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A home of one’s own?

  
  

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Tabitha Tickletooth
08:33 / 06.04.06
Been thinking about starting this thread for a while, but it seems such a big subject (inside my head, at least) that I’ve been lurking under the cloud of daunt. This first post is very, very long, but I wanted to get the central themes down at the start to encourage the broadest possible discussion. I’m also hoping to show how my concerns tie together. Please, please read on because I think this could be such an interesting discussion and I really want to know what everyone thinks.

Right, here goes! The central question I’m interested in is: what implications does living alone have for individuals, societies and the environment?

In the rich Western world we are seeing an increase in single occupancy accommodations. Here are some figures for the UK, and reading around this situation appears to be similar to trends in Australia and the US.

What started me thinking were some articles which mentioned the potential environmental implications of more people living alone: a need for more housing, land use, models of home ownership and other economic issues. Particularly in the UK, continued residential expansion is causing serious concern.

From this starting point, however, I realised that I’m also very concerned about the possible impact on individuals and society from more of us living alone. Does it decrease tolerance, are we becoming isolated, what happens to our support networks, etc?

On top of that, I’m disappointed that the move away from ‘traditional’ family living arrangements hasn’t resulted in a rise in alternative shared living arrangements, which figures would seem to indicate it hasn’t. I’d always believed that when we started moving away from the mother, father and 2.5 kids household, we’d construct new shared living arrangements that weren’t based on sex or blood relationships. It seems we haven’t – we’ve largely just started living alone.

And it struck me that behind all of this, I was making a value judgement - share/good/happy vs alone/selfish/sad. Even while I acknowledge making this judgement, the wrongness of it is screaming at me: being able to live alone has been massively empowering and a source of freedom for women, in particular, and for many others oppressed by the old structures of enforced cohabitation. And what about the fact that not everyone who lives alone *chooses* to live alone.

So, I’m interested in how people live (single v cohabiting) and what they think about the subject generally. I realise that this has potential Lab (environment)/Switchboard (politics of home ownership and habitation - more people living longer and alone is a key issue in the current UK pensions debate, for example) aspects, and if these issues come up perhaps companion threads in the appropriate places might be started.

But everyone lives somewhere, so I thought that a Conversation thread might be the place to start.

Me: I live with my partner in a typical, small, East London two bedroom terrace. I have never lived alone and don’t think I ever would because I would be lonely. I worry that my friends who live alone might be lonely even though I know, rationally, that they are not and that they like living alone. Some part of me thinks that living alone is selfish (which makes me feel embarrassed but I feel compelled to admit), because I believe we need to share both space and resources in order to build communities that work with growing populations and shrinking space. I fear that more people living alone is resulting in an increase in intolerance although I have no proof of this. I think having to live with people is good for you.

What about you?
 
 
kybalion
08:55 / 06.04.06
I will begin living alone in 4.5 months. I'm highly looking forward to it. I think it is interesting that you think isolation will increase intolerance. I feel that intolerance is a socially gained trait, and isolation will be useful to further shed the unwanted influences I have gained from being a socially constructed animal.
 
 
elene
09:14 / 06.04.06
What a great idea for a thread, Tabitha!

I share a flat with my best friend and her boyfriend. This has worked out pretty well so far but probably wouldn't were I not single. It's a big flat, but pretty snug for us three with his children too at weekends. It makes a lot of sense, we share the various responsibilities and I at least benefit from the company. Yes, that does feel a bit awkward sometimes too.

This situation arose by chance, before this I had a medium size flat to myself. The independence was nice, but it was comparatively wasteful. Nevertheless, it's likely I'll live in a single flat again before too long. I hope I'll be able to restrict myself to a really small one. I think that's the most important thing, to minimise waste. After that it's a balance between independence and loneliness.

Flat sharings, Wohngemeinschaften, are quite popular among young people in Germany but I'd find it very difficult to convince myself to try this with people I didn't already know very well indeed. I think having to live with people is good for one too, but I've really got to decide with whom.
 
 
Mistoffelees
09:16 / 06.04.06
I´m living on my own since 1995. I have a very cheap three-room appartment (70 m²) for myself, and I can´t imagine living with someone else. This all goes back to living with my parents in a one-room-flat and now I´m probably compensating.

There´s lots of vacant appartments in town, so there´s no reason to feel bad about having so much room for myself.

We had lots of problems with finding flats before 1989, but since the wall came down, there´s lots of space, and many families are building houses just outside the city.

And to me the argument, that living alone equals less tolerance doesn´t hold. I have never had the experience, that people who live alone are less tolerant than people, who live as a couple/family/in a commune.


On top of that, I’m disappointed that the move away from ‘traditional’ family living arrangements hasn’t resulted in a rise in alternative shared living arrangements, which figures would seem to indicate it hasn’t.

That seems a bit naïve to me. Whenever friends of mine live with other people, they always tell me "Oh, ze´s a pig, look at the bathroom!" or "Ze always eats my groceries, but denies it!". So if people can afford it, they prefer living alone, so they don´t have to be confronted with the problems that arise, when we live with other people.
 
 
Tabitha Tickletooth
09:20 / 06.04.06
4.5 months - sounds like you are indeed counting down to single living! I can't see, though, how just living alone would allow you to shed unwanted influences - surely you won't be having *no* contact with people and are influenced by those you don't live with as well as those you do?

Maybe I need to explain what I mean by intolerance better, though. I'm not suggesting that living alone makes you a racist, misogynist, serial killer, etc. It's more about what I think of as 'baseline' consideration and tolerance for others that I think can be diminished when people no longer share space. As I say, I have nothing but the anecdotal to support me...
 
 
Ariadne
09:22 / 06.04.06
I spent years living alone, and really enjoyed it - I never felt lonely. And after years of sharing flats, it was bliss not to be harrassed by other people's peculiar habits and even more peculiar friends.

Now co-habiting, that's good too - it's like living alone but with company! That sounds daft, I know, but sharing with a partner is very different to sharing with friends or flatmates. Though he still eats all the vegemite.

I really don't think that, on the whole, you'll get people switching from family living to living with flatmates - if they get away from the family unit they're going to want their own space. Which is wasteful, admittedly, but sharing is hard.
 
 
William Sack
09:43 / 06.04.06
Tabitha, I think I know what you mean about intollerance, and I think you might be right. I lived alone for 5 years during which I had 2 spells where I had a lodger, both of whom were good friends. I hated sharing my flat as I had become too accustomed to having my own space.

One advantage of living alone is that you don't have to make the effort to do certain things and can function within your own household without having to be concerned with other people's interests. When that changes you can become resentful of having to make that effort. When I say "you" I do of course mean lazy old asocial "me".

I now share a house with Mrs. S and 2 year old twins.
 
 
Tabitha Tickletooth
09:51 / 06.04.06
elene: ...I'd find it very difficult to convince myself to try this with people I didn't already know very well indeed. I think having to live with people is good for one too, but I've really got to decide with whom.

This is obviously very important and raises something which I completely failed to acknowledge - personality/temperament. I spent years living in share accommodation in my 20s, sometimes quite short term. I lived with lots of people, some who I liked, some who really irritated me.

Thing is, I have friends who went through nothing short of anguish when they didn't get on with their flatmates. From Mistoffelees comments, it would seem that for people he knows, the negatives of sharing far outweight any positives. For me, sharing that didn't work out was never that much of an issue - I'd navigate through some situations and in the event that it became really unpleasant, I'd simply move somewhere else. This wasn't always easy (with a large dog and a cage-free bird in tow) but it seemed preferable to remaining in a hostile or unhappy space.

There's no denying, however, that different people experience difficult situations 'in the home' very differently.

Mistoffelees: why was my belief that people would live together but in different units 'naive'? People have had all different kinds of shared living arrangements throughout time. I'm interested that you seem to be positing living alone as the highest aspiration - So if people can afford it, they prefer living alone, so they don´t have to be confronted with the problems that arise, when we live with other people. I have a largely positive experience of sharing and have never aspired to live alone.
 
 
elene
10:12 / 06.04.06
For me, sharing that didn't work out was never that much of an issue - I'd navigate through some situations and in the event that it became really unpleasant, I'd simply move somewhere else. This wasn't always easy (with a large dog and a cage-free bird in tow) but it seemed preferable to remaining in a hostile or unhappy space.

I've usually lived with a partner, with several breaks in between when I was alone. I've twice before, when I was much younger, shared a house with friends. Both times it got really messy - but we were young and poor and a bit nuts. It can get really bad, though I don't remember ever thinking I'll never do that again, and I have thought that when relationships ended. If everyone's mature and reasonably self-sufficient it doesn't seems so difficult, like right now.

I suspect your pets provide as a really good test of any new flatmates. If people can't cope with this then you'd likely not want them anyway.
 
 
Mistoffelees
10:16 / 06.04.06
No, it´s not the highest aspiration to me. I meant, it´s better to live alone, than living with someone for financial reasons. If I get along really well with my girlfriend, I wouldn´t rule out living with her.

And the "naïve" reply: I thought of all the extremists over the world, and mostly when I read about them in the news, they don´t live alone [the Unabomber being the only exception I could think of]. Be it the "prussian blue" family in the USA, or hardcore mormons, or palestinian extremists, or Mao and his community cooking groups.
 
 
Loomis
10:24 / 06.04.06
I think living alone becomes more attractive as you get older and more set in your ways, or also if you’ve previously lived with a partner, which, as Ariadne says, is a bit like living alone as everything is shared so it’s not like you have to worry about people nicking your food (though your booze still disappears). Anyway, living alone is not usually financially possible until you’re older and earning more, by which time you tend to have accumulated more (nicer) stuff and got into habits and it becomes harder to compromise. Which gets back to your point about isolation Tabitha, which I think is a good one. Compromising is a key ingredient to a healthy society and when you live in a world where everything is tailored precisely to your tastes then it can be harder to see where someone else is coming from or to embrace change.

I really enjoyed living in share houses when I was single and wouldn’t have considered living alone even if I could have afforded it. But then I never had any major problems with flatmates, so I guess I was lucky. And if I were single now I would probably consider living alone and wouldn’t be unhappy doing so, but in the end I would probably rather share. But sharing doesn’t have to mean living in the big brother house – it can just be two people, which I think makes it easier to resolve differences and have a shared outlook rather than five people each with their own shelf in the fridge and their own cupboard. A lot of people aren’t independent or outgoing enough to enjoy the toing and froing of a house full of strangers coming and going all the time.

I also agree that it had seemed that by now there would be more of a change in living arrangements, such as middle-aged single people sharing houses with friends, but then it could be a generational thing, from a time when you either lived with your parents or you had your own family, and they were the two basic living arrangements. Whereas as our generation ages I think it will be accepted in society for older people to share with friends, and not just singles but combinations of couples and/or singles in larger houses. I read an article a couple of months ago about a share house where all the residents were 60+ and it sounded great.

However I think this trend of living alone will fade pretty soon simply because it is no longer affordable. I was reading something about Sydney the other day where house prices and availability are in a similar state to London and how it is becoming increasingly normal for people to stay at home until their thirties (or moving back after having lived away) so they can save money to buy something. That could be a symptom of the anti-renting/property ladder viewpoint that’s scaring everybody into owning property as soon as possible. And I think we will see a rise in people buying with friends rather than partners.
 
 
ibis the being
12:00 / 06.04.06
I lived alone for a year in a tiny studio apartment. I can't blame all of my unhappiness on my apartment status because when I moved into my studio I'd just gone through a breakup and all my friends had moved out of town - but yes, living alone for me was lonely to the extreme. I'd get home from work at 6.30 and the evening would yawn before me like an ordeal to get through. Typically I coped with that by heading to the bar around the corner, alone, and getting drunk until midnight. On the weekends I slept a lot.

Those were not my expectations for living alone. I'm an introverted person who likes quiet time, and I actually thought I would like living alone. I envisioned myself reading a lot of books, cooking for one, drawing. Until I saw just how many hours alone lay before me. There was nothing cute and romantic about being stuffed into my small ugly studio, with little sunlight, no porch or yard or other outdoor area... I didn't even have a couch. I would just drink and pace. It was madness. The couple of friends I still had in town wouldn't come over because being in my 'home' was depressing and almost claustrophobia-inducing.

But in even in better circumstances, with a bigger apartment (in some dream world where I could afford that) and friends nearby, I don't think I'd choose to live alone again if I could help it. Maybe now that I have a dog I could do it. But it was incredibly boring and too easy for me to slip into drinking too much to pass the time. When eventually I moved in with my current boyfriend and roommate, the transition was very easy. The extra work/compromise seemed a small price to pay for human company.

Now I live with my boyfriend, dog, and a friend of ours - have had this arrangement for nearly two years. Right now we can't afford not to have the friend as a roommate, and we like this apartment. It's working out ok, although I am starting to feel annoyance with some of the usual roommate bad habits (doesn't clean, doesn't chip in, etc). In a perfect scenario, yes, I would choose to not have the roommate and just live with my boyfriend. I know that gets back to the nuclear family arrangement... but I think it's just harder to live with more than one other person at any time, because more than two in a house and (it seems) someone's always going to try to slip through the cracks chore-wise.
 
 
Mourne Kransky
12:51 / 06.04.06
I suppose, if you're a miserable, misanthropic, utterly selfish person who doesn't play well with others then you're going to avoid living with company in the first place.

Whether the mere fact of living alone, accidentally so to speak, would make you more selfish and less tolerant, I am undecided. I think I probably was more selfish and less tolerant when I was living the single life in my own flat. But not very much more. I grump whatever.

I was happy enough living on my own. What I didn't like was having one other friend move in and share with me in my flat. Within six months we'd be screaming at each other over somebody using too much bogroll. After a year, the UN would have to send in a task force to keep the peace.

A bigger flatshare, I have found, is easier to manage. Have shared with half a dozen others when I was younger, though not for very long spells, and quite enjoyed that. I did weary of the noisy impromptu partying and bohemian squalor after a while and I think I'm too old to manage that now. It was a lifestyle that was well suited in my youth, however, and I wish I'd done more of that then.

My ideal now is me and my beloved, nesting in a disgustingly middle class way. Co-dependency suits me very well. Had a decade of that in the past and have lived an idyll with the Elephant God for longer.

Single person households are not nunneries though. When I was a single man, I socialised outside of the house a lot more, made arrangements to do stuff with friends more often and was more likely to be up for an impromptu drinking sesh.

I kept up with family commitments better and I had a wider range of friends and many more acquaintances I'd put off time with. I also had cats. I ate less and got wasted more. I was more engaged, through friends and work, with broader society than I have ever been. I was certainly more active politically. I didn't really want to give up that life, truth be told, when Ganesh first moved in.

Happier now though.
 
 
grant
15:08 / 06.04.06
I socialize a lot less now that I live in a (large) house with many people, rather than when I lived in a (small) apartment by myself. I think this is partially a function of having dependents, but also I have more fun at home.

I've always been a homebody, though.

On top of that, I’m disappointed that the move away from ‘traditional’ family living arrangements hasn’t resulted in a rise in alternative shared living arrangements, which figures would seem to indicate it hasn’t. I’d always believed that when we started moving away from the mother, father and 2.5 kids household, we’d construct new shared living arrangements that weren’t based on sex or blood relationships.

I'd always been under the impression that 'traditional' family arrangements weren't, really -- that before the mid-20th century, it was more standard to have several generations under one roof, and that the nuclear family grew out of the classic 1950s suburb: suddenly, grandma & grandpa got lodged in condos & townhouses somewhere far from the grandkids.

As far as the perspective from the senior side of the fence, there's been a lot going on lately with the damages/risks of living alone (and in pseudo-alone spaces like traditional ALF condos) compared with "village style" assisted living setups.
 
 
Kit-Cat Club
15:18 / 06.04.06
I used to live alone, but in a really grim bedsit. I was relatively happy there, but I did try to spend more time out and about, and would delay going home. I also ate really badly and spent most of my time reading rather than doing all the creative things I imagined I would do. Having said that (and despite pretty good experiences of shared living) I would probably try and live on my own again rather than sharing with people I didn't already know at least a little bit.

I think the key thing for me is privacy, which is a luxury really, but something I find it quite hard to be contented without. I need to be able to close the door (my door) and know that that bit of space is mine and no one can intrude. There doesn't need to be that much space to achieve this! My parents still live in our family house, which is large, and they rattle around in it. I wouldn;t like that amount of space, I think, and besides, it is dreadfully inefficient. But I live with my partner in a pretty small flat, and really it is a bit too small. Moreover it's not soundproofed, so if one of us is working with music on in the sitting room, the other person can't avoid the music even by sitting in the bedroom with the door shut. Ditto when the guy above us or the girl next door have visitors/play music.

I think I'd be reasonably happy to live in a more communal environment provided I had the ability to shut it out when I wanted to, and provided I had some control over my surroundings (on the level of being sure that no one would introduce something without my having agreed to it - I remember being absolutely livid when I once came home to find that my flatmate had moved all my books around - GRRR).
 
 
Brigade du jour
16:15 / 06.04.06
Single person households are not nunneries though. When I was a single man, I socialised outside of the house a lot more, made arrangements to do stuff with friends more often and was more likely to be up for an impromptu drinking sesh.

Yep, Xoc just nailed it as far as I'm concerned. So much so, in fact, that I'm sorely tempted to use that as my primary reason for living alone. The truth is, however, that it would probably be an excuse if I said it. The main reason is merely that I like privacy, I like my own space. Like Kit-Cat Club, my space doesn't have to be very large - at the moment it's a studio flat (which means a bedroom in a fairly large East London house with the enviable comfort of an en-suite bathroom, not some spacious open-plan sanctum sanctorum like people have in sitcoms) and I think of it as a little womb to which I can retreat when I need to be on my own. I should point out, however, that being on my own gets quite boring quite quickly, so I always make sure that when I have free time I spend it outside of my little womb. Or I invite people over and we have dinner and watch movies and all the cool stuff that flat-sharers and families do. Best of both worlds. Sneaky, aren't I?

Anyway, this has been my living situation for about two years now, and I don't miss sharing with friends, as I did throughout my twenties, as much as I thought I might. On the other hand, I like to think that I'm not retreating gradually into a little lonely shell of self-absorption and losing any social faculties I might once have had. But then that's an opinion generated on the inside looking in.

I've often wondered whether the fact that I like living alone is chiefly down to being an only child (some might say the classic definition thereof!) and therefore accustomed at an early age to 'making my own entertainment' and perhaps lacking a certain amount of socialisation brought on by sharing space and more intimate moments of my life with siblings of a similar age. According to my own anecdotal evidence, it seems that those who prefer sharing accommodation are generally those who grew up with brothers and/or sisters around the place. I'm no psychologist, but it seems like a reasonable leap of logic to me. Where's Ganesh? He knows about psychology and stuff ...
 
 
girakittie
18:42 / 06.04.06
I am now 30, having somehow survived my twenties, and I am living alone again as of six weeks ago. I have lived in communal living situations and alone, I have also lived with romantic partners twice (both times were disasters!).

As a single parent, living with housemates/roommates has to be one of the most frustrating things I've ever done. I've lived in probably 10 or 12 different roommate situations over the past ten years. I think that if I were not a parent, it would not have been so terrifying. But as it was, I could afford very little toward rent in the beginning because I was on welfare (the dole) and so was forced to live in less than ideal roommate situations as that was the only thing I could afford. I was trying to create stability for myself and my child, in situations that were in and of themselves inherently unstable, with absolute strangers. Not something I'd ever willingly go through again.

My last round of "roommates" was a houseshare. First with a couple whom I was fond of and their three children. That could've worked out tolerably well except they are MUCH more social than I am and regularly had people in and out of the house, as well as scheduled parties two and three times a month. Additionally, they were resentful that I had more disposable income than they did because I only had one child while they had three.

My last roommate situation, they had been together as a couple for nine years (no kids) and just recently decided (after we all moved in together) to get a divorce. It wasn't a good environment to come home to, especially with the four hours I was spending a day commuting. So I moved back to San Francisco, into a 1 bedroom flat where I have enough room that when my daughter visits me over the summer (she lives with her father currently, in Oregon) we won't be too much in each other's hair.

That, at least, is my hope.

Having done roommates and done living alone, I would say that living with roommates is infinitely harder. It's easier on the pocketbook, to be sure, but there will always be altercations over whom should be doing what and paying for what, no matter how well you thought you had the agreements hammered out.

I don't find that living alone makes me more intolerant. I find that it actually makes me far more tolerant because I am getting the time and space I need to myself. As others have commented in the thread, there is a certain amount of frittering away of time that is less likely to happen in shared living arrangements, but all in all it is the best solution for me.

It is difficult in that I do get lonely and I have a hard time calling friends and inviting them to do things. I don't want to be a bother. But it is still infinitely more peaceful than having to share space with someone you can't stand.

As for whether it is wasteful or not, I guess it would depend on how you look at it. If you have a 3 bedroom house and even, at the extreme, say a set of parents and four children, that's six people in one structure. For the size of two 3 bedroom houses, side by side, you could have one apartment building with twenty or thirty apartments in it, depending on how tall it was. Of course, apartments can run fairly small here. But even if you figure only one person per apartment (which I would guess it probably runs about half and half here, between single residents and couples), that's still either eight or eighteen more residents than your two houses side by side. Yes, they will use probably more electricty per person, but as far as water usage is concerned, I would think it would be pretty constant.

Ultimately, I guess it's about how you define efficiency.
 
 
Spaniel
18:55 / 06.04.06
Well in this context I'd say we're defining it as the least wasteful way of using resources.
 
 
*
21:10 / 06.04.06
I live in a co-operative house. The house is three stories (including the ground floor) + a basement. There are fifteen double rooms and eight singles— space for 38. We're usually full or have just one space.

We have a licensed commercial kitchen which is inspected by the health department regularly (probably at least twice a semester, I can't recall off-hand). We're part of a network of similar co-ops, so there is an off-site warehouse which ships us our food. Our work system is very organized and also highly flexible. In our house, things get done and the house in general stays pretty clean. Other co-ops in our network are, shall we say, not so good at that aspect. Because we buy in bulk our food is cheap, and we can get great organic groceries delivered to us. It costs about $4 a day for each person's allotment of food, which is included in our rent. In addition, water, electricity, natural gas, trash/recycling, wireless internet, and a certain budget for social activities is also included.

There are tons of benefits to living this way. When I moved out here from across the continent, I knew myself well-enough to know that if I had just moved to a new city, into my own apartment by myself for the first time ever, and started grad school/a new job, I would probably be neo- and agoraphobic and let certain things slide, like, oh, getting groceries, eating, and non-essentials like that. Instead I moved into a community where, while we have our problems, we generally support each other. People will notice if I forget to eat for a couple of days, for instance. I have made some great friends. It's also stressful at times, especially now that I have a leadership role in this great community. But I'm staying here as long as I can.

Besides, we have a hot tub.
 
 
Mourne Kransky
21:27 / 06.04.06
You sybarite!
 
 
ibis the being
23:32 / 06.04.06
I've often wondered whether the fact that I like living alone is chiefly down to being an only child (some might say the classic definition thereof!) and therefore accustomed at an early age to 'making my own entertainment' and perhaps lacking a certain amount of socialisation brought on by sharing space and more intimate moments of my life with siblings of a similar age. According to my own anecdotal evidence, it seems that those who prefer sharing accommodation are generally those who grew up with brothers and/or sisters around the place.

I'm glad you brought this up, because I was thinking about it as I was writing my last post. I'm one of six kids (two "half" sisters so really I grew up with three siblings). Of course as a kid/teenager I was always griping about not having enough privacy, and as I mentioned I'm an introvert... but by living alone I found out that I'm more comfortable with a certain amount of noise, foot traffic, and human company in the house. Being alone was maybe too alien to me because I was raised in a pretty full house.
 
 
Tabitha Tickletooth
08:19 / 07.04.06
This is great! So interesting people's different experiences of living alone/sharing. I'm really surprised by the number of people who have lived or do live alone. And by the fact that financial pressure seems to be almost exclusively the reason people share - ie if you can afford to live alone it is preferable.

An obvious distinction, which I hadn't factored in, has emerged - there's a big difference between co-habiting with a partner and sharing with someone(s) you aren't having a relationship with. While I agree that it's different, I still think it requires the sharing of space. It forces you, if it is going to work and be a fun way to live, to be considerate. And to tolerate the occasions when the other person comes home hammered and plays the same Nick Cave song over and over and over again at 3am. Loud. And you should see what I have to put up with.

The major difference is in your motivation to tolerate and be considerate - but fuck me if it still doesn't get trying at times.

Loomis: I also agree that it had seemed that by now there would be more of a change in living arrangements, such as middle-aged single people sharing houses with friends, but then it could be a generational thing, from a time when you either lived with your parents or you had your own family, and they were the two basic living arrangements. Whereas as our generation ages I think it will be accepted in society for older people to share with friends, and not just singles but combinations of couples and/or singles in larger houses. I read an article a couple of months ago about a share house where all the residents were 60+ and it sounded great.

That's what I expected too. In fact, if I find myself no longer living in a relationship, I very much hope to share living space with someone else. I'm already in my mid-30s so from what I am reading, it sounds like that might prove quite a challenge.

(id)entity - your place sounds brilliant! Again, I expected to see more of this by now, but I can't say it's that common. As someone who doesn't wish to own a house/flat/land (which I realise is an another, though related, issue) this sounds ideal to me. It would be interesting to hear if anyone knows of similar co-op arrangements in the UK - or in Australia (Melbourne, particularly, if I might be so demanding).

The only child thing mentioned by CMB and Ibis - I'm a bit dubious about this. I guess I have been more inclined to identify personality as central to the desire to live alone, rather than your experience as a child. I come from an outrageously noisy, in your face, family and I love living with other people. I don't really have much of a sense of privacy at all. My little brother adored living alone, until he finally moved in with his partner and now has a baby. Even then, he is *so* fiercely protective of his space. Makes me realise how absolutely hideous having to live with me must have been for him...
 
 
Ariadne
08:58 / 07.04.06
God, I think (id)entity's place sounds like a nightmare! That level of sharing and communal living would just freak me out, I think. I'm far too private and like to eat what I want and do what I want, without other people around.

And I'm not an only child, so that doesn't fit. I shared a room with my sister until I was about 13, so I'm used to sharing space - I'd just prefer not to, and especially not with relative strangers.
 
 
Cat Chant
13:02 / 07.04.06
Hee. I was just about to post about how fantastic (id)entity's place was when I saw Ariadne's post and suddenly thought hang on, yeah, completely fantastic in theory and I'm so glad there are people doing that, but there's no way I could do it.

My fantasy was always to buy a little terrace of houses, like the back-to-backs in Leeds where I used to live, and have a village with all my friends, rather than a communal place. Find a way to maximize privacy - I don't think I could hack cooking/eating with 38 other people on a regular basis, like Ariadne - but minimize waste/duplication of resources (I'm currently living in a flat, in a house with eight or nine other flats, none of which has more than two people in it: do we really need, say, ten washing machines for fifteen people?).

One thing I've noticed that's weird is that living with Tangent (my gf) has made me waste a lot more food. This is partly because I'm more in touch with my body and like myself more, so I won't just cook one huge, dull meal out of whatever vegetables the veg shop round the corner has and then keep eating the leftovers till they're all gone before I cook anything else. But it's still bad.
 
 
Bear
13:15 / 07.04.06
I think I'd be dubious of sharing with a stranger since the fork stealing housemate. I don't think I'll ever get the image of him washing his balls in the bath (with a vest on) out of my mind.

On the other hand some of the best times I've had in London were in the bedsit in Vauxhall.

I've never actually lived alone but my housemate and I have a good understanding and pretty much keep out of each others way. We both seem to know when drinking sessions are required...
 
 
Loomis
13:22 / 07.04.06
He washed his balls in the bath? Too big for the sink were they?
 
 
Bear
13:39 / 07.04.06
Many a sleepless night I've sat awake wondering, mainly on why if he thought everyone was out (hence the open bathroom door) was he wearing a vest?
 
 
Axolotl
12:43 / 08.04.06
I've only ever lived with flatmates, ranging from friends to completely random people. I've not had any real disasters, and the nearest I came to having one was when I was living with friends, rather than some person found via an ad in newsagent's window. I like the human contact and it's nice to have someone to talk to when you get back from work, but sometimes I begrudge having to be considerate and polite.
I'd quite like to live on my own, but I don't think it would be good for me - I worry I'd end up a crazy hermit. However the privacy and the chance to be gloriously selfish all the time do appeal. However I can't really afford to live on my own at the moment, so it's not really an option.
 
 
Jack Vincennes
13:24 / 08.04.06
Ariadne: I'm far too private and like to eat what I want and do what I want, without other people around.

Deva: One thing I've noticed that's weird is that living with Tangent (my gf) has made me waste a lot more food. [...] I won't just cook one huge, dull meal out of whatever vegetables the veg shop round the corner has and then keep eating the leftovers till they're all gone before I cook anything else

I think that for me the issue of living alone or with others is all about the food. I'm thinking about the difference between my final year at uni and my Master's year (at a different university). In my final year, I basically lived on the top floor of a hall of residence with someone else -there was my room, his room and a tiny kitchen, then an external door that led to the rest of the hall. I mention this so it is clear we could not have lived in closer proximity without sharing a bed -neither of us had huge rooms, and we'd wander in and out of each other's space pretty much as we saw fit, and were unbothered by this. We would also cook together (usually with my friend downstairs), every single night -there were probably five nights in that year where we were both in the same city and didn't cook together.

In my Master's year, I had much, much more space as I was in an actual flat with four other girls. The kitchen was massive and it had a proper living room which wasn't small either. However, there was no cooking together at all, and everyone else got on my nerves when it came to be time to cook. Got on my nerves in a 'getoutofmyfaceoutoutoutnowpleasego' sort of way. I think it was the fact that I was making the kind of meals Deva describes (with lots and lots of Campbell's soup instead of proper sauce, they were pretty rough as far as I remember) and I was struck by the wastefulness of it as I was spending about as much on food as I did the previous year yet eating meals that was so much more horrible.

I'm currently living with my partner, so the cooking patterns are much more like the one I enjoyed. I've never lived alone for an extended period of time, and whilst I don't think I'd mind from the point of view of evenings with no-one to talk to I'm not sure how I'd feel about cooking entirely for myself every night of the week -I'm sure I'd start getting irritable about wasting food and money on same.

Ariadne, I'm interested in what you say -is it the lack of control over food you'd have in a large group (as in (id)entity's example) that you'd dislike, or being cooked for by someone who might make something rubbish that you'd dislike? Or to put it more clearly, does what you say apply only to cooking with large groups or is it something you dislike in general?
 
 
*
21:08 / 08.04.06
Well, I know I don't cook for myself when I live alone, and I also don't eat leftovers very well— I have weird hangups around food. And here in my house we reuse leftovers in new dishes, and even though there is a lot of food waste (usually because people put something in the fridge without labeling it, and it will get thrown out if it doesn't at least have a recent date) we are really strict about composting, so that makes me feel a little better.

I love our cooking system. People here generally cook much yummier and healtheir things than I would be eating living alone. And when I cook, it's exciting to cook with someone for 30-40 people, with access to a wide variety of ingredients and all the amenities of a commercial kitchen. I get to feel creative, which I never do just making a meal for myself to subsist on.
 
 
Ariadne
07:41 / 09.04.06
Vincennes - I wouldn't like having to just eat what everyone else is - I suppose I'm a bit fussy, and I would freak out at the idea of it being my turn to cook for so many people. And really, I don't work well in a team, I think! The whole concept of trying to work/cope with all those people, and not even at work but in my home environment where I should be relaxed - I feel panicky just thinkng about it!
I've shared flats with up to five people, where we shared cooking - it was okay, but really, I'd have preferred not to - the arguments over food bills and what to cook just got too tiresome.
 
 
Blake Head
13:10 / 09.04.06
How strange. I’ve literally been thinking about exactly the same thread for the past week and lo and behold, I take my eye off the ‘lith for a few days off and find one in full swing. That said, I think mine would have been much less well thought out and essentially nosier. Regardless, in the most narcissistic way possible: great idea for a thread Tabitha!

As superficial as it might sound, I want someplace where all my books can live; I constantly feel that I’m not all “there” (for lots of reasons) having my stuff split between my current flat and in storage at my parents’, it makes where I’m staying feel unstable or temporary, which I guess it is. I agree with Loomis about living alone being something you assume will happen when you’re a bit older, but recently I’ve felt that despite not really being in a financial situation to comfortably afford it, it might be worth the trade off in (my already meagre) disposable income if I can find a small place where I don’t need to rely on anyone else. Incidentally, I always liked the idea of living in a shed at the bottom of the garden, like Rollins! I have a sister that I’m close to and definitely edge towards living alone, and having my own space for my own entertainment so to speak, and going out / inviting people into that space. The group fantasy amongst my good friends is having an artist colony / island to live on together, but with those that are “that way” (including me) having defined private homes. Total decadent luxury of course. Having someone you’re living with “together” seems different from just co-habiting, it doesn’t feel like that need for privacy is so large, so in many ways I’d rather that than living alone, but at the same time I’d rather live alone than live with people I wasn’t that close to.

Generally I’ve been pretty fortunate and I’ve made some good friends from random flatshares. So far I’ve stayed in flats where the landlord co-habited, which I’ve said that if I have any choice I’ll try not to do again in the future, as it definitely affects how they and you view the flat, and in my experience of sharing with older guys a couple of times does seem to tie in to uncomfortable notions of patriarchy / authority – which is a convoluted way of saying that I’m feeling worn down and itchy through living with guys who naturally assume that they know best. I had one very unpleasant situation involving a major argument with a former flatmate that made the remaining time I lived there very uncomfortable, as again they were my landlord as well and it makes you realise your vulnerability / dependency in that situation.

Just to go off on another tangent, I do find that living with other people you can be very conscious of that other person or persons and sort of live around what they’re doing, when they’ll be in, even describing your own activities in a way that makes sense to them… or is that just me? I mean, feeling that these people you spend a lot of your time around become a part of the community you use to define yourself against/within, which involves socialising your own idiosyncratic traits. Personally the idea of living alone appeals partly because I don’t think I’d be quite so self-conscious about my “little habits”, and it would be healthier if I had the freedom not to need to reference other people’s concerns. And no, I wasn’t Bear’s dubious fork-stealing ball-washing stranger!

It’s privacy really. Kit-Kat’s idea of an enclosed space is similarly important to me, but when that’s just a room in a flat, I think you have to work hard to not become hermit-like (if like me you’re a home person) and in a healthy flatshare to resist the notion that you’re just renting a room and in a house where you have the use of the facilities. I actually get on really well with my current flatmate and I still feel that need to have a “bigger” space, or maybe a more “whole” space would be more accurate. I’d hate to have the responsibility of cooking for other people, That said I make dinner occasionally for my current flatmate for pleasure and he never ever cooks for me - bastard! I take it all back, flatshares are rubbish. But responsibility might be the crux of it, communal living might be a really good source of support but it also makes demands on you, and generally I’m much happier when I can be self-sufficient and if I have periods where I’m feeling less domestic than others there’s no-one to exert pressure to do something about it other than myself.

Of course I might just be miserable, misanthropic, selfish and wasteful at heart.
 
 
PatrickMM
04:18 / 10.04.06
I'm still in college, so the whole living situation is a bit different, primarily in the fact that I don't pay the rent on my dorm room. However, I've definitely shared some of the experiences on this thread.

The first year I lived in a regular dorm, double with a roommate. We weren't particularly close, but got on well enough, and because we were all freshmen, I knew most of the people on the hall and frequently people were drop by and hang out in the room, or I would wander down the hall and do stuff with people. It was a very communal setup, like each individual room was part of a larger whole. This was pretty close to what you see on sitcoms, where your friends would just drop by all the time and hang out for a while, and it was pretty fun. Also, my roommate was out a lot, so I had a bunch of time on my own.

Then the second year I had a single on a hall with a few of my friends. So, I knew some people on the hall, but it wasn't that same sense of community. I will say that being on my own made me try to get out more, largely because I had this sense that while I was alone in my room, other people were doing all kinds of awesome stuff. So, it was the weekends that were sometimes toughest, if I wasn't doing anything, by the time it got late, I'd sort of run out of things to do on my own and felt bad that I wasn't do something better than just sitting alone in my room. Obviously it's not as dramatic a solo living experience as being in a building far away from anyone you know, but at times it felt like that.

However, on the whole I did like having a single. There's a lot of merit to being able to play music or watch movies whenever you want, and generally not worry about keeping up appearances.

This year I've been living in an "apartment style" dorm, which is basically two single rooms, a kitchen/common room and a bathroom. So, I had one roommate, but my own room within there. In some ways, this is the best of both worlds because I get the benefits of always having someone to do stuff with, but at the same time it's a bit annoying to have to account for someone else. And this time my roommate seemed to never leave the room, so I never had the sense of real privacy.

I do find that living with other people you can be very conscious of that other person or persons and sort of live around what they’re doing, when they’ll be in, even describing your own activities in a way that makes sense to them… or is that just me?

I would definitely agree. When he leaves, I sometimes feel the obligation to play some music loud, just because I've only got the opportunity to do so now, whereas if I was living completely on my own, I wouldn't necessarily want to do that.

Another thing I've found is that living with someone changes the relationship. I think it's hard to be really good friends with someone you live with because it's tough to keep up conversation all the time. So, when it's just us in the room, we usually don't talk that much, but when other people come over, it's like that brings us back to friends and not just people living in the same place.

I think it basically comes down to being "on." When I wake up, I want just a half hour to take a shower and eat breakfast without talking to anyone, and even just saying "Good morning" to someone is annoying. I don't want to be on at that point, and when you're living alone you don't have to be, but with a roommate, there's sort of an obligation to be on all the time, and that can be tough.

I guess the reason people do live with family or people they're in a relationship with is that you don't have that obligation to be sociable with them. You can let your guard down, and with a roommate, unless you're really close, you'd probably feel the need to keep your social persona on most of the time.
 
 
Olulabelle
22:47 / 10.04.06
I used to live alone in a teeny little cottage in the middle of nowhere on the Longleat estate in Somerset.



Actually, I didn't live on my own there at all, I lived there with my eight year old son. But, in terms of adult company I lived alone. After 8pm every evening I chose what to eat, what to do, what to watch on TV, whether to watch TV or whether actually I preferred to stand outside and listen for baby owls. Baby owls or bats.

I loved living on my own. I made allowances for no-one. My house looked like I chose, I left things lying around, or I didn't. I was obsessively tidy, or I wasn't; it was my choice.

I didn't use the heating, I mostly burnt deadwood from the forest and wore jumpers. I lived in a house with little light, in the evenings just the light from the TV or the computer. Sometimes I sat in candlelight. I had a house mouse and I liked it. It ate the dry dog food and sometimes bits of toast. Some evenings it would skitter across the living room and then stand stock still, looking at me when it realised I was there.

I loved my teeny house because I found it, it was mine and I was responsible for it.

Now I live in my partners house in a big city. It's still his house; when we fight he tells me to leave. It doesn't feel like my home yet even though I've lived here since August.

I feel like I now have nowhere which is 'mine'. I don't feel stable and I don't think my son does either.

Living on your own makes you feel stable because you have no-one to answer to or rely on other than yourself. Living with other people means you can never truly believe that things will be okay, because by it's very essence other random factors are involved.
 
 
Blake Head
23:12 / 11.04.06
Living with other people means you can never truly believe that things will be okay, because by it's very essence other random factors are involved.

God – yes! I don’t think I’d mind bohemian squalor and randomness temporarily, but “home” needs to be a stable foundation, a cave sheltering you from the elements and the wild beasts that roam outside. Instability or negative behaviour in someone you’re living with, even if it’s not directed at you, can really upset your own sense of harmony.

What happened to your wee cottage Lula? It sounds great! Can I go live there?
 
  

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