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pulling magic

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the rake at the gates

17:53 / 04.03.02

ok i woundering what magical techniques people have used in the past to attract people, i mean at the very least magic should be able to help get you laid occasionally, and i could do with a bit of help, sigils arent working, probably cause im obsessing with this one girl too much, so what else is there?, what about a few love gods that have worked in the past for you. cause my lack of success in this area is making me question why the hell am i bothering with all this stuff if i cant even do this

18:04 / 04.03.02

The best magick in my books is applying healing to issues that you are currently making rash descisions about. No good taking your mind of putting your dick into something, when putting your dick into something or not is the problem.
Check out the catastrophe model in Liber Null.
Sort your head out and you'll be in a much better place. As in a place where you sex life is less traumatic and more fulfilling.
To sort out the head use meditation on a well balanced deity, use sigil magick to exert some self healing, make a talisman, or try energy healing and regression.

either that or pay for sex.

18:06 / 04.03.02

I've also tried the whole sigil route, didn't work.

Now this is just a suggestion, but instead of doing the whole magick thing.....talk to the girl. You know do that thing where smart words come out of your mouth and you ask her to go out for coffee or something.

18:22 / 04.03.02

There is a technique called the 'Moon Glance' which involes visualising a cresent moon on its side over both your eyes and the eyes of the person you're chatting up...Of course what this mainly does is to use the eyes as the great flirting tool that they are but it is handy if you're slightly shy and have trouble keeping eye contact...Don't try too hard though as you may just look weird and cross-eyed and that's pretty off putting...(my apologies to any boss-eyed barbloids who may be offended

)

Nietzsch E. Coyote

19:00 / 04.03.02

You could also try sigils or an invokation so that when you talk smart things really do come out of your mouth.

21:18 / 04.03.02

Well, Jimmy, if it's one specific girl you're talking about, you may have a problem. we've talked about the control issues here before... basically if you know she doesn't want you any attempt at magickal coercion is deeply deeply dodgy. If you're unsure as to whether or not she wants you then you ought to try 'mundane' (as if these situations could ever be called that!) methods. Above all don't judge yourself as a magician by your 'failure' here: it takes two to tango.

I once used a mantra for casual sex: took the intent seed FUNSEXWITHAHOTWOMAN, reduced/anagramificated to something simple, got it going round and round my head while I got a vortex going, then released. Worked like a charm and the results came the very next time I went on a night out. Mind you, afterwards she gave me a fake phone number and the bruising took a few weeks to heal, but nonetheless, result.

That was very good therapy for me... I get the feeling that will and fenris have the right ideas for you here. Heal the part of yourself that isn't happy about your lovelife, empower yourself with feelgood charms. a little glamour is good for a man. and it'll enhance more than your sex life.

We're The Great Old Ones Now

21:26 / 04.03.02

Everyone always assumes pulling magick has to be worked on the other person. That's not pulling magick, of course, that's an attempt at mind control. There are techniques for that (psychological ones) but they're not exactly pleasant.

Much better option is to work some positive transformative magick on yourself. Assuming the obvious physical things are taken care of (hygene, hair, some form of appropriate style), you can work on a fine fair aura of fun and freedom and passion. Not as easy as it sounds, as we suppress our emotions and natures habitually. Meditation, relaxation, self-acknowledgement, opening the channels (or whatever the hell) to let you into direct contact with the world.

Which is scary.

Less searchable M0rd4nt

15:33 / 05.03.02

Or you could just stop acting like there's something so inherently wrong and unattractive about you that you need magick to get over it. Talk to her. Converse, dude. Us females appreciate that shit.

We're The Great Old Ones Now

17:17 / 05.03.02

<shrug>

Some people need to do a little work on themselves before they feel up to that. Magick's one way to manage that, and actually one of the less obnoxious ones.

But yeah, of course.

Ground Zero

09:29 / 06.03.02

quote: magic should be able to help get you laid occasionally, and i could do with a bit of help, sigils arent working, probably cause im obsessing with this one girl too much, so what else is there?

er...other girls to obsess over?

Honestly, I was going to go into great detail about the moon glance technique described in liber kaos but I see someone else pointed it out.
What I can tell you is I have had loads of success using that technique.It does work...
-but-
Always remember it comes back on you (3 fold?) and some honey may use her magic on you...next thing you know...(You think your obsessed now...?)
A friend of mine told me a while back that my use of magick to draw women to me had backfired on me...I gave it s lot of thought to say the least. I used to make women fall for me - until I fell for someone *HARD*
It was as if I was *enchanted*

Now- no more magic to get laid. I prefer the old fashioned, be honest and ask technique.

But hey- I am insane...

09:48 / 06.03.02

Instead of trying to affect the girls, perform a ritual to affect yourself. Cast a glamour on yourself that would attract girls the way honey attracts flies.

I'm kind of shy so I've been playing with the idea of a servitor that would kind of direct a girl's attention to me. Nothing major, just make it kind of whisper in her ear. Have it plant a suggestion in her mind, "Hey that guy seems interesting, let's go talk to him". See, it wouldn't really be controlling her actions or anything, it would just be a suggestion.

Nietzsch E. Coyote

09:48 / 06.03.02

hypnosis is just suggestion too.

the rake at the gates

17:11 / 06.03.02

the trouble is that when i first tried to use magic on this girl, it didn't work, so then i tired again, i've tried sigils, different kinds serval times, candle magic, poppet magic, and even a servitor, but none of it seems to work. and it's not as if i've got zero chance with her. i'm now more obsessed with seeing a result, rather than i am with the girl. i cant understand why it wont work!, and it's causing a major doubt problem in my magical belief, i mean at least one of these spells should of worked, unless a. theres no such thing as magic, or b. im just really shit at it. why the fuck cant i get this one thing to work!

17:22 / 06.03.02

i mean at least one of these spells should of worked, unless a. theres no such thing as magic, or b. im just really shit at it. – jimmy jazz

how about c. it wasn't meant to be and you need to get over it?

It may help if you shift your perspective a bit and imagine yourself for a moment as being the recipient of the very sort of manipulative energy you are throwing at this woman.

Imagine being with someone that you don't really like and you don't know why, you're not sure what's going on but this person always seems to be around you taking up your time and energy. You're having sex with this person and you have no idea what you're doing there, in fact you'd rather be somewhere else...

i'm now more obsessed with seeing a result, rather than i am with the girl.

If you're not interested in her as a human being, why should she bother with you at all? Think about it.

[ 06-03-2002: Message edited by: Ierne ]

17:28 / 06.03.02

Possibilities:

1. You don't actually want to do this, because you know it's pretty unpleasant, so your focus is off.

2. You want to do this so much you're screwing it up.

3. She's got some mojo of her own and she's protecting herself from your moderately obnoxious free-will-destroying, non-consensual sex magicks.

4. One of the Barbelith servitors is intervening to prevent you from doing this, because it's been set up to help posters out, and this includes stopping them from doing fucking stupid, nasty things because they're hip deep in lust.

5. One of the many broad-spectrum anti-boy-doing-bad-to-girls servitors, thoughtforms, godforms, or whatever else is getting in the way. The ocean isn't empty, you know.

6. I'm standing over your working with a psychic baseball bat, and every time you charge it, I smash six kinds of magickal shit out of it until it lies down and bleeds to death and its corpse is eaten by the sub-forms of angry browsing animals and bacteria.

Do I have to wave my hands around any more? Or am I getting through to you? If you tried this with drugs or hypnosis, it would be a sex attack.

Now. Go clean yourself up. Do a banishing, do a cleansing. Do them every night for a month. Then do some exercises to get your chi flowing. Don't think about sex at all during this time. If you manage that, come back here and I'll tell you something else worth knowing.

Tryphena Absent

17:40 / 06.03.02

If you want a Goddess who'll do what's best for the situation no holds barred you can try Kali but a warning goes in hand because the result isn't always what you want it to be.

17:58 / 06.03.02

Great idea. quote:Mahakali is very dark, usually naked, and has long, disheveled hair, a girdle of severed arms, a necklace of freshly cut heads, earrings of children's corpses, and bracelets of serpents. To add to her dreadful appearance, she has long, sharp fangs and claw like hands with long nails and blood smeared on her lips; she laughs loudly, dances madly.

For an encore you could invoke the Baron to find your wallet and ask Moloch to bless your sister's pregnancy. Still, at least neither of those would involve forcing someone to act against their wishes in accordance with your own desires.

Less searchable M0rd4nt

18:02 / 06.03.02

Well, everyone else has already slapped your wrists, so I'll stick with the technical stuff.

Obsession, my friend, will fuck you up like nobody's business. No matter what spell you use, no matter what tecnique you try, your own obsession will trip you up. Love spells are notorious for this.

In your case I'd recommend a bit of a shutdown. Let the whole magick thing slide for a while. Try a week at first, and see how you get on. Use the time to try and build your self-esteem and confidence- learn to like yourself a bit more.

Getting away from this specific case, the problem of obsession can be overcome by using a technique like continuous creation. The idea behind this is that you don't just charge your sigil once and forget it; instead you copy it out several times times a day- fifteen's a good number.

A variant on this is simply to write down your statement of intent fifteen times a day. (This one is great for our non-magicky friends- tell'em it's an "affirmation" or a "confidence building exercize" or something. They'll be practicing ritual magickians and they won't even know it. Heee!)

18:05 / 06.03.02

Having done what you're trying to do (mine worked heheheh) all I can say is CONSIDER YOURSELF FUCKING LUCKY! Haven't you ever heard of, "Thank God for unanswered prayers"? You don't want this. Trust me. That said... progress report, please.

Less searchable M0rd4nt

18:15 / 06.03.02

... Oh, yeah- and your intent is all, y'know, immoral and fucked up and whatall. Just thought I'd mention it.

18:23 / 06.03.02

Chaos magick is asking for the result, but not asking for how you get it. If you're going to sigel for sex, don't think about any particular person. Just send it out there, and see what comes back. Go out, be social, have fun, and let yourself be suprised by who drags you home for a shag

But most of all, don't obsess. You have to stop thinking about it, and banish it to where you really don't care for it to work right. Then, something'll fall in your lap. As long as you fret about it, it won't happen, and the universe will make a point of annoying you with this.

In other techniques, few things are sexier than confidence. I got a lot of milage out of something my friends dubbed "purple rays of velvet sex" that I was putting out. Broadcast sexuality and availability, see what bites. Don't pull, lure. And of course, let yourself be lured. It works much better that way, and makes less of a mess.

the rake at the gates

18:12 / 07.03.02

okay, in reply
1. im not really one for that whole, it was never meant to be stuff, i mean surely this shouldn't be out of the realms of magic, i mean if this is my desire why cant i get it to manifest, unless
2. i subconciously dont want this to happen, im not too sure about that, not with all the effort ive been putting out on this.
3. 'If you tried this with drugs or hypnosis, it would be a sex attack'. ok for a start, it's not like i want to turn her into a brain dead zombie sex slave, so i think that is a little harsh, i mean who here hasn't tried this at least once?
all i wanted to do was to make her a little more interested in me, and might i add ITS NOT JUST ABOUT SEX!, and i know this is infringing on her free will, but again who here hasn't altered peoples free will at some point, if not for this reason for something else? even if its for something good like making a depressed person feel happy.
4.'Imagine being with someone that you don't really like and you don't know why' i suppose this is true, and as this person is a friend of mine, what im doing isn't really fair to her(even if it doesnt seem to work), so i think i'll just give up, even though i still really like her, and let me repeat ITS NOT JUST LUST!

but my major problem is not my relationship with this girl, my major problem is that i've been trying to put the magic on her for ages, and if anything it has had an oposite effect. The magic i've been doing should have done something and it hasn't, regardless of the situation i've repeatly asked for a result and failed to get it, and the fact that i dont get the result i want is what is making me obssesed.

so maybye theres is a hidden force getting in my way, or maybye i cant do magic for what ever reason, i think what i'm really after is confirmation that my magic actually exsists

19:09 / 07.03.02

quote:Originally posted by jimmy jazz:
ITS NOT JUST LUST!

No, its "lust for results."

quote:
but my major problem is not my relationship with this girl, my major problem is that i've been trying to put the magic on her for ages, and if anything it has had an oposite effect.

Exactly what I was trying to get at above. If you obsess on the results, your own attention to it will thwart your every attempt at making the magick work. Its become an obsession for you. Of course it doesn't work! You have to put it completly out of your mind, pay it no attention or desire. Cast your magick with a clear head, then think of it no more. If you can do that, it might have a chance to work. Yes, to a certain degree, you have to stop wanting it to work before it will have a chance to actually work. Sorry, the game is against you that way.

If you just want to show some results, you might try something easier to get your mind off of, like wishing for a red sweater.

Tuna Ghost: Pratt knot hero

19:15 / 07.03.02

quote:Originally posted by Mordant C@rnival:

Obsession, my friend, will fuck you up like nobody's business. No matter what spell you use, no matter what tecnique you try, your own obsession will trip you up. Love spells are notorious for this.

...which is why you go to someone else when your lust for result is too much to handle. It sucks when you don't know any other magick users, but hey, obsession and trying to fight will probably fuck things up really badly. Let me repeat what others have said: do something that effects you only. Something like making yourself more charismatic (or whatever characteristic you think she's into). This way, you won't lust for results nearly as much, and it's easy to put it out of your mind.

I'm not going to make a comment on the morality of this case, as I don't know anything about your intentions other than what you tell us. But don't be an ass if you can help it.

19:31 / 07.03.02

The other thing to consider is that it's not just about you and your magic.

It could very well be that her natural magical defenses are stronger than your magical attempts to woo her. This might also explain why it's 'backfiring'. On some level she knows that you're doing this to her. No wonder she's not going to fancy you.

Couple that with your 'obsession' and yeah, you're magic isn't going to be very effective.

09:02 / 08.03.02

Okay, this is the last time I'm posting on this topic, and I beg you to read it through, because I'm going to be tough at the start and then it gets nicer.

quote:it's not like i want to turn her into a brain dead zombie sex slaveNo, actually, in a way it's worse. You aren't prepared to take that much responsbility for objectifying this woman, so you want her to be a willing participant in your version of the world - which you will achieve by a form of superior force.

quote:all i wanted to do was to make her a little more interested in meOperative word 'make'. That's force, kiddo. So no, the 'sex attack' comparison is not harsh. It's just not what you want to hear.

quote:ITS NOT JUST ABOUT SEXSo in your defense, you don't just want to take her body, you want to take her mind as well? Yuhuh, you're a sweet guy. Stay away from my sister or I'll rip out your karma and use it to make sausage.

quote:i know this is infringing on her free willAlmost the legal definition of sexual violence.

quote:who here hasn't altered peoples free will at some pointMe. Probably many others. And even if we had, that wouldn't make it right. If all the other kids tie someone down and slash them with a razor, does that make it right? (Hint: no.)

quote:my major problem is not my relationship with this girlYuhuh. It's your relationship with the world and with yourself. quote:my major problem is that i've been trying to put the magic on her for ages, and if anything it has had an oposite effectWell, shit. You treat her like a performing seal in your heart, I'm guessing that comes over in your overt relations with her too. Take a big, big step back, and get some perspective.

If you want to use magick to do that, by the way, let me recommend a full-on Knowledge and Conversation of the Holy Guardian Angel. Crowley has a version, I think there's one in the OTO course - a web search will point the way. Takes a while, worth it.

09:24 / 08.03.02

<shakes his head sadly>

This is fucking pathetic. You've said time and again that the girl is not at all interested in you. You know what that should tell you? You should back off. Go lock yourself in your room and jack off until your damn dick is raw and bleeding. "Oh but its not about sex". Why are you obsessed with this girl? What attracts you to her? Is it her intelligence? Try to actually speak to her about a subject she's interested in. If the conversation is going well, ask her if she would like to continue the conversation over coffee. Score! Is it her body? If it's just her body, you disgust me, you sick pervert.

Magick is great and all, but dammit its not a panacea. Its not going to solve your fucking relationship problems. I really recommend you read Chrome Circle by Mercedes Lackey. Yes, its fantasy, but in it you'll learn something. I'm paraphrasing here, but the main character says something along the lines of "Magick causes more problems than it solves". I haven't gotten into any major trouble with magick but I'm sure someone here has come into contact with dark evil squiggly things.

You want to affect this girl's free fucking will. That is fucking disgusting. If I were going to attempt a ritual to attract girls, I would make it subtle, just make it so a suggestion is planted in the girl's head. A suggestion is not like a command. You want to mess with someone's brain so that you can have your perfect little fantasy world. Ooooh, look I have my love slaves that fulfill my every whim and desire.

Sure, I've thought about taking away somebody else's free will, but for god's sake, I was 12! I didn't know any better. Its a good thing my own little Jiminy Cricket decided to wake itself up and say "Thomas, that is not a good idea, put the books away, step away from magick for awhile and just be a kid".

[ 08-03-2002: Message edited by: Trijhaos ]

Less searchable M0rd4nt

09:47 / 08.03.02

I think we're all being a mite hard on JJ. Not that I would for one moment condone his attitude *gives JJ the evil eye*, but if we take magick out of the equation, is his way of looking at relationships so different from that of the majority of young men?

Look at your telly, your magazines, your comics; listen to your radio or your records, whatever. Every day, in every medium, we're sold this lie: "The gender you desire is composed of alien beings... you can't relate to them on thier own terms... you can't communicate with them... they cannot be understood... they must be bribed and decived... they must be coerced... so buy our NEW AND IMPROVED line of DEODERANTS!"

Woman or man- and, as far as I know, gay or straight- this is the lie that we grow up with. Sure, it takes a different form for men than it does for women, but it's always the same lie. Here's the truth:

To find a lover you don't need a smooth line, a particular shade of pink nail varnish, a new car, the right aftershave, an official "The Rules" bracelet, or the latest mobile ringtone. You don't need spells. What you need is to be yourself, as hard as you can, every day. Takes practice, takes time, and you can't buy it in a bottle. But once you learn the trick of being you- heh. You'll never forget it, and you'll never need anything else.

09:47 / 08.03.02

I don't know about the majority of young men, I'm not exactly the most social person in the world so I don't know how other guys see women. Personally, girls scare the hell out of me. If I knew how to iniate a conversation I'd be fine, but dammit I'm too shy.

I guess his view of women as some sort of conquest could be valid. I'm sorry , but if a girl ever expressed disinterest in me, dammit I'd back off. Maybe its my upbringing, but I've always been taught to respect other people and their decisions. If a girl decides she's not interested in you, then you should respect that. Don't try to take away their free will. When I walk around the campus and see these guys treating their girlfriends like shit, I just want to walk up to them, rip their balls off and shove them down their throat. A woman and her decisions should be respected. A woman is not an alien, she is human dammit. Women have a right to be respected, not treated like some object of lust.

I'm sure everybody already knows that though.

Less searchable M0rd4nt

09:47 / 08.03.02

Unfortunately, Trijhaos, you're in the minority. One day someone somewhere is going to be bloody glad they found you.

09:47 / 08.03.02

This thread has been an excellent read. Does it merit a companion gender politics thread (on top of an ethical magic spin off thread)?

09:47 / 08.03.02

<buffs his shining armour>

You can just call me "Sir Trijhaos the Valorous"

. Every day, I mount my iron stallion, Honda, and we right wrongs wherever we find them.

Minority? Well, crap. I'm always in the minority. Of course, I believe in this instance being in the minority is great.

I hope somebody feels lucky when they find me, and I hope they do it soon. I'm getting...*sniff* so....*sniff*...lonely. Maybe I should put out lost and found signs.

09:47 / 08.03.02

Maybe you should do a spell, Tri?

No really, JJ, I think the obsession thing is fucking with you in more ways than one. Magick aside, nobody likes to be pined over. It's annoying. I mean, really when have you liked someone that's pining over you? Never, that's when. Cause if you liked her back that you'd get together and there's no pining period. So stop sweating her, back off, be cool, be aloof...don't disappear but be distant. She'll come around.

OR!!! Maybe its worked and she's already interested in you but since you're friends she doesn't want to ruin the friendship by mentioning it.

OR (and this is the mean one but it might be true) Maybe you're ugly, dude? And Magick is not gonna help that.

Solitaire Rose as Tom Servo

09:47 / 08.03.02

I read through the first few messages, and having been under an obsession or two in my past, so I can't judge without being judged.

But instead of trying to draw this girl, pick out the qualities about her that attract you and make a sigil that someone with those qualities will show up in your life (much like how Grant found his Ragged Robin ^_^). Also do one to rid yourself of the obession, because in a lot of cases they are messy and nasty to live with.

09:47 / 08.03.02

That's a good idea. But still you should be careful. Morrison's Ragged Robin turned out to be a huge problem (I think she was a psycho of some sort, not sure though).

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