Subcultural engagement for the 21st Century...
Barbelith is a new kind of community (find out more)...
You can login or register.

Underground > Head Shop >

Wisdom of the Ages!

19:05 / 27.12.01

So my ex-boss very well-meaningly gave me this cheesy Wayne Dyer self-help book called Wisdom of the Ages: 60 Days to Enlightenment as a goodbye present. Each chapter --there are sixty, of course-- is headed with a quotation from some famous wise person, followed by an essay. You're supposed to read one essay per day, and in 60 days voila!

Well anyway, I thought I'd give it a try, in my own way, as a small tribute to a genuinely nice person.

I'm only going to read one chapter a week, so it's going to take me a year-plus to get properly enlightened; so it goes.

And then I thought I'd also post the quotations here, because Wayne Dyer's not exactly Virgil to my mind. I'd rather see what Barbelith makes of these little bits of wisdom, so-called. Would like the conversation to find its own shape, so I'll leave it at that.

19:09 / 27.12.01

1. Meditation

quote:Learn to be silent.
Let your
quiet mind
listen and absorb.--Pythagoras

quote:All man's miseries derive from not being able to sit quietly in a room alone.--Blaise Pascal

20:16 / 27.12.01

The quotes are not an actual invitation to conversation are they?

Here is my silence

"

"

02:05 / 28.12.01

Cant be quiet...too busy laughing due to Jawbones response.

Im hoping the essays are better than the quotes...cause it doesnt look like he's gonna be giving any info that would be new/interesting to anyone who has even the slightest knowledge in the 'wisdom' fields.

So are the essays worth the price of admission?

02:43 / 28.12.01

The first quote sounds like decent advice to me, but pretty much stands alone.

The second quote is obviously false, since some of the unhappiest people I know are the ones who have nothing to do but sit quietly in a room, alone.

I see more wisdom in your post, Persephone, than in the quotations.
here:
quote:Well anyway, I thought I'd give it a try, in my own way, as a small tribute to a genuinely nice person.

11:10 / 28.12.01

Digression:

When I was young and irresponsible, I used to love using quotes from favorite authors/musicians as epigrams for chapters/stories etc.

Now I find this habit, especially when practiced by acclaimed authors, tedious in the extreme. If you have to appeal to the authority of Pythagoras or Spinoza or Robert Anton Wilson or Stephen Malkmus or somebody in order to make your point, your point probably isn't all that coherent. Don't reference your favorite author or what someone else wrote in an op-ed and expect that to stand without argument or back up. for instance, all the Chomsky -quoting numbskulls who think that a quote from him or Edward Said on a matter is an argument ender. Don't do it, man.

11:48 / 28.12.01

quote:Originally posted by kegboy:
So are the essays worth the price of admission?

No.

I mean, I've only read the one.

Though I did learn that Pascal invented the syringe.

[ 28-12-2001: Message edited by: Persephone ]

20:43 / 30.12.01

quote:Originally posted by kegboy:
Im hoping the essays are better than the quotes...cause it doesnt look like he's gonna be giving any info that would be new/interesting to anyone who has even the slightest knowledge in the 'wisdom' fields.

"The savage who thinks nothing of tossing off such a trifle as a tale of the sun and moon being the halves of a baby chopped in two, or dropping into small-talk about a colossal cosmic cow milked to make the rain, merely in order to be sociable, will then retire to secret caverns sealed against women and white men, temples of terrible initiation where to the thunder of the bull-roarer and the dripping of sacrificial blood, the priest whispers the final secrets, known only to the initiate: that honesty is the best policy, that a little kindness does nobody any harm, that all men are brothers..."

The Everlasting Man, by G K Chesterton.

Sorry... what was it you were saying about people using quotes to back up their points?

01:42 / 31.12.01

"Boredom is the dream bird that hatches the egg of experience."

--Walter Benjamin, who also said: "Quotations in my works are like robbers by the roadside who make an armed attack and relieve an idler of his convictions," and whose goal it was to write an essay composed entirely of quotations, and who I've been reading these last few days, and if anyone can explain the dream-bird quotation (especially if you happen to be both capable of finding and translating the original German and, clearly, more than a little bored) in a way that doesn't destroy its beauty for me I'd appreciate it . . .

12:02 / 03.01.02

2. Knowing

quote:Do not believe what you have heard.
Do not believe in tradition because it is handed down many generations.
Do not believe in anything that has been spoken of many times.
Do not believe because the written statements come from some old sage.
Do not believe in conjecture.
Do not believe in authority or teachers or elders.
But after careful observation and analysis, when it agrees with reason and it will benefit one and all, then accept it and live by it. --Buddha

First, this shows why Wayne Dyer should not be in charge. Why is this chapter called "Knowing" when the quote is about "Believing"?

There’s already been a lot of interesting stuff said about belief in Ellis’s “respecting other peoples beliefs” thread, which I can’t find at the moment...

I agree with the assertion that *some* belief is necessary and good, but not with what the Buddha (supposedly) says should be the basis for belief: observation? analysis? reason? Benefitting one and ALL?

According to my dictionary, belief implies mental acceptance of something as true, even though absolute certainty may be absent.

15:30 / 03.01.02

quote:Originally posted by Persephone:
[b]I agree with the assertion that *some* belief is necessary and good, but not with what the Buddha (supposedly) says should be the basis for belief: observation? analysis? reason? Benefitting one and ALL?

I can see some potential arguments against the last condition, (and more in favor of it), but what's wrong with the other conditions, Persephone? They sound pretty damned good to me, and I understand why you would want us to abandon these methods. What would you have us do?

17:18 / 03.01.02

I don't know...

Corrupting Shakespeare and Tom Stoppard respectively, the two things that come into my mind to say are "Et tu, Buddhe?" and "Rationalism! Is that all you have to offer me?"

It's not that I think reason is useless. I may be taking reason for granted, even.

I mean... reason is what, that it should be *the* basis for belief? I always go back to the medieval idea that beasts have instinct, man has reason, and angels have understanding. But even if reason is the bread and butter, I believe man has slivers of instinct and even understanding; and lately I'm more interested in those.

What things do you actually believe in, and do you know why? Capital punishment? Affirmative action? Reincarnation? That the earth is round, not flat?

Or, for that matter, do you believe that you know anything? (I mean, I do... I know how to cook an egg, etc.)

18:11 / 03.01.02

Sorry about this if that was supposed to be rhetorical:

I believe I know things, yes.

I either do or don't believe in reincarnation depending on a number of details.

My moral system claims to be all-encompassing, has a fairly simple basis, and can both support and oppose actions that are seemingly the exact same action. It's intended goal is not the happieness of all mankind, but the greatest degree of love in your heart. It probably states the ideal as opposed to affirmative action and opposed to capital punishment, but the ideal isn't necessarily what it supports now.

As far as instinct is concerned, we do know that muchg of instinct is very useful. But we know this by observing it, and analyzing our observations.

How do we even know there is such a thing as instinct? We observed.

For me, observation isn't the basis for everything, but experience is. "Observation" implies there's something to be observed, and therefore cannot be fundamental. Experience might impoly an experiencer, but I wave my hand at that and hope people ignore it until I can figure out an answer.

22:12 / 03.01.02

Well no, I almost never ask rhetorical questions. That's not something that you would have known, though.

I am always going to be more interested in a laundry list of what people cop to believing, than in an abstract about belief. If I had to choose.

11:51 / 10.01.02

Hey, this one's not bad...

<grins>

Though I feel somewhat like a hostess stuck with a tray of unpopular hors d'oeuvres. Fifty-seven more to go!

3. Leadership

quote:True leaders
are hardly known to their followers.
Next after them are the leaders
the people know and admire;
after them, those they fear;
after them, those they despise.

To give no trust
is to get no trust.

When the work's done right,
with no fuss or boasting,
ordinary people say,
"Oh, we did it." --Lao-Tzu

I had first-hand experience with a *bad* leader for the show I did last year, and reading this is like bing! bing! bing!