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Alan Moore and Melinda Gebbie's 'Lost Girls'

 
  

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Ron Stoppable
14:18 / 08.09.06
that's really interesting, EvKG - I've read two other reviews that said much the same; along the lines of "if this work of pornography falls down anywhere, it's that there's too much sex." And not in a prurient, but think of the chiiildren way but at the expense of exposition.

On the plus side though, whatever my eventual judgement of it's quality, it's nice to be actually, properly excited about something new. It's been a while since I've felt this sort of anticipation about a comics 'event.' Makes 52, OYL, Civil War etc feel quite tame by comparison.
 
 
Our Lady Has Left the Building
19:08 / 08.09.06
Crap, the amazon.com website has slipped it to 4-7 weeks. Not sure it's worth ordering from them right now, it takes so long as it is...
 
 
MattShepherd: I WEDDED KALI!
20:02 / 08.09.06
The more reviews I read, the more my appetite is... unwhetted? I love Moore, but the art excerpts don't appeal to me at all. I've got it ordered on Amazon.ca, but I may cancel or work something out with a UKer if it's impossible to get within a reasonable time limit over there.
 
 
EvskiG
21:12 / 08.09.06
Why not order directly from Top Shelf?

I imagine it's quicker than Amazon.
 
 
MattShepherd: I WEDDED KALI!
22:04 / 08.09.06
In my case, at least, a difference of about $25 U.S.

Oh, and they're out of stock:

The Lost Girls first printing sold out on the first day of sale, and the 2nd and 3rd printings have already been ordered to meet the demand (arriving in October and December, respecively). So, if you see a copy, be sure to pick one up right away, as these new printings are likely to sell out in just a few days as well.
 
 
sleazenation
06:51 / 09.09.06
I'm guessing that there will be a supply of Lost Girls for sale after the Alan Moore/Melinda Gebbie talk at the institute of education...
 
 
Ron Stoppable
07:57 / 11.09.06
what's that, Sleaze? sounds interesting..
 
 
Ron Stoppable
08:01 / 11.09.06
ah never mind. overcame my laziness and looked it up:

Details and tickets here
 
 
Dicodisco
09:38 / 17.09.06
This sucks.

***************************************
LOST GIRLS UNITED KINGDOM & EUROPEAN UNION (UK/EU)
DISTRIBUTION DELAYED
***************************************

Top Shelf recently received correspondence from the Great Ormonds Street Hospital (the owners of Peter Pan in the UK/EU), and as a result, UK/EU distribution of Lost Girls has been delayed until the matter is resolved.
It has been a very cordial exchange, and one we are glad to participate in.
As soon as the matter is resolved, we'll make a formal announcement about it, but this may result in the book being delayed for the UK & EU markets until 1 January 2008
 
 
Spatula Clarke
09:48 / 17.09.06
Third time's the charm.
 
 
sleazenation
13:25 / 17.09.06
And From the same press release/email quoted above - there won't be any copies on sale at the Alan Moore talk...
 
 
ghadis
15:49 / 17.09.06
I'm glad i ordered my copy from .com when Flowers mentioned it. Very quick delivery. I had it in my london based hands within 4 days. Hanvn't had a good chance to sit down with it yet but it is a thing of beauty. Fantastic production values on it.
 
 
Janean Patience
13:16 / 05.10.06
The release of Peter Pan in Scarlet, an officially sanctioned sequel with full approval from Great Ormond Street and the Oxford University Press, may explain why they were set on blocking Moore & Gebbie's rather saucier offering.

According to the blurb Michael died in the Great War, Wendy's got kids, a load of the Lost Boys are back, Peter's still a boy and the spirit of Captain Hook still stalks Neverland.

Comments from David Barrie, the great-great-nephew, focus on the "vital difference" the royalties make to GOSH. The phrase "but to be honest, I'd prefer a really filthy version" doesn't appear.
 
 
All Acting Regiment
14:21 / 05.10.06
The "in Scarlet" bit makes it sound, well, yeah.
 
 
Sniv
14:35 / 05.10.06
There's already a sequel to Peter Pan. It's called Hook, and it sucked balls (in the bad, bitey way).
 
 
Janean Patience
14:59 / 05.10.06
"Anyone want to read my new Peter Pan/Gone With The Wind slash story, Peter Pan in Scarlett?"
 
 
Our Lady Has Left the Building
05:52 / 13.10.06
Chris Staros was at the Moore/Gebbie event in Central London last night. Discussions between Top Shelf and GOSH had been amicable, he said, and they'd come to a mutual arrangement, TS don't publish before the GOSH copyright runs out (On Dec 31st 2007) and then neither GOSH or TS have to waste huge amounts of money taking it to the courts. They will be free to publish the first UK edition on the first of January 2008, and will work out something special for the long-waiting UK people (that haven't resorted to buying it from the US).

Which I suppose means that 'Peter Pan in Scarlet' is not an attempt by GOSH to prolong their hold on the Peter Pan copyright but an attempt to wring the last few pence out of it before it goes public domain, and maybe this whole mess can be read that they were concerned that something that looked Peter Pan-ish was coming out at the same time they wanted lots of newspaper headlines for their 'official sequel'.
 
 
Mario
09:44 / 13.10.06
Publishing sequels shouldn't affect the copyright on the original. It MIGHT impact the trademarks, but I don't think that would be a problem in this case (I've never seen the character's name trademarked).
 
 
doctorbeck
09:55 / 13.10.06
i thought alan moore was great at the talk last night, jovial and funny and not at all up himself as that profile on the culture show implied a few months back, very thoughtful and almost deferential to melinda gebbia his colaborator and partner at times. i wish i could remember some of the one liners but got a bit drunk after and it was all a blur. stuart lee was very good as interviewer and impressed with some high level fan boy triv. wonder if Uk comic shops will be selling import copies of LG in the meantime?
 
 
ONLY NICE THINGS
22:39 / 14.10.06
Which I suppose means that 'Peter Pan in Scarlet' is not an attempt by GOSH to prolong their hold on the Peter Pan copyright but an attempt to wring the last few pence out of it before it goes public domain, and maybe this whole mess can be read that they were concerned that something that looked Peter Pan-ish was coming out at the same time they wanted lots of newspaper headlines for their 'official sequel'.

Possibly. However, it's also the case that if the owner of a copyright is not shown to be defending that copyright, the copyright passes into public usage. That's why people who call vaccuum cleaners "hoovers" in articles get legal letters from Hoover asking for a correction. So, GOSH has to be seen to be defending their copyright, even if it shortly likely to expire, or anyone else could release Peter Pan stories which might much more closely resemble their intellectual property.
 
 
Mario
23:57 / 14.10.06
Possibly. However, it's also the case that if the owner of a copyright is not shown to be defending that copyright, the copyright passes into public usage.

Trademark, not copyright. Copyright is automatic from the moment of creation (in a tangible form), and needs no defense to remain valid for it's full term. If I write a story, it's protected by copyright as soon as I save it to permanent storage. Even if it's never published, I still have the copyright.

Trademark is different, and usually applies to pictorial descriptions and uncommon words. Furthermore, you can have multiple trademarks for the same word, so long as the two usages cannot be confused.

(For example, the comic book character named Aztek was a trademark of DC, but the automobile named Aztek was a trademark of Pontiac)

A lot of folks get the two confused.
 
 
Ticker
20:56 / 22.10.06
okay now that I have my copy I'd like to ask the other folks who have read it, do the last few pages make any sense to you?
I mean sure historically, but in the overall context of the story?

wait do we need a different thread to talk about the work itself sans the GOSH thingy?
 
 
sleazenation
21:12 / 22.10.06
This was something that was covered in the promotional interview with Moore and Gebbie the other week, which I guess annoying for those spoiler purists already annoyed by the delayed release in the UK...

But yes, like Moore's last book of Miracleman, the contrast is between Eros and Thanatos, a creative, imaginative, generative force on one side and an deadly, destructive failure of imagination on the other leading to death and destruction. All the way through the book we see the building of the First World War and its eventual manifestation literally wipes away the hotel in which Alice, Dorothy and Wendy enjoyed themselves.

There are also a number of interpretations for the last few pages, but I'll leave those for a PM/overtly spoilery thread if you want to hear more, XK.
 
 
electric monk
11:54 / 23.10.06
First of all, sorry I've not been very involved in this thread. I've been following along, but haven't had much to add to the proceedings.

Secondly, I'm willing to submit edits to rejigger this thread to be a more general 'Lost Girls' thread for y'all to play in. Maybe just called 'Lost Girls' with "From litigation to publication and beyond" as a new summary? Whaddaya think?
 
 
doctorbeck
14:53 / 23.10.06
sounds like a plan, deserves a thread if the talk was anything to go by. was also wondering how people have gotten on ordering it from america to be posted to the UK?
 
 
Ticker
18:09 / 23.10.06
thanks sleazenation. Though I'll have to go read it again but my initial reaction was that the Thanatos wasn't presented as well as the Eros. I realize they weren't going to spend all the time setting it up but it was a bit of a disconnect. In hindsight I suspect if I could read the german in the last few pages perhaps the transition would have made more sense.

Time to go hassle the spouse to translate for me.
 
 
DaveBCooper
13:30 / 02.11.06
To answer doctorbeck's question, my copy took just over a week to arrive - left the USA on Oct 24, apparently, and arrived at my luxury penthouse home in London (ahem) yesterday.

Great looking package, shall be interested to read it properly (have only skimmed it at the moment), and will almost inevitably post my thoughts on it.

Also see that the whole G.O.S.H hoo-hah has been written about in the current 'Private Eye', with an interesting prediction about the likely fuss in the UK Tabloids when LG is published for the UK Market in 2008.
 
 
matthew.
01:25 / 07.11.06
Mine came in the mail today! Woo! I've already read the first volume. Here's something I didn't know: the book is gigantic. I didn't think it was going to be that heavy or huge.

Some thoughts: the art is great. Very sumptuous, very lush. It's extremely colourful and splendiforous. A treat for the senses.

The sex. Well. It's not that arousing. It's more fascinating. As erotica, it's not effective. As a work of "art," Lost Girls is more interesting in how Moore plays with the archetypes and elements of the stories.

I have to admit, like others, I'm more interested in the story than in the naughty bits. I'll give more thoughts when I finish.
 
 
Our Lady Has Left the Building
05:59 / 07.11.06
Damn you Royal Mail! Last night I had to make do with the 1977 Jackie annual and a tube of Vaseline again.
 
 
Essential Dazzler
17:20 / 08.11.06
I really liked it, but I noticed a drop in quality when I reached the third book.

I'm wondering how much of that drop in quality was a side effect of reading the whole thing in a single afternoon, it is a little relentless.
 
 
Ticker
17:41 / 08.11.06
yeah it helps to come back to it and not just speed devour the thing.
 
 
matthew.
00:17 / 09.11.06
I also noticed a drop in quality to the art. But then again, the reason why I noticed it is because as soon as I finished the third book, I turned back to the very first to start again.
 
 
Our Lady Has Left the Building
19:20 / 19.11.06
Hmmm, I've just started on book two. All the male characters so far seem to have been circumcised. Is this some clever metatextual comment on pornography that goes over my head?
 
 
Our Lady Has Left the Building
10:33 / 26.11.06
So, does anyone want to discuss the actual work at all? I've finished reading it and am resolutely un-blown away. What I have to work out is whether the elements I don't like are some clever meta-commentary on the nature of pornography and erotica that goes over my head or just badness. I have to say though, that I am not a fan of Melinda Gebbie's artwork in this. All too often it comes over as flat, either that the scene has no depth at all, or if it does, it looks like one of those little boxes you might have made as a child with flat two dimensional characters standing at various distances from the peephole (diorama?). In the otherwise striking image of the Tin Man fucking Dorothy they are both being drawn as directly facing the reader, which would mean that his cock would have to have a rather impressive ninety-degree twist along it. And I know that the images from the stories are in the imaginations of the women, not 'real', but it's much of a piece with the rest of the work.

How old do people think Alice is supposed to be in this? From reading I assumed that she was in her fifties or sixties, but she's drawn to be as old as Wendy, mid-to-late thirties/early-forties, and not much older than Dorothy.

Has anyone got a translation for the German in the last chapter?
 
 
doctorbeck
08:50 / 16.04.07
like our lady above i have just finished lost girls and was pretty bored to be honest, relentless sex really, and although the idea of setting it in the real emotional and erotic lives of 3 very well known literary characters was a good idea but wasn't done well enough to make it anything i was interested in reading.

i also didn't think the insights into anything warranted what is essentially underage and sometimes coerced sexual acts. in fact i found them pretty distateful and unnecessary. so on the whole a waste of paper i would say, and in fact i sold my copy on ebay straight away as i didn't really want it around the house.

to be honest it read like john byrne had done it.
 
  

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