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The OC is here to make us feel good about being poor

 
  

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Jack The Bodiless
15:48 / 25.05.04
Fly - yes. I know you usually ascribe 'quality' to anything that you find yourself liking. This is the characteristic I was referring to. Why does the OC have to be 'quality', just because you enjoy it?

I guess what we're looking at is the difference between soap and drama - for me, soaps like this sit in a prescribed niche, delivering safe, formulaic thrills and relative absurdities in a non-threatening but enjoyable manner. Drama should aim higher, and is usually distinct from soap in most of the above descriptors...
 
 
ONLY NICE THINGS
16:08 / 25.05.04
I don't quite get the terminological distinction. This is a series in which a recurring cast go through a series of events which develop them as characters and develop the environment in which they exist with a continuity. In between, adverts happen... that's the OC, or Six Feet Under, or the Sopranos, or ER, or for that matter Buffy or Babylon 5. Or, indeed Beverley Hills 90210. The OC is on earlier and one a different network, but does that make it a different genre, or just aimed at a different audience (except clearly it isn't, since the comparisons are being made here with a facility that suggests a common experience of all these shows).
 
 
Tryphena Absent
16:12 / 25.05.04
At first I thought The OC was rubbish but then I caught on to something... the whole damn show is about social shifts and rather oddly it works in the same way as Six Feet Under because it never abandons its central theme. The scripting is good, the acting's rather marvellous and it's not cheap, tacky or entirely depressing. The characters actually change. It's not a soap then, perhaps you need to watch a soap in order to understand the structure of that type of show. Admittedly the theme of the OC is driven home with a sledgehammer but that's not surprising, I've never seen a US show that didn't do that for the first season but come on- Luke suddenly ends up hanging around with Seth Cohen because his dad is gay, major social shift, Marissa tries (kind of) to commit suicide and she's suddenly a social caterpillar. These plotlines seem so-so when described but they're not, this is a far better show than you realise, you just need to attune yourself to the in-jokes (Ryan the trouble attractor, Julie's white trash eye make up etc.)
 
 
ONLY NICE THINGS
16:40 / 25.05.04
Yeah - I think the knowing quality is important. See also "Smallville", which endeared itself to me enormously when one character suggested that she drive, with the implication that she had noticed that the other character's car always got totalled.

Anyway... perhaps we also need to think about what we mean by "good" or "quality" here. Surely the quality of a TV drama (or soap) is to a very great extent dictated by how enjoyable it is, whatever *kind* of enjoyment that is? So, while the characters in OC are in an environment where the generators of drama for the Sopranos (violence, murder, the psychological torment of middle-aged mob bosses) or Six Feet Under (kinky sex, unexplained deaths) would simply not function, does that mean it cannot be dramatically satisfying? In the sense of... well, what was more dramatic? Faith killing Kakistos, or Willow saying "I don't need to say 'oh'. I got it already. They slept together"? The former would not fit into the OC, the latter would...
 
 
Regrettable Juvenilia
16:56 / 25.05.04
Why does the OC have to be 'quality', just because you enjoy it?

Well, look at it another way: what do you think the people who make The OC are trying to accomplish? The least over-idealised answer possible is "get viewers, and keep them". How is this achieved but by making people enjoy watching it, and keeping them entertained, and ensuring that they invest in what happens to the characters? This is clearly happening, so the show succeeds in its aim. Your point seems to rely on the idea that other shows - Angel, or Six Feet Under, or The Sopranos - have other aims, which I'm not sure is provable. Angel might seek to keep its viewers invested and interested by subverting genre expectations and throwing in outrageous plot twists. Six Feet Under might seek to keep its viewers invested and interested by making them cry buckets, or recognise characters or situations as being very similar to ones they have encountered. The Sopranos - well, it does several of the above, or it makes for unsettling viewing, or it makes you watch it for the food, or... D'you see where I'm going with this? These are methods. They are very good, satisfying methods. But I do not think that there is a clear gap between these shows and something like The OC as result, except where there is a difference in how much I enjoy watching them. I do not think that it matters if Six Feet Under is Good For Me, or intended to be so.

And yes, I do find it very odd that some people choose to distinguish between the art/entertainment they like and the art/entertainment they think is actually any good. There's no art or entertainment I like that doesn't have some kind of redeeming feature, no matter how goofy or cheesy it may otherwise be... So if on the whole the "I like it" outweighs the "I think it's silly", then something is good. Okay, I'm getting a little too repetitive here.

I find it odd that you classify Adam Brody's adlibs as somehow separate from the process by which an episode of The OC was produced - as if Brody was not cast on the basis of comedy, as if he had nothing to work with in the character of Seth as written, and most glaringly of all as if the director, editor, producers etc had simply not noticed these adlibs, and thus allowed moments of genuine creativity and quality to slip through, rather than choosing to go with the takes in which Brody made adlibs, or choosing which adlibs to keep and which to ditch, or actively encouraging them, for instance... This example seems to me to be symptomatic of precisely where our attitudes differ, but I can't quite articulate why.
 
 
Regrettable Juvenilia
16:58 / 25.05.04
(Haus: huh. And people think we agree on purpose.)
 
 
No star here laces
15:07 / 29.05.04
Dear friends: I have terrible news about Seth.

He likes Bright Eyes.

And the Shins.

This is only marginally mitigated by his love for Kavalier and Clay.
 
 
nedrichards is confused
15:09 / 01.06.04
Tangentially related but too good to pass up, if any Screech admirers haven't heard of the mindblowing concept that is Dustin Diamond Teaches Chess then they need some swift education.

As for the OC I respect for it's groundbreaking take on televisual reality. In one of the early episodes Seth and thingy were playing on an Xbox (as healthy young men are want to do) yet instead of the mindless button mashing and controller aerobics reminiscent of bad 40s noir driving they were *actually playing*. It interrupted the lines and everything. The most realistic thing I've seen on TV in ages.
 
 
Regrettable Juvenilia
07:25 / 02.06.04
Jefe, Seth's music taste has been established from day one - and what else would you expect someone like him to like?
 
 
No star here laces
16:44 / 02.06.04
I dunno, could have been something iconoclastic and retro. It's far too much to hope that he might be a David Banner fan or something.

But ohmygod, ohmygod, ohmygod: how fucking despicable is that Oliver guy? Most hateworthy character EVER. That is the best thing about the OC - it's capacity to inspire visceral emotions about the characters.
 
 
adamswish
11:27 / 03.06.04
When I've been watching the O.C. I've always drawn a strange comparision between Ryan and Sandy. Both outsides to the incestuous (apologies for crap spelling if I've got it wrong) social set. Both looking for acceptance into the little society while fighting hard to keep their own values/identity/whatever alive.
Okay so Sandy's money (or his wife's money) allows him to play the rebel as opposed to Ryan not being given a break and having his background used as a weapon against him (although it seems with each episode his history is sinking further and further into the background. That is until the writers spring another old face from Chino at him). But I can feel the comparisions between the two of them and it works quite well to.
 
 
yawn - thing's buddy
11:49 / 03.06.04
Fuckin gallus.

great show - great title - great eyebrows - great 'moms' - and Cotillions too. (I so looooooooove Cotillions)

but seth - nah.

just as angus deayton based his entire career on one sketch by John Cleese in Monty Python (newsreader, 'and now for something....'), this little twerp seems to think a career can be built on the bones of the breakfast club nerd. (he uses the same comic timing, the same facial expressions, even his hair is kinda similar in arrangment)

and he's just far too accepting of his new 'brother' - gimme some tension man.
 
 
Regrettable Juvenilia
11:22 / 07.06.04
Quick things about the last-but-one episode: how cute were Summer and Anna's reactions to each other's presents for Seth? Awww. But is it me, or is Marissa becoming more annoying all the time? Ryan's too good for her! Then again, even she is too good for Oliver. His surname is Trask, people. His family builds giant mutant-killing robots! It kinda sucks that you have Sandy telling Ryan "you don't have to be the parent anymore", thus giving me a lump in my throat, and then when Ryan follows this advice it leads to Marissa meeting this dick. Tsk.

Best thing about that ep was still Sandy's Stallone expression.

Latest episode had lots of very very good things: new credits, a nicely meta Ryan-looks-like-Russell-Crowe gag, a pirate/ninja gag, Seth and Anna finally get it on without interruption, and they even get me to feel sorry for Summer!

The bad: I suspect Oliver is going to be back. But not before September, because Channel 4 have decided we don't need The O.C. in our lives that much after all and are taking a three-month break halfway through a season. ARRRRRGGGHHHHH!
 
 
ONLY NICE THINGS
11:46 / 07.06.04
What? They. Will. Pay.

Marissa is a bit scary, not least because she has no body weight, and between that and the huge eyes, tiny nose and bone structure she resembles nothing so much as a skull on a stick. Put a black sheet over her and she'd be a dementor...

But how lovely were Anna and Seth? And how good was the lead-in?

"Well, Captain Oates has had to much champagne, and Carson Daly is pretty much a ginormous tool, so..."
 
 
yawn - thing's buddy
11:52 / 07.06.04
I do find it quite amusing that nearly every episode ends with Ryan running in slow mo to either deck someone, restrain them, catch or kiss them.

It's as if all the clever script management and delivery is inexorably linked the creation of a moment where Ryan can do this. (which, of course, it is)

But last night's ep was great. As close to the pop comics GM was dreaming about a few years ago i reckon we'll get.

But the OC is becoming self aware: As Zenithboy notes above, the meta-crowe joke being but one example; another?: why, the congo-line entrance of heavy metal party animals who, on cue, samba'd through the door, as if by magic - this only happens in sentient fiction.

Marissa is so watchable - fuckin gorgeous but also totally deranged looking - this is good. But then I like her character too - the little, 'thank-you' she gave Ryan's 'I Love you' at the end was sharp, funny, sexy, complete. That stare and shake of the head she gives - excellent stuff.

Ryan is so blank tho.
 
 
No star here laces
00:35 / 08.06.04
You think it's self-aware now? Just wait for the Paris Hilton episode...

Oliver has hateful hair. And hateful jackets.
 
 
No star here laces
08:54 / 08.06.04
And actually I find summer the most intriguing. She has the most secrets and the most consistently surprising responses.

And the episode with the kissing booth. Well, if that isn't one of the most romantic things ever...
 
 
Regrettable Juvenilia
09:26 / 08.06.04
Careful, I think you're getting ahead of us...
 
 
No star here laces
10:25 / 08.06.04
Where are my OC dawgs in the US? And dude, you really need to get broadband...
 
 
The Natural Way
12:09 / 08.06.04
A big "YES!" to Ryan in slo-mo! Made me piss myself laughing and then, suddenly, I was really moved.

Romance-OX!
 
 
Regrettable Juvenilia
13:20 / 05.09.04
It's baaaaaaaaaack on Channel 4!

Oliver really is so despicable that I find myself wishing he was on another show, a show in which really, really terrible things might be expected to happen to him, like being bludgeoned to death by Tony Soprano's massive bear paws, or washing up on an LA beach in need of a Fisher funeral. Unfortunately his character has the negative side effect of making Marissa less sympathetic: he may be very rich, but you'd have to be pretty dim not to see through his schtick pretty quickly.

The 'Ryan-sees-something-he-shouldn't' leading to 'a-dilemma-about-whether-to-tell' thing is incredibly overplayed now, but I'm glad he's so used to it he now has a good response prepared: solve the problem practically if you can, then make the person in question do the telling.

Luke's song was priceless. But not any worse than any of Rooney's - are they a real band, or a fictional one? I'm really hoping for the latter... It did make me feel for Ryan all the more that he seemed to be the only one with enough taste not to dig that shit.

I'd also like to believe that Seth can engineer some 'teamwork' to solve his triangle, if you catch my drift, but I doubt it.
 
 
ONLY NICE THINGS
17:14 / 05.09.04
I fear Rooney is real. Sorry, dude. This was the indie-rock version of the kids from 90210 meeting De La Soul.

Having Luke started out as so vile is mamking it hard for me to accept him as part of the gang - teenagers just are not good in that way. Seth might more credibly say "Luke has a gay dad... REVENGE!", as he perfectly reasonably did at the point of revelation. As such, turning him into a gigantic labrador puppy is probably their best bet.

Ah well. Marissa, as far as I can tell, has almost no personality, which may make her more amenable to Oliver, who has the personality of Drew from Dawson's Creek. Seth and Sandy so own this show.
 
 
The Strobe
17:15 / 05.09.04
Yeah, Luke's song was something else...

also, what's with the Saturday morning ones? Is that a repeat of the last one or are we getting two episodes a weekend? I hadn't seen the Saturday one, anyhow, so that was a pleasant hungover surprise - and included a fantastic pirates/ninjas joke from the boy Cohen. Well done.

I get a sinking feeling Rooney are real, but I haven't done the research.

Oliver definitely deserves great pain, but I'm interested to see where his storyline goes; I liked the final shot of him looking in on everyone, missing out on the fun as Luke and Marissa pull, Cohen and Luke play Dynasty Warriors, and Summer and Anna try to cohabit happily.

Man, Anna. There's a girl who knows how to co-ordinate clothes and eyeshadow.
 
 
No star here laces
01:19 / 06.09.04
Ha! I'd forgotten about that pirates/ninjas joke. So many moments. I would re-watch this episode but I can't bear to watch Oliver again for even a moment.

I swear they mathematically distilled the essence of every dislikeable character ever into that guy. He's rich. He has "quirky" hair. He's "sensitive". He wears jackets with jeans.

I think Luke's character shift is OK, personally. Thing is, that his previous power and cockiness came from having his crew behind him, and without them he's a little lost. Anyway, the "labrador" thing is just a phase which makes more sense later on when the arc of the character develops more (desperately trying not to give away the key spoiler here).
 
 
Jack The Bodiless
21:32 / 06.09.04
I really lked that bit in tonight's ep when they were all, like, golfing and Oliver was all, like, snooty sneery, and even Luke noticed but Marissa didn't and then they were having a nu metal golf cart race and then Oliver was all, like, I KEEL YOU! and EVEN LUKE NOTICED BUT MARISSA DIDN'T.

What is it with this girl?! T'chah.

And Ryan is so totally trying to out Boreanaz Boreanaz. Only with blonde floppy hair. I think he's got a Klingon forehead, hence constant forehead-hideage. Even his "I don't do nice and easy" was so totally an Angel line. Our Dave should sue. Intellectual property and so forth.

Caleb needs his own series. Alan Dale has NOT AGED in the last twenty years. I think I have a crush on him.

Seth n' Anna's channel hop TV watching was utterly inspired. And the "Your hair." "You're here." lines had me spitting Grolsch (it's ok, I was drinking it at the time, I don't excrete the stuff).

I have also become addicted to One Tree Hill. This is bad. But Craig Scheffer (probably spelled wrong, but hey!) is fantastic... As is JoeyImeanHayley.
 
 
Regrettable Juvenilia
08:39 / 22.09.04
The Oliver plot is slowly but surely chipping away at my love for this show. Firstly, it makes Marissa look dumb and unpleasant for not seeing through him. Secondly, it makes almost every character look a bit dumb for not being 100% on Ryan's side. And thirdly, it makes Ryan look dumb for handling it so badly...

At this point I'm hoping for an episode that consists entirely of Sandy and Jimmy drinking beer and discussing meatloaf.
 
 
ONLY NICE THINGS
08:54 / 22.09.04
That would be *great*. Peter Gallagher is basically my dream husband right now.

Oliver does feel like he's parachuted in from another show, doesn't he? Something a bit Melrose Place-y... I'm also not loving Seth, either, both for failing to pick up on the Oliver issue, presumably overcompensating due to the Summer issue, but also for sabotaging Summer's life. I can tell he's going to end up with her, Anna will be revealed as a subplot and DIE SCUM DIE.

And when will Ryan stop punching people? He's got to be realising that it rarely ends well...
 
 
Jack The Bodiless
20:12 / 27.09.04
Yeah, but it's how these shows work! Reversals, stupid decisions, sudden walkings in on the boyfriend and his ex in a not-at-all-compromising situation that gets hilariously misconstrued... Staples.

Seth and Anna are just Xander and Willow with better hair, and they were never meant to be together. But don't write her out, for fuck's sake! Gnah.

Am I alone in thinking that Sandy and Caleb slash would be hott? Probably. Alan Dale's ropey yank accent is a shame (unless he's meant to be South-African in some way? I dunno), but Peter Gallagher, an Irish American, playing a Jewish American without resorting to cod-yiddish or Woody Allenisms, deserves respeck.

And everyone letting Ryan down (apart from Sandy - when he offered to drive Ryan to the hotel to confront Oliver - YES!) - that was telegraphed for a while. I loved it when Luke, despite being a bit of a dumb prick, was the only one (apart from Sandy, boo yah) to stand by Ryan - Ryan stood by him despite having very little reason to, and so he was the only one (apart from Sandy! Yo!)to appreciate that the boy was worth listening to. Shows Seth and Marissa up for the spoiled only children they are.

And I would have hit him too. I would have hit him with a pool cue, but I would have hit him.
 
 
ONLY NICE THINGS
08:00 / 28.09.04
Again with the Sandy lovin' - this episode made me like him more than *anything*, both for his support of Ryan and for his whupping of Seth upside the head.

I'm hoping to see Oliver out and Anna kept in, but I have a nasty feeling it may be the other way around. In fact, wouldn't it be funny if, after an awkward couple of episodes, Oliver joined the gang and then whenever anyone subsequently mentioned that he was a gun-toting mentalwrong everyone closed ranks and supported him, è' la Ryan?

I am more minded to forgive Seth for being a cretin than Marissa, but I suspect that that is purely because he's far better acted. One of my big gripes with the OC is that Marissa is acted so robotically sometimes that it makes it very hard to remember *why* everyone is after her, when she seems to be recovering from some complex form of head surgery...
 
 
Regrettable Juvenilia
08:46 / 28.09.04
I realised the other day that one of the reasons Oliver is so annoying is that he reminds me of Robbie Williams.
 
 
ONLY NICE THINGS
10:16 / 28.09.04
That might be it.

Incidentally, shout-out for Ryan's response (paraphrased)

"Why would I want you not to shoot yourself? I hate your guts. If you shoot yourself, the only person you'll make happy is *me*."

Bless the boy.
 
 
The Strobe
11:48 / 28.09.04
Probably my favourite episode of the OC so far. Sandy is, clearly, the man, and I'm quite glad he managed to lay down the law with Seth. That way madness lies. Unfortunately, madness also lies with forcing Seth onto Summer because she is quite dreadful in so many ways, and to see Anna go to waste is criminal.

One of my big gripes with the OC is that Marissa is acted so robotically sometimes that it makes it very hard to remember *why* everyone is after her

Me too, Haus, me too. Her personality is about as thick as her legs, and her facial expressions really do shit me. Also, she is so blind to Oliver's obsessive-compulsive (OC - hey, I see where this is going! It's all about him!) nature as to boggle even the average mind, and thus I realise she's even dumber than I think she is. Also, she never conveys anger, merely a succession of strops, and this doesn't ingratiate her to me, either. Still, the more I think about it, I've known more people who resembled Oliver and Marissa than anyone else in the cast, so it's probably just further indication of society's downward spiral.

Luke is becoming more endearing, though he needs to stay away from EVIL MUM OF MARISSA. But hey, you can see where Caleb was coming from.

I think Sandy and Kirsten are everyone's "special parents". You know, for when real parents aren't enough.
 
 
Regrettable Juvenilia
11:53 / 28.09.04
At this stage I really don't see what's so dreadful about Summer - she wasn't the most endearing member of the cast for the first few episodes, but that all seems a loooong time ago now...
 
 
ONLY NICE THINGS
12:59 / 28.09.04
Hmmm... I think part of it is that Barbelith, being largely a bit older than Seth, has got past its collective Summer phase and would now rather go out with Anna. Which, since Seth is the geeky entry character (Ryan may be an outsider, but it's made clear in the first episode that so is Seth - he's too dorky, too ambiguously sexualised and probably too Jewish) is a bit of a factor. Summer, as the popular girl, should certainly *desire* Seth, but she should be rejected in punishment for her previous inaccessibility.

Cigar, anyone?

So far I have admired Summer's capacity for evil, but most of all the readiness with which she got depressed when she realised that she hadn't made a comic for Seth. That was lovely, and very self-aware.
 
 
Regrettable Juvenilia
13:16 / 28.09.04
I quite like the fact that the current Seth storyline seems to be partially about the fact that having interests in common isn't the only thing you need to make a relationship work... Anna & Seth barely seem to want to kiss each other, let alone anything heavier. I can't tell how much this is a mutual lack of chemistry, though - in the episode where they stayed in Oliver's suite, it looked as if Anna was planning to initiate something before Summer gatecrashed, but even she doesn't seem that keen since. She wants Seth to be her boyfriend, but does she want Seth?
 
  

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