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Ever been to a psychologist?

 
  

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matthew.
04:21 / 15.11.05
This summer I realized that I was clinically depressed and I wanted to do something about. I had been entertaining thoughts about suicide more and more and I did not even feel like doing the things I once enjoyed (ie writing, reading). So, with the help of my parents, I discovered a nice psychologist and until my money ran out, I saw him once a week for two months.

Without this turning into a thread on the success or failure of psychotherapy (a thread which exists here) I just wanted to know if people have been to see a psychologist or a psychiatrist more than once. I'd like to compare experiences, essentially.

I've taken quite a few psychology courses at Uni, but not enough to call myself an expert. However, I knew what to expect. I knew the tricks and the strategies. I even went so far as to ask him if he was Rogerian.

In some ways, he was exactly what I expected. In other ways, he completely shattered my notions of psychotherapy. He had curly orange hair and he wore a variation on the same outfit every time: denim cutoffs and a Hawaiian shirt. We sat in leather chairs in the dark and he constantly shifted positions. He never wrote a single thing down; he remembered everything. He swore like a sailor. It was intensely jarring to hear a fifty year old Jewish male swearing so much (when I was bored with him, I played a game with him - I did not swear at all. I wondered if he would pick up on that and then not swear in reaction. Either he didn't notice or he just liked to swear. A lot)

In terms of his success or failure - I'm not entirely "cured". In his defense, I ran out of money before we could really "get" anywhere. I still am prone to the same depression, but at least my therapist gave me some rudimentary tools to combat it. But enough about me (I'm not Syph) - what about the rest of Barb? If it's not too personal to talk about, has anybody else seen a psychologist on a regular basis and want to trade old war stories?
 
 
modern maenad
08:30 / 15.11.05
Good on you Matt for taking the plunge - sounds like you got something out of the therapy, but as you say, just didn't have enough money/time. And thanks for starting this thread, I've always felt that the more open discussion of depression/therapy/medication the better.

Returning to your original question, I have a fair amount of experience as a patient/client with psychiatrists, counsellors and therapists. I was diagnosed with clinical depression nearly ten years ago and saw my first counsellor, attached to a GPs surgery, at the time. Since then I feel I've encountered the good, the bad and the ugly. I've never encountered professional misconduct as such, more failures of competence/training and general inexpereince. Another important factor in the past has been my own reluctance/inability to engage with the therapeutic process, partly the result of my youth at the time, the depression and lack of confidence.

I am now 34 and recently went back into weekly psychotherapy and am finding it really productive. Its taking up all my 'disposable' income, but I finally realised that I really wanted to sort a few things out best I could and that this was money very well spent.

If you can possibly rejig your finances I'd recommend it. Not sure about the extensive swearing - did the therapist initiate the swearing during sessions or was he responding to your own use of language? If it was the former then I'm not sure what to think, if the latter then it may be he was trying to communicate in familiar language, especially when it comes to emotions as swearing can be a key way of expressing feelings.
 
 
Ganesh
09:47 / 15.11.05
I've got experience being one (psychiatrist), and would be happy to talk about some of my experiences from that angle. I'm particularly interested in the different ways psychiatric disorders are conceptualised, packaged and treated within private and state-subsidised health frameworks...
 
 
Goodness Gracious Meme
13:14 / 15.11.05
A both-sider here.

I've worked in a voluntary capacity in various listening/mental health support environments for a few years now, am part-way through counselling training/do some research in specific areas of client experience of mental health services.

Think I saw a CMHT psychiatrist once, about 10 years ago. Been seeing a counsellor for about 5 years now. It's been life-changing and continues to be. It's long-term stuff and has taken me years to get where I am now. There was an intial and reaonsably rapid stage of identifying clearly the major stuff, as I went in knowing only that I felt horrible most of the time.

Then the torturously long slow bit, getting to a place of feeling safe enough to talk about and work with the big scary stuff. I'm only really just starting this now, and it's gruelling but also incredibly exciting, as big shifts seem to be happening pretty much constantly.
 
 
Goodness Gracious Meme
13:17 / 15.11.05
As a researcher/worker I've heard about alot of people's experience of counselling, and of psychiatry, and there seems to huge variance in standards/therapeutic value. I think I've been very very lucky with my own counselling, as my counsellor is wonderful.

I'd like to hear about people's practice or experience of pyschology, as this I know very little about.
 
 
matthew.
13:37 / 15.11.05
Thanks everybody for the replies.

RE: the swearing. No, he didn't swear first in reaction to my initial swearing. He just started cursing without any provocation from me. It was jarring to say the least.

Ganesh - if you don't mind, are you a clinical psychologist, or something else? From your post, I'm taking it that you work within a public facility framework, and not a private practice?

Everybody - I'm glad you've all had good experiences with counsellors. I sympathize for those who did not.
 
 
Mister Six, whom all the girls
14:27 / 15.11.05
I went to see a shrinker in High School after being snide about killing myself to a friend got me into trouble with the school guidance counselor.

Saw a few; one was REALLY into Dean Koontz for some reaon and eventually ended up with this 50's-ish guy who I got along with until one day he turned on me and got very harsh (this happened to a friend of mine who was seeing him as well), so I decided to stop seeing him.

I met up with several counselors in my time throughout college, made them earn their pay by being dramatic a couple of times but found them terribly comforting. A key part I always thought was that I was a big talker. I'd talk about my problems till the sessions was over and then some and was very open to criticism, etc.

A few years ago I was living in Cambridge, unemployed and without two cents to rub or any insurance. I ended up applying for and getting Mass Health coverage and saw this spectacular counselor for a few weeks... until I got a job and couldn't afford the time or fees.

This last person I met with was just great. He used the same vernacular and talked in styles I did to meet me head on and told the most marvelous stories to illustrate different ways at looking at things. Most importantly he addressed the emotional process of moving through trauma rather than just logical. This was tough and I wish I'd seen him for a lot longer to get it down better.

My life has been remarkably stressful and troubling lately and I miss seeing someone to talk about it. I use the 'no time' excuse, but... I should really investigate it.
 
 
matthew.
18:43 / 15.11.05
My therapist was into Koontz too. Maybe there's something there...
 
 
SteppersFan
18:47 / 15.11.05
I've never had a harsh therapist, they've all (I've had three, all women FWIW) been really nice.

After my dad died and my family broke up (turned out he'd been having an affair for decades, left my mum, she had several heart attacks -- it was heavy shit) I was suffering so much I would have had to kill myself if I hadn't got help. Therapy saved my life.

I saw a psychiatrist when I was younger after an incident; he was rubbish, just put me on anti-depressants, didn't deal with any issues at all.
 
 
Mister Six, whom all the girls
18:48 / 15.11.05
Maybe.

The thing was that was all he talked about. Here I am 17 and thinking of chucking it in and all he can think of are book reccs! Maybe it was his method of distracting me?

Nice guy otherwise.

Let me share an anectode from my last counselor;

Apparently in Africa, they have this technique to move elephants. They start with this massive chain attached tyo the lead elephant. They hook that up to a tractor and pull the lead elephant for days until the foot moves an inch.

After that, they detatch it from the tractor and pull the elephants by hand using a rope... easy as pie.
 
 
Ganesh
18:53 / 15.11.05
Ganesh - if you don't mind, are you a clinical psychologist, or something else? From your post, I'm taking it that you work within a public facility framework, and not a private practice?

I'm a psychiatrist ie. I completed a general medical degree (MBChB) then went on to specialise in Psychiatry (MRCPsych). I work within the UK's National Health Service, which would indeed fall within the remit of "public facility framework".
 
 
neukoln
19:05 / 15.11.05
I've seen half a dozen counsellors (i.e. no psychology qualification) over the past 5 years and each of them was ineffectual. I didn't get any value from talking about my past, or my current goings-on. It was tedious going over and over my history. Again and again. I entertained the thought of writing out the whole thing and posting it to them. It could have saved me the first 5 sessions, and £200.

However... I've recently started CBT. And in doing so I think I've found my therapy. It is practical, and proactive, and doesn't wallow through your past. If all goes well, it may indeed help me drain my stinking moat.
 
 
Mister Six, whom all the girls
19:12 / 15.11.05
CBT?
 
 
grant
19:31 / 15.11.05
I married a social worker, helped her with the researchy/writing parts of getting her MSW and she's just started seeing her first clients as a private-practice counselor this week.

Sometimes I think I should get certifications of my own.

We do have a DSM-IV lying around the kitchen, and when feeling particularly catty will refer to acquaintances as histrionic or borderline or bipolar II or whatever.

But no, never seen a therapist. Except socially.
 
 
w1rebaby
20:04 / 15.11.05
I have seen counsellors, CBT (Cognitive Behavioural Therapy) practioners, psychiatrists and psychologists, on both sides of the Atlantic, mostly because of rampant psychosomatisation. All of the people concerned were different. One over here spent about half of the time pissing about with his Palm Pilot. One of the Americans was, stereotypically, obsessed with my family; the other one was quite obviously drastically dysfunctional, addicted to Diet Coke, doing a sixteen hour day every day and barely listening to a word I said. I only went to him because I knew what meds I wanted and I knew that I could tell him what to give me in the right way that he would prescribe them. His receptionist was cool though and we had a lot of great chats.

Certainly I wouldn't advise expecting any mental health practioner to behave in a certain way. The question is, are they doing you any good? Are they so freaky that the idea of going to see them is disturbing you? Have you been with them a while and can't really see any difference? If so, perhaps it's time to go somewhere else.

Incidentally, if it's any help, the conclusions that I've come to have been:

1. there's nothing really wrong with me that needs medical intervention, at least rarely;

2. apart from a few issues regarding reward and fulfilment, I'm mostly just immensely bored with my life.
 
 
Mourne Kransky
20:08 / 15.11.05
So was it love or transference then, grant?

I'm doing a group therapy course at the moment, with experiential group work for three hours a week, and I'm analysing every fucking thing. I can barely be civil to my poor mother on the phone. And, as for climbing into bed with a shrink every night, there's no hope for me... I guess sometimes a cigar is just a stiff dick, as Freud might have said if he had been fonder of us benders.

CBT, btw, is Cognitive Behavioural Therapy. It's a short-term treatment option, often used to help with specific, focused problems like phobias, panic attacks and mild or less severe forms of depression.

It combines cognitive therapy, examining troublesome cognitions (thoughts, attitudes, and beliefs) and behavioural therapy, which focuses on how you behave in response to those troubling thoughts.

CBT's about identify thoughts that cause troublesome feelings and behaviour, and learning to change that thinking which then leads to more appropriate and positive responses. The aim is to replace unhelpful or negative cognitions with positive ones.

The research shows that it's effective (and cost-effective too) , so it's becoming more and more available here in the UK all the time. To borrow neuköln's metaphor, it won't drain the stinking moat but it'll help you build a canoe or a stout drawbridge to cross over it. Classical psychoanalysis might help you drain the moat but, then again, you might just drown. From that point of view, CBT's a better option.
 
 
Ganesh
20:10 / 15.11.05
Fridgemagnet, I wholeheartedly recognise your conclusions. I'm just a little surprised you had to work your way through X number of psychological therapists to reach them.
 
 
w1rebaby
20:21 / 15.11.05
To be honest, for much of the last year in the US I was quite aware that I was paying $75 an hour for somebody to talk to every Saturday, and a place to go. For the actual content of the session I was "oppositional defiant" i.e. paid no attention and argued all the time. But the suburbs will do that to you.
 
 
Ganesh
20:23 / 15.11.05
As will private medicine.
 
 
Mourne Kransky
20:24 / 15.11.05
And Freud said you had to pay or it wouldn't work.
 
 
w1rebaby
20:26 / 15.11.05
Oh, and the times here were because I hated my job, I knew I hated my job, but I just didn't want to admit how much I hated my job. Comically, my shrink was treating a bunch of other people from the company who hated their jobs, and tried to convince me that the real reason I was miserable was that I hated my job, for the very rational reason that they were treating me like shit. I just didn't really want to believe that whole-heartedly. The "work hard play hard", "I can deal with anything and if I don't it's me not the job" self-image is important when you're a twentysomething corporate.
 
 
w1rebaby
20:32 / 15.11.05
Hey, I got rebates on the $75 from my insurance.

Actually, despite all the stereotypes of US psychs, I was quite impressed with my particular one; she actively discouraged me from taking medication, and apart from the "family" aspect (no, I am not going to introduce you to my mother even though she is coming over here for a visit) most of the things she was trying to do seemed very sensible. I just didn't really pay much attention.

The dysfunctional one was everything you'd expect though - absolutely obsessed with different drugs, when he could keep a single thought in his head for more than a minute. Fucking nutter. There's a prescription gap that goes on though which meant I couldn't get anything from the original one. Psychologists can't prescribe, psychiatrists (? I think) can.
 
 
grant
20:42 / 15.11.05
So was it love or transference then, grant?

[Rogerian]
So you think I might be confusing love with transference?
[/Rogerian]


My favorite therapeutic modality, in a semi-ironic can't-believe-the-name way, is brief response therapy, by the way. The social workers I know all seem to really like it. From where I sit, to quote someone with far more experience in the mental health profession, it seems like an excuse for therapists to actually tell people as bluntly as possible to stop whining and adapt.
 
 
neukoln
20:49 / 15.11.05
Fridgemagnet, I wholeheartedly recognise your conclusions. I'm just a little surprised you had to work your way through X number of psychological therapists to reach them.

Ultimately, I think I am going to come to the same conclusion as Fridgemagnet. As much as I hate to admit it. But feeling shit is pretty entertaining - in a deeply satisfying way.

My CBT therapist is as smart as a whip. This is possibly as important as the therapy itself (which you can teach yourself from a book i.e. Mind over Mood Greenberger/Padesky). It's interesting watching someone disassemble your flawed logic. Logic, which you have invested a lot into... and are not wanting to relinquish.
 
 
Ganesh
20:50 / 15.11.05
Psychologists can't prescribe, psychiatrists (? I think) can.

Yep - because psychiatrists have completed a medical degree then specialised, therefore they have the same prescribing abilities as other doctors.
 
 
Mister Six, whom all the girls
21:00 / 15.11.05
My GP recently prescribed me klonopin for high blood pressure... believe it or not... and I felt like I was gonna die (plus I found out drinking with it was a no-go so I missed out on that as well).
 
 
matthew.
21:35 / 15.11.05
My psychologist didn't even mention medication whatsoever. I felt a little disappointed. I wanted to be cool in a Bret Easton Ellis-kind of way, I guess.

Also, I remembered something about him: he never wore shoes. Never. Apparently he only wore sandals if he had to get into a store or something....

He was very "about" my family. Wanted to know everything about them and when I tried to explain that my mother was "obviously" maternal, he immediately stopped me. He told me, "Mothers aren't always 'obviously' maternal. You say that a lot. You should stop saying 'obviously'." It was fascinating that he was so into the words I used. I always knew psychologists were trained to pick up on that, but I didn't think he'd flatly tell me to stop using a word.
 
 
Ganesh
21:39 / 15.11.05
Interesting. I'd be more likely to jump on the word "clinical" used in conjunction with "depression", on the grounds that it doesn't actually mean very much in terms of distinguishing one type of low mood from any other type of low mood.
 
 
w1rebaby
21:47 / 15.11.05
It means "officially validated", at least.
 
 
Ganesh
21:47 / 15.11.05
Unless one self-diagnoses it.
 
 
w1rebaby
22:01 / 15.11.05
True.

Perhaps just "proper".
 
 
Ganesh
22:03 / 15.11.05
Or "more proper than thou".
 
 
matthew.
22:04 / 15.11.05
I thought that "clinically depressed" would give other 'lithers an idea of what I was going through without having to spend an hour detailing it. I meant that a) it was recognized by an accredited psychologist and b) it wasn't simply ennui or malaise. I really was depressed, depressed enough to consider suicide seriously.
 
 
Ganesh
22:07 / 15.11.05
Well, fair enough if an accredited psychologist said, "you're clinically depressed". It's worth pointing out, though, that this in itself doesn't differentiate a particular instance of low mood from another. One man's "clinical depression" is another man's "ennui/malaise".
 
 
matthew.
22:24 / 15.11.05
You're 100% right. I guess that's why it wasn't taken so seriously by my parents at first. They thought I just needed to go out more, fuck more people, drink more, etc. They thought I could be easily "snapped" out it. I think that's the difference I was making with depression and "clinical depression"; it wasn't something I could deal with by myself any longer.

As a psychiatrist, Ganesh, do you try to stay away from such terminological problems? When dealing with a patient, do you try to come up with something unique to the patient, or do you end up writing down "clinically depressed" as a catch-all? (The reason why I'm asking is because one of my friends is a psychologist who works with children. She sees so many kids in so little time that there is very little chance of delving deep. So she relies on catch-all phrases to get the paperwork done. She's intensely sad about the whole system and affairs, but what can you do, short of changing the entire system?)
 
  

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