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Some people...

Murray Hamhandler

21:14 / 18.09.02

If I had hair, I'd be tearing it out. I've been back in school for 2 1/2 weeks now and I'm convinced that the people on this campus (IU, for those who are curious) are, on the whole, the most unfriendly group of people I've ever encountered in my life.

Generally, I try to be Mr. Ray O. Sunshine, with a smile and a rainbow for everyone I meet. I figure there are enough shitty people in the world. How much does it take to be pleasant to passersby, really? A whole hell of a lot, apparently. The responses I've gotten from random people around campus have ranged anywhere from utter indifference to abject disgust. Very rarely does anyone return a smile or react to me in an at all civil way. It's really dehumanizing to be constantly reacted to as if I were a stick of furniture or a particularly unpleasant stain. Is it just me? Am I hoping for too much from these people? Should I even bother with them? I don't know anyone on this campus, but I was hoping to. Now I don't know if I want to know any of them. I feel icky...

21:39 / 18.09.02

Seems to me that people mostly react that way because they're not used to seeing cheery folks. That's no reason to stop being pleasant.
Keep on smiling and sooner or later you'll get a positive response. When that happens it'll feel great and all those miseries out there will seem like a distant memory.
It's a cliche but it's true : If you can cheer just 1 person up a day and they do the same etc etc...

Whatever happens though, don't be mean or rude to anyone who looks at you like you're some kind of freak. Keep the moral high ground.
Good luck.

21:42 / 18.09.02

The bumper sticker is right. Mean people suck. As cliche as this sounds, I'd try to find some people who share your interests. Is IU a big school? Sometimes I find people at large schools can be more guarded than at small ones. I'd say 2 and a half weeks is enough time for people to get settled and get over their initial 'I'm back at school' stress, but maybe they're still kind of wound up. Meanwhile, just keep being you, hon. It may take some time, but you'll find some non-bastards. Good luck.

21:47 / 18.09.02

Everybody can't be like that, can they?

Around here, there's no reason for people to smile and nod or say "Mornin'" to each other because 75% of the people are talking on friggin' cell phones.

Just give it time. If you want to meet people, go to club meetings and the like.

Tuna Ghost: Pratt knot hero

21:53 / 18.09.02

You are experiencing something that nearly everyone in the south east united states expects to happen when they go up north. And to some extent, it's not an untrue stereotype.

How do you deal with it? Christ, man, I dunno. You just get over it, I would imagine, or find some sort of inner peace that won't let it get you down. Or you can do what I do, which is let it turn you into a cold, unsympathetic and unfeeling bastard in a town full of cold-blooded fiends (hey, I'm working on the harmony one).

23:47 / 18.09.02

the same things happened to me, quite embarassingly i tapped a guy on the shoulder and said hi on the way out of a shop who i know from class. the guy and his girlfriend just cut me off. theres a term for people like that: assholes. Doesn't mean you have to change, stay friendly.

00:04 / 19.09.02

For the most part, I let things slide. Where I live there are a lot of mean people, especially in cars. I live on a street that has roughly thirty thousand cars a day travel on it. In the last month there have been three just outside my window. Each progressively worse than the last.

Johnny O, I know the stereotype you speak of. I had a reverse experience of it in Alabama. A waitress could obviously judge that we were from up NO-ahth. After the meal, (nine bucks) we were foolish enough to pay without the exact amount, so she went off to change our twenty dollar bill. After a few minutes, her co-worker in crime proceeded to set our table and ask what we wanted for breakfast...

Sometimes I let it slide.

00:06 / 19.09.02

Oh yeah, everyone in the place turned their heads at us when we said 'no grits' on our order.

00:07 / 19.09.02

Some people they tease one another
Take pride in themselves
Keeping the other one down
Well I'm not like that at all
Some people they hurt one another
They love to see
Hurting the other ones' eyes
Well I'm not like that at all

Some people are born for each other
Holding the other ones' hand
They always understand
Some people cry
Some people know why

Some people they use one another
So aimlessly
Not like lovers do
Well I'm not like that at all

Some people they long for each other
They love to talk
Holding the other ones' hand
They always understand
Some people cry
Some people know why

Hear the word unspoken with a voice unheard
When a thought is broken by a tender word
When a heart is moved
When a heart is thrown
The silence tell you you're not alone

Some people are born for each other
They love to walk
Holding the other ones' hand
They always understand
Some people cry
Some people know why

Some people

Some people are born for each other
They love to walk
Holding the other one
Some people they long for each other
They love to talk
Holding the other one

Some people are born for each other
They love to walk
Holding the other one
Holding the other one
Holding each other

Matthew Fluxington

00:37 / 19.09.02

I wish I could observe how you are acting in public, Deric.

I think a lot of people just don't want to be annoyed, and there is a distinct possibility that your being extremely outgoing might be interpreted as being less friendly and more irritating by some people. If you're skipping down the street with a huge grin saying "howdy! what a beautiful day!" to total strangers, I think you can expect them to maybe think you're a little too perky for their tastes.

I know that I'm not crazy about chatting with strangers, and I'm certainly not keen on having small talk with the aggressively friendly. I know that I'm not alone in this. I would recommend being a bit more laid back and giving people some space and time, or let your relationships with people grow organically. If people are ignoring you when you're trying to reach out to them, it might not be their fault, exactly.

But really, what do I know? I'm one of those northern East Coast yankee city slickers.

01:05 / 19.09.02

no buried nugget of wisdom, this - but people are meanies, tried and true. as long as you arent harassing people with your sunshine, forcing it up their asses and whatnot, you are doing a public service. maybe a hundred people will pass by and scoff at your cheer, disgusted with your ability to be happy (and will most likely blame it on pharmaceutical assistance, stupidity, or plain ignorance) in the face of all the crap that bends them, floundering with their own troubles. but trust me from experience: one small, kind act on your part could very well serve to impact someone elses life in a very positive way.

I too am an east coast city dweller, a tough guy and a bit of a cynic. but simple human kindness can go so very far, dont ditch it

ONLY NICE THINGS

01:10 / 19.09.02

Count yourself lucky. On the rolling hills of Oxbridge Academy, London (just by Strawberry Hill) you woul dhave been tracked down by scouts, shot full of tranquiliser darts and shipped to the Botanical Gardens in a cage by now.

01:14 / 19.09.02

remember, man - we are the "chicken soup for the soul" nation

ONLY NICE THINGS

01:23 / 19.09.02

I'm not sure we even *have* enough tranquiliser darts for that lot.

The Return Of Rothkoid

01:39 / 19.09.02

Only tranquiliser darts?

11:36 / 19.09.02

Anybody remember that bit in Big Brother when Adele sat down with Johnny and made a confession? Even though, she said, you don't get on with some people. It doesn't really mean that you don't like them or they are bad people. It's just the way it is.

She was frantically trying to justify her beastly behaviour towards him with an eviction and a baying crowd fast approaching. Dunno, that just stuck in my mind. Personally, I find it hard to relate to excessively friendly people (how can you genuinely want to be friends with everyone? You treat everyone this way, I just don't feel special...this isn't working... ), but just being nice is more important than any other quality.

12:12 / 19.09.02

Deric, have you seen Amelie?

18:42 / 19.09.02

Usually, when strangers approach me on the street, I make one of my bodyguards tackle the person, mace them, and knock them unconcious with a billyclub.

I'm very shy.

Murray Hamhandler

20:43 / 19.09.02

It should be said, it seems, that I'm not in any way aggressive about my goodwill. I'm definitely not trying to make friends w/everyone I see. I think I might well come across as borderline shy, actually. Mostly, I'm trying, in the least intrusive way possible, to show the random people that I encounter that I bear them no inexplicable ill-will. From personal experience, I know that I feel better when a stranger acknowledges me as a human being instead of just some obstacle to get around as quickly as possible and definitely...NOT...make any eye contact with, for the love of god. I live in about the safest place in the world, where closing oneself off and being an automaton in public doesn't have any real utility w/r/t issues of personal safety. I've lived in places like that before and that's a big part of the reason I'm not living in any of those places now.

Possible factors to take into consideration in this situation:
For the first time in my life, there are adults who are younger than me and with whom I feel some semblance of an actual generational gap. And they're everywhere. Maybe this problem that I'm having stems at least in part from being, in some cases, as much as seven years older than some of the "kids" here. Maybe I'm forgetting what it was like to be that age. Maybe my head was planted just as firmly up my own ass back then.

Also, I'm coming out of an extended period of pseudo-reclusiveness, wherein I've had little social contact w/anyone outside of my exceptionally small circle. I decided at some point to not let the shitty people that I've known in the past turn me into a misanthrope and, despite mounting reasons for resorting to misanthropy, I'm determined to get back out in the world and to try to recognize the worth in people. Maybe I'm naive (many would say so, I'm sure), but I would like to think that small gestures like meeting the eyes of a person as you walk down the street or smiling at someone who looks like they're having a shitty day have a humanizing effect, that people appreciate being treated like something more than objects even in situations where they aren't necessarily in direct social contact w/others. Am I nuts?

21:45 / 19.09.02

To be honest Deric? I'd sooner get on stage in my underwear than make eye contact with someone I didn't know on the street. Eye contact is like letting a person in, and I think I actually regard street eye contact as a breach of propriety; it's like invading my space. But I don't think I'm an asshole. And if I met you and didn't look you in the eye, it wouldn't be personal or mean. I don't think you should judge this behavior as having a certain value or intent. Maybe you could think of this as a foreign culture experiment. I mean, you wouldn't go to Japan and expect them to shake your hand and slap you on the back. Maybe you could pretend that everyone's Japanese...

Hrrh. But now I've just squirted mustard on my shirt, so maybe that's instant karma for you.

Murray Hamhandler

23:25 / 19.09.02

Maybe that's it. Maybe I'm just too "heart on sleeve", too all about wanting to overcome all of that "walls between us" stuff. I don't know. All I know is that the only alternative for me has been to shut it all off completely. So I'm hurting either way.

00:07 / 20.09.02

and of course staring people out while walking on the street inevitably leads at some point to the alpha male scenario as once happened hilariously to me years ago with the local hardman who nearly crashed his car over a fifty foot drop into a river rather than break eye contact with me. it has also lead once, when i was having a really confident day in my first year of uni, to me and a guy not breaking eye contact chicken style from about ten metres away even to the point where we both watched each other walking by. i'm generally a friendly person and will look down or if i do make eye contact look away again. i hate the scenario when you're walking towards a group of drunk girls though.

00:13 / 20.09.02

Sing with me, Deric!

*lustily*

I am a rock!
I am an i-i-i-i-i-i-island...
And a rock feels no pain
And an island
Ne-ever cries

It's easier to be introverted in this world, I think.

Well, you've always got Barbelith.

Murray Hamhandler

01:28 / 20.09.02

Thank you, Persephone, but I'm actually trying terribly hard to move as far away from what once was practically the anthem of the sovereign nation of Derichollowaynia as I can. As someone who is by nature an extremely sensitive person (in a bit more literal "overreacts to stimuli" than "ponytails and poetry" sense), forcing all of that shit to turn off was a bit like slow death. Painful as it can sometimes (or often) be, the route I'm currently trying to take feels much more right for me.

02:10 / 20.09.02

But seriously, best of luck to you. I was only trying to make you laugh with the singing.

You are reminding me of a book, which I have gotten from upstairs to quote to you (edited for spoilers, as this comes from the end):

I felt... a sense of initiative which was perhaps after all one of the guises of love.... When does one ever know a human being? Perhaps only after one has realized the impossibility of knowledge and renounced the desire for it and finally ceased to feel even the need of it. But then what one achieves is no longer knowledge, it is simply a kind of co-existence; and this too is one of the guises of love.

It's a lovely book --Under The Net by Iris Murdoch, if you haven't read it.

Murray Hamhandler

01:13 / 22.09.02

In the spirit of mirth and good tidings, I, too, shall sing my rebuttal:

My smile is stuck
I cannot go back to your Frownland
My spirit's made up of the ocean
And the sky and the sun and the moon
And all my eye can see
I cannot go back to your land of gloom
Where black jagged shadows
Remind me of the coming of your doom
I want my own land
Take my hand and come with me
It's not too late for you
It's not too late for me
To find my homeland
Where a man can stand by another man
Without an ego flying
With no man lying
And no one dying by an earthly hand
Let the devils burn and the beggar learn
And the little girls that live in those old worlds
Take my kind hand
My smile is stuck
I cannot go back to your Frownland
I cannot go back to your Frownland

And I will indeed look into your book, Persephone. That passage sounds lovely and I am relating very muchly.

STOATIE LIEKS CHOCOLATE MILK

11:17 / 22.09.02

I always took the attitude that it people are that unfriendly, they're probably not the kind of people you want to hang out with anyway. Not easy when you're surrounded by the fuckers, though.

You'll meet the right bunch of people. Cool people are rare enough that they tend to seek each other out.

13:44 / 22.09.02

Thanks for the lyrics, exp - love that song, brings back memories.

Back in school (university) I noted the cold we-are-all-strangers thing, people hung out in groups, it seemed impossible to be accepted into these groups, and being too shy to overcome it, I kept pretty much to myself. (you'd think this is a high school phenomenon but no, it's not) After a while there came the inevitable team work projects, the already-formed groups joined up, and the loners were teamed up as "leftovers". Then suddenly, when being "forced" to work together, we discovered we all had one thing in common: We'd kept to ourselves and wondering how on earth people made friends in this place. We'd all been focusing on the groups and wondering how to join one, instead of noticing the other loners out there. All of us had wished that someone would just stop and say hello. But we didn't, because we were too shy and afraid of being met with a frown and rejected as weirdos. What a waste...

Keep smiling and keep being friendly and just be yourself. Sooner or later you'll come across one of those loners who might just be feeling the same way you do and who'll be thrilled that someone actually reaches out.

Murray Hamhandler

22:33 / 22.09.02

Sounds lovely, Ambicath. I hope it happens. Unfortunately, I've always felt a bit alienated, even among the alienated. So we'll see.

At any rate, I can sense things getting a bit better. A few more friendly faces here and there. Maybe it did just take a little time for people to get adjusted. Now the problem is for me to figure out how to meet/talk to new people. And that, my friends, is a whooole other hill of beans...