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(mis and dis) information

03:29 / 27.12.01

I'm wondering if all of the information we recieve here is currently allowed to exist on the web in a directed effort to frighten us webheads. All over these threads, links abound to frightening controls enacted by the current US govt. There are countless pages detailing the public harrassment of individuals/institutions and the rampant removal of legal civil liberties. Why are these pages still up, and multiplying daily? Assuming at least half of the "conspiracy theories*" are at least half true, why are all these unconventional information sources allowed to continue? Secret services and FBI watchdogs are playing it kind of quiet, but it's a loud kind of quiet here on the web... why make all the noise, if not to convince another animal you're bigger and meaner than you may first appear? It may be a means of scaring us shitless into toeing a party line, to make totalitarians seem everywhere and impossible to counter; to fight the informed with information, as it were.

* - the words "conspiracy theories" seem a little outdated, seeing as how the term has been recontextualized to further fragment public perception.

A

10:33 / 27.12.01

Well, there are a number of possible reasons why information like that on this website is not routinely censored.

Firstly, if a government censors criticism of itself, then that usually lends credibility to those criticisms.

Also, openly totalitarian govenments always eventually fail. If a democratic government is too harsh in dealing with dissent, then it would seem too fascistic, and ordinary folks would be opposed to it. In a free, democratic society, it is important that opposition to the government be tolerated (except perhaps only in the most extreme circumstances), or the society will no longer appear to be free and democratic.

The best way for a government to deal with a "conspiracy theory" about itself which happened to be true would not be to directly deny it, or to attempt to punish peple who spread it, but to ignore it, or, going further, drown it out with competing conspiracy theories, or attack the credibility of those responsible for the theories.

Of course, this is all just hypothetical.

It's late, I hope I'm making sense.

12:37 / 27.12.01

Keep in mind, too, that Joe Average Citizen generally receives news and info from such places as CNN, the local paper and the local news broadcast, MSNBC and the like. None of those sources are especially known for pushing the envelope of news-gathering information. If only say, 5 - 15% of the population pokes around for more information, I don't think that's all too surprising to the government. Besides, that 5 - 15% is likely to be the same group that was all ready being a thorn in the side of "The Establishment" before this happened.

Ya follow? Am I making sense at all?

Unpopular news and actions is released and are put forth on days where it can be kind of ignored or forgotten about. It's basic PR.

For example, I read in my hometown paper that over the weekend, the largest group of reserve troops in over two decades had been called up to active duty. I got a little angry that that story had been released for public consumption on Christmas Eve. Who besides me is reading the paper that day?

Anyway.

The resistable rise of Reidcourchie

12:58 / 27.12.01

This thread seems based on two fallacies.

1). That we are in any way shape or form a threat. We're not and even if we were it would be very is to "spin" that we are just the lunatic fringe.

2). That "they" (pick your own) are not already making use of Barbelith. After all it's free, no tears inteligence work for information on say certain anti-capitalist activities. I would imagine barbelith is a lot more use to intelligence/law enforcement agencies up and running than shut down. I would imagine it would be a matter of course for inteligence agencies to monitor web sites like this, it would seem stupid for them not to and from that how difficult would it be to introduce their own information to the site? Low cost for a disproportionate amount of gain.

13:41 / 27.12.01

quote: I'm wondering if all of the information we recieve here is currently allowed to exist on the web in a directed effort to frighten us webheads.

Welll... considering it's people like us who are seeking out/making this info available, I'd say no. It's gonna be a long time before they have the tools to censor the web, I reckon... even if the tech gets sorted, they'd need to reach an international consensus on the hows and whys of internet policing. Which is a lot more complex that it sounds.

We're frightening ourselves, and unfortunately we might well be justified in that.

13:43 / 27.12.01

You forgot these fallacies

(3) Intelligence agencies cooperate inter- and intra-governmentally in order to present a monolithic portrait of world events. There's no interservice competition.

(4) Intelligence agencies have the time, manpower, and will to effect this "censorship."

(5) All of the people complicit in these coverups (not thousands) are either too dedicated/fearful to expose the machinations of these intelligence agencies.

If the FBI doesn't have the ability track people they have great reason to believe are a clear and present physicaldanger to the US (ie, Mohammed Atta, who was detained at one point), what makes you think they have the ability to track and interdict the mental or semantic or psychological dangers posed by "conspiracy theories" etc.?

A

09:48 / 31.12.01

It's also worth keeping in mind that "they" are probably pretty stupid and incompetent, and not much good at doing anything except following orders.

We're not talking about Lex Luthor or Doctor Doom here, just some right-wing, fundamentalist christian, patriotic, follow-without-questioning types.

We should never attribute to conspiracy what can be put down to stupidity.

The resistable rise of Reidcourchie

09:48 / 31.12.01

You just keep thinking that.