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Is banksy a sell out?

 
  

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Our Lady of The Two Towers
19:32 / 20.07.03
Went there this afternoon with the young Pin, It's a fair hike from Liverpool Street, we did it the hard way, about two miles or so I reckon, intelligent people will probably work out you can bus most or all the way.

The animals have gone, it was decided to be inhumane to keep them there in weather like this. It's basically what looks like a stripped out garage, big sliding doors and a milk float out front. There are pictures and stenciling done on the walls, mostly stuff that will be familiar to people who have read his two books. Pride of place went to the now empty animal pens, one had two policecars crashed on top of one another, and there was a large vandalised statue of The Thinker. There was an upstairs area that was open to the public, a couple of old offices filled with trash and rubbish, but some people insisted on going in to do the stroky beard thing thinking it was part of the exhibition. Hanging from the ceiling were policemen with angel wings, very nice. If you're free tomorrow afternoon pop along and show your support.
 
 
_pin
10:00 / 21.07.03
If someone does go today, cna they try and check out what the projection is of on the ground floor. I could make out a croud in the background and something moving in the front- I'm guesing riot police watching someone dancing, but who knows, as it was daylight.

Oh, and check everyone sitting on sofas reading Banksy books instead of looking at Banksy things. Mmm... The Face...

And the murial where Cargo was built- can someone please tell me all they can about the documentary that was made about it, as it's really starting to bug me now...
 
 
_pin
14:45 / 21.07.03
Interesting... looks like it's gone down early. I quite like the idea that, but not giving anyone directions and making it far away, it took the police three whole days to actually get there and do something, but what did they find to pull it up on? They took away the animals, which is a shame, but I'd rather they weren't there, simply to ease my namby liberal guilt- so what was there?

Which I guess means we can all getback on topic now: judgeing by the size of the first BOGOF scuplture (the aforementioned Thinker, in bronze, witha traffic cone on it's head, daubed in paint and looking shite), which accoridng to the rules has a twin somewhere else waiting to be given to the city, and the fact that the exibition, complete with cars, a plenthora of seats and everything else (possbily even a milk float, although I'm not sure if that just happened to be parked there... ) was free, it's safe to say that he hasn't "sold out" by doing the Think Tank work (and it's not just the album cover, but also the singles too), but rather ploughed all the money back into extending the Banksy Brand.

Although could the rest of the BOGOF works, which is a very nice idea, please just be a lot better then that one??
 
 
Bill Posters
07:49 / 03.08.03
> potus, yep, it looks like we missed our chance.

Strange, mainstream it may be, but not so mainstream as to not get shut down by da law.

I must say i was a bit phased to see prints of his for sale in Forbidden Planet yesterday! I mean, i know nothing about art, but isn't buying banksys from a shop totally against the whole spirit of the graf art? And not just any shop, but Forbidding Prices at that. Oh dear oh dear...
 
 
STOATIE LIEKS CHOCOLATE MILK
10:43 / 03.08.03
Ah, not that this is something I do lightly, but for once I have to defend FP's honour. Their major book-buyer (my old boss) is a huge Banksy fan, and deals straight with AK Press. You know how the section in FP where they keep the political/conspiracy books & mags has been shrinking? That's so not his doing. He hates SF but loves all that stuff. I very much doubt FP management (let alone Titan head office) would have anything to do with selling anything even remotely as cool as Banksy.

I'm still not sure why he still works there...
 
 
Bill Posters
12:06 / 03.08.03
ah...
 
 
_pin
09:46 / 04.08.03
Doe snayone have any news on if it really was "da law", tho? Reports at the time seemed to be hinting that it was really just petulance at having the animals leave early.

So what do people think of everyone saying his real name is Robin Banks? It was funny when the BBC just said it the day the exibition went down, as if someone wrote it on a piece of paper and slid it across a table to them with a quick nazel sniff and a slight nod, and then published it without ever thinking to read it out loud, but I've found articles in Spanish dating back to 2001 saying that it's his real name, implying that it wasn't some joke to throw out to the media.

Shame if he really is called Robin Banks, I must say.
 
 
mondo a-go-go
14:08 / 04.08.03
You can buy limited edition Banksy prints at the Tate Britain (and probably Modern for all I know). £50, or double if you want it signed. Seeing as "signed" seems to just mean his stencil logo is added on the print, I dunno whether it's worth the price. Probably be very collectable and sellable soon, though.

Pity none of the prints were actually of anything I would want to own. And I'm mostly a fan of his....
 
 
Our Lady Has Left the Building
09:27 / 21.05.05
More Banksy mischief.

New exhibition which involves Banksy.

Anyone feel like going?
 
 
TeN
16:49 / 21.05.05
Wooster Collective is also holding a walking tour of street art today in NYC, which is supposed to include a guest appearance of a new Banksy stencil. I was considering going, but it starts in 7 minutes, so I guess I missed the boat.
 
 
Our Lady Has Left the Building
10:56 / 05.08.05
Banksy draws on big wall in Israel.

Soldier: What the f*** are you doing?
Banksy: You'll have to wait until it's finished.
Soldier (to colleagues): Safety's off
 
 
Not Here Still
11:28 / 05.08.05
Just coming here to post the same thing...

From Guardian article:

"Banksy also records on his website how an old Palestinian man said his painting made the wall look beautiful. Banksy thanked him, only to be told: 'We don't want it to be beautiful, we hate this wall. Go home.'"
 
 
paranoidwriter waves hello
15:20 / 05.08.05
The issue of whether Banksy is a "sell out" fascinates me. I mean, how is ze supposed to eat (etc) and keep producing work at such a prolific rate if most of hir work is free? And who amongst any of us is "whiter than white"? I've even witnessed people slagging off Banksy for selling prints while they were drinking a can of Coke and smoking a Marlborough!

But I suppose it's a difficult problem for any such (I dunno) "radical" (?) artists to maintain their integrity AND survive, although (IMHO) as long as such artists don't help advertise Shell, Coke, (etc), then surely their actual work far outweighs such considerations as "selling out" by doing a few record covers? Now, I know there was controversy over Banksy's involvement with Puma, but I get the impression there was more going on there than met the eye -- sorry, I'd love to explain further, but I'm duty bound not to.

I've known Banksy for a few years now (not that we're close friends or anything) and I have nothing but admiration for hir work and personage. My favourite pieces of hir work has to be the rats, and the homeless angel in the doorway.

The latest Palestine wall images are (IMHO) brilliant, as always.

(BTW, at 'Turf War' the farmers who owned the animals were on hand twenty-four hours a day, and, as they themselves commented, the pigs and cows were treated FAR batter at the exhibition than they are at (say) a slaughterhouse or at market. Indeed, the reason they were taken away early was because of Banksy's concerns over the fiercely hot weather which unfortunately coincided with the exhibition. Also, at the time, I found it ironic when an animal rights protester stood by the pens and started screaming about animal abuse, without realising that her shouting was obviously making the animals VERY distressed indeed.)
 
 
skolld
16:08 / 05.08.05
i 'heart' banksy,

definitely not a sell out, it's just good art.
 
 
paranoidwriter waves hello
16:07 / 07.08.05
doctorbeck: i think the name existantialism was lifted from the graffix bit of the crass collective, maybe existential press it was called?

toksik: doctor beck, i think you may have missed the pun. he does stencils, and existentialism is a type of philosophy.

stencil+existentialism=Existencilism.


To the best of my knowledge, you're both right. Indeed, the amazing genius that is Gee Voucher ('Crass' cover artist) has exhibited along with Banksy (and others) for the past two 'Santa's Ghetto's' (at least).

I'd only ever heard of Crass from friends who were around at the time of their music, but when I saw Gee Voucher's work I was knocked sideways. I was so impressed I bought a T-shirt (picture of the Statue of Liberty covering her eyes, with the strap-line "Oh America") and a poster (a burnt disembodied hand caught on barbed wire with the headline "Your Country Needs You"). At the time, I was lucky enough to actually meet Gee Voucher and I was overjoyed at how personable and genuinely lovely and friendly ze is. Indeed, all of the artists at 'Santa's Ghetto' (e.g. Mode 2, Joe Rush, Insect, etc) were thoroughly decent and intelligent souls. I was very glad to meet all of them and learn from their experiences/wisdom.

(Note; in case anyone gets confused about the appearance, disappearance, and reappearance of this post: I posted this post a few days ago, then (fearing I might be coming across as a name-dropping wanker) I had it deleted. However, a fellow member has since assured me that the post wasn't as bad as I thought, so I've reposted it today.)
 
 
Our Lady Has Left the Building
19:05 / 22.10.05
BBC2, Thursday 27th October, 7:00, The Culture Show 'has an encounter with the artist Banksy' whatever that will turn out to mean. (Repeated on Saturday)
 
 
c0nstant
12:49 / 03.12.05
I didn't see the point of starting a whole new thread on banksy when this one was still on the front page, so...

Has anyone read his new book, Wall and Piece? I picked it up the other day, and I have to say I'm rather dissapointed. It's mostly stuff that has been printed in his previous two books with a few new bits of writing and a little bit of new graf. Still its large format and hardback, which is nice I guess.

Actually maybe this IS on-topic, I'd say that reprinting material he's already released just to make a buck is kinda selling out...
 
 
paranoidwriter waves hello
15:08 / 03.12.05
You may have a point there. But then, I've only seen the cover through a bookshop window, and not looked inside. I'd imagined the book was a kind of compendium of Banksy's work; a nicer, larger book on better quality paper, with larger images (etc). The previous books were, though (I thought) a nice format, perhaps a little small to appreciate some of the images. i.e. imagine a pocket book of an artist's work whom you admire and compare it to a much larger, more coffee-table friendly size. So, is this really selling out, or maybe responding to the needs of those who would prefer a larger format?

Are there no new notable works inside?

(Oh, and BTW this years Santa's Ghetto is opening on Berwick Street [I think] this week. My tip: check out Polly Morgan's work.)
 
 
paranoidwriter waves hello
15:15 / 03.12.05
(Apologies: it opened last Wednesday and runs until Christmas Eve.)
 
 
Our Lady Has Left the Building
16:40 / 03.12.05
I wouldn't say it was a bad thing for Banksy to reprint hir previous books, they can be quite difficult to get hold of. And ze doesn't seem to be surrendering to the mainstream just yet, can't see him on Richard and Judy's sofa in the immediate future.
 
 
c0nstant
11:53 / 04.12.05
new stuff...well, theres a few pics of wildstyle graf on farm animals (as in his exhibition), some really nice stuff that he did on the palestine wall, a nice section about his habit of placing his works in museums and galleries such as the tate, the louvre etc. Oh and a section on street sculpture.

blah, actually there is a fair amount of new work. I suppose I was expecting a book of totally new works, maybe that was unreasonable?
 
 
c0nstant
11:58 / 04.12.05
best quote ( I think):

"Graffiti writers are not real villains. I'm always reminded of this by real villains who consider the idea of breaking in some place, not stealing anything and then leaving behind a painting of your name in four foot high letters the most retarded thing they've ever heard"
 
 
Our Lady Has Left the Building
15:39 / 05.12.05
Well, I got it today so I'll have a look at it, but that new stuff sounds rather like what was in the last lil book, which came out earlier this year.
 
 
c0nstant
03:34 / 06.12.05
you may very well be right. I didn't realise he'd released a third small book (which is unlike me, ususally I keep quite close tabs on people I like), it seems to me that the hardback might just be a collection of all three previous books.

If this is the case, it's still well worth getting. Amazon are currently selling wall and piece for £12, whereas buying all three smaller books would cost £46 (!). Highly recommended if you have none of banksy's previous stuff. Still worth a look though if, like me, you only have one of his books.
 
 
c0nstant
18:27 / 15.12.05
in fact your dead right, on the copyright page it states:

'previously published in part as three small little books'
 
 
Our Lady Has Left the Building
14:06 / 17.12.05
Highly enjoyable, though I don't think it's all three of the small books, I didn't compare and contrast but I thought I remembered stuff that wasn't in this collection. Nice though. One of the pics of the Palestinian Wall has a tall gangly white man with glasses. There was a website that claimed this was Banksy, don't know if that was true or not.
 
 
Tryphena Absent
21:08 / 21.12.05
I'm still pretending that Banksy is a collective. I like it best that way.
 
 
· N · E · T ·
06:50 / 23.12.05
I think it's possible Banksy is a collective, I spotted one in a Bangkok market recently: a suit selling cellphones like balloons. Anyone familiar? Has this thing been chillin there for years?

Unfortunately, some Thai cops gave me their eyes before I could get a proper shot, but would post it in all it's grainy glory on request.

Could be a fake I suppose, seems witty enough to have been authentic though.

Helping out Blur with or without being compensated for it really deserves "sellout whore-slut?" What happens if ze just likes Blur and wants to promote something ze feels is worthwhile?

I vote no pending further evidence. . .
 
 
elene
11:24 / 23.12.05
Oh, I see .. really good!
 
 
STOATIE LIEKS CHOCOLATE MILK
18:35 / 23.12.05
I think it's possible Banksy is a collective, I spotted one in a Bangkok market recently: a suit selling cellphones like balloons. Anyone familiar? Has this thing been chillin there for years?

Bear in mind Banksy's never shied away from making some of his stencils available to the public. (Which reminds me- I think I have one somewhere which I've never used).
 
 
· N · E · T ·
21:29 / 24.12.05
Bear in mind Banksy's never shied away from making some of his stencils available to the public.

Fucking swote! . . . should have known.
 
 
Tryphena Absent
23:52 / 26.12.05
I'm curious- I took a look at Wall and Piece this weekend and it's divided into very clear sections? Does anyone here have a favourite section and if you do then why?

I love the cows, simply because I love moving graffiti and I thought the cows looked hot like that. Personally if I was a cow and I was looking for a soulmate and I saw a bull with a banksy on it I would so mate with him.

My real favourites are the rats though. 1)I like rodents, 2)they have nice faces, 3)there's something very urban about them and rats really represent London for me (and I love my hometown). I suppose this is because it really sprawls but is incredibly built up despite its size. Rats seem to be an animal with the ability to scale that urbanism despite obvious human disdain for them.
 
 
Keith, like a scientist
03:16 / 11.01.06
what makes the rats chapter is when he captions one of the images with (paraphrase) "i had been doing rats for years when someone said to me 'oh, that's really clever. it's anagram for art.' and I had to pretend I had known that all along."

my copy of this book finally arrived today, and i was really pleased with it. his body of work so far is very impressive in terms of it's sheer daring at times. his social commentary is whimiscal, of course, but also insightful at times. although, more often than not, it is tantamount to a big middle finger to 'the man.'

love the quote on the back cover.
 
 
c0nstant
12:51 / 14.01.06
Bear in mind Banksy's never shied away from making some of his stencils available to the public.

linky?
 
 
Olulabelle
10:43 / 23.01.06
That's true actually, there used to be a downloadable Banksy stencil on the Greenpeace site Saveordelete.com but the site doesn't seem to work now. It looked like this:


(It's the green one on the bottom left.)

This is also referenced by Duncan Cummings on 25th March 2002.

So it was a long time ago, but it proves there is at least one example of Banksy making his stencils publicly available.
 
  

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