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What does Grant Morrison expect Barbelith to evolve into?

 
  

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Jack Denfeld
05:54 / 22.12.02
I read the great interview Yawn did with Grant Morrison. They briefly touch on Barbelith. Grant says he reads it from time to time, but he thought it would have evolved by now. Something along the lines that someone will have an interesting idea, that will be immediately shot down and criticized instead of helped along. But I'm not quite sure what Grant means by Barbelith taking a step forward. Any ideas?

P.S. Please don't move this to the comic thread.
 
 
Seth
08:32 / 22.12.02
A pterodactyl.
 
 
Our Lady of The Two Towers
09:28 / 22.12.02
that sings.

Or maybe a flying car?
 
 
autopilot disengaged
11:21 / 22.12.02
that's really interesting.

it is true that the various collaborative ventures have usually either arrived stillborn or died shortly afterwards.

speaking personally, i've gotten a lot of support for my offsite projects from particular barbies - which has extanded to political stuff up to and involving protesting in the motherloving streets - i've learnt a lot, i've had plenty preconceptions challenged and sometimes righteously modified...

but group action stemming from the board is pretty rare - fond memories of a few of us invading tactically-selected chat rooms around the time the bombs fell on afghanistan, like to think we gave some reactionaries pause for thought...

for a while i pushed to develop some kind of more organized feedback group over in the Creation - response was generally so underwhelming i stopped trying in the end. it's a shame, 'cause genuine peers are few and far between.

one interesting thing, thinking about evolution, is the way in which barbelith's actually structured somewhat similarly to modern terrorist/activist groups - a general hub with local cells, each of which are capable of co-ordinating or acting autonomously.
 
 
autopilot disengaged
11:23 / 22.12.02
i was also gutted when my 'make-up for boys' thread scored less than ten replies. if the revolution ain't gonna be glam - count. me. out.
 
 
sleazenation
13:10 / 22.12.02
it is true that the various collaborative ventures have usually either arrived stillborn or died shortly afterwards.

Speak for yourself autopilot, but I've seen quite a few things that have appeared on barbelith evolve way beyond their original peramiters, people who post here have produced music, comic strips and anthologies, a fair few novels of varying degrees of awfulness (hey the point of NANOWRIMO isn't to produce great novels...) Jenny Everywhere, various bits of magik stuff and various bits of political activism. Your own Anti war blog and other stuff is part of this. yeah some ideas don't quite meet the reception anticipated by the authors- see the comics dogme thread, but that's not necessarily a bad thing.

This isn't a criticism of what you do, or don't do but I do find it a source of concern that many people seem to expect something out of barbelith.

Barbelith doesn't make anything. You do.
 
 
The Strobe
13:58 / 22.12.02
What does Grant Morrison expect Barbelith to evolve into?

Answer a question with a question: does he care?

This is not his place. This is a place people who liked his work started and this is what it became. He's a seed. He's not an owner.
 
 
The Strobe
13:59 / 22.12.02
A more interesting question, though possibly as pointless:

What does Tom Coates expect Barbelith to evolve into?

Though I really think evolve is a bad word. In this case.
 
 
w1rebaby
14:13 / 22.12.02
autopilot:

one interesting thing, thinking about evolution, is the way in which barbelith's actually structured somewhat similarly to modern terrorist/activist groups - a general hub with local cells, each of which are capable of co-ordinating or acting autonomously.

...or at least it should be. With cells going down to one member.

I think sometimes there's too much emphasis on Barbelith being one entity to which we all belong and express ourselves through, leading perhaps to all the bitching about cliques etc.

I have no idea whether Grant Morrison thinks this, but the question doesn't really bother me anyway.
 
 
Slim
15:55 / 22.12.02
The most important question is, "Who cares what Grant Morrison thinks about Barbelith?" He admits to only reading threads here occasionally and as far as I know he doesn't post. As far as I'm concerned, his opinion on Barbelith matters oh so very little. I wasn't aware that when I started posting here I was a rat in Morrison's maze.
 
 
Tryphena Absent
15:59 / 22.12.02
What does Grant Morrison think of as an interesting idea? I find this question much more intriguing then his personal views on Barbelith. This place after all is not his and is really only tied in to the Invisibles quite lightly. His website is possibly the most boring that I have encountered in the last four years on the internet, I hate to say it but it's true, I went there the other day because my morbid sense of curiosity (and my inner geek) told me too. I encountered some photos that would be amusing if I knew him and a catalogue of his work, I suppose he isn't in to making a site, fair enough. This place details his work in a way that is much more elaborate and intriguing, probably because it's populated by fans, had I stumbled across it after reading The Invisibles I think my reaction to it would have been much more ridiculous and full of jumping up and downess.

So basically I doubt he finds his own website interesting, this website is about the things he's already written about to a certain extent, this is our bit of discovery not his. What is he interested in now? I don't know and I only want to know a teeny bit.

I suppose Grant Morrison doesn't know what he wants Barbelith to become. I suspect he misses a lot about it if he only takes notice every once in a while and I wonder if he searches for his name when he comes here? Sorry, off track completely. I don't think the question does he care is valid, the question is do we care? Only the part of me that is shallow and wants a celebrity lover cares and I try to ignore it as I think it's very stupid and shouldn't really be there. Down with the celebrity madness!!!
 
 
Our Lady of The Two Towers
16:42 / 22.12.02
I think Slim's pipped me to the post on the most important question but an equally valid question could be; What does Barbelith expect Grant Morrison to evolve into? Thankfully Grant has never acted like he expects the collective to kiss his arse, but the place isn't about him any more, if it ever really was.
 
 
Matthew Fluxington
17:12 / 22.12.02
That's one great thing about Barbelith, in that the place was originally built on Grant's work, but is now so autonomous that we no longer care about his approval, and if he were to actively participate, he'd be treated no better or worse than anyone else. That's certainly a million miles ahead of the drooling sycophants over at the old WEF.

I would think that at this point, Barbelith has its own aesthetic which is different than anything Grant's ever done, or anything else online, and that's the draw.
 
 
iconoplast
17:48 / 22.12.02
Well, I mean - clearly we're all here because we're victims of that stupid sigil bomb Grant built that turned us all into Invisibles so he wouldn't feel lonely anymore.

And now the bastard's gone and sworn off of us.

---

Seriously - there was a fantastic article by Malcolm Gladwell in the New Yorker recently that said that maybe three people, ever, have had original and brilliant ideas alone. All the rest of those brilliant people emerged from groups. And I agree with this - it's hard to get really far out there alone. You need people to talk to and bounce stuff off of.

But I'm not sure Barbelith is real enough. I think if Barbelith were a coffeeshop I would feel a lot more of an identification with it and with the rest of you. The anonymity and distance of the internet makes community hard to achieve. As long as we all want to be, we're members here. But I'm a member of my circle of friends even when I don't want to be, and when I'm sulking and brooding, the fuckers call me and give me advice and generally prove that, whether I like it or not, they care about me.

It's been about a year, now, that I've been lurking about, and I'm still in awe of this place and of many of the posters. But I am starting to recognize the weird boundaries limiting its space. You can't argue your way to a moral necessity without assumptions. And without shared assumptions, we're just sort of... breeding, raising, and training our ideas to fight it out in this weird pokemon petri dish of memetics.

Which, I mean, hell - which is a great hobby. But memetic pokemon trainers don't have the best career prospects off-site.
 
 
mixmage
18:39 / 22.12.02
Hmmm... another good one, Poser of Questions.

At first, I thought you were asking about BARBELiTH, throwing the Magick thread open to the wider fora. But no.

hmmm... the board ain't owned by ol' G. Even if he has dibs on the servitor, the board is a whole other domain. And since you asked...

What do you think, threadstarter?
 
 
The Return Of Rothkoid
21:00 / 22.12.02
For my own part, I think it matters not one whit what GM thinks about it. I didn't come her for him (or for The Invisibles, for that matter) and so it's of little import if he likes it or not. He don't like some of what goes on? Big whoop. I don't like some of his writing. But I think the potential is here, even if it could use a hefty dose of sit-ups to work that intellectual/spiritual rigour set on occasion.

So, in essence, nyaaaah.

More importantly: what do you think Barbelith's turning into? Don't answer; figure it out for yourself and make it happen.
 
 
STOATIE LIEKS CHOCOLATE MILK
00:09 / 23.12.02
What are we all expecting GM to evolve into? Hey? Hey?
 
 
STOATIE LIEKS CHOCOLATE MILK
00:09 / 23.12.02
Bugger. Someone already said that.
 
 
cusm
02:13 / 23.12.02
Even if he has dibs on the servitor...

And even that is highly debateable. The nature of that beast is not to be controlled by one person. Its a public working, the way it was released. Of course, copyright on the name is another matter entirely...
 
 
8===>Q: alyn
06:29 / 23.12.02
Grant who?
 
 
Sax
07:12 / 23.12.02
Grant Lee Buffalo. Didn't you know this was an alt.country fan site?
 
 
gridley
12:24 / 23.12.02
We should evolve into Bizarro Barbelith. It am my worst idea ever!
 
 
The Falcon
13:03 / 23.12.02
We already are.
 
 
Jack Denfeld
16:21 / 23.12.02
I find it interesting that the answer to what Morrison expects this board to evolve into seems to be "Fuck him! We're all grown up!"

I was just curious if anyone had any idea what Morrison thought the board could evolve into. Didn't mean to start any father/son expectation thing.

So I was thinking, Grant's evolved into a comic book writer on a top 10 team book over the years. So maybe he expected Barbelith to evolve into the new monthly writer on the Avengers! Barbelith Assemble!
 
 
The Falcon
04:15 / 24.12.02
Barbelith would never get past Marvel editorial. Or perhaps...

I want Haus to write Punisher. Punisher in Hertfordshire... - "Broken Herts", he could call it. Oh, and Jack Fear on JLA - "yeah, Jack - respect the icons!"

Or not.

Barbelith could probably write Avengers pretty sweet, actually. I like this idea.
 
 
Ganesh
11:03 / 24.12.02
*whispers*

I still say we should glass his cats...
 
 
bio k9
11:34 / 24.12.02
I expect Barbelith to evolve into a really great penis.
 
 
Lionheart
13:58 / 24.12.02
monkey
 
 
Old brown-eye is back
21:10 / 24.12.02
I interviewed Mr Morrison myself about six months ago but as yet have been too lazy to write the fucker up. I too asked him about the board, but until I get back to London and listen to my tape recording of said event I can't say with any certainty how he answered. There was definitely something about people occasionally getting it (and he did mention someone's fiction suit), and also something about how folks should now go on to do their own thing. Yes.
 
 
iconoplast
21:27 / 24.12.02
I've been meaning to ask.

What means it, this 'glassing the cats' of which you speak?
 
 
Old brown-eye is back
21:41 / 24.12.02
As in break a glass over a table and then jam what's left of it into the face of one of his cats. No one here could possibly approve of that, surely.
 
 
mixmage
23:38 / 24.12.02
Rothkoid: noted. seconded. proceeding.
 
 
Bear
23:54 / 24.12.02
Monkey Bears
 
 
The Return Of Rothkoid
04:32 / 25.12.02
Mixmage: true dat.
 
 
Our Lady of The Two Towers
16:44 / 25.12.02
"No Monkey Bears for you Queer Granny!"
 
  

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