to give a stuff about ~ but I don't think that would have much hope of capturing the Saturday popular entertainment, tweens and young adults crowd. It's obviously trying to get the audience inherited from Doctor Who, and in a way it's doing the same thing (knowing reworking, nods to the old iconography but "sexed up" a bit) ~ so I think it has to take this tack.

Actually I think I fancy that Robin a little bit. Which is odd because he looks like Charlie out of Lost's slightly better-looking brother.
 
 
miss wonderstarr
07:32 / 06.10.06
Wikipedia:

The first full reviews for the programme began appearing on September 7, 2006, after a preview of the opening episode had been shown at the press launch the previous evening. The website of The Guardian said that: "The challenge for the new Robin Hood is to appeal to younger viewers while pulling in their parents as well. It will be no easy task. About as difficult, in fact, as simultaneously firing two arrows from the same bow, and both hitting the target. But as Robin showed in the opening episode, it can be done." In The Times, critic Paul Hoggart backed the series to be a success: "Armstrong as the rather understated Robin Hood should still be moodily cheeky enough to find his way on to the bedroom walls of a few hundred thousand pubertal girls, and Lucy Griffiths as Marian is inevitably feisty. But the villains steal the show, with Richard Armitage’s Guy of Gisborne off-setting Keith Allen’s gags as the mocking, heavily sarcastic Sheriff. The audience including cast, crew and their friends cheered at the end but this remake should go down well with families at home, too."
 
 
DaveBCooper
08:13 / 06.10.06
If, for some reason, you miss it (such as because you’ve set the video to record the Python-fest on BBC2 the same night), I believe it’s repeated on BBC3 on Sunday evening
 
 
Kali, Queen of Kitteh
13:12 / 06.10.06
I'll be off to BitTorrent this weekend, then.
 
 
Benny the Ball
15:43 / 06.10.06
What I'll be wanting? I'll want the company that produced it to not contact me and offer me a job doing screen tests at next to nothing money, then complain that I charge to much, use my assistant to do the tests, then run off to Hungary or where ever, and not hire anyone from the UK to save money, while taking a huge lump of money off of the beeb that I pay for to make the damned thing, and then expect me to watch it. Bitter?
 
 
Kali, Queen of Kitteh
16:03 / 06.10.06
Ouch.
 
 
Our Lady Has Left the Building
17:33 / 07.10.06
I'm trying to work out which Allen annoys me more at the moment.
 
 
Suedey! SHOT FOR MEAT!
17:40 / 07.10.06
Hollyoaks Hood!
 
 
Our Lady Has Left the Building
18:02 / 07.10.06
Richard Armitage is dreamy!

I know everyone assumes I hate everything, so I just want to say I wanted, WANTED, this to be good. OK, it wasn't totally awful, but I think most of the faults can be placed in the script which had a few bits of witty dialogue but didn't really think that much about action sequences. Take the bit where Robin leapfrogs backwards off of the first floor of the house. That was so badly done I assumed there was going to be the old gag of Robin missing a horse that I hadn't noticed was supposed to be underneath. The bit where Robin throws a sword about a quarter of a mile to knock out the guards holding Much was daft. Robin's skill seemed to wax and wane. He can fire four arrows in quick succession with expert precision from several hundred feet away, but cannot fire twelve arrows to bring down horsemen who are several times further away? He can throw that sword so far yet be held dead-to-rights by a bowman, unable to move? Make your mind up producers!

But they can improve on this. I hope they can. I don't really understand why they felt it necessary to have an origin episode and if they did it really should have been over by the end of the first show, expecting people to come back next week is a real act of faith. They should have followed the Doctor Who model, start in the middle, flesh out the beginning later on when they have viewers loyalty. Why tell the story from the start? Everyone's seen 'Prince of Thieves', 'Robin Hood: Men in Tights' or that one with Sir Hisssss.

Notice how they don't have a 'next week on Robin Hood' thing like Doctor Who?

This might get better once the start is out of the way. And I presume Sam is the grandson of Doctor Two?

But the best part of that hour was the ad for Torchwood afterwards.
 
 
Our Lady Has Left the Building
18:04 / 07.10.06
And he might improve once he's given some real work to do but I think telling Keith Allen to play the Sherrif as wacky rather than malevolent was a real mistake.
 
 
Our Lady Has Left the Building
18:09 / 07.10.06
Actually, sorry, I've just realised, the first two episodes are for the benefit of the USian children who haven't seen Prinec of Thieves aren't they? That makes sense now...
 
 
Spaniel
18:22 / 07.10.06
(I don't assume you hate everything, I just think you have a way of talking about things that can sound hate-filled. I'm sure you like all kinds of stuff)

So, Jonas Armstrong then. I know he's supposed to be all hoodied and doe-eyed and relatey to the youths, but I think the guy just looks like a stage school wimp. Granted, he's not a terrible actor but the question is does he have the gravitas to carry a character like Robin Hood?

I haven't seen the show so I'd like to hear the opinions of someone that has.
 
 
Our Lady Has Left the Building
18:54 / 07.10.06
I didn't mind him but the Radio Times described him as a boyband reject.I think that's a little unfair, but that bad script did no-one any real favours.
 
 
Lama glama
19:57 / 07.10.06
Cringe-worthy! From the constant use of slow motion to the horribly stilted dialogue and largely unlikeable cast, it was a chore to sit through it 'til the end. I'm glad I did, because admittedly, the scene where Robin frees his friends from the gallows was a little impressive. Except they ruined it with more slow motion and odd flashy light effects.

I've never been enamoured (or remotely interested) in the Robin Hood mythology, so maybe those that already had something invested in previous incarnations of these characters enjoyed it more. I'll give it a chance, in the hopes that the humour rights itself, the direction becomes less fussy and the dialogue becomes tolerable.

Plus, they might show another Torchwood trailer afterwards. It was worth watching the show for that alone.
 
 
Our Lady Has Left the Building
20:42 / 07.10.06
To be honest it would have been an achievement to put enough character in the script to reach 'unlikeable' level.
 
 
miss wonderstarr
22:16 / 07.10.06
I do like the Robin Hood mythos, and fortunately for this programme I think the basic Hood story is so packed with fun episodes, potent ideas and solid figures that as long as you keep touching base with it, you will have something half-decent. And that's what I thought this was. The notion of Robin of Locksley returning home from the Crusades, finding his home drastically changed under a sleazy Guy (about Robin's age) and the bad father Sheriff (opposed to the good distant father, Richard the Lionheart) ~ then giving up his nobility, turning outlaw and adopting all the Sherwood Forest iconography, plus some intrigue with Marian and a stock save-the-criminals from the scaffold scene is just plain good story-stuff in my opinion, so this episode had a lot of its job done already.

Couldn't quite decide if I thought the Matrixy nonsense with the arrows was groovy or horrible ~ it was probably inevitable if you're making Robin Hood in 2006 ~ but I think the effects shots were ladled on too thick. No need for that split-second flash of black and white when Robin's about to use his Hood power. Showing his backwards leap three times from different angles was 70s action-film naffness. Not sure about his being so randy and rash with the guy's daughter, either, and how that gels with his upright, forthright nobility in other scenes ~ is he thrillingly moral and self-sacrificing, or a cheeky chancer?
 
 
miss wonderstarr
22:50 / 07.10.06
I think telling Keith Allen to play the Sherrif as wacky rather than malevolent was a real mistake.

It seems to be the Alan Rickman take on the character, which took the pedestrian Prince of Thieves to the panto... in a bad way. You cannot do a proper drama like this if the villain is a funny, not-really-scary uncle.
 
 
■
23:42 / 07.10.06
MINOR SPOILY




Will supply more thoughts when sober, but Allen does get to do some proper malevolent, if a bit hamfisted (well, it's Keith Alllen, innit?), next week.

He was a bit Biggins tonight, though.
 
 
Lee
11:14 / 08.10.06
"I presume Sam is the grandson of Doctor Two?"

Not only that, Patrick Troughton himself was the first actor to play Robin Hood on television, in a 1953 BBC series.

This adaptation itself was often naff and some of the dialogue made me feel the same way I tend to when surprised by a particularly strong pickled onion. My reaction in some spots was almost allergic.

However, it's not fair to judge a series on the basis of its pilot. I'll give it to episode four and see how I feel about it then.
 
 
Not in the Face
09:19 / 09.10.06
I'll give it to episode four and see how I feel about it then.

I'd think that was pretty generous tbh. Like Miss Wonderstar I really like the mythos and am generally a sucker for any take on it from Errol Flynn to the previous BBC ones. I even used to really like the Austrian William Tell's that were shown badly dubbed years ago.

So I really wanted to like it but found its efforts to 'update' its language too jarring; the script was extremely self-conscious in its efforts to be modern but just came across as divorced from the overly clean medieval setting, it was rife with inconsistencies and both Robin and Guy need lessons on glowering - instead of looking like they were about to lay some retribution down they just looked constipated.

I think it carries some of the weaknesses of the last season of Dr Who tbh, in being too grand for its budget - it wants to be like the Prince of Thieves but I suspect it doesn't have anywhere like the money to spend on decent action sequences, but neither does it seem to have the inclination or the skill to replace it with mystery or tension. Instead we got a lot of cheap camera tricks to try and give the impression of action. It only really got going when Keith Allen was on set, and as others have said his panto Sherrif was rather at odds with the overall tone.

OTOH its repeated at 7pm on a Sunday so I'm likely to give it a few chances out of sheer laziness and convenience.
 
 
miss wonderstarr
09:58 / 09.10.06
Echoing what someone's just said over on TMO ~ that "thwupp!" sound effect for every change in location got very cheesy, very quickly. But I did find myself thwupping along with it.
 
 
STOATIE LIEKS CHOCOLATE MILK
16:13 / 09.10.06
It seems to be the Alan Rickman take on the character, which took the pedestrian Prince of Thieves to the panto... in a bad way.

Still not seen the new Beeb one, but much as I love Alan Rickman, I have to say that among the worst things about Prince of Thieves was that it featured a comedy rape scene. Oh Alan.
 
 
Benny the Ball
17:56 / 09.10.06
Someone told me recently that the Prince of Thieves was heavily edited by Kevin Costner, to get rid of Alan Rickman's obviously superior performance. Even the bad stuff was better than Costner.

Anyway, excuse the digression - as you were.
 
 
Benny the Ball
06:51 / 10.10.06
Okay, I've started watching this morning - about 15 minutes in, and I hate it. Awful, terrible, clunky, cheap. I know it's a set up episode, but it could have tried harder. Oh, and when, when, when will directors and cameramen learn in this country that unneccesary pans and zoomz break the illusion and make the programme look like As if and not gritty and real and edgy.
 
 
Regrettable Juvenilia
08:28 / 10.10.06
The only real problem with it was that weird interlude with the dyer and his "daughter", who was about 2 years younger than him tops. That made it like watching a school play.
 
 
■
08:38 / 10.10.06
I gave it a fair amount of leeway, given it's a first episode and all, but there were bits which really had me wondering what they were playing at. Sexy vixen tries to seduce handsome stranger while her father isn't looking... in a house without walls. A trench is dug for no clear reason. What's going on?
The arrow-time is unnecessary and irritating, the choppy editing likewise. I can only guess they're going for grabbing the younger viewers who know nothing of the mythos, and wanted the pilot to be flashy, as the second ep does tone it down a bit.
On the positive side, I really like Much. He reminds me of someone (one of the hobbits, probably) and is immensely likeable. Kind of a scruffy Xander. In fact, this is where I think the show is headed: an attempt at a "male" Buffy. Conflicted relationships and angst; awesome powers which must be kept in check most of the time; ensemble cast with an arboreal Scooby Gang. Gisburne could well develop into an interesting character (possibly the show's Spike), as he is simultaneously very nasty yet has much more depth than the mugging Sherriff.
However, they need to make everything a bit less shiny. It's all just too damn clean, and those settlements are tiny - Nottingham seems to be just a castle. Another point in its favour, though, is that it's not just Robin aginst the Sherriff in a vacuum, as the counci puts the dispute into context. There are laws, the Sherriff may think he's above them but he's not entirely. The link to the crusades is also interesting, and (albeit a bit clumsily) is used as a metaphor for modern imperialism, a theme which I think we'll see develop, but whch would be more interesting if the Bush/Blair character wasn't such an old panto dame.
I think the best thing to do is to treat it as an entertainment show with pretensions to quality drama. It's certainly not in the realms of the Praed/Connery show and doesn't want to be.
 
  

Page: (1)2

 
  
Add Your Reply