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Matrix: Reloaded

 
  

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000
21:58 / 24.01.03
This Matrix Reloaded script, for real?

"Expect even more comic book-style heroics this time around. “Basically, Neo becomes Superman and Morpheus becomes Batman,” says Laurence Fishburne,"

Link
 
 
bjacques
22:44 / 24.01.03
I thought The Matrix did ok by its own lights but, no, it's certainly not as ambitious as Cronenberg's stuff or at least one movie I can't mention without spoiling it. It's a brainwashing movie with a lot of kung fu. Anyway, the red pill was used in Total Recall, and before that it was yellow, in the 1950s story The Yellow Pill. Old idea. So I'll just wait for the sequels unless Hollywood makes the Dutchies wait 2 months like last time, in which case I'll do what's necessary and Jack Valenti can go piss up a rope.
 
 
Our Lady of The Two Towers
12:54 / 25.01.03
The red pill thing... In the second half of the movie, when they drive to see the Oracle they drive in a car, this is clearly derivative of the first half of the movie where Trinity and the two people who people can barely remember drive Neo to see Morpheus. The film is so derivative,. it even copies itself!!

Rrrr.
 
 
gentleman loser
21:46 / 26.01.03
Jack Fear:

The Matrix starts with a mildly intriguing premise which it implies will be the main thread of the film: but it soon become apparent that the film will ignore the logical implications of the virtual reality bit as soon as they become inconvenient to the chopsockey. And so the VR aspect is revealed as a gimmick, peg onto which to hang a state-of-the-art munitions-porn movie.

I agree entirely, but that won't keep the fanboys from slobbering all over it just like they did over the Star Wars prequels. As long as it makes money, no one will give much of a damn, I suspect. As bjacques points out, I'm constantly amazed that people who should know better don't realize that The Matrix is pretty much a ripoff of an Arnold Schwarzenegger action flick; Total Recall (1990). The plots of both movies are almost frame for frame identical, though the settings differ. I enjoyed both movies as entertaining action fodder, but little else.
 
 
Spatula Clarke
22:23 / 26.01.03
As much as I don't give two shits about Matrix, I'm really going to have to take issue with that. That two films cover similar topics (and they're not even that similar in your example, other than the very basic 'false memories' premise) does not imply that one ripped the other off. Give me some evidence - any evidence - of the "frame for frame" thing, please.
 
 
Hieronymus
01:31 / 27.01.03
Bleh. I liked the first one. And I'll be in line for the second.
 
 
000
07:20 / 27.01.03
I also take the underdog position and say I want to see where 300 million dollar goodness can take 2 movies.
 
 
Hieronymus
14:57 / 27.01.03
Yeah, yeah. I know. Nobody's interested. But in any case, for those that are, the SuperBowl ad for the next onejust showed up online.

Paint me a idiot fanboy, I suppose, but I think it looks sharp as hell.

We now return you to our original film snobbery, already in progress.
 
 
The Natural Way
15:00 / 27.01.03
Well, I'm looking forward to it. Shut up, Barbelith, yr lips're flapping again.
 
 
Foust is SO authentic
15:55 / 27.01.03
I was pretty apathetic about Reloaded. Until I saw that trailer. It has possiblities, yes.
 
 
arcboi
16:07 / 27.01.03
The new trailer looks amazing. It's Super Neo!
 
 
Mister Six, whom all the girls
19:16 / 27.01.03
A lot of my friends are bummed out that I didn't like Matrix. BUT, I did see it on a little TV after reading the prelim threads on old school Barbelith and was ready to accept the similarities. Stealing from Invisibles didn't bug me, but what did was that the film doesn't know when it was hilarious and when it wasn't and I guess I was bothered at how it COULD have been amazing but so... wasn't.

I do agree with the idea put forth here that if you're going to havfe one unbelieveable reality, stick to that, rather than two unbelieveable realities, it really lost me when we saw that 'unfortunately' they were living in a bombed out future, riding a sub rescuing people from a hive. I mean, that's pretty mind-blowing, but the movie says 'Yeah, I know,now FORGET THAT, we're going back to the other bit, only now that'll be different too.'

I dunno.

If I see it, it'll be in a proper cinema with mates who liked the first one... drunk. I hear that is how it should be seen.

Least it ain't Daredevil.
 
 
Our Lady of The Two Towers
12:21 / 28.01.03
And it ain't Total Recall either. Or rather, if The Matrix is Total Recall, then so is Existenz, so is Tron, so is...
 
 
The Natural Way
12:47 / 28.01.03
I prefer stoned w/ the visual feast movies, Six. But each to his own.
 
 
Mister Six, whom all the girls
13:53 / 28.01.03
Nah, that's how I watch MASH, Runce.

I hear you, though. I am a huge movie snob as well, so it takes a lot for me to want to watch anything. As a kid, I saw my da once a week for a movie and watched vids with my mom during the week. So I have this deep seated notion that I've probably seen it all. And Matrix uses a lot of 80's sci-fi techniques when it all comes down to it (holocaust future, giant robot bug-things, car chases, gun fights, guys in suits as the enemy... etc), which you can imagine I saw a LOT of back in the day.

But seeing it stoned is another matter. That Klinger is a trip, man. He's a woman in a man, dude! Like Russian doll man.
 
 
Hieronymus
00:22 / 12.04.03
Final appetizer before the main course next month.

Not as high octane as the Super Bowl ad but sweet to the eyes, nonetheless.
 
 
Matthew Fluxington
02:57 / 12.04.03
I'm kinda blown away by that bizarre Total Recall "frame by frame" thing. Gentleman Loser, are you aware of what "frame by frame" means?

I think the whole "The Matrix is awesome cos they were inspired by Grant Morrison's most convoluted mess of a comic series and therefore it's awesome" thing is really dim, and I find it depressing that so many people seem to buy into it. Isn't that kinda like saying Shitty Glossy Faux-Punk Band X is awesome just because the lead singer is totally obsessed with The Clash's Sandinista?

I agree with Jack Fear and Videodrome's posts in this thread. However, I do want to see both of these films just for the hell of it. I enjoyed enough of the first one to make it worthwhile. It's like riding a rollercoaster, or watching my little brother play a video game. I wish people wouldn't think so much about it and take it so seriously.

The Matrix : action movies :: Tool : bonehead nu metal
 
 
Spaniel
13:02 / 12.04.03
Car chases and gun fights? Surely these are standard features of the action movie, nothing particularly 80's about them. Unless you want to argue that the action movie as a genre has it's origins in the eighties - a not untenable position. Interestingly, I'm not sure that the original movie has any car chases (but I'm well aware that the second has).

Six, trust me, Runce has seen more than his fair share of films. He knows where the Matrix borrows from.

Flux, think the rollercoaster analogy while an oldie is also a goodie. It seems to me that people frequently make catagory errors when talking about movies. To my mind watching The Matrix is so far removed from watching Three Colours Red that it might as well be a different form of entertainment. The Matrix seeks to pump adrenaline and triple the heart beat. It is visceral through and through. Even the concepts on which the movie are hinged are little more than exciting idea bombs (don't agree? Probably haven't spoken to enough good old boys down the pub about Neo and his chums).

If we are going to compare however, it's urely worth talking about the effect The Matrix has had on the action movie genre as a whole, after all it was almost solely responsble for bringing Hong Kong action flick techniques to the west and has subsequently spawned a bajillion clones.

Personally I'm really looking forward to the sequels, but then I am very immature.
 
 
videodrome
13:52 / 12.04.03
The 'modern' action movie has origins in the late '60s and early '70s - Steve McQueen is the only name you need to know. Gunfights and car chases? Think The Great Escape, Bulitt, The Getaway. Not to mention non-McQueen flicks like the east coast/west coast one-two cop indictments of The French Connection and Dirty Harry.

But then there's always those...what were they...westerns? Gunfights and car chases, except that the cars were horses. Hey, 'Palomino' is a great name for a sedan, don't you think?
 
 
Professor Silly
16:40 / 12.04.03
by the way, Total Recall had its basis in the short story "We can Remember it for you Wholesale." Did Philip K. Dick write that--I don't remember.
 
 
Olulabelle
23:34 / 12.04.03
Not sure how relevant this is in that it's not directly related to the script, but it is about The Matrix: Reloaded and it's interesting anyway. It's a 'Wired' article on the Special Effects.
 
 
Yotsuba & Benjamin!
01:15 / 13.04.03
That Wired article made me appreciate the film a whole lot more. What they're doing, technology-wise, is astounding. The rollercoster analogy is even more fitting when you look at it from this technology angle. Think of the brilliant sceintists and designers who toiled night and day to make Batman: The Ride 90 seconds of pure full-throttle entertainment. Check the new trailer and you'll see that exactly what it's going to be.

Look at it this way, we're almost guranteed at least 3/4ths less horrific exposition.

"AI? You mean, Artificial Intelligence?"

"Squiddies?"

"The important question is not where, Neo. But when."
"*When* am I?"

Oh, FUCK, Neo! No one expected you to actually ASK!!!!! "The One" who's getting on my last fucking nerve!
 
 
Professor Silly
08:07 / 13.04.03
For once I totally agree with Flux. I enjoyed the first film without feeling compelled to over-analyze it. I did see it ten times in the theater, two of those times on 'shrooms.
Apparently the brothers have different interests--one digs on comics and the other gets his jollys through religious study. As I personally enjoy both of these things...well, it seems clear....
On the one hand I get massive rushes of energy at the action scenes, all the while smirking at the crude buddhist leanings and not-so-subtle masonic imagry. I saw the movie at the advice of a powerful magician--and it provides a nice little avenue for those who've had no contact to these kinds of ideas.


Rock - fucking - video

enough thing-think
 
 
Seth
11:05 / 13.04.03
Just finished the Wired article. I'm not certain how these guys can make claims to innovation when the effect they dubbed 'bullet time' was already in use in adverts and music videos before the Matrix, and 'virtual cinematography' has already been used in Fellowship of the Ring They're ploughing more time and effort into it, but that's only to be expected considering the enormous budget at their disposal. Although if they really are influenced by Grant Morrison, the fact that they take other people's ideas and rebrand them as their own should come as no surprise...
 
 
nedrichards is confused
10:53 / 14.04.03
Yep and in predictable fashion We Can RTemember It For You Wholesale is a very, very good PKD story which Total Recall massacres.
 
 
uncle retrospective
16:03 / 14.04.03
Thread rot
Flux, lay off Tool. They're Nu metal? Then Sonic Youth are grunge.

End thread rot.
 
 
Matthew Fluxington
03:07 / 15.04.03
Yeah, the "Nu Metal" thing might be a bit unfair. If I said "Angry-Meathead Quasi-Prog Metal," I would've been much more accurate.
 
 
uncle retrospective
14:28 / 15.04.03
I still object to meathead, but the rest is about right.
 
 
gingerbop
22:20 / 15.04.03
The bald guy in it was Othello in the video we watched along with it in English. Once i noticed it was the same guy, every time iv seen him iv just thought: those two roles sooo dont go together and its just wierd.
 
 
Jack The Bodiless
02:51 / 20.04.03
Flux: "Yeah, the "Nu Metal" thing might be a bit unfair. If I said "Angry-Meathead Quasi-Prog Metal," I would've been much more accurate."

Fucking idiot. For a start, you clearly know nothing of the media concept that is 'nu metal'. Tool pre-date any working idea of 'nu metal' in the media by well over seven years. It's a catch-all term used to identify certain rock/metal bands who are actually relevant to the audience in question, and who, as a result, have actually sold more than the usual 'cult audience' span of records. It's also used mainly in the UK media. Anyone using their brain can see that there's a world of difference between Tool and Linkin Park. The former began in 1991, and moved beyond the Soundgarden-stylee template of their opening EP to create on of the only dynamically individual voices in rock music today. The latter put themselves together to try to duplicate Korn's "Pearl Jam with Big Riffs" template, but with mainstream pop success. I am very glad that both succeeded, because heavy rock music needed both to thrive in the way that it has in the last four or five years. Nirvana were an overhyped flash-in-the-pan. Korn, Faith No More and the Deftones helped create the heavy musical climate that we see today, with assistance from Offspring. Without them, we wouldn't have bands like Tomahawk, System Of A Down, etc.

By the way, anyone who uses the term 'progressive' as a pejorative without clarification is an utter moron. And anyone who uses the word 'meathead' to describe Tool has no understanding of the band, their lyrics or their music. But then I'd expect nothing less from Flux, who appears wholly incapable of reaching outside the confines of his own wee musical ghetto. Sad little man.
 
 
Elijah, Freelance Rabbi
03:02 / 20.04.03
i gave up on the phrase "Nu Metal" and instead choose for the more mean spirited "Mall Core" anyone who knows what a Hot Topic is should understand

oh, and back on topic i may have a chance to see a DVD screener of reloaded, in which case i will start a new thread full of spoilerific spoilers
 
 
deadhead
04:09 / 20.04.03
Hey is it me or isint flagrant that the matrix is just ripping off idea from other people and claiming it as their own??

In the preview I saw parts of terminator, Akira, The Killer or The Crow(the parts where the birds fly out in slow motion)


I dont know why but no one seems to realize this movie is unoriginal and pretentious. People think if you watched The Matrix your intelligent but no one seems to create intelligent things out of it. Besides for an intelligent movie its really not hard to follow...


Anyway.... isint it ironic that for a movie where the heros fight machines so much money is put into special effects by computers.


I guess the machines owns us already....



read deadhead comics ....coming soon
 
 
bio k9
05:56 / 20.04.03
I'd apologise for derailing the thread but I can't even see the tracks anymore...

Jack, you can call Nirvana "overhyped" all you want if thats your opinion but "flash-in-the-pan"? They released three proper studio albums (each better than the last) plus a collection of demos & non-album singles and the unplugged disc and only went away because Kurt killed himself. Imagine if the Manics had the good sense to give it up after Richey "disappeared". Would they have been a flash in the pan too?
 
 
Matthew Fluxington
11:32 / 20.04.03
Oh come on, Jack The Bodiless. My biggest problem with Tool is their painfully dumb and adolescent lyrics - I defy you to defend them from the position of an adult. My whole point in my snide little analogy up above was that Tool are often held up by their fans as being so much smarter than their immediate peers, which may be true, but a few shallow references to some smart ideas/topics isn't quite enough to overcome the overwhelming immaturity and gracelessness of the lyrics/music itself.

So, yeah, Jack, Tool isn't quite "Nu Metal", but that's who their immediate peers are and that's what they are being positively compared to. The Matrix isn't quite The Fast & The Furious either, but it's the same thing.
 
 
uncle retrospective
17:00 / 20.04.03
Flux says "Tool isn't quite "Nu Metal", but that's who their immediate peers are and that's what they are being positively compared to."

So we're back to judging bands by their peers and fans eh? Oh Flux...
 
  

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