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Speakerboxxx / The Love Below

 
  

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Yotsuba & Benjamin!
12:59 / 24.09.03
So, Speakerboxxx/The Love Below. Is there a more straightforward, out to save the world from suckiness and hate album, band, or concept than is on display on this double CD?

Oh, and as far as "Flip Flop Rock" goes, everyone else, don't bother. The best song ever has dropped and this is it.

The Love Below is a bit lacking, but She Lives On My Lap outfucks the entire Lovage CD, and that's serious fuck material.

But what do you think?
 
 
Matthew Fluxington
14:06 / 24.09.03
Hmmm. I don't have fully developed opinions about the record, and I just don't ever feel like bothering with listening to the records in sequence because there's just way too much fluff between the two of them, especially on Andre 3000's record. Each of the albums has a few undeniably brilliant songs on it - Andre has "Hey Ya," "Prototype," "Roses," and "A Day In the Life Of Andre Benjamin," and Big Boi has "Ghettomusick," "The Rooster," "Bowtie," "The Way You Move," "Church," and "Knowing." Overall, Big Boi's record blows Andre's away. His record is a solid A, and Andre's is just an uneven B.

I think it comes down to this - Andre's album is "weird" and "crazy" in all the ways you'd expect it to be, but Big Boi's the one throwing the real curveballs. "Ghettomusick" is the most adventurous song on either record and one of the only true Outkast songs, and you can tell. It's one of the songs where you get the aesthetics of both men coming together to make something truly inspired, which is the main appeal of Outkast to me. It's fun to hear Andre doing Prince impressions and being allowed to be as concept-album pretentious as he wants to be, but let's face it, I've already got about ten Prince albums, so "Prototype" and "She Lives In My Lap" are just a little redundant.

That drum and bass cover of "My Favorite Things" is probably the worst thing I've heard on a good album in a long, long time by the way.
 
 
rizla mission
08:13 / 25.09.03
So is there much on this album that sounds like that song Outkast did on the soundtrack to the ScoobyDoo movie?

Cos I thought that was utter genius, although I gather nobody else did..

I'm a bit cautious of this new album, in that, brilliant as it was/is, Stankonia did reveal a pretty massive appitite for self-indulgence. On that album it was kept in check by a steady stream of unbelievably great songs, but, well, basically I can imagine them going compleeetely off the deep end on what seems to amount to a double-CD concept album..

I mean - dude - not just "double album" length.. "double CD" length!

I'd also much prefer to hear them working together than apart, but then I guess most people would..
 
 
nedrichards is confused
11:32 / 25.09.03
Rizla: there's a bit I suppose. "Hey ya" and "GhettoMusick" are equally badass. I'd say visit your local filesharing network and sample to see if it's for you.

p.s. I loved that track too.
 
 
Matthew Fluxington
12:33 / 25.09.03
Rizla is exactly right - what the new Outkast ammounts to is, in terms of vinyl, a quadruple album in terms of length. At least half of the combined two cd set is inessential. That really depresses me, because if they just reined it in and made this a succinct single-disc record, it could be mindblowing. As it is, it's just a lot of great songs surrounded by lots of stuff which would be better off as b-sides of import singles.
 
 
Regrettable Juvenilia
14:05 / 25.09.03
All I know is, I'm really excited about getting this on Monday. Have only heard 'Flip-Flop Rock' and 'Hey Ya' so far, love 'em both. Even though I think the latter is the better song, I fully expect the Big Boi disc to be the one that surprises and entertains me more.
 
 
Red Cross Iodized Salt
01:29 / 26.09.03
Picked it up today on vinyl and it is a quadruple album. The Andre 3000 sides are patchy (that drum+bass effort is an embarrasing low point), but the Big Boi sides make up for it.
 
 
Laughing
02:40 / 26.09.03
I just bought the album and I'm in a geeking-out-loving-every-minute phase, so I can't put forth a coherent opinion yet. I listened to The Love Below first and adored it -- yeah, Andre's doing a Prince impression, but it's a good Prince impression so I don't have a problem with it.

And "GhettoMusick" rawks. It is kicking my balls so hard I'm going to puke on my balls and also my ass.
 
 
Regrettable Juvenilia
10:56 / 26.09.03
Omigod. Just got this too. Am listening to Speakerboxxx for the first time. OMIGOD. 'Unhappy' is the sound of Big Boi rubbing his belly in satisfaction after eating Timbaland for breakfast with some waffles. 'Bowtie' is my new night out anthem, and the horns on that track and 'The Rooster' make me grin - the horns, man! And of course 'Ghettomusick' is so mad that it's been discussed a lot already - such a great club track, so insane the way it goes chill-for-a-moment>INSANE-SUPAFAST-HAPPY-HARDCORE-MAXIMALISM-INTENSITY>caaaaaalm, caaaalm, mellow>AAAAAARRGGGH-HERE-WE-GO-AGAIN-BREAKNECK-BREAKBEATS-WAAAAH!

And the ludicrous buttery soul on 'The Way You Move' and the ludicrous Hammer-Horror rock opera on 'Bust' - and what's this one? 'Knowing'? OMigod - okay, I need to be alone for a while. I'll get back to you, but so far Speakerboxxx is easily the best hip-hop album so far this year.

Shout-out to public housing!
 
 
Matthew Fluxington
12:02 / 26.09.03
Oh man, I forgot to mention how much I love "Unhappy."

Actually, there's very little I dislike about Speakerboxxx. Even the thing with Big Boi's kid works. Andre's damn lucky that Big Boi was considerate enough to insist that their records were released as one package, because I think that otherwise, Andre would have suffered critically and commercially.
 
 
Regrettable Juvenilia
10:53 / 29.09.03
Flux, I agree about commercially, but critically the consensus seems to be "wow, isn't Speakerboxxx awesome, Big Boi was the interesting one all along!", whereas I think if The Love Below had been an Andre solo album it might have been looked upon more indulgently. When you have Speakerboxxx there to remind you that moving away from hip-hop beats and rapping can be as much a retrograde move as a radical one if not more so, The Love Below suffers. But I seem to like it more than most people - I actually like the opening tracks, the feeling that you're caught up in some mad technicolour musical - Andre's old-fashioned-ness is different from anyone else's old-fashioned-ness that I can think of right now, and that makes it a lot of fun - I really dig the jazzy playfulness of 'Love Hater' - who can resist the sentiment "everybody needs someone to rub their shoulders"? And I think 'God' is hilariousness - he just hits the right note to stop it being irritating and boorish, if you ask me - especially the bit where he says he's not picky, she doesn't have to have to a "big ol' ass, just something well-proportioned to her frame, you know, a nice potato" - at least I think he says "potato", it could be "rotator".

'Happy Valentine's Day' probably sums up the weaknesses and strengths of Andre as a solo artist - it's a lot of fun, a LOT of fun - especially the start - "My name is Cupid Valentino, the modern day Cupid" - and when the piano comes in during his rap. But it's soooo reminiscent of Prince, sounds so much like a homage, that it's impossible to enjoy without thinking of the resemblance (it is to Prince as Interpol's 'PDA' is to Joy Division or The Darkness' 'I Believe In A Thing Called Love is to Queen, I guess, in that I still like it but think "tsk, tsk"). In fact I'm sure it sounds exactly like a specific Prince song with the handclap beat and those guitar licks

'Dracula's Wedding' is the other track I really like on The Love Below so far - at first it made me think it was Dre playing at being The Neptunes to make Kelis feel at home, but Kelis herself really makes it great - and the little "ssshh, here she comes!" before her vocal comes in - oh yes.

I *do* think it's really telling that both Dre and Big Boi have an anti-war track on their respective CDs, and that Dre's 'Love In War' is a vague, pleasant enough, hippy love song about hiding under the covers from all that nasty fighting, whereas Big Boi's 'War' is a fiery, polemical anti-Bush administration tirade - and it's the superior song...

I think I could talk about this record all week. Outkast=Best Band Ever???
 
 
Matthew Fluxington
17:08 / 29.09.03
Clap Clap on Andre and racial passing:

It might be worth it for all y'all burn-hounds to actually pick this one up (or at least check out someone's physical copy) because the packaging is pretty cool. Well, less the packaging, I guess, and more the liner notes, which, aside from featuring all the lyrics to the non-skit songs (thanks guys!), has some really interesting photos. I mean, you knew it would--it's Outkast, after all, and even if you've only glanced at it in the store, you've seen the borderline-atrocious picture of Big Boi on one cover and the hilarious one of Andre on the other (a Glock and pearls? Oh, Mr. 3000!). But inside...well. How to put it? I guess, basically, it made me understand why Salon assigned someone "writing a book about racial passing in American culture" to review the album.

OK, there's Andre under the Eiffel tower in a plaid suit. OK, there's Andre as a centaur in the heavens with three naked ladies. I'll even give him, sorta, the one with him on a bench with a girl and a bulldog. But the one on the inside back cover makes me wonder. It's him on a hill, having a picnic with his wife, who is in a crew-neck orange sweater with white collar peeking out, and his children, who are in penny loafers. Andre himself has his hair slicked back (as he does in the bench and Eiffel shots) and is wearing what can only be described as an outfit straight out of the 50's. The whole thing resembles either a shot from a religious pamphlet or Far From Heaven. In other words, it's kind of a minstrelry of whiteness.

Which all makes me wonder--and honestly, I'm asking this, I don't have an answer yet--is Andre just fucking with us, with this and the whole "Hey Ya" thing? Is he pulling a fast one on us white people? Outkast, of course, has a bit of a reputation as a hip-hop group white people like (which is probably true, given that they won two Grammies and all) and various critics (unlike moi) have seen fit to hedge their bets on "Hey Ya" in particular, and The Love Below in general, by saying that well, obviously, it's just going to appeal to rock critics (read: white people) more. And while I don't see any particular problem with that, it does make me wonder, as I say, what exactly the master plan is here.

Of course, it also makes me wonder if there's any answer to the question "How much does Andre like Prince?" other than "a lot." Aside from the specific parallels ("Hey Ya" being the "Raspberry Beret" of 2003, for my money, and the minimalism of the drums there in the ecstatic-pop context evoke nothing more than "Kiss"), Andre seems to have, on this album, done a nice job of solving the problem of audience and race that sent Prince spinning into the art-jazz abyss of late--albeit an abyss that's well-deserved, since we'll still be figuring out his 80's output in 20 years, most likely. But from what I understand of the Prince mythos, he began rebelling against his almost universal pop appeal (exemplified, perhaps, by the lack of any bass in some of his best songs) by making what he perceived as "black" music, first with the Black album and now more or less continually with NEWS etc. But Andre has, I think, figured out a way around this, one that's actually rooted in Outkast's appeal: genre-hopping/melding. And one of the genres he's aiming toward is Coltrainey jazz, but if this album is any indication, he wants to fuck with it and mix it with other shit. And that's not white or black but just musical. It's interesting, anyway.


We really need to get Eppy posting over here.
 
 
Regrettable Juvenilia
19:52 / 29.09.03
Yeah. I think he's touching on a huge ocean of fascinating things going on with race and the racial connotations of different types of music that can be said about TLB. I think you're right (in the comments on his blog) about how 3000 relates to fashion as well. His outfits are both knowing and sincere, which is true for a lot of the musical genre-hopping as well, I think. And that photo of him as a centaur IS worth buying the album for.

But I'm all about Big Boi at the moment. I feel like Speakerboxxx is one of those records is one of those records that connects with exactly how I'm feeling at the moment, whatever that is... I'm going to try to post to this thread once a day for the foreseeable future. Maybe I can come up with 100 reasons to love S/TLB.

Oh, and anyone else reckon Speakerboxxx >> Stankonia >> The Love Below?

Plus, how good is Jay-Z's guest verse on 'Flip-Flop Rock'? "why that, why this, niggas wanna hijack the flyness, I'm on a whole different plane..." Shout to public housing!
 
 
bigsunnydavros
20:31 / 29.09.03
Jay-Z's verse on 'Flip-Flop Rock'=every bit as good as his (wonderful) verse on 'Crazy In Love'? I think so.

I like The Love Below, but at the risk of sounding like I'm towing the party line Speakerboxxx rocks me so much harder!

I only got it this morning, so I'm still taking it all in, but I just know that it's going to take me ages to get a grip on whats going on in all of these songs, and that's what I love about Speakerboxxx-- it's really imediate, but there's a whole wealth of sonic excellence going on in there as well.

I think that Flyboy is painfully right with his comment about 'Happy Valentine's Day' and others like it being to Prince as Interpol are to Joy Division (though I do actually like 'Happy Valentine's Day' a lot - it's my favourite of his Prince workouts at this stage).
 
 
bigsunnydavros
20:39 / 29.09.03
Do you know what song from The Love Below I do like a lot though? 'A Day In the Life Of Benjamin Andre' -- I think that's a really interesting track.

Andre's narrative flows really smoothly, but the minimal rhythm track and droning noises give it this weird intensity -- it almost feels relentless at some points, like something from Aphex Twin's I Care Because You Do, but, y'know, better!
 
 
Regrettable Juvenilia
14:56 / 03.10.03
There's not actually a bad song (as opposed to skit) on Speakerboxxx, is there? 'Reset' is really nice broody, melancholy hip-hop - reminds me of what I was listening to around the autumn/winter of 98 (I think). It strikes me that one of the things that Big Boi does really well is versatility - not just production wise but vocal versatility as well. He can speed-rap, he can do high-pitched weirdness or a deeper, smoother tone, he can sound bitter and aggressive or incredibly laid-back and unfussed... This might sound pretty obvious stuff but I'm struggling to think of many high-profile rappers around at the moment with as wide a range.

'The Way You Move' has suddenly grown into track that makes me hit the repeat button. It's the kind of unassuming number that sounds relatively familiar at first but gets stuck in your head, and what's actually going on in there becomes increasingly impressive with each listen...

Plus - "get your hands off my cheeks, and let me study how you ride the beat: you big freak." - how can you not love how, um, 'fat-positive' Big Boi is?
 
 
bigsunnydavros
16:06 / 03.10.03
'The Way You Move' is great - I love the way that the verses slide so seamlessly into the chorus despite the fact that they sound so entirely dissimilar; there's no friction there, it just glides on in! One of the great things about quite a few of the Speakerboxxx tracks is how nicely Big Boi plays with contrasting sounds - 'Ghettomusick' is an obvious example, but there's also stuff like the hook on 'Knowing', where the two vocal lines play off each other really wonderfully - one harsh, one smooth as all hell.

On 'The Way You Move' you've got the very sparse verses and the very lush choruses, and they just meld together into one classy little song. It's not, as Flyboy pointed out, one of the tracks that really smacks you on the head first time you hear it, but it does stick with you, doesn't it?

The Love Below is definitely growing on me with each listen, but it still looks a tad flabby next to the prizefighter that is Speakerboxxx. There are a couple of tracks which I don't particularly love ('Tomb of the Boom', for example), but nothing I actually dislike at all.

And yeah, Big Boi is just generally a brilliant rapper and vocalist with so much range and confidence. It's always been obvious that he's a really talented guy, but hearing so much of him without Andre on Speakerboxxx really brings attention to how masterful he is all across the board.
 
 
bio k9
03:33 / 05.10.03
I just heard on the radio that Big Boi fell into a pit that was holding some of his fighting dogs and was torn to shreds!
 
 
Bear
12:53 / 06.10.03
I really don't know about the Outkast like you guys do but I just downloaded Speakerboxxx and it fucking rocks so far not what I was expecting at all - didn't I slag you off for having it in your hand flyboy at a meet a little back - if I did very sorry

Didn't realise it was a double CD though but I think the site had the other part just off to check now.
 
 
Regrettable Juvenilia
13:11 / 06.10.03
Ah, you didn't slag me off, just looked bemused as many people do whenever the first thing I do upon sitting down is wave a CD at them and burble excitedly.

How about that 'Bowtie', eh?
 
 
Bear
13:44 / 06.10.03
Ahha...

The first few tracks are excellent but it kind of looses it for me in the middle (around Tomb of the Boom), Flip Flop Rock has too much going on for me but that might just be because I'm listening to it on headphones.

Really like Reset though.

Just about to listen to the other CD...

I'm so out of date! Anyone heard of a band called The Beatles?
 
 
Regrettable Juvenilia
14:32 / 06.10.03
'Tomb Of The Bomb' is all about the Ludacris and Big Boi verses (the last two), it doesn't really kick in until then.

'Flip-Flop Rock' - weirdly, someone else (Flux elsewhere?) said they thought it sounded cluttered at first - I dunno, that impression went away after about the second or third listen for me. Another example of how a track can switch between two speeds very effectively, although I think in this case the end result is oddly consistent, rather than the sudden stop-starts of 'Ghettomusick'. Did I mention that Killer Mike's verse is awesome too? Well, it is. "Watch 'em as they gawk and they gander, you can follow or lead like Commander Picard" - goofy, but brill.
 
 
Bear
14:50 / 06.10.03
Man alive if I wasn't expecting the first CD to sound the way it did, the second CD is much more my thing which seems to be not the norm but then I kinda like Dido so what would I know....happy I found this now....
 
 
Regrettable Juvenilia
15:40 / 06.10.03
We probably ought to switch to talking more about The Love Below now - does anyone else think the guitars on 'Prototype' sound like they belong on Siamese Dream? Which isn't a bad thing - I think it's kinda cool that Andre can make essentially an indie rock ballad, 'cos I'm in favour of cross-pollination and all that. I've also really come round to 'She Lives In My Lap'... in fact, to be honest I think if you cut out the 3rd quarter of the record (ie from 'Behold A Lady' to 'She's Alive', which is probably the weakest track), it'd be a perfectly respectable album. Well, okay, if I'm in the wrong mood I find 'Spread' REALLY annoying, but otherwise...

Okay, sneaking in two more comments on Speakerboxxx:

1) They really need to get MOP in to appear on a remix of 'Bust' right now. Shouty shouty SHOUTY goodness.

2) I really hope 'The Way You Move' crosses over so it gets played in the cheesiest of nightclubs - y'know, it'd slip in so well next to 'Rock Your Body' on the playlists. In fact if anyone hears this track in a club, let me know, 'kay?
 
 
rizla mission
20:22 / 06.10.03
Er.. Big Boi hasn't really been torn apart by fighting dogs has he??

Because that would be kind of, um, bad.
 
 
Matthew Fluxington
21:37 / 06.10.03
No, it's true. Big Boi fell into one of his pitbull pens, and they mauled him. He's going to be okay, but he's badly hurt. He gets what he deserves, considering that he's the guy who had them bred to be killing machines.

I heard it on the radio. You can't lie on the radio.
 
 
Spatula Clarke
20:11 / 08.10.03
Got this yesterday and still don't feel familiar enough with it to do any proper pulling-apart (curse of the double album stikes worse than ever because of this being two individual albums rather than one double), but I need to say that Dracula's Wedding is bloody brilliant. The Hammer-creepy cat moan "yoooooou're" that it opens with, the puns, the crackly B&W perv-vampire vocals, Kelis (love Kelis), the "shhh... here she comes" that Fly's already spunked over, the R2D2 scratching that greets her...

Two and a half minutes is both far too short and also absolutely the perfect length for something this good.
 
 
Matthew Fluxington
20:19 / 08.10.03
One of Barbelith's favorite music writers (if by Barbelith you mean me, Flyboy, and Big Sunny D) Sasha Frere-Jones weighs in on the record on the Slate site.

Key quotes:

Apparently there are people in this country who would not dance in their chairs when "Bowtie" comes on. This is why we need national health care now, because that is not right.

..

...Big Boi is one of the best MCs working. He is, at the very least, hip-hop's fiercest enunciator. If somebody tries that "rapping isn't music" nonsense with you (it still happens), hand them any of Big Boi's verses from Stankonia and ask them to map out the accents, references, and feet. Give them several days and lots of graph paper. (You might want to mention the quality of something is rarely correlated to complexity, but that stuff tends to impress ignoramae.)
 
 
Gypsy Lantern
19:49 / 22.10.03
Finally got around to picking this up - I really just have one word to say on the subject and that word is bowtie.
 
 
PatrickMM
18:58 / 09.11.03
Got this, I've only listened to The Love Below so far, and it's incredible. 'Hey Ya' is great, and there's a lot of other genius tracks, 'Prototype,' 'Dracula's Wedding,' and 'Roses' are just awesome. More when I listen to Speakerboxx.
 
 
Matthew Fluxington
18:37 / 16.11.03
Help Outkast pick their next singles!

I'm totally stunned that "The Rooster" is not a candidate for Big Boi's next single.

Either way, my picks:

Big Boi
first choice - "Bowtie"
second choice - "Unhappy"
third choice - "Reset"
fourth choice - "Church"

Andre 3000
first choice - "Roses"
second choice - "Behold A Lady"
third choice - "Spread"
fourth choice - "Prototype"

Picking Andre's single was much harder since I think the top three choices all should be big hits. I chose "Roses" over "Behold A Lady" because I love the song so much, but I do concede that "Behold A Lady" is probably a better single to follow up "Hey Ya!"
 
 
Regrettable Juvenilia
18:56 / 16.11.03
My Big Boi votes were the same as yours: I'm really pleased that 'Bowtie' and 'Unhappy' are possible contenders, since they're my favourite two tracks from his album - it was very, very tricky for me to choose between them. One is the ultimate party/confident swagger tune, the other always just hits me right THERE in the heart. But 'Reset' would also do me fine, and it showcases a side of Outkast that maybe doesn't get enough attention.

Andre's options please me less. I think he's insane not to put 'Happy Valentine's Day' out as a single, and after that I'd consider 'She Lives In My Lap' to be the next best option (or has that been a single in the US already?). As it is I have to take 'Prototype' as number one, followed by 'Roses' (great tune, shame about the sentiment), 'Behold A Lady' (some days I really like, some days the self-consciously weird bits annoy me - "candy coated unicorns"?) and then finally 'Spread', which fortunately I cannot see being released as a single...
 
 
Matthew Fluxington
19:13 / 16.11.03
I know that they made a video for "She Lives In My Lap," but I think they are really wise not to make that the next single. It's just toooooo Prince-y and it's not pop enough. "Hey Ya" is a cross-format pop hit, and I think they want to keep that gravy train rolling along.

"Prototype" is a good song, but it's too far out in the rock/soul direction, it's maybe a little too straight for its own good. It may be a good song to market to rock radio, but other than that, I think it isn't a great idea.

"Spread" would really work on radio/video, I can see that one really catching on. It's a dark horse, but it's something that could work. It'd be better as a third or fourth single, though.

"Behold A Lady" is insanely catchy, it's a genre mash-up like "Hey Ya," and lyrically it is very accessable. I think it could be a massive hit. They'd be crazy not to release it.

"Happy Valentine's Day" isn't a good choice, mostly because most people will think of it as a cheesy novelty song.

"Roses" is also very catchy and easy to like, and it has the benefit of being a true Outkast song since Big Boi is on it. The sentiment is the problem though - outside of the context of the album (which includes the radically opposite "Behold A Lady" and a thematic continuity that defangs the song a bit) it could alienate a lot of people.
 
 
Regrettable Juvenilia
08:43 / 17.11.03
"Happy Valentine's Day" isn't a good choice, mostly because most people will think of it as a cheesy novelty song.

When I first read this I was like: "*splutter* Blasphemy!" But then I thought about how putting the song out as a single right now might indeed make it seem like a novelty record 'cos of the "there's all this fuss about Santa Claus" line - still, imagine if it was Christmas Number One. How much would that rule?

Despite my earlier opinion that the song is too close an homage to Prince, I think my favourite moment on the whole of The Love Below might be when the little psychedelic dream-sequence sound after "so you gon' find out... tonight!" suddenly stops dead before he starts the rap.
 
 
Jackie Susann
01:37 / 18.11.03
Did you see them on the American Music Awards? Dre did a whole airplane-themed 'Hey Ya', and opened by saying, 'Ladies and gentlemen, please turn off all pagers and mobile phones because we fly - we just can't help it' - and launching into the song. They blew away everyone else on the night (which is not saying much - how many country bands are there in America?)

Re - endless Prince comparisons - what's really great about Dre is that he's equal parts Prince and Morris Day, so he can be eccentric and sleazy and musically adventurous and have a sense of humour about himself at the same time.
 
  

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