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Canada and the rest of the UK

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Bard: One-Man Humaton Hoedown

19:14 / 27.10.05

I like the UK. Spent over a month there this summer, and I found people to be very agreeable, hospitable, and far more civilized than many I know in Canada. The public transit systems seemed to be better (the Underground blows the socks off the TTC), and the rail system was, similarly, far and above better than anything we have here.

Hopefully sometime in the next year and a half or so I'll be getting my dual Canadian-English citizenship through my father. That will be amusing...since then entering and staying in the country will be, needless to say, easier.

08:16 / 28.10.05

Before you all criticise Matt, or indeed after, it might be worth pointing out that the Britishers in this thread cannot even agree amongst themselves on what constitutes the UK ...

08:43 / 28.10.05

But yeah, number of people who can name the first Australian Primeminister vs the first US President is very, very, shaming.

Edmund Barton!

08:51 / 28.10.05

Loomis, I would humbly suggest that all the Britishers in this thread know damn well what constitutes the UK (England, Scotland, N.Ireland, Wales). It's really not open to debate - it's a matter of hard political fact.

Course, doesn't mean that Matt has to.

08:58 / 28.10.05

Although there does seem to be some disagreement about what constitutes Britain. That is, whether ‘Britain’ refers to Great Britain or the UK.

09:03 / 28.10.05

I have no doubt Boboss, but you may like to have a word with your countrymen Sleaze ("The United Kingdom is shorterned reference to the United Kingdoms of Great Britain and Ireland") and Ganesh ("Scotland and (Northern) Ireland are, as I say, parts of Britain").

While Sleaze's was probably a typo and Ganesh was aiming to point out that in general parlance Britain is often synonymous with the UK, the two statements above, taken at face value, are incorrect, so it's not surprising that someone from another country would have difficulty knowing the truth when UK, Britain, England, etc. are used interchangeably all the time in many media sources. Furthermore, all three are often referred to as countries, which makes it even more difficult.

09:17 / 28.10.05

Before you all criticise Matt, or indeed after, it might be worth pointing out that the Britishers in this thread cannot even agree amongst themselves on what constitutes the UK ...

I am not - nor will I ever be a Britisher. What is wrong with Briton?

There is confusion Loomis about the UK and GB etc but as Smoothly and others have said that doesn't mean that some people know what's what while others don't.

What makes me really angry is when websites ask you what country you're from and the option is UK. That's not a country! Grr.

09:20 / 28.10.05

Isn't it?

09:28 / 28.10.05

"Britisher" was just me being silly, Jub. I know that it's not the correct term.

I'm not saying you don't know what's what. I'm pointing out that in usage the terms are often interchanged, which is precisely the point, and explains why residents of other countries are often confused.

We'll let wikipedia have the final word shall we?

The United Kingdom of Great Britain and Northern Ireland (usually shortened to the United Kingdom or the UK) is a country (or more specifically a constitutional monarchy or unitary state) off the north-western coast of continental Europe, surrounded by the North Sea, the English Channel, the Celtic Sea, the Irish Sea, and the Atlantic Ocean.

It is composed of four constituent parts: three constituent countries—England, Scotland, and Wales—on the island of Great Britain, and the province of Northern Ireland on the island of Ireland.

09:32 / 28.10.05

More on the terminology, historical and prevailing, here.

09:33 / 28.10.05

And for Stoatie, this:

09:35 / 28.10.05

the only part of the UK that feels significantly different to any of the others in my experience is Cornwall. i reckon historically they've been too busy just being chuffed with the idyllic mildness of their surroundings to be as uppity as the rest of the provincials. sadly, recent arguments about the 'correct' way to spell the 'Kernish' language suggest perhaps their happy pastie-eating ways are being eroded. i blame the internet.

09:41 / 28.10.05

i've never been to the isle-of-man though. the annual motorbike-slaughter-festival aside (seems a bit frightening and noisy really) i'm sure it's quite a good place. for, y'know, watching seagulls and stuff.

09:41 / 28.10.05

Smoothly, that's brilliant!

10:49 / 28.10.05

Loomis I'm not sure where you are seeing a typo in what I wrote.

The United Kingdom is shorterned reference to the United Kingdoms of Great Britain and Ireland. This is how it is set out in the Act of Union 1800 to the best of my knowledge. Subsequent to the 1800 act, Ireland has split into various other entities. Currently UK is a shorterned version The United Kingdoms of Great Britain and Northern Ireland. Yet since the Irish Republic is a republic I'm not sure to what extent it is not legitimate to refer to the Kingdom of Ireland as referring to anything other than Northern Ireland... Of course this could well be more of a political question...

11:16 / 28.10.05

You're saying two different things Sleaze:

The United Kingdom is shorterned reference to the United Kingdoms of Great Britain and Ireland.

Currently UK is a shorterned version The United Kingdoms of Great Britain and Northern Ireland.

Surely anyone who asks the question in 2005 is asking for the current definition, which is the second of your two statements above. How it was set out in 1800 isn't relevant, and to give an 1800 answer to a 2005 question is incorrect.

11:33 / 28.10.05

It kind of is relevant, since that was how Ireland and Great Britain were joined, and as I go on to point out, the only part of Ireland that is a Kingdom in 2005 is Northern Ireland. Unhappily enough I didn't detail the change between the 19th century Kingdoms of Great Britain and Ireland and the later 20th century designation of the Kingdoms of Great Britain and Northern Ireland (which now appears on passports and official documents) as I was hoping to simplfy matters to some extent, and thus not mentioning the abortive attempt at creating Southern Ireland, the short-lived Irish Free State, and the period where what is currently the Irish Republic was referred to as 'Ireland'...

foot long subbacultcha

11:44 / 28.10.05

I know a couple of people from Cornwall that don't consider themselves as English or British. That's probably as weird as it gets. But, saying that, I have also encountered Cornish women in the past who have felt the urge to rummage around under my shirt because they'd never touched a brown person before. Or even seen, in fact. In real life.

When I talk about Canada over here to people who've never been there, their ideas of the country fall into one of three simple camps:

1 - "Oh, right, America Junior?"
2 - "Canadians, yeah. Really friendly people."
3 - "You know what? I have relatives there. I should go visit some time."

Personally, I love what I've seen (apart from Ontario suburbia - that freaks me out) and want to go live there!

Mon Oncle Ignatius

13:36 / 28.10.05

I know a couple of people from Cornwall that don't consider themselves as English or British. That's probably as weird as it gets.

Weirdly, it has also been known as West Wales in the past.

14:03 / 28.10.05

Weirdly, it has also been known as West Wales in the past.

Whereas today unfortunately, it's turning into one big weekend holiday home for the rich of London.

BTW, for those unaware of these things, don't go to, Strandtown in Belfast, for example, and try to explain to people there that Northern Ireland isn't technically british, however right you are!

14:17 / 28.10.05

"Oh, right, America Junior?"

there'salso 'frozen yanks'.
that gets a bit of mouthplay in australia.
they also call americans 'seppos',which i have to admit to finding hilarious.

seppo->septic tank->yank.

its not very nice, but it alludes to what appeared to be a commonly held belief in australia that americans, like septic tanks, are mostly full of shit. this board would seem to be proof that this is not entirely accurate, however tempting it may be to swing for the big country when its really the big cunts you hate.

i was introducedto the term by a geezer who kept calling me either gary (not my name)or 'scotland'.
not big on specifics or accuracy, that chap.

14:31 / 28.10.05

That's brilliant toksik. From now on I'm calling you Scotland. Or Gary.

If you ever need anything named, just ask an Aussie. When Prince kept changing his name, a radio station held a contest to re-name him. The winning entry was "Davo".*

* pronounced dave-oh, in case anyone's unsure.

toughest, fastest, fatest

15:24 / 28.10.05

It is composed of four constituent parts: three constituent countries—England, Scotland, and Wales—on the island of Great Britain, and the province of Northern Ireland on the island of Ireland

Northern Ireland is not a province, there is no basis for such an entity in the UK, it often called a province because it consists of 6 of the 9 counties of Ulster, an historic province of Ireland it is actually incorrect to refer to it as the Province of Northern Ireland, it is simply Northern Ireland. Of course technically it shouldnt be called Ulster either unless you are talking about the 9 counties, but let's not go down that path.

As for whether the inhabitants of NI are british or not, that is up to them - describing them as british is fine if they want as they are citizens of the UK and I don't know any other way of describing it. That does not mean NI is in Britain, it is not. NI is an entirely arbitrary division of the island of Ireland. Well not arbitrary it was chosen to ensure protestant hegemony in the statelet.

toughest, fastest, fatest

15:26 / 28.10.05

Come to think of it NI shouldnt be called that as County Galway in the Republic is further north, North East Ireland would be more accurate.

16:58 / 28.10.05

and to think, this was once a thread about canada and has since turned into a gamem of "Tag! You're brit!"

Canada is loved by all.

17:06 / 28.10.05

Weird. I just wanted to say something "witty" about John Byrne being from Canada [the only "negative" fact about Canada I could think of], but his FAQ says he is from England and his father is a Lord!

So, yes, Canada is loved by all.

17:08 / 28.10.05

Damn Keggers, I was just going to post the same thing!

Bloody self-absorbed British.

P

On the other hand, I think someone mentioned, if they can't figure out how they perceive themselves, their perceptions of Canada may be a bit disconcerting.

17:50 / 28.10.05

Cheers, Smoothly. 'The UK' I'm clear on, but 'Great Britain' was clearly confooozing my miiind. Venncore.

18:25 / 28.10.05

i havent really given an answer because i dont really have a simple perception of canadians.

one girl i met was much like anyone i would have hung out with in the UK, another was a complete fucking twat, another was a girlfriend for a while.
i also used to skate and work with one, a guy we called 'the lad' who was a total conundrum.
a good conundrum, hey.
he amped me up big time when it came to skating and partying, and he is a big part of the reason i still have a board.
he's also the reason i go for the oilers if asked.
i always play them in the NHL games too, even though in some iterations they kinda suck.(that's obviously because the folks at EA have no idea about hockey. clearly.)

i used to work with a guy who was unable todrink(he said it was due to his asian origins) who was a drug fiend and drum and bass fanatic who liked the pixies.
he was a pretty uptight guy, but his toprock was solid and his joints were packed.

i do remember noticing more than one canadian being super-proud of their flag, and have been told by several that travel agents actually suggest displying it, so strong is the anti-american-pro-canadian meme. i remember one geezer wearing head to toe Roots causing some giggles in australia, both for the GUESS WHERE I COME FROM! and the MY CLOTHES SAY FUCK! factors.
and as i go to hit post, i have just remembered due south...
i fucking loved that show.

there's definitely more, but none of it seems any more relevant than the stream of shit above.

18:54 / 28.10.05

that's my stream of shit, incidentally.

00:51 / 29.10.05

This is an odd topic title. surely just 'Canada and the UK' would've sufficed.

Anyway, I'm Scottish and I always used to fancy living in Canada, because you could like pick up all the US culture that was so great without having to actually go there. Similar, if a bit nicer - in the south anyway - weather. And I fancied it's political relation to its' neighbour as not wholly dissimilar to Scotland's to England.

By the way, Matt, those are the four worst British comedies of the last twenty years. I like Trailer Park Boys. I used to like Kids in the Hall.

00:52 / 29.10.05

Apologies. Fawlty Towers was quite good, but otherwise I stand by my words.

08:31 / 29.10.05

that's my stream of shit, incidentally.

Quiet, Gary.

09:16 / 29.10.05

Canada is really just a province of Scandinavia. The Vikings were the first Europeans there, a thousand years ago. It's like Norway, but bigger. And most of them speak a language that's quite similar to English.

Do we think the other is good people is an example of where we are divided by a common tongue, in that Wildean way. It probably doesn't set teeth on edge in Canada.

I know lots of Canadians but they have all migrated out. Similar to Scotland in that regard. Lots of people from around the world are still queuing up to immigrate to Canada. Utterly different from Scotland in that regard.

You have lots of bears, huh? Excellent.

09:19 / 29.10.05

kidsin the hall!
of course.
that was the funniest thing on telly for a while, and brain candy was just hilarious.

sky high wouldnt have been anything like as good without those dudes either.

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