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Underground > Comic Books >

Fables: Why Should I Read It?

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Matthew Fluxington

12:04 / 30.11.04

I've recently developed a vague interest in reading Bill Willingham's Fables. The premise is somewhat intriguing to me, but I'm not sure if I really want to invest a lot of money in catching up with the series. In this thread, I would like for you to either make a case for why I should read the series, or tell me why I shouldn't. You don't need to recommend other series or other comics by Bill Willingham. This only needs to be about Fables.

12:25 / 30.11.04

Don't. You'd hate it.

Seriously. I know I hated it; and from what I know of your tastes, you, in particular, would certainly hate it.

12:42 / 30.11.04

Do tell us more, Jack. I need to hear about its awfulness.

Matthew Fluxington

12:48 / 30.11.04

Me too.

13:16 / 30.11.04

Mostly that it's a nice idea hamstrung by horrible execution. Unengaging storylines, flat and unappealing characters, a take on sexuality seemingly derived from well-thumbed volumes of Playboy's Party Jokes; full of all the folkoric shit you hated about Sandman any of its saving qualities (i.e., erudition, wit, and occasional insight).

It's not as show-offy as Sandman, but I actually think that's to its detriment: if you must deal with fairy tales and folklore, you should at least do some reading on the subject. There's no feel of any real research behind it, and it's written in a broad, slack formula-TV style: "She's Snow White! He's the Big Bad Wolf! THEY FIGHT CRIME!"

Worst of all, I think, its vision of the "mundane" New York City didn't feel very mundane—so any contrast between it and the fantastic characters in exile there was lost.

I only read the first few issues, admittedly—but given that my first impression was one of wasted potential, it seemed unlikely to improve.

Fluxington's on record as having a low tolerance for twee fantasy anywez, so to him I say: Don't waste your time.

Matthew Fluxington

13:22 / 30.11.04

Yeah, that pretty much confirms every doubt that I had about the series. If only the covers weren't so pretty.

13:28 / 30.11.04

That's me covered too. Thanks Jack.

Yotsuba & Benjamin!

13:35 / 30.11.04

Yeah, it's those covers that keep eating up any loose comics budget I have. They're just too gorgeous, but I have a stack of unread Fables that probably just aren't ever going to get read. I'd pretty much echo the above sentiments.

13:54 / 30.11.04

I picked up the first TPB and wasn't very impressed, nice idea but the art is a bit flat and unappealing. However you can pick it up for about £7, so if you want to check it out, that is probably the way to go.
I have to say that while not a fan of "Fables" I'm loving DC's policy of pricing the first couple of TPBs of a series at a low price to encourage people to try them out.

Matthew Fluxington

14:20 / 30.11.04

For real. I came very close to picking up the first Fables book just because it was $10 and it seemed like a good deal.

I like Mark Buckingham's artwork quite a bit, but the other artist who drew the first book is very bland, pretty much the typical kind of technically-proficient-but-kinda-ugly artwork that I've come to expect from most Vertigo series.

Our Lady Has Left the Building

14:25 / 30.11.04

I'm reading the second book, Animal Farm, and it turns out that most of the Fables, like Snow White, Wolf, Old King Cole, CAN'T die, because they're immortal because everyone tells their stories 'all the time'. The sound you can hear is the remaining dramatic tension leaving quietly through the side door.

14:54 / 30.11.04

Just to add my voice to the haters alliance. I only bought the first issue, which some might say isn't really giving the book a shot, but euughh. Awful. It read like one of those really trashy fantasy novels where they try to marry the elements of fantasy literature with the "real world", like Terry Brooks and shite like that. Awful, awful, awful.

16:26 / 30.11.04

Echo.

I read the first arc, the writing was far too mediocre, excellent concept but I don't see a writer of his standing pulling it off.

I'm told it gets better. I haven't the money to try it a second time though.

20:10 / 30.11.04

I read the first three trades courtesy of friends and the library. It wasn't that bad, but it wasn't anything very memorable, and it had a bit of an Elseworlds Checklist feeling to it: "What's Snow White like in this reality? What's Goldilocks like? What are the Three Bears like?" There were neat scenes and the settings were great, but something about the dialogue writing felt very flat and unnatural to me.

Also, it doesn't help that I'm not a big fan of fairy tale update stories. If I never see another "It's Rapunzel, but in Las Vegas!" or "It's Sleeping Beauty with an erotic twist!" again, I'd be a happy girl.

03:38 / 01.12.04

"I'm reading the second book, Animal Farm, and it turns out that most of the Fables, like Snow White, Wolf, Old King Cole, CAN'T die, because they're immortal because everyone tells their stories 'all the time'. The sound you can hear is the remaining dramatic tension leaving quietly through the side door."

Actually, I think this is a sort of Endless scenario. They can die (the last trade arc saw a major character killed off), but the essence is reborn somehow, and at some point. So Snow White can get whacked. And does anybody really believe that any comic, movie, or (nonliterary) novel character is going to get bumped off?

This series has had an odd effect on me. I disliked the first issue intensely, and ignored the book for two years, but I kept reading positive things about it from people whose opinions I value. I bought trade #1 and grudgingly admitted to myself that the book did have merit, although it could have been much better plotted (and scripted). I liked it enough to buy each trade in turn and the new one (Wooden Soldiers) finally & completely won me over with a climactic scene and dramatic arrival that actually made me smile. I'm one the fence as to whether to start reading the comic, or keep reading trades. I guess I am now a fan, one whose been sucked in through the back door. Bigby Wolf (hated him in particular when ish 1 came out) is developing into a cool & complex character, and his hate-hate-love relationship with Snow White is becoming compelling due to a complication that I will not spoil...

Willingham's writing is often workmanlike, but he seems to be improving, and the series does deliver in cumulative effect, the main question being "who is the adversary and when is he going to turn his attention towards Fabletown?" After reading this far, I have grown to care what happens. And this is from somebody who HATED, nay loathed, Willingham's Sandman Presents work.

Bottom line: if you have an interest in myth, folklore & fairy tales, this will be, at very least, a diverting read.

08:41 / 03.12.04

and it turns out that most of the Fables, like Snow White, Wolf, Old King Cole, CAN'T die, because they're immortal because everyone tells their stories 'all the time'. The sound you can hear is the remaining dramatic tension leaving quietly through the side door.

I think the argument could be made that if any 'dramatic tension' the book possesses rested solely on whether or not the characters could die or not, than yeah, it would be a pretty shit book. But that's not what it's about. And Snow White's inability to die even after being shot in the head provides for a nice exchange between her and her sister later on.
It's not as show-offy as Sandman, but I actually think that's to its detriment: if you must deal with fairy tales and folklore, you should at least do some reading on the subject. There's no feel of any real research behind it, and it's written in a broad, slack formula-TV style: "She's Snow White! He's the Big Bad Wolf! THEY FIGHT CRIME!"

Er... where exactly did you ever get the impression that it was supposed to be as "deep" as Sandman? It's based on the relatively lighthearted versions of Snow White, The Big Bad Wolf, the Three Pigs, and so on. "THEY FIGHT CRIME!" ?? No it's not.

You know, it is possible to over-intellectualize something, which is exactly what you seem to be doing here. It's like if someone did a noir retelling of the Muppet Babies and you expected them to do research further than watching the cartoon.

10:21 / 03.12.04

i nearly picked up the first trade in the library yesterday - the big quote on the cover sad something like 'essential for anyone interested in fantasy told in a modern context!!!'. that was all i needed to know - it rests there still.

Haus of Mystery

12:14 / 03.12.04

You don't like it because you love The Sandman so much that there's not enough love left for anything else.

Non?

Haus of Mystery

12:18 / 03.12.04

It's like if someone did a noir retelling of the Muppet Babies and you expected them to do research further than watching the cartoon.

Is it? Wouldn't a knowledge of the Muppet Show that preceded MB also help? And a knowledge of noir storytelling traditions?
Could be that Fables is lazy high concept Vertigo-by-numbers, and that Willingham isn't doing his own concept justice.

Plus - simile of the year, no questions.

12:38 / 03.12.04

You don't like it because you love The Sandman so much that there's not enough love left for anything else.

Um... no.

Could be that Fables is lazy high concept Vertigo-by-numbers, and that Willingham isn't doing his own concept justice.

Um... yes.

WHOSE SIDE ARE YOU ON?!?

Haus of Mystery

14:00 / 03.12.04

Jack, the first bit was directed at Gumbitch. Not you. (But I bet you do love Sandman)

16:08 / 03.12.04

But I bet you do love Sandman

if i were betting on this, i would bet that he begrudgingly admits that Sandman is really pretty high-quality stuff, but i bet he feels kind of dirty/uncomfortable about it because it can be just so damn twee.

(British folk: did i use the word "twee" right? i cringe when other Americans who try to use British-isms, but twee seems to be the right word for what i mean in this case)

16:24 / 03.12.04

I enjoyed SANDMAN at the time, when it was coming out monthly—I might have even thought it was the BEST THING EVAR!—but some years after the series ended I realized that I never took the issues out of their longbox and re-read them. So I gave 'em away, haven't missed them, and have never felt the need to buy the TPBs.

So 'twas a thing very much of its time—its time in my life, anyway.

That said, I recognize that it did indeed have moments of wit and insight, both of which are sadly lacking in FABLES.

17:17 / 03.12.04

It also had Dream, Destiny, Desire, Delirium and Destruction.

No comment.

07:56 / 04.12.04

Is it? Wouldn't a knowledge of the Muppet Show that preceded MB also help?

Not really. The gap between the attitude with which the characters were treated in Muppet Babies and how they were treated on the Muppet Show is so large as to make that knowledge irrelevant. (?? Good lord, can't believe I justified the analogy to that length... brrr.)

04:01 / 05.12.04

Yeah, it's those covers that keep eating up any loose comics budget I have.
Birdie, Flux :
just download jamesjean.com its much more worthy of your time. His sketchbook pages are stunning even as tiny images.

I tried reading the online preview for Fables #1 once, google gives me a review with the same reaction I had:
third page: "You look out of breath Jack," says Mr. B. Wolf. "Been climbing beanstalks again?"' (Cue canned laughter) "No. Blown down any piggies' homes lately?" At which point I physically winced.

Haus of Mystery

15:36 / 06.12.04

Without wishing to prolong this toooo much...

The gap between the attitude with which the characters were treated in Muppet Babies and how they were treated on the Muppet Show is so large as to make that knowledge irrelevant.

Not so - much of the character's interaction was based upon relationships set up in the original show. And part of the appeal of MB was that you could see them in their formative stages, with often knowing winks for the audience thrown in (a la the 'Ultimate' line).
Plus a noir retelling would probably involve a sexual subtext, and some nefarious misdeeds, all of which would be better informed by the original series, as it is here that the characters' more base motives and desires are laid bare.
(The eternal triangle of Piggy, Kermit and gonzo, Fozzy's washed up Vaudevillian act, Rolf's tortured artist reduced to a pianist in a run down variety show, Animal's psychotic id nature...) A knowledge of these would invariably help a noir retelling to be richer and more resonant surely.

16:17 / 07.12.04

Fables? One of the best comics out there, though the first arc won't convince anyone of that. It's one of the few comics out there that doesn't hit the reset button at the end of each tale.

17:08 / 07.12.04

There's a typo in your last sentence. I think it's supposed to read, "It is one of many, many creator-owned comics which tell, over time, a complete story, with a beginning, middle, and end—a concept which is standard in all other media and which is in itself no guarantor of quality, except inasmuch as comics are still perceived as a medium for anal-retentive retards to whom growth and change are anathema."

20:41 / 07.12.04

It would be much quicker to type the second part of the post rather than bother with the preamble that's clearly designed to make you look witty and clever.

11:18 / 08.12.04

No no no no no no no no no. It's not about making me look witty and clever: it's about making you look... well, less than clever.

Although I wasn't expecting you to up the ante by proving yourself thin-skinned and humorless, too. Well played!

13:48 / 08.12.04

Great the internet isn't it? You get to insult people and then sit back and look smug if they comment on it. It's not thin-skinned or humourless when pointing out that someone has been unnecesarily ruder. You could have just expressed a differing opinion to mine, I'd have happily taken that. But you didn't. So I get to respond. Marvelous.

14:01 / 08.12.04

Perhaps now would be a good time for everyone to calm down and return to the topic in hand... if indeed anyone has anything more to say on the relative merits or otherwise of Fables.

14:06 / 08.12.04

like yourself? this thread was only any good when talking about the muppets. let's finish it:

fables is shite. buy it if you like that kind of thing, but don't be surprised if you start to stink.

Haus of Mystery

14:43 / 08.12.04

Gotta say though Jack, the Brunt has a point. You're comment was snarky and provocative so don't be surprised if he reacts accordingly.
However, I like seeing scraps, so thanks for brightening up the Muppet thread.

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