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Cocaine

 
  

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CorvusB
18:40 / 31.10.01
Okay, here's the deal: Once again I have a hair up my ass about my circle of friends doing coke. I'm very much on the fence about the whole affair. It really concerns me (being one of the big three drugs I will not do), but I also worry that I may be inordinately concerned and I should just calm down. I need to get an objective opinion, but I don't know where to find one or how I would recognize one if I did find it. So once again, I turn to the penetrating insight of the Barbelithers (espcially Ganesh if he has a take on this).

1) What do you personally think of cocaine?
2) Do you know of any on-line resources for intelligent opinions about this sort of thing?
 
 
Frances Farmer
19:09 / 31.10.01
There's always Erowid.
 
 
SMS
01:10 / 01.11.01
Cocaine is especially dangerous for women. The way this works is that women process things in different parts of their brain from men. Cocaine (and other drugs) can apparently do some really horrible things, that I'm afraid I don't remember, right now. This was coming from some big-shot doctor, so I take it as pretty legitimate, but, at the same time, I don't remember enough of the facts to really present them here.

I don't have anyone close to me who takes cocaine, nor have any of my family members had problems specifically with it. From what I hear, people can be weekend users. Once they have it, they use it all. But it is very addictive for some people, or for people who use it often.

Cocaine is an expensive habit, and this is one of the things that makes it so dangerous. If you DO become addicted, it's going to be hard to fund.

Quite frankly, I'm concerned about your friends' motivations for taking the drug, as well. The benefit of cocaine seems to be little more than a buz, and the cost is quite high. Despite all the talk about everybody fighting for hir own survival, people very often act to harm themselves. I know I have, although I've never used drugs to this effect.
 
 
Hush
05:19 / 01.11.01
I've never really enjoyed cocaine but have friends who do. There use is limited to parties and is essentially social. I sometimes take a bit at parties to keep up, but prefer quality speed, anyday.

Like all drugs, being among those who take when you do not makes them seem very dull. In this case monomaniac and obsessively dull.

I've never known anyone have problems with cocaine, though. (If problems represent long term personality changes, addictive behaviour, using it outside a recreational context, spending more than you can afford, alienating people) my guess is it takes repeated and regular use to do this.

The key issue's are these:-
do not take a drug to stop you feeling bad because you've taken that drug.
if you're friends are exhibiting fucked up behaviour avoid them until they are not.

Sorry if that's a bit harsh. I love drugs, hate abusers. Overall I would say address the relationship, not the drug use.
 
 
Regrettable Juvenilia
05:19 / 01.11.01
quote:Originally posted by All-Loving SMatthewStolte:
Cocaine is especially dangerous for women.


The poor fragile dears also shouldn't drink - they can't handle it, you know...

But seriously, cocaine can be fun. It's morally indefensible, but then so are a lot of the things we consume legitimately. On the couple of occasions when I've taken it in reasonably large quantities, I found it pretty unrewarding. It's not my "drug of choice" (man), but sadly because my drug of choice is alcohol, if someone I'm out with has some cocaine, doing a line or two always seems like a great idea.

It depends how much your friends are doing, really, and how often - once a week, once a month? More often? Less?
 
 
cusm
13:18 / 01.11.01
The big problem with coke is that its such a short ride. You get a pretty impressive rush, are up for about 20 minutes, then crash and start looking for more. Its a high maintenance drug, rather like smoking cigarettes. Indeed, that is much the problem with its additcing factors, one can start doing lines at about the frequency one might have a smoke.

Chemicly, it prevents reuptake of seratonin, dopamine, and adrenalin. The last being the one that hurts the most, as maintaining high levels of adrenalin can really wrack your body when its all done with, not to mention the heart.

If you've enough of a head to limit yourself, it can be used responsibly. However, as far as drugs go, coke is one of the more difficult to keep a sane handle on. Hence, its tendency towards abuse. One can quickly get carried away, and finding themselves defending their habit agressively. That's the problem with mixing adrenelin with euphoria.

Its not for everyone, but it won't turn you into a drooling degenerate junkie with one dose, either. One can use it socially and even binge on occasion without adverse effects to their life. It just requires a little self monitoring.

Its really not as exciting as it sounds. The buzz is fun, granted, but its not all that. Its a good icing to an already good time, not necessarially a good time in and of itself. Riddalin will give you much of the same effects without the body crash, and it lasts for hours. As far as drugs go, there's just no beating good clean speed
 
 
The Natural Way
13:42 / 01.11.01
With all due respect, I think a lot of the drama surrounding coke is a bit of a hangover from the eighties "just say no!" campaign, or somethinglikethat. Pretty much everyone I know does it occassionaly, and while I respect the decision to refrain (my twin brother doesn't really dig on it) I think it's a little annoying when people start taking some moral high ground about it, or get unduly concerned.... if yr careful, as with most drugs, there shouldn't be too much of a problem.

(He says; clad in his Brett Easton Ellis, American Psycho-style lifestyle, snorting, fucking and doingdealsafterlunch....Hmmm...maybe doing cocaine isn't such a good idea after all)
 
 
No star here laces
14:35 / 01.11.01
Er right.

Promised I wouldn't reply to this thread, but crap is being talked.

1.) Coke is dangerous to women.

Whatever. Any neurological differences there are between the genders do not involve radically different neurotransmitter systems of so this is highly unlikely. Plus I know tons of women who do it all the time to no noticable ill effect.

2.) Coke is highly addictive.

Common myth. If you rank substances on their propensity to cause addiction and abuse coke comes waaaay below cigarettes and alcohol. Freebase coke (i.e. crack) is extremely addictive, but the experience is very different. And incidentally, all you speed users, crystal meth is far more addictive than coke.

3.) Coke fucks you up.

One of the main reasons coke is so popular among the relatively affluent weekend users is precisely because the ill-effects are so limited. You don't feel all that bad in the morning, it doesn't fuck up your temperature regulation like pills do and it doesn't screw your heart and teeth the way speed can. And sex actually gets better as opposed to impossible.

In general, coke is a relatively painless drug. It's good fun and a reasonably controllable experience. Just cos the guys in gangster movies always end up addicted doesn't mean you're on course to do a Tony Montana as soon as you start hitting the odd stripe, just like acid doesn't make you think you can fly and turn you psychotic.

Prize for most idiotic comment in the thread clearly goes to this:

quote:The benefit of cocaine seems to be little more than a buz, and the cost is quite high.

Never mind mate, I understand vitamin supplements have many health benefits, and they're quite cheap...
 
 
netbanshee
14:49 / 01.11.01
...actually have bumped into it a little bit lately and have had a good time but I still reserve a bit of caution...like I would with all drugs. Funny enough, it used to make me nervous as hell to be around but after giving it some time and knowing people who use it occassionally having no problems with it, it doesn't come across anything like the general public would let you think... Anyway, I think other drugs out there are better, cheaper...
 
 
ONLY NICE THINGS
15:01 / 01.11.01
You know, I cannot think of any reason why the eternal battle of "Coke goooood! Coke baaaad!" should be being played out in the Head Shop.

Then again, I have just smoked a big bowl of crack, so I'm a bit non-linear...
 
 
No star here laces
15:03 / 01.11.01
Nanny Haus, get thee to the flame warrior thread.
 
 
Ganesh
15:09 / 01.11.01
Cocaine's one drug of which I have virtually no experience, either first or second-hand: never tried it meself, and relatively few of my (generally lower SE class Edinburgh) patients have ever admitted to using it. I know from theory that it's not especially addictive (compared to, say, heroin, nicotine, benzodiazepines) and I've never heard the 'dangerous to women' thing at all, and strongly suspect it's bollocks.

Like to try it at some point myself, but suspect I'd become a monster...
 
 
w1rebaby
17:49 / 01.11.01
I've had some in a spliff, but that's the limit, and that's probably not a representative experience. Generally the price and short up-time put me off. Speed is considerably better value.

From observation I can say that I don't know anyone who's been improved by taking coke... most people seem to turn into arrogant arseholes. That's not a desperately well-informed observation though, because I don't know a lot of people who do coke (when I'm with them at least).

So basically what I'm saying is - I know very little but I'm telling you it anyway.
 
 
The Natural Way
18:12 / 01.11.01
Yes, but I know fuck all people who're "improved" by alcohol, or speed, or E...

The trick is to have friends who take coke and have parties. Then you get it for free.

Which is nice, 'cause it's hard to overdo someone else's stash. They won't let you.
 
 
Fiction Suit Five
19:33 / 01.11.01
Never buy coke, sho' nuff, steal other people's. Crap drug for city boys. Stick to 'shrooms (free) and pills (cheap). And don't worry about what your friends are doing; it's their choice. But don't lend them any money.
 
 
Tuna Ghost: Pratt knot hero
23:09 / 01.11.01
I tried coke once. It was great. I loved it, and still think it's the greatest drug ever. But I'm never gonna do it again. One of my good friends got addicted in highschool, and it was a long hard deal to get to rehab and finally quit.
 
 
.
23:09 / 01.11.01
quote:Originally posted by Luke Wing:
Like all drugs, being among those who take when you do not makes them seem very dull. In this case monomaniac and obsessively dull.


And thats the problem with coke in a nutshell. The things that i enjoy most about drugs are the social elements, and in an E crowd especially there is a strong interest in others (some people even think of this as empathy, not sure i'd go that far), which is often killed stone dead as someone decides to end the night with the coke. The atmosphere can change quite dramatically, that lovely feeling of "connection to others" (whatever you want to call it) is lost. but then again, maybe my criticism here is merely to not be with cokeheads on an E.

Some other issues concerning coke:
A general trend seems to be people thinking that coke is somehow a more "adult" or "mature" experience to that of pills, why is this?

and then there's the whole CKone thing (thats coke and ketamine), who knows how thats going to end up?

if there is such a thing, is coke more a "gateway drug" than others, the logical progression leading onto crack?
 
 
SMS
23:09 / 01.11.01
quote:Originally posted by Tyrone Mushylaces:
...
1.) Coke is dangerous to women.

Whatever. Any neurological differences there are between the genders do not involve radically different neurotransmitter systems of so this is highly unlikely. Plus I know tons of women who do it all the time to no noticable ill effect.

I'm sure this is true. I'm getting my information from some big-shot Doctor Dubowski who does research on this kind of thing. He could be wrong, of course. I put less faith in doctors than most of the people I know, but he <<<seemed to know what he was taling about,>>> the explanation he gave <<<sounded>>> right, whatever that means. I would hope that any women considering using cocaine, however, would do some research in this particular area before actually taking any. At the very least, figure out why this rumour has been so successful, so it can be easily discounted.

quote:2.) Coke is highly addictive.


I don't think anyone has said this. I did say that it's quite addictive for some people, but never intended to say it is for all or even most.

quote:Prize for most idiotic comment in the thread clearly goes to this:

"The benefit of cocaine seems to be little more than a buz, and the cost is quite high."

Never mind mate, I understand vitamin supplements have many health benefits, and they're quite cheap...


I'm surprised this made you angry rather than my statement "Quite frankly, I'm concerned about your friends' motivations for taking the drug, as well," because how the hell could I know what someone else's motivations are. But doesn't a 45 minute buzz cost something like $100? To me, that sounds like a lousy deal, and we wouldn't pay something like that if it were LEGAL (or maybe we would. I don't know the history behind it). If I were one of your friends doing coke, you should be worried, but I never meant to imply it wasn't possible that they want different things than I do. If I had a hundred bucks to spend on drugs, I can think of a dozen more things to buy than coke.

Thanks for the advise on the vitamins, though. Are there any in particular you'd recommend or should I just take a multivitamin?


quote: Origianlly posted by young runt ...start taking some moral high ground about it, or get unduly concerned....

Hope I didn't sound like I was saying people who use cocaine are evil people. I may be too concerned, of course, but I'm not condemning anyone here.

[ 02-11-2001: Message edited by: All-Loving SMatthewStolte ]
 
 
Regrettable Juvenilia
10:02 / 02.11.01
quote:Originally posted by All-Loving SMatthewStolte:
At the very least, figure out why this rumour has been so successful, so it can be easily discounted.


For the same reason that 'Tonight With Trevor Macdonald' had am edition devoted to the pressing issue of "women are drinking: should we stop them?".
 
 
The Return Of Rothkoid
10:38 / 02.11.01
I don't know how relevant it is, but for some reason, coke freaks me out more than the thought of other drugs do. Government marketing? Work experience? Not sure, but that's how it is. Odd.

[ 02-11-2001: Message edited by: Rothkoid ]
 
 
Ganesh
17:08 / 02.11.01
"Brain Fever: The Dangers of Women Reading Books..."
 
 
CorvusB
18:23 / 02.11.01
quote:Originally posted by Rothkoid:
I don't know how relevant it is, but for some reason, coke freaks me out more than the thought of other drugs do. Government marketing? Work experience? Not sure, but that's how it is. Odd.

[ 02-11-2001: Message edited by: Rothkoid ]


It's more relevant than you think. It's that sort of knee jerk wariness that is causing me such confusion. It's exactly why I started this thread. I can't tell you why coke upsets me so much, why so much more than any other hard drug does. Is this just Reaganite indoctrination?
 
 
cusm
18:59 / 02.11.01
quote:Originally posted by CorvusB:
Is this just Reaganite indoctrination?


I'll tell you what, Nancy Reagan had me convinced growing up that coke would not only instantly enslave you, but it would damage your brain, ruin your life, and possibly even kill you at any time. When I finally tried it for myself, I was quite dissapointed. Its good and all, but not anything like it was made out to be. After that, I'm just not impressed. I've had meth, MDMA and various derivitives, speed and psychedelics of all sorts. As far as drugs go, coke is rather simple and straightforward. I classify it closer to weed than to heroin. It in fact is far less damaging to your brain than pills ever are. Coke just wrings you out. E will actually do some damage to your cognitive abilities.

I personally found its ease of use one of the major factors in its addictiveness. Because its not such a big deal, one might be tempted to take it too far, just as one might with booze or weed. It does require some safety gloves, as it is harder of a drug, but used responsibly it is no worse than anything else you've probably already done to yourself. Liquor will kill you just as quick, if not faster.

I say, try it for yourself before you make an opinion. Fuck Nancy Reagan, think for yourself. If its not physically addictive, proven to be damaging or have long lasting effects on you, or more strenous to your body than you think you can take, its probably safe enough to experiment with. Just keep your head on, don't mix, and look it up in Erowid first. Sure, it might kill you, but only if you're stupid with it.
 
 
netbanshee
23:24 / 02.11.01
...hey Corvus...I was pretty much in the same camp as you up till just recently. I mean...I thought Coke was supposed to be "the path to the Devil" but the more real contact I had with it, the less I thought of it. It still gives me the same tick occassionally, but it was kind of that way with synthetics for me a few years ago too.

One thing the new awareness has done to me though is wonder why I should do any drugs at all. Sort of like getting bored with it. Of course, the anxiety level during my general days of sobriety sets in quite often for me and a nice kick in the pants by a substance has been known to break the spell. It's like tug of war but morality and any previous notions haven't been in the picture for quite a while now.
 
 
M.
22:28 / 04.11.01
Coke's OK, not really my personal thing but I dig it in the right situations (in the parking lot of a sleezy metal show off the back of a leather clad womans motercycle). I have also NEVER known anyone to develop a personal problems with it, though I'm sure this is due in part to the fact that none of my friends can afford it regularly. It would be much more distressing, I think, to know your friends where getting into something like crank, a drug which I've seen turn people into walking ghosts. But coke is much easier to treat like a casual experience akin to weed.
 
 
Cherry Bomb
14:43 / 05.11.01
I vowed to never ever do it but never say never. Recently I did try it. I kind of had the same Nancy Reagan brainwashing going on in my head, but once I tried it I saw it was not the big deal I was all afraid it would be.

And really, if you're going to try it, it should definitely be in the rock star setting I was in at that time: 2:30 in the morning, speeding around Chicago in a brand new bitchen' Camaro, blasting Queens of the Stone Age "Feel Good Hit of the Summer," on the way to a nameless club, a few lines off the toilet, free drinks followed by Ren & Stimpy.

Still though, I'm a little more fond of a good glass of Shiraz and a Wintson Light. Glad I know what the fuss is about though.

I don't know anyone who's addicted - though I do have a friend who missed a roundof good holiday parties because he was spending the entire weekend locked in his bedroom doing a giant bag of coke and wanking.

That was two years ago, and he seems fine.
 
 
The Return Of Rothkoid
15:19 / 05.11.01
quote:Originally posted by CorvusB:
Is this just Reaganite indoctrination?
Well, not living under Reagan, particularly, I don't think it is. In my case, anyway. I think mine's borne out of seeing people at work act a bit scarily after taking huge whacks of it. Then again, one of the people in question was also very drunk, and was on Prozac at the time, too, so that might have had something to do with it, also...
 
 
cusm
18:59 / 05.11.01
quote:Originally posted by M.:
Coke's OK, not really my personal thing but I dig it in the right situations (in the parking lot of a sleezy metal show off the back of a leather clad womans motercycle).


Yea! That's how you do it

Seriously though, coke does evoke certain lifestyle images, just as weed does for hippies and burnouts. I enjoy that sort of thing, just for the sheer fun of it, but it may be a part of what makes people fear it. I mean, if you take away the guns, movie stars, gangsters and rock stars, its just some speed. But the culture it represents is an altogether different drug on its own.
 
 
grant
16:10 / 07.11.01
quote:Originally posted by Tyrone Mushylaces:
Er right.

Promised I wouldn't reply to this thread, but crap is being talked.

1.) Coke is dangerous to women.

Whatever. Any neurological differences there are between the genders do not involve radically different neurotransmitter systems of so this is highly unlikely. Plus I know tons of women who do it all the time to no noticable ill effect.


Actually, Harvard researchers just did a study on this very thing!

quote:Though estrogen is produced during a woman's luteal phase, its protective effects appear to be mitigated by the progesterone that is also produced.

Yet even during the luteal phase, estrogen may bestow a benefit. In a previous study, the researchers found that cocaine produced a 20 percent reduction in blood flow in men, compared with the 10 percent drop that luteal phase women displayed. "If we had studied more people this might have turned out to be a significant difference," he said.

Although the researchers did not look for actual brain damage in these studies, chronic cocaine users are known to have higher rates of stroke and silent ischemic attacks than non-abusers. In addition, cocaine's squeezing off of the blood supply has been shown to produce subtler kinds of damage, such as changes in electrical activity. "Most of the brain damage that is associated with cocaine is extremely subtle--you don’t find it unless you’re really out hunting for it," says Kaufman.

He believes that by preventing such damage, estrogen could provide a much-needed adjunct to existing drug-rehabilitation therapies, many of which are plagued by high drop-out rates. "Most treatment is designed to get people to stop using drugs," Kaufman says. While engaged in such programs, people often continue to use cocaine, which leads to more brain dysfunction and, in turn, to cognitive and emotional deficits that can impair a person's ability to maintain jobs and relationships—and ultimately their therapy program.

"One thing we are learning is that relationships, jobs, and environmental factors are critically important in influencing the outcome of drug treatment," Kaufman said. "So if we can give something that helps people work better in their environment by protecting their brains and their ability to think, behave, and hold a job, that should improve outcomes as opposed to what we’re seeing now."

The prospect that estrogen—long known for its role in female sexual development—might be enlisted in the war on drugs is not a complete surprise. Researchers have known for some time that chronic cocaine abusing women generally experience fewer disruptions in cerebral blood flow and less neuronal loss in the frontal areas of their brains than men with comparable cocaine use histories. But what gave women the advantage was unclear.


So, there is a gender-based difference - but it favors the fairer sex. Go figure.
 
 
Devin 1984
18:38 / 09.11.01
I've tried most every drug, and Coke is awesome at the time, but man, it is not worth it.

A- Could give you a heart attack.
B- Addictive and expensive.
C- Makes some people violent.

Most coke heads I know are yuppies or muscle heads.

Stick to the psychedelics.

devin

www.harplander.com
 
 
Rage
09:55 / 10.11.01
I never saw the big deal with it.
 
 
Tryphena Absent
09:55 / 10.11.01
Coke's OK... I know a coke addict and she's lovely and sweet - good at being sociable if she wants to talk to you but actually a lot of the time she prefers to talk to people she doesn't particularly like who make her feel insecure like her boyfriend's ex. Hmmm?

She has a slight problem... she's about to be kicked out of home because her parents have found out. Her bank account's overdrawn already so god knows where she's going to live or how she'll support her addiction.
Basically, know this, coke is extremely addictive and it's best not to do too much of it unless you're earning.

On a personal level the only stuff I really don't touch is k and smack (I think I just left something out...) because they scare the fuck out of me.
 
 
yawn - thing's buddy
17:59 / 10.11.01
in my experience, it goes like this:

most rewarding drug experience at top, least rewarding at bottom.

very high quality cannabis resin
good quality grass (n.lights, skunk etc)
mushrooms (liberty cap)
lsd
=high quality speed, ecstacy
coke
booze

'rewarding' means:

enhanced visual and aural perception, pleasant alterations in sexual experience, increased enjoyment of social interaction, greater ability in annihilating opposites

thank you.
 
 
Torquemada
15:35 / 13.10.02
Coke is good, but not the best.

Bloody expensive. Allows you to drink A LOT more.

It also tops our charts as the best sex drug. You could give it to an Enid Blyton character and she'd be doing red-hot-dutch within the hour (so to speak). I've seen this effect happen to quite a few women (and a few men). Also lets you do quite an good impression of a kango digger. For hours.

Plus, of course, it's also the symbol of ultimate indulgence - you know, it's nice to do a line of cocaine, but it's nicer to do a line of cocaine from a ladies' cleavage whilst drinking champagne ...(etc. etc.)

Downside=in the first hour after snorting, you are forty times more likely to have a heart attack (think I read that on New Scientist). So there ya go - the price of indulgence.
 
 
Scrambled Password Bogus Email
19:22 / 13.10.02
I bloody love it.

The gateway to cocaine use is undoubtedly alcohol. I would rarely do coke sober (what's that? You got some? Oh, fuck it then, let's 'ave a line...;-)), but after a mild skinful with a few mates, as closing time approaches (bear in mind in the UK the pubs close at 11 o'poxy'clock), there is nothing better than grabbing a few take outs and getting a gram or three.

Yes, utter bollocks get discussed fervently. Yes, the most interesting thing slowly but surely becomes the next line. Yes, it leaves no noticeable spiritual reward whatsoever, and is the most forgettable drug experience after Rohypnol. For an illegal substance, it has absolutely no...well, SUBSTANCE.

But there is no better drunk experience than being utterly shitfaced, scoring, hoofing up the first fatty and being instantly, sparklingly, air conditioned in the brain again.

Only to go right on drinking until one is shitfaced again 'cos the chaz has run out.

That, allegedly, is what really tipped the scales for poor old Ozzy. It wasn't so much the choom as the volume of alcohol consumed BECAUSE of the choom.

Allegedly.

Peace to all and sundry, and don't worry if your mates are doing coke. If they start rocking up, that's when you can worry!

:-D
 
  

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