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KONG!

 
  

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FinderWolf
01:19 / 15.12.05
Howling with delighted laughter/cheering, or howling with mocking laughter...? (If it's Kong vs. dinos I can only imagine its the former)
 
 
Spaniel
20:59 / 15.12.05
Narnia can fuck off. I mean, really, it can.

Yep, it ain't perfect, it starts slow and could've lost a good half an hour (although I suspect it would need a rewrite rather than a reedit), but fucking hell, that's was quite simply the *most* spectacular movie I've ever seen. It's sad that we've become so inured to the grandeur of the blockbuster and the magic of special effects that I'm the first poster to mention just how utterly bloody incredible this film is to look at.

I believe in big monkeys.
 
 
Spaniel
21:06 / 15.12.05
Actually, scratch that, I'm not the first to mention it.
I am proud to add my voice to the chorus.
 
 
Mr Tricks
22:40 / 15.12.05
The former, for certain, Finderwolf.

a couple of days later I'm still just running the delima's those characters faced in my head with a "close call" sort of memory that I don't often applied to movies.
 
 
Seth
00:16 / 16.12.05
What a massive Two Towers Cinematic of an experience that was...

The main impression I had leaving Kong was wondering exactly how much of the movie is waiting to be restored for the DVD in a year's time. Like the second LOTR film it seemed utterly stripped of characterisation, pacing and a sense of geography.

Character's exposition-heavy dialogue in the opening scenes was strained past breaking point, with no real counterbalance (indeed, a lot of characterisation is talked rather than seen). There were a lot of heavy-handed lines of pay-off dialogue delivered without any of the legwork necessary to make them justified (too many clumsily inserted literary quotes, too). Relationships were rushed, motivations absent, characters forgotten for whole stretches. We Hamptons call this The Faramir Effect, a phenomenon of Jackson's editing process that was fixed in the full version.

Oh, and while we're on 'characters:' who on earth though Jimmy was going to be a good idea? Shades of that annoying kid in the third Matrix movie.

Skull Island seems to expand and contract inexplicably at crucial moments. Again, this is much like TTT. Characters will pop up in the nick of time without having earned it by having the intervening journeying seen on screen. In seconds Darrow and Driscoll are out of the river and back at the gates, within minutes Baxter returns to the boat to get help from deus ex Englehorn. Again all of this was fixed in the full version of Two Towers, so I'm starting to see a pattern...

The point at which I was totally removed from the movie was as the film crew made its way into the interior of Skull Island for the first time, with the dawning realisation that a sequence highlighted in one of the trailers was going to be totally absent from the film I was watching. The missing scene is the one where they're filming on the beach only to have Darrow's scream eerily answered by Kong's roar, which would have seemed to be a nice piece of foreshadowing. At this point the mechanism of the making of the movie intruded, and I found myself almost incapable of thinking about anything but Jackson's editing decisions. What else was missing from what I was seeing?

When you're questioning every camera cut you know that there's either something wrong with you or the movie... or in this case the creative process behind the movie. I usually have absolutely no problem in becoming lost in what I'm watching. I consider it one of my strengths to be able to go along with a film for the ride and accept it for what it is. The experience felt pretty galling, as though my interest in the film prior to its release (as inoffensive as downloading the trailers and a couple of pre-production diaries... no spoilers, only approved pre-release footage) was actually damaging the experience of the movie itself.

The length of the picture was not a problem. For a three hour-plus picture the time flew by, and indeed much of it seemed rushed. The effects are generally terrific, bar some poor contrasts between live actors and CG elements. I'm personally of the opinion that the best effect in the film is New York City, beautifully designed and realised and content to sit in the background almost unnoticed after the initial rush (although there were a few intrusive *look what we can do* long shots included at the start in dialogue scenes that probably wouldn't have existed had the locations been physical places).

But for the first time I'm properly concerned about Jackson as editor and the flabbiness of his team's writing. A ninety minute story becomes a rushed and palpably incomplete one hundred and eighty minute movie. One which a rewrite could have sorted nicely rather than what I'm willing to lay money will be a twelve month wait for a version about a half-hour longer. Jackson's next challenge as a filmaker is to be concise.

He's got a nice line in killing Andy Serkis in horrible ways though. Good good.
 
 
Spaniel
08:14 / 16.12.05
Despite the fact that I obviously enjoyed myself much more than you did, your comment about a ninety minute movie feels right on the money.

Jackson's next challenge as a filmaker is to be concise

But of course he has been concise before: Heavenly Creatures is concise, The Frighteners is concise. It does, however, look like he's forgotten how to do it.
 
 
Spaniel
14:56 / 16.12.05
I think Jimmy, and most of the rest of the crew, should be edited into oblivion. Time spent on them could have been spent developing the major characters.

In Jimmy Jackson has created his own Jar Jar Binks.
 
 
gridley
12:06 / 18.12.05
I definitely liked it, but had some problems with it.

spoilers


Jimmy was definitely a problem. I also thought that the giant insects bit could have been cut and replaced with scenes of them searching. With all the dinosaurs, giant apes, and giant bats, the insects just seemed like filler. The deaths they gave us would have been far more dramatic if they'd come at Kong's hands.

I don't usually criticize special effects in films, but there were several moments where the effects took me out of the moment. For instance, there's a bit where Kong roars with Ann right next to his mouth, and her hair seems completely unaffected. That's basic stuff they figured out with Roger Rabbit and I can't believe they missed it.

Then there were the weight issues. I didn't really buy those vines holding the weight of Kong and three T-Rexs. Or the ice in the pond. And I don't know whether I was relieved or disappointed that they didn't show us how the hell the remaining crew managed to lift Kong onto the ship.

And I wish they could have at least shown Ann shivering a bit, considering she's wearing nothing but a thin little dress at the top of a skyscraper on a snowy winter's night. They could have even had Kong warming her with his breath.

Still, I loved Kong's personality. Enjoyed Brody and Black immensely. I'm still not sure Naomi Watts was right for the role, mainly because it seems like they wanted the character to be funnier.
 
 
Spaniel
19:01 / 18.12.05
That's basic stuff they figured out with Roger Rabbit and I can't believe they missed it.

They probably didn't, I suspect they just ran out of time.
 
 
FinderWolf
20:28 / 21.12.05
Was just shopping for presents for my young nieces & nephews and was in the action figure aisle - saw several King Kong figures, one of which was Kong ripping open the jaws of a T-Rex, complete with a label bullet point that said "JAW-RIPPING ACTION! TEAR OPEN THE T-REX'S JAWS!!" and also mentioned that a tiny Ann Darrow figure was included that could fit in the T-Rex's mouth.

They also mention a dinosaur called a Vastatosaurus and a mutated pirhana called a Pirahanadon. "Vastatosaurus"?
 
 
PatrickMM
22:30 / 26.12.05
There was a really great movie in there, but I feel like there was way too much fat to make it an enjoyable film experience. First, it took way too long to get to Kong, there were a ton of scenes that felt like stuff I'd usually see in a deleted scenes section and say "Yeah, I can see why they cut that."

Also, maybe I'm going against the grain here, but I feel like the dinosaurs took away from the majesty of Kong. If we've already got a giant ape, why do we need dinosaurs, it just felt gratuitous and added nothing to the film's emotional center, which was Kong and Ann Darrow.

I think Naomi Watts was phenomenal in this movie, they used a lot of very tight closeups on her and you could see everything that needed to be said in her face. And Kong too was amazing, totally convincing. The stuff with the two of them worked wonderfully, and the ending sequence was a real highlight. The sensation of height was conveyed so well that I was actually feeling uncomfortable, with the shot of Ann on the broken ladder as a particular highlight.

I would have liked to see about 45 minutes cut, to bring the focus on Kong and Darrow, without the distractions of the other people. The crew was never particularly developed, but there was a ton of time spent on them, and then they just disappeared once the movie went back to New York, meaning there was no payoff for all that time spent.
 
 
matthew.
23:27 / 26.12.05

Watched King Kong last week. Here's my two cents (well, three):

1) Too long - it's three hours. 50 minutes to get to the island, 20 to see Kong, then it's 50 minutes of the greatest thing ever put to cinema (whoa, hyperbole much?) and then half an hour of nothing, then twenty minutes of fighting aeroplanes. Jackson could've cut out an entire hour.

2) The Spider-Pit is ridiculous awesome. Don't want to spoil anything, but these creatures are so unique.

3) Kong versus Dinosaurs. Yes. That's why movies are made.
 
 
H3ct0r L1m4
03:34 / 27.12.05
loved it a lot, hated it a bit.

in fact, loved it much more up untill setting foot at Skull Island. all the Depression Era atmosphere, the mistery of a unknown and frightening thing to come.

some action scenes at Skull Island dragged a lot, for me, not the first hour, no matter how coll is a fight between Kong and the dinos. I know there is a bucket full of references to the 1933 original version and I have LOTS of nerd love for them but, man, that bug pitt scene was so unnecessary, as were the gay sailors and all the non-white folks used as cannon fodder.

I guess the movie suffered from Oscar rush. Jackson is still not that far from B movie days. it's not difficult for an expensive movie like this to get a back actress to play a native shaman or a good eyeliner for the white person below that makeup.

VERY dodgy CGI in a lot of scenes, and I won't buy them as being homage to old chroma-key effects. wasn't looking for those, they just popped by when were least wanted, characters not mixing well with computer scenery, lights not matching, creatures with few weight.

possible non-spoiler goof: I've never seen a city covered with snow in my life, so correct me if I'm wrong; the night Kong ravages the streets of NY they're covered in snow, people wear heavy coats and fur. the following morning it just looks like autumn, Naomi doesn't feel cold at the top of the Empire State... maybe I'm nitpicking.

what else? the EARLY EDITION guy was good as the actor, hehe, Andy Serkis [Gollum, Kong] was great as Lumpy [the chainsmoking sailor; watch him running from the dinos!]. Naomi Watts? greatest scream/cry queen of modern age. perhaps Jack Black can pull a good Curly at the future THREE STOOGES Farrelly Bros movie.
 
 
Yotsuba & Benjamin!
09:20 / 27.12.05
Just saw this. I could kind of see the validity of some of the complaints here if it wasn't 100% a movie from the 30's shot with the movie power of today, but it is. It's not a homage or a pastiche, it's a straight up olde timey movie, complete with walking cardboard like Jimmy and Mr. Hayes. And that's why I actually happened to quite like the both of them, Jimmy especially.

Now is the point in the film where we tell the audience exactly what we're trying to do, see? Imagine Barton Fink's Jack Lipnick on Peter Jackson's shoulder the entire time and things start to make a lot more sense. This is a monster picture; the audience wants to see action, drama, monsters, and plenty of 'em. They don't wanna see the monsters in people's souls - well, all right, a little bit, for the critics - but you make it the carrot that wags the dog. Too much of it and they head for exits and I don't blame 'em. There's plenty of monsters right on that island, Peter.

So yeah, I Loved it and never felt it drag for a second. I loved Kong's apeyness. I loved the serious vertigo in Kong's fall. I loved that Jackson managed to get me all moved not by a monkey falling off a building, but with an actress playing in a shitty chorus line. How the hell did he manage to do that? I loved how backlot New York City looked. I loved how off and unscientific the dinosaurs looked. I've got no kind of bug-phobia (extra digits are my thing) but those lake grubs were creepy as fuck.

On a sadder note, I am officially done with seeing blockbusters in the theater. Fuck parents, fuck their snotty and unruly kids. Fuck their cell phone calls. Fuck their complete inability to enjoy even the slightest moment of calm. I can't think of any movie that I can't just wait to see on DVD. Smaller and better movies are rarely as annoying to watch in the theater, but this bigger stuff is now off-limits at Chateau Exclamation Point. They honestly don't even sound that much better in a theater environment, and clearly look a zillion times worse. Peace out, big movies! See you at Best Buy on a future Tuesday.
 
 
matthew.
13:51 / 27.12.05
Fuck their complete inability to enjoy even the slightest moment of calm

Amen. Just 'cause there's no explosions, doesn't mean there's nothing happening. Yeesh.
 
 
CameronStewart
15:45 / 28.12.05
>>>The point at which I was totally removed from the movie was ...the missing scene is the one where they're filming on the beach only to have Darrow's scream eerily answered by Kong's roar, which would have seemed to be a nice piece of foreshadowing... What else was missing from what I was seeing?<<<

I think that the scene you describe (which I also remembered from the trailer, but not until after I'd seen the film, it didn't occur to me as I was watching) would have muddled the flow - I think if they were filming on the beach and then suddenly they heard this god almighty monstrous roar, it might have been a bit too big a leap of logic to have them decide "hey, let's go a little further inland and see what that was." I liked how it was presented in the final film - they stumble on to the island and, assuming it's long deserted and safe, they just wander in and before they know it they're in all sorts of shit. The filming-on-the-beach scene, I think, didn't harm the film by its absence, it would have detracted from the slow, escalating horror of their intrusion on the island.

But that's just me. I really loved the film (saw it last night), and while I agree with many of the criticisms I've read, none of them really hampered my enjoyment.
 
 
louisemichel
16:54 / 28.12.05
Did you cry during the movie ? i know I did...
Actually, not during the movie, but well, let's say it was too hard to watch the end credits through the tears...
Ok, Kong has flaws, but i definitly love that movie.
and I also happen to believe in big apes.
 
 
FinderWolf
17:16 / 03.01.06
Why did tribal lady haveta smack Naomi Watts around as she got her ready to be Kong's latest new friend? She slapped her at least twice.
 
 
Yotsuba & Benjamin!
18:09 / 03.01.06
An unnecessarily violent move for rheumy cannibals?

And for the record, I thought she was just flicking either shit or blood on her.
 
 
David Batty
14:25 / 04.01.06
Hmm, great film, bar the odd line of cod dialogue and dash of clunky CGI. But I'm surprised there hasn't been more said about race & racism - and comparison between the original and this version. I haven't seen the original in some time but isn't the standard interpretation that Kong represented the noble savage & white patriarchy's fears about black men? The depiction of the island natives in the 2005 version was pretty shocking though - they looked like the Orcs from Lord of the Rings.
 
 
FinderWolf
16:24 / 04.01.06
For me, the best part of it was the interaction between Naomi Watts and Kong - and I was especially impressed that their scenes had little and mostly no dialogue. The relationship and the kind of rapport they build was shown all through CGI Kong's behavior (which was fantastic and seemed very much like how a real gorilla behaves) and Watt's eyes and facial expressions.

I will say that Lumpy the Cook's death was one of the most horrific & disturbing I've ever seen on screen. And Jimmy the kid didn't bother me at all - although does he die at the end or just cry a lot when he sees the carnage and then we never see him again?
 
 
Hawksmoor
18:26 / 04.01.06
Well, what can i say that a quite few people on this site haven't already said? The movie rocked...hard. I expected it to be a pretty good film with Jackson at the helm, for we've seen what he does with properties that he has a deep respect and love for...LOTR, anyone? What i didn't expect was to feel myself trying to hold back a whimpy tear at the end of the film. I'm a grown man, for God's sake!! LOL. Everything, from the story to the CGI to the acting to the feeling and emotion that were present throughout this film, was damn near perfect. What a few people on this site have been saying about pets and Kong and the woman (or the Woman and the ape , depending on your view of things as they were presented) makes sense, as far as them feeling like they'd lost pets all over again, bringing that feeling back. Certainly understandable. What made me want to shed a tear, though, wasn't this comparison, but the thought of what the film was basically about. Exploitation and Love. I'm black, so as some people here might assume and understand, it brought thoughts of how my people were brought and sent from Africa to America and other places to be used and used and used and used until they were used up and thrown out or sold or killed. Whatever the case was in each situation. When Kong died at the end of the film, i felt very bad for Kong and Darrow, but i felt worse for the people who had done this to the pair of them. I felt worse because people, even in film and television, not to mention books and other forms of media, never seem to learn their lesson. Some of you may say, "This was only a movie and why would you get so literal, so serious, about it?" I'd say because despite the fact that this was only a movie, things like this happen everyday, in marriages, child-parent relationships, in businesses and clubs, in gvmnt., all over the world, as John Coffee said before he rode the lightning. Things like this keep happening, but we never seem to learn better because of it. The movie was Brilliant. Oh, and i never meant to turn anything into a racial debate, so before it gets started, i'd like to make that point clear. The movie, to me, at least, is as clear now as it was all those years ago whe it first hit the Big Screen. Beyond all the special effects, CGI, brillaint acting, explosive scenes and all that, it was basically a story about mankind's inhumanity and lack of understanding (or the I don't care attitude) for each other, or even for the living things around us.


Hawksmoor....From The Bleed.
 
 
Tits win
23:30 / 04.01.06
Man, I don't care how good your CGI apes look, or how perfectly-presented your homage of a '30's monster movie' is, it's the year 2000 (plus 6) and I'd have preferred some decent story in those 90-odd minutes of Kongless screentime. Sheeeeesh....And that last line had me open-mouthed and eyebrow-raisen in dumbfoundedness...Holy crap. It might as well have been: "It wasn't the guns that killed him...It was the bullets..."

And Return of the King was shit, too...
 
 
The Return Of Rothkoid
11:10 / 10.01.06
Jack Black punched more holes in this than the moments where the CGI failed to convince. It was a comedy up til we get to the island, and by that point, he's invested too much yuk-yuk into the character for you to feel anything about him other than annoyance. The movie's last line rests on his shoulders, and because he's such a japester, it feels like a punchline, not a trenchant observation.

Oh, and it's 40 minutes too long, and needs almost all of the bug and runaway dinosaur scenes cut out.

I know he's a fanboy remaking a film for fanboys, but christ...
 
 
FinderWolf
16:43 / 10.01.06
I just saw the 1933 version for the first time since I was about 12...I barely remembered any of it other than Kong on the empire state and Kong bashing through the doors of the wall on the island (also remembered Kong's eyes peeking in through the hotel window about to nab Ann Darrow).

The 1933 version kind of blew me away - even with the dated acting style, it's really an amazing film. In some ways it's a far better movie than Jackson's remake - the humans' stories are more palatable, I think, even given the dated style of the whole thing.

And the special effects are amazing considering its 1933. There are several shots where I found myself thinking "How did they DO that, given that they really didn't have much in the way of technology for F/X??" Shots where there's a foreground with humans, Kong in stop motion in the middle of the shot, and then a background which features a moving realistic-looking waterfall. Even the huge Kong head, primitive though it is, features articulated eyes, eyebrows, lips, and several other key points.

I came into this thread not very psyched about Kong, but after seeing Jackson's and now the 1933 version again, I now consider myself more of a Kong enthusiast than I would have thought I'd be. Also, the documentaries and making of stuff on the DVD of the original film are really pretty terrific.
 
 
matthew.
02:20 / 15.11.06
Bought the extended edition today. Haven't watched it yet. I'm concerned. And yet excited. I'm very interested to see what has been put in, I'm also very interested to see if the film flows better, if the running time doesn't seem like eight years. With The Two Towers in the theatre, I was bored bored bored with every Gollum scene, talking to his reflection, blah, blah. But when I saw the extended version, the film felt shorter, even though it was longer. A much more enjoyable film. Let's hope the same can be said of Kong. I'll keep you posted, Barbelith.
 
 
Mistoffelees
08:56 / 15.11.06
That would be kind of you. I was very underwhelmed by this movie. I wanted to see Kong go apeshit, and not enjoy some varieté and go iceskating. And since I felt the same about the two towers extended version as you, this movie might win from a few more minutes, if they include a giant ape. And not a young man that is learning to read, or the problems of actors in times of recession, or Frank Black being (full of) himself, or Naomi Watts being torn between man and ape, etc.
 
  

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