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Alcohol is a strong drug

Goodness Gracious Meme

15:20 / 07.11.02

yeuch. Have an awful awful hangover - one of those ones that lasts all day, but what's really got me is how pronounced the depressive effects are. Haven't really drunk (more than, say, a couple of glasses of wine/pints in an evening) for quite a while, and my body actually feels a bit poisoned. My head definitely does, a real strong low feeling.

Ick. This is why free entry clubs and £1 tequilas are a bad thing.

It's just got me to thinking (wiht all the drug advice flying about) about how strong a drug alcohol is, and how, certainly in the UK, we don't take it at all seriously. This alcoholic comedown feels much worse than most other drug comedowns I've had...

do we normalise the side-effects of alcohol in a way we wouldn't with other drugs?

Tryphena Absent

15:27 / 07.11.02

Well I've had lovely dry eyes all day as a substitute to full blown hangover. Yuk and I had to drive miles and staring at the stupid M4 made them really hurt.

The UK doesn't take any drugs seriously, the general consensus usually sits at two extremes, don't care or totally disagree with. At least that seems to be the case with most of the people I've met.

15:43 / 07.11.02

The depression effect of hangovers is definitely underrated. As well as direct physical reasons (headache, nausea, sleeping badly all make you miserable and anxious) there's that "god, I made an utter twat of myself last night and everyone hates me now, I'm going to change my name and move to another planet" feeling. N.B. I did not move to the US just because of a particularly bad hangover, I'd just like to make this clear now. I've started crying on trains the morning after for no reason.

When I was on A-Ds, hangovers were much more bearable. I don't know, if only there was a quick-acting A-D it could be added to Resolve for a much more effective remedy.

I think tequila is particularly bad for this effect. There's something about those damn cacti.

16:00 / 07.11.02

I've only become horribly ill on alcohol a few times, and each time Tequila was involved. Coincidence? I doubt it. Its evil, though I do love the stuff.

At least with pot you can't kill yourself from taking too much like you so easily can do with booze. You smoke too much pot, you lay there stupid unable to operate the bowl. You drink too much, you end up in the hospital. Yet, one of these is legal and the other not.

Goodness Gracious Meme

16:13 / 07.11.02

Friend who works in the netcaff I'm has just given me his take on the evil stuff:

Tequila=tokillya

Which clears up alot

It's horrible stuff, and slammers are I think alot more overtly 'drug'ish than alot of other drinks - there's a real 'hit'/buzz. it's not, unless you're really diseased, a 'savour the flavour thing'

urgghghh.

See, was thinking about comparisons with gear. It definitely does have a depressive effect and most smokers will have experienced the delights of the smoker's hangover, but I've never had anywhere near this kind of gloom/leadeness from a night of smoking... like i say, is comparable to pill comedowns, and as i'm lucky enough not to suffer these too badly, is actually worse.

16:34 / 07.11.02

Haven't got much time right now, but when I suffered from depression, drinking Kronenbourg 1664 had a marked effect - it turned a drama into a crisis. Stopping drinking the stuff really made a difference. I think it must have some horrible chemicals in it.

Would write more, but I have to dash - yes, I'm off to the pub....

16:35 / 07.11.02

It's been said that any time you bring five random people together, regardless of where they're from -- NYC, Tokyo, Moscow or the middle of the Gobi desert -- if you say "tequila" you'll get at least one of them making an involuntary shudder.

16:46 / 07.11.02

But you will still end up buying five shots!

17:02 / 07.11.02

Hmn. I think we normalise a little with alcohol, but we don't tally a slightly-woozy head with the damage it's doing to say, the liver, etc. I'm v busy atm but will probably post further on here, simply because I was really considering starting an "alcohol" thread after all the various other drugs ones. I'm trying to remember the last day I had without a drink, and there are only one or two in the past month. I think it might be one, actually. That's not good.

17:34 / 07.11.02

The completely horrifc nature of my hangovers is what stopped me drinking regularly. They leave me mentally and physically unable to do anything for 24 hours. The day after the day after, I feel about as rough as everyone else does through a 'normal' hangover. And wasting two days of your life a week feeling like death warmed up is not a good idea. I can get away with it every now and again, but the risk isn't worth it.

Not sure what the point I'm trying to make here is, other than this:

we don't tally a slightly-woozy head with the damage it's doing to say, the liver, etc

isn't true for all of us. I'm nearly always made completely aware of the damage I've done to myself.

17:47 / 07.11.02

Hmm, well, yes, I've never ever had a pot hangover. Maybe after quite a lot of pot I might be a bit spacey or tired the next day, but in general with pot you can wake up the next da and be rarin' to go.

Not so with alcohol. I don't tend to have too bad hangovers but I do notice after a night of heavy drinking that I'm tired, even if I got enough sleep, and constantly thirsty. I've also noticed that you especially feel a hangover if you haven't been drinking in a while.

It is a depressant, and I have noticed myself and others get particularly teary the night after a big drinking session - this tends to happen to me if I've gone out say, three nights in a row. But I do think alcohol is certainly worse for you than marijauna is.

I've thought about giving up, but I love wine and beer so much. I love having a glass of wine or a pint. It's probably partly the social thing. I wonder if I went out and just drank water would that work? Probably to some extent I imagine..

19:22 / 07.11.02

I'm sure I'm generalising to a large extent, but alcohol seems a lot more accepted in the UK. It's strange being back in Ontario where it can only be bought from government liquor stores, and daily time in the pub doesn't exist.

I remember walking through the financial district in London around 3-5pm and all the pubs were filled out to the sidewalks with people. I don't think we even have any pubs in that part of town here...

I don't about the side-effects of this though. Does England have more health problems from it per capita? violent crime or drunk driving? or is it just normalised to the extent that it's a negligable effect?

The Return Of Rothkoid

21:16 / 07.11.02

SFD: yes. Kronenbourg is a fucking evil thing. I don't know what they put in it that makes it so, but it would make me violently depressed and snarky. Seems that a straw poll of people I know find the same effect - any ideas why? I don't get like that on Guinness or dark beer.

I do find I'm using it more, though, since I've been back. It's really worrying me, but it's the socially-acceptable thing, y'see. But I know I'm really blocking things out with it - not to a Nil By Mouth kind of level, no, but enough that it concerns me. Quoth Grant Lee Buffalo, again: "It kills me to think/that we're no longer livin', just lookin' for excuses to drink."

That's about where I am. And not far off some other people around, methinks: I drank a lot more in London, though maybe I just notice it more here.

21:20 / 07.11.02

hmm, not too sure what the stats are on booze-related crime/illness

but yes, i've had my worst ever 'morning after' feelings on booze, and it's all too easy to think "ahh well, it's only good clean fun- few drinks never hurt anyone". Having had to endure long and slightly demanding work-trips abroad, which i felt i could only survive psychically by drinking my way through, i've resorted to quite a few of the Barefoot Doctor-style remedies for taking the edge off the effects of the evil stuff. Eating ginger definitely seems to take the edge of the sluggishness that you feel with a hangover- gets you a bit more back in the mood for things- but that could just be me

Murray Hamhandler

22:30 / 07.11.02

I'm perfectly functional (relatively speaking, of course) on large doses of LSD and a drooling mess on large doses of alcohol. And I've done way more alcohol than LSD. Make of that what you will.

The Return Of Rothkoid

22:37 / 07.11.02

I think it means that you can't buy acid at the bottle-o.

Perhaps this is the reason alcohol's so overlooked as a drug? Because it's so ubiquitous? Certainly moreso in the UK where you can buy it from grocery stores, unlike Australia where it needs to be a licensed premises, etc, etc.

12:09 / 08.11.02

I personally think alcohol is one of the most heinous and plain unpredictable drugs there is. This may be mainly down to its ubiquity.

But it's more likely that it's a depressant (so you'll have the potential to feel down and be less able to control it if you do) but it doesn't completely land you on your arse - like, say, dope, ketamine or diazipan.

Not touching any of that stuff (alcohol included) at the moment.

12:10 / 08.11.02

fridgemac'n'cheese> definitely relate to that "Oh God" feeling. Every Saturday morning it would feel like the world had ended.

15:09 / 08.11.02

Well, I'll tell you what. I've hosted, worked, and been to a lot of parties. When there are problems with people acting out, its always the drunks. When everyone's tripping or on something other than drink, the worst thing to deal with is maybe someone having a panic attack and needing a little coddling. When drink is on the menu, shit gets broken, people get stupid, fights break out, its a mess. Why is it a house full of fucked up people can behave themselves on drugs but if there's beer instead, I have to throw people out and preform minor house repair afterwards? Pot may interfere with your memory, but alcohol makes you right stupid. Its by far not my drug of choice, its up there with coke in the trouble it can cause.

Though I will have to admidt, it can be right tasty, and a fine time if you just have a little. I'll bash it left and right, but then find myself cooking mead in the basement because its yummy. So it definitely has that going for it. You see, we don't think of alcohol as a drug, we think of it as food (certainly the case with Guinness), which I think is a lot of the problem. Except for Tequila, which I think most folks think of straight away as a drug, and for good reason

11:59 / 17.11.02

Desired effects of alcohol consumption:

1. Loosens tongue and inhibitions when faced with being paraded in front of Ganesh's colleagues at the wedding reception of one of same.

Did the job, I was able to discuss Fame Academy at length having watched a whole ten minutes worth of it in the past and was generally an affable, sociable cove for the duration of the affair, remembering that this was an English wedding and they're oddly inchoate things in comparison with their lustier Scottish cousins. The most badly behaved and embarrassing member of the wedding was the one entirely sober man there.

2. Walked for miles there and back and didn't feel the cold.

Unpleasant side effects of alcohol excess:

1. Bleeuurgh, feel like someone gave the inside of my head a fresh coat of viscous paint overnight.

2. There is only one small English note left in my wallet of the scarce resources marshalled before the evening began.

3. I feel extravagantly penitent for all my imagined sins of the past twenty four hours, but can't remember what they were.

4. I attempted several posts in the drunken wee small hours which gibberish faced me when I first logged on this morning. More penitence, must crawl on my knees all the way to the Shrine of Our Lady of Walsingham.

5. Just remembered that I took the Lord's name heedlessly in vain when my lengthy conversation with that nice Ghanaian Charismatic Christian woman had otherwise been going so well...

6. I now have to begin watching Fame Academy, in its endgame, to find out who Ainslie is after championing him to vociferously last night.

7. My liver is sufficiently well marinaded now for one of Prince Charles' eight chefs to sautée and serve up with fava beans.

I observe that the latter list is much longer than the former and conclude that I should have listened to bitchiekittie all along.

Now for medicinal cheese on toast...

Tryphena Absent

12:12 / 17.11.02

Ainslie's my favourite, he's got a nice coat. Yep that's how I decide who to like in Fame Academy- singing, no. Dancing, no. Clothes, best to go for that I think! I haven't even been near Popstars because it's a bad bad programme.

12:49 / 17.11.02

The completely horrifc nature of my hangovers is what stopped me drinking regularly. They leave me mentally and physically unable to do anything for 24 hours.

God, it's nice to not be the only one. I am starting to get less evil hangovers, but there was a period when every time I drank to excess I would get the Fear - continuous, tense, intense, panic fear - in waves for the whole of the following day (one one memorable occasion, for two days) and have to lie on the floor being terrified that I was going to, oddly enough, fall off the world. And then I'd tell people "I'm hungover" and they'd start making laddy ho-ho, self-inflicted type jokes that I'm sure they wouldn't if I'd told them I was on a coke comedown.

But yes. Alcohol is poison, and my entire body and brain are quick to remind me on the morning after that I have, in fact, poisoned myself.

22:55 / 17.11.02

I have to say that hanging out with bitchiekittie has turned me into a more responsible drinker. I drink, but it's no fun getting drunk when your girlfriend doesn't, so I tend to drink without getting hammered. For instance, last night, we went out for a meal and a gig (Smog at Fletchers in Baltimore, if you're interested) for my birthday. With drinking friends I would probably have got slaughtered and feel appalling today. However, I stopped drinking beer when I felt I would turn into a dribbling embarrassment if I continued, and started drinking Red Bull instead. There was no going to shit clubs for no good reason, no "beer mugger" emptying wallets and, importantly, no soul-crushing hangover. I recommend it.

Incidentally, I've realised that one of the reasons I feel so shit on the morning after is sleep apn(o)ea. Alcohol exacerbates it massively, you get a crappy night's rest with less REM sleep and snore like a big walrus, occasionally choking yourself awake and then going back to sleep without realising.

16:12 / 18.11.02

Happy Birthday fridgeboy! Happy fridge, bk! Happy Not-hungover-anymore to me!

Goodness Gracious Meme

16:15 / 18.11.02

ha. for how long, eh?

20:51 / 18.11.02

Only till I go back up for a visit to Scotland, where they're thinking about putting thiamine in the beer.

Probably will still get a filthy hangover but at least I won't end up with Wernicke's encephalopathy or Korsakoff's psychosis, just a bigger beer belly and George Best's liver...