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X-Men Vs....The Comics Journal!

 
 
Murray Hamhandler
18:58 / 21.09.02
The new Comics Journal contains a review of E Is For Extinction in case anyone who doesn't regularly read the Journal was interested. A surprisingly positive review for a mainstream comic, though plagued by the Journal's usual backhanded compliments and lazy journalism when dealing w/the mainstream. Interesting points raised. Well worth discussing. What do you think? I will write more when my wrists are through hurting from all of the typing...
 
 
some guy
19:19 / 21.09.02
Interesting self-loathing on the part of the reviewer there. Can we sometimes just enjoy something for what it is, or must everything be measured against Hamlet?
 
 
moriarty
20:25 / 21.09.02
Thanks for typing all that out Deric. When your wrists heal I'd really like to hear what you think.

I'm more apt to defend the Journal (which I enjoy occasionally) over the New X-Men (which I don't). As Laurence makes clear by referencing the reviewer solely, the Journal isn't a hive mind. I've seen many editors and reviewers express contrary views about their colleagues, usually along mainstream/alternative lines. I've also read two inverviews with Morrison, a complete overview of the first part of the Invisibles, and a glowing review of the Doom Patrol, among other things in the Journal's pages. That said, this review in particular does look a little sloppy.

If anything, I think his review of New X-Men is too positive. They should let me have a go.
 
 
Boy in a Suitcase
21:38 / 21.09.02
"Cyclops isn't Stephan Dedalus, and never will be."

Fucking jackass.
 
 
Our Lady of The Two Towers
16:28 / 22.09.02
To paraphrase; "I found it in a comic shop, therefore it's only on sale in comic shops and not in bookshops." I'm sorry, but there's not really much of an excuse for that.
 
 
The Falcon
21:48 / 22.09.02
I hate TCJ on principal, anyway. But look! A clever reference - 'cos Cyclops comes from the Odyssey, and Dedalus from Ulysses.

So, ummm...

I suspect these people to be far worse than fanboys - 'Oh look, I've got a critical faculty. Oh, it's gone into overdrive. Now I'm a dick.' Chris Ware wrote a beautifully executed, miserable-as-fuck story in Jimmy Corrigan. Hats off - but I'd rather read Daredevil, to be honest.

The end.

And incidentally, I enjoyed JLA more for being essentially clueless about J'onn J'onzz and the like. It got me interested in them, so I could discover sub-par tales about them elsewhere. I believe my enjoyment of New X-Men is, if anything, slightly impaired by having actually read Fabian Nicieza.

I love mainstream comics when they're done properly. Which New X-Men is. (IMO, or whatever...)
 
 
Murray Hamhandler
01:05 / 23.09.02
Self-loathing indeed, Laurence. We (being the Journal) can indeed enjoy a comic for what it is, so long as the book in question is not a dread...mainstream title. Although, as moriarty points out, I might be reacting slightly disingenuously on that count. But probably only slightly...

It should be noted that I've only been reading the Journal off and on for about three years now, but in that time I've seen a lot of loathing (self- and otherwise) directed towards mainstream titles. It seems to me that the Journal's main intent (and an admirable one, at that) is to present the medium of comics as one worthy of serious study and criticism. I think that they feel it necessary, on those grounds, to separate the wheat from the chaff. Understandable. However, too often they seem to dismiss mainstream books simply on the grounds of their existence as mainstream books, without any of the further exploration that they would afford to books w/more overt artistic aspirations (or classic mainstream books). And the anti-mainstream attitude of the Journal sometimes goes beyond simple dismissal and into the realm of...claiming the moral high ground, almost. I can recall several occasions (the two-part Alex Ross interview springs immediately to mind as a particularly repulsive example) when mainstream professionals have been more or less browbeaten about whoring themselves out and pressured to justify their desire to earn a living wage.

I'm not of the opinion that reviewers at the Journal even need to like a single thing that they review, but why shouldn't a mainstream title be subjected to the same criteria as a book published by Fantagraphics (the problems inherent in Fantagraphics' ownership of the Journal being a whole different topic in itself...)? This seems incredibly lazy to me, on par w/the dismissal by the entire filmic community of a movie like Freddy Got Fingered (perhaps an absolutely terrible example, as I seem to be one of the only people in the world that saw any depth in that particularly deft yet admittedly flawed satire). The general idea being, if it says Marvel or DC, it's all surface, and we should poke fun at their anachronistic overuse of the tired superhero tropes rather than digging deeper than the fisticuffs and funny underwear.

But I didn't start this thread simply to point out the Journal's flaws. As I said, I've read the Journal for three years and have recently subscribed, so they must be doing something for me (I burn a lot of calories from hurling my copy across the room in frustration, for example... ). I'm more interested, in this case, in discussing whether or not this particular review is a clumsy step towards more widespread acceptance, by the Journal, of modern mainstream comics as subjects worthy of deeper critical study. My take? "Ehhh...".

As has been noted, the tone of the review was at times very revealing of the reviewer's fear that he would be identified as a former fanboy and beaten by his beret-wearing colleagues. Yes, the review was haltingly positive, but a somewhat positive review of a mainstream title does not a well-balanced cricical review make. The main problem in this case being that Grant isn't concerned, first and foremost, w/the aesthetic preoccupations of the reviewer. It's perfectly valid to criticise the book from that standpoint, but downright lazy to neglect and/or downplay other aspects of the book. NXM is about ideas. True, it may not be breaking the mold of the medium as a whole, but Grant certainly is attempting to do so w/in the book's particular genre (whether he's succeeding or not being completely up for discussion). As long as reviews of this nature are sloppily punctuated by disclaimers like "just another uninspired power fantasy" that are more of an attempt by the reviewer to distance him/herself from the subject matter than a true representation of the subject of review, mainstream reviews in the Journal will continue to be mere tokenism (for reasons that are beyond me, beyond a more friendly take on the pre-established "Well, yes. It's all garbage." position), serving only to perpetuate their anti-mainstream bias.

On a side note, I'd very much like to read your review of NXM, moriarty. I'm sure you have some very interesting things to say about it...
 
 
Murray Hamhandler
20:17 / 23.09.02
A perhaps ill-advised second thread on the matter is now up on the Comics Journal board. For what it's worth.
 
 
ONLY NICE THINGS
22:27 / 23.09.02
Well, thank the holy Christ that you took the link down, Deric. God forbid that anyone who might actually have read Ulysses (I cried when Numenor was returned to his long sleep after the Magician in Black was defeated) should have an opportunity to have their brain boiled by the sheer insight of a (stifles hysterical giggling) comics enthusiast.

This, at least, will not interfere with the pleasure I felt when Molly Bloom let Blazes Boylan touch her tits with his claw (the middle one is the sharpest).
 
 
The Falcon
22:52 / 23.09.02
Yeah, what about the bit in A La Recherche De Temps Perdu when Omacron, the Galactic Beast of Seven Hells, is unleashed on the small French town of Combray?

That was nearly as good.
 
 
Murray Hamhandler
23:38 / 23.09.02
By way of clarification: the removed link that I speak of in the TCJ thread is the now non-existent link (that was originally in the first message of this thread) to my probably ill-advised transcription of the Comics Journal article in question. The "grousing about following a link" comment was in reference to my initial interpretation of this sister thread.
 
 
The Falcon
02:00 / 24.09.02
Actually, Deric, thanks to your link I no longer hate TCJ. The posters there are erudite and generally entertaining.

Did find a claws-out battle between two academics, though, which was fun. Who's trolling who? and whatnot.

But I'll still get on my high-horse about quality mainstream, as I do with any medium. I hate all this high/low art, under/over-ground shit.
 
 
Murray Hamhandler
20:59 / 26.09.02
For those interested, there's a response from Brayshaw himself over on the TCJ thread, which I'm working (w/some difficulty due to lack of coffee) on a cogent reply to at the moment. If you're brave enough, dive in w/your own two cents. Feeding myself to the wolves isn't nearly as painful as I thought it would've been...
 
 
MojoJojo
16:43 / 25.05.03
"I've also read two inverviews with Morrison, a complete overview of the first part of the Invisibles, and a glowing review of the Doom Patrol, among other things in the Journal's pages."

Which issue can I find the overview of the first part (vol 1), and the Doom Patrol review?
 
 
bio k9
20:27 / 25.05.03
If anything, I think his review of New X-Men is too positive. They should let me have a go.

Please do.
 
 
moriarty
21:41 / 26.05.03
Right after I finish my Miracleman and Bazooka Joe pieces, Bio. Or, never.

Janitor, I had to do a little digging but I finally found the issues you're asking about. I'm afraid my memory is a little faulty. The Doom Patrol "review" is actually just a small paragraph in issue #210, the 100 Best Comics of the Century edition. It didn't make the main list, but issue #34 of the Doom Patrol, the Monsieur Mallah and The Brain issue, ranked #17 on the top mainstream comics according to Ray Mescallado. Issue #218 has a five page interview that deals specifically with Morrison's illness and how it related to his work on the Invisibles. There is also a five page review of Vol. 2 (not Vol. 1 as I previously stated). Both are by Nick Hasted.
 
 
dlotemp
23:50 / 26.05.03
Off topic aside to moriarty:

Don't know if you're being snide about the Bazooka Joe reference but, if you are interested, I'm told that there is an essay about Bazooka Joe and his comics in one of the early issues of BLAB! the comics anthology. Don't know the specific issue but somewhere between #3-#9.
 
 
dlotemp
23:58 / 26.05.03
I should have stuck to my first quess. The essay appears in issue #3.

I found a blurb on the anthology at the following web address. Apparently, the book is for sale but a bit steep for me. I heartily recommend the anthology though. Good stuff.

link
 
 
moriarty
01:05 / 27.05.03
I am never snide when it comes to Bazooka Joe. I had started an essay on the Bazooka Joe comics ages ago, but found only a small amount of information. During my search I found a reference to the issue of Blab that you mention, but the idea eventually fell away from me. Thanks for the info, though.
 
 
MojoJojo
15:07 / 27.05.03
Thanks Moriarty

Yeah, I have both TCJ #210 and #218.

I still think that there might have been a Doom Patrol series overview from back in '93, or whenever the series ended. I guess I'll google some more.

A more recent issue (#248) had a review covering the silver age Doom Patrol, if anyone's interested.
 
  
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