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Underground > Policy & Help >

Fuck Topic Abstract

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13:01 / 03.01.03

C'mon now, Haus. Wiping their arses is easy 'cause they're beautiful...

ONLY NICE THINGS

13:02 / 03.01.03

Oh, I like wiping arses. It's the topic summary bit I object to...takes me away from my arsedungeon.

13:39 / 03.01.03

You're a cheeky imp, Mr Haus.

Nietzsch E. Coyote

08:28 / 07.01.03

I must say I don't object to Topic abstracts in themselves. It is the snarky references to the lack of one or "stick to the abstract" sort of thing that really bugs me. There was a point where the comments quite pissed me off. I think rather than include a snark in the middle of a thread that is, in fact, off topic someone who is actually upset could pm the perpetrator, or person who has forgotten in the case of Haus' abstractless thread about abstracts (hilarious). It is my suspision that most people who are making snarky comments don't actually care about the abstract but just want to be snarky.

In review, pm someone, the thread originator or a moderator, if there is no abstract rather that cluttering up a discussion with technical issues.

ONLY NICE THINGS

09:14 / 07.01.03

Coyote actually raises two complaints here, approximately. The first is threadrotty requests telling people they should have put in an abstract. Since only moderators *can* put in a sumamry after a thread has been created, I'd suggest sending the person who started the thread a PM asking them to send a moderator a suggested topic summary, or sending a PM to a moderator drawing their attention to the absence oif a topic abstract, so they can put one in or contact the original poster asking for their thoughts on what the summary should be.

He also mentions "stick to the abstract" requests, however, which is a very different thing, as these are requests to stay *on*-topic, and thus I struggle to see them as inimical to the thread. In a perfect world, perhaps the mod could message everybody in the thread reminding them individually of the topic summary, but I'm not surte that's practicable.

13:04 / 07.01.03

Three or four important keywords might do at a pinch.

I agree. If the intention of the abstract is to provide for thread searching and thread recycling, a group of key words would be the most appropriate abstract. I think a group of well-chosen key words could also be effective in keeping a thread on-topic.

09:51 / 01.02.03

After being away from the board for some time, I came back and posted a topic about magic. I was critiqued by Haus, and part of the critique sounded pretty strange. Something like "No fucking topic abstract".

See, I read it as my post was so abstract, it didn't even count as a topic in Haus' opinion. Then I noticed what it was for, and that it was generally recommended. When I 1st started posting, there was no topic abstract option. I actually wish we'd always had one, as I'd like to see some of my older posts.

The Return Of Rothkoid

21:57 / 03.02.03

Jack - I think you can always go back to your old ones and put them in, should you so desire...

20:00 / 15.03.03

I'm pushing this back up to the top in the hope that people actually read it, as there's been a spate of non-abstract threads appearing in Music (and elsewhere) recently.

To reiterate: Abstracts help keep threads on-track and reduce the likelihood of duplicate threads appearing. If you don't include one, moderators will. If that happens (and, as in the most recent case I've seen, it's entirely unclear from both your thread title and initial post exactly what it is you want to talk about) there's a very good chance that the thread won't cover the ground you want it to.

Each time I have to fill in an abstract for somebody else I'm PM-ing them with this info. So far I've re-written it on each occasion, but from now on it's a generic one, 'cause I'm sick of having to do it.

05:02 / 16.03.03

Topic abstracts: good. Plenty of reasons for this already given.

Requests in-thread to provide topic abstracts: might seem annoying in a thread, but serve a useful purpose overall.

Requests in-thread to "stay on topic" according to the abstract: bad. Unless things are seriously deviating from the stated topic - by which I mean, moving to discussing entirely different points, Buffy rather than Hussein - it seems to me that even being encouraged to start a new thread on something that could be considered a potentially productive diversion, but which might just collapse, is not a good idea. These things should be allowed to be explored.

ONLY NICE THINGS

19:22 / 16.03.03

So, topic abstracts good, using topic abstracts for anytihng other than search requests bad?

I'd say that there is no point in asking people to provide a topic abstract in-thread, because, once again, non-moderators cannot add topic abstracts, even to threads they started.

If somebody is requesting that people go back to the topic abstract, I would suggest it is usually because the thread is in danger of rotting in an unprofitable manner. I can't think offhand of a situation in which what could be seen as a profitable evolution of the question in the topic abstract has been received with a demand that that evolution be quashed and the discussion be returned to the subject bounden by the topic abstract. Do you have any specific examples in mind?

01:43 / 18.03.03

So, topic abstracts good, using topic abstracts for anytihng other than search requests bad?

Pretty much. Also, perhaps, a summary of what the thread-starter's intention was, but if people just put keywords in, I wouldn't complain.

I'd say that there is no point in asking people to provide a topic abstract in-thread, because, once again, non-moderators cannot add topic abstracts, even to threads they started.

Well, the author can provide an abstract to the moderator, who then adds it.

If somebody is requesting that people go back to the topic abstract, I would suggest it is usually because the thread is in danger of rotting in an unprofitable manner. I can't think offhand of a situation in which what could be seen as a profitable evolution of the question in the topic abstract has been received with a demand that that evolution be quashed and the discussion be returned to the subject bounden by the topic abstract. Do you have any specific examples in mind?

Not off-hand. I think threadrot can be identified on its own without reference to abstracts. I don't think we need another tool to define what the topic of a thread is apart from the thread itself.

I think the main problem we have with threadrot is personal arguments. Technically speaking, arguments may be on-topic, but, say, include lots of references to past behaviour mixed in. I don't think referencing abstracts is useful in stopping that.

05:12 / 18.03.03

To me, the problem with demands being made to keep a thread on-topic is that the demand itself is off-topic. The topic of the thread could easily become the issue of whether the thread is or should be kept to the original topic.

The Natural Way

10:51 / 08.08.03

One way to pretty much guarantee that posters remember to provide abstracts:

Invert the 'New Topic' page, so that the abstract box is on top.

I'm SURE this would help.

11:34 / 08.08.03

Yeah, that and - again - making the abstract a required field.

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