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Crime Scene Investigation - The Comic Book

 
 
Shortfatdyke
06:04 / 04.08.02
i'm a big fan of csi and have just read that there's going to be a comic based on the series. max allan collins is going to write five stories, and gabriel rodriguez is the artist. it's been a long, time time since i bought a comic, so i don't know these names, but it will be in the style of the show and feature the same characters.
 
 
Solitaire Rose as Tom Servo
06:53 / 04.08.02
Max Collins wrote Ms. Tree, a few Batman comics, and is best known for his "Nate Heller" novels that put the Chicago private eye in the middle of just about every historical mystery in the 20th Century (including the Black Dahlia, Amelia Erhardt and the Lindberg kidnapping) which have won a few awards. He wrote the comic of "Road To Perdition" and way too damn many movie novelizations.

He can be a very good writer, but most of the time is an average one.

My question is: Are comic adaptations of TV shows and movies necessary anymore?
 
 
glassonion
10:44 / 04.08.02
more to the point do we need any more hardboiled fucking crime comics? even channel 5 approved ones?
 
 
sleazenation
10:49 / 04.08.02
To which my answer would be, now more than ever comics of tv series are valuable as money spinners - in the UK in the 80's virtually the whole of marvels out put was tie ins to cartoons and films - a generation of UK comcs fans at least came in on this stuff -

if you are looking for an outreach program to get non-traditional comic fans reading comics how better to start them off than by taking familiar characters and settings and creating new stories for them ? many people will buy (witness the success of star trek comics for various publishers and the current vogue for 80's cult classic titles) and a substantial proportion of which will be sufficiently accustomed to the the comcs form and the places you have to go to buy comic to try other things.

Don't get me wrong, i don't think this s the be all and end all solution to the question of getting more prople to buy comics but it is definitely one proven successful way to build an audience.
 
 
sleazenation
10:51 / 04.08.02
For example, its piqued the interest of SFD - someone who would never describe herself as a comics fan... imagine how many more people like her would be sufficently interested...
 
 
Shortfatdyke
11:09 / 04.08.02
ah well, i feel nice and gloomy about this project now.

i used to buy a lot of comics - fantastic four, spiderman, daredevil. stopped buying em when i hit my teens and got politically aware - comics offered me nothing then. i'm unfamiliar with the genre now and don't know whether they'd offer me anything now (apart from hothead paisan). and i wouldn't call csi 'hardboiled crime'. anyway, the main question is, will it be any good? if the stories are good, then i'll buy it. if it's rubbish, i'm not going to collect the set just for the sake of it.

and if someone could recommend me a good comic - i.e. not full of straight white men and huge breasted women (remember i haven't seen a comic since the late 70s/early 80s) with some kind of point to the story, then i'd be happy to give it a go.
 
 
invisible_al
11:31 / 04.08.02
As someone who is gradually becomming hopelessly addicted to the show on channel 5 I think it would be interesting to see if they could pull it off. In the show there isn't much violence except in flashback with lots of different camera techniques being used to show off the 'evidence'. I've never actually seen a 'mystery' comic where its all about whodunnit, well except 'The Mystery Play' by our Grant.

Hmmm OZ, the comic now there's something that would be interesting to see.

Could definately see a few other series that would work if done well, The X-Files is a comic adaptaion that didn't thill me becuase the art was average along with the plotting.
 
 
glassonion
11:46 / 04.08.02
'if the stories are good, then i'll buy it. if it's rubbish, i'm not going to collect the set just for the sake of it.

and if someone could recommend me a good comic - i.e. not full of straight white men and huge breasted women[...]'

well which do you want? good comics or ones without any white men in? you seem to imply they or voluptuous women could have no business in a good comic, and i can't agree. i honestly expect this comic will stink like most tv spinoff comics [i'll admit i don't like the show either. no patch on 'homicide']. i don't mean to get all arsey but, y'know, the weather today has me down. on a positive tip: try the comic FRANK by jim woodring, which has no people in it at all and will make you laugh like drugs.
 
 
sleazenation
12:44 / 04.08.02
well, at the moment we are all discussing a comic that won't be released until december so in a very real sense - none of us know yet if it will be any good... but there are some hopeful signs ... in the past there has been a tradition of getting no-name third rate creators to work on licenced comics but that is clearly not the case here with successful (his past comic has successfully been turned into a film) and award winning (the afore mentioned shamus awards) writer getting the gig. His work could still be terrible here, but there is reason to hope,

Secondly the art style will at least be trying something different with ashley woods drawing the flashback/evidence sequences and another artist with more traditional style doing the rest. now again - this approach might work or it might be awful, but what is encouraging is that these people are puting a lot of thought into their work - it might not 'work' but it won't be a slap-dash cash in....


on the comics for SFD side of things - i think the mainstream book X-force/X-statix fits your critiia for since it is focus is neither exclusively white, straight or male (although it arguably contains some white straight males particularly in in the persona of spike freeman) - it is also politically engaged, (particularly its take on cuba) and critiques the whole media industry and cult of celebrity. Of course just cos it does all these thingsyou might not necessarily like it, but hey - that's always the chance you have to take trying something new.
 
 
Regrettable Juvenilia
14:58 / 04.08.02
do we need any more hardboiled fucking crime comics?

%Yeah, there's a real glut of these fuckers that's just leaving no room for large men in spandex hitting each other, ain't there?%

CSI the comic: bring it on. I'd much rather see an 'original' (ie, not an adaptation, not in the non-existent sense of the word) comic that covers similar ground, but this isn't a bad thing in the meantime.
 
 
yawn - thing's buddy
14:58 / 04.08.02
Seen csi once cos i heard a lot of posi-patter about it - it was o-fuckin-kay. Details were nicey but was well used to that shit from comics weren't we?

But the leader of the gang guy - so camp - gimme Bobby Sixkiller any day and please, will someone help Renegade proove his innocence?

yknow - bobby sixkiller is a really great guy and renegade should thank his lucky stars that he's on his side.
 
 
glassonion
15:11 / 04.08.02
you know despite the hair sixkiller couldn't take down 'beefburger' brubaker. hogan thanks the thunder gods for him. and the crime comics thing you child - not about superheroes but about bad dialogue and the desperate static conjuration of hiaasen and ellroy's reactionary stock atmospheres through so limited a number of techniques. wow the way he lit that cigarette then lectured the ho made me feel really cool.
 
 
Shortfatdyke
15:26 / 04.08.02
"well which do you want? good comics or ones without any white men in?"

i thought it would be pretty obvious to anyone who's read my posts on barbelith that the old fashioned superhero saving a helpless female wouldn't be my kind of thing. i also made it obvious that i'm not a comic purist - this is probably my fourth post in this section of barbelith and you're not inspiring me to return. blaming the weather for being 'arsey' is a bit weak. i think, glassonion, that you might benefit from reading a bit of hothead paisan - a latino femininist militant dyke who's a match for any of your fave characters. plenty of straight white men appear, but they don't tend to survive for very long.

thanks to those who haven't been arsey!
 
 
glassonion
19:08 / 04.08.02
i haven't read a comic with a guy-saves-girl plot in a long time. i doubt many even get made. you don't know much about comics so trust someone who does - read FRANK or XSTATIX and have fun with them like we suggested. i promise you'll enjoy them more than the csi comic you came seeking information about. anyone familiar with my inflammatory remarks on barbelith would be cool enough not to get in an undue twist about them. hothead paisan sounds fun, though i have trouble these days laughing at shit where people get murdered on account of inborn traits or cultural stereotypes. and yeah the weather doesn't forgive lazy rhetoric, but shit at least i gave an excuse.
 
 
bio k9
22:11 / 04.08.02
Are we all done with that now? Good. Thanks for playing.

Did you ever get around to reading From Hell? Mortiary has my mini review of Stray Bullets somewhere, I think. I'll try to find a link.
 
 
bio k9
22:15 / 04.08.02
Magic.
 
 
Solitaire Rose as Tom Servo
01:52 / 05.08.02
Sadly, I don't see a need for comics that spin out of TV shows...the Buffy comic underperforms on a level I didn't think possible, the Star Wars comics don't even sell to the faithful, and most others are just comics they put out to give lesser talents a job until a spot opens up for them on a mediocre series.

SFD, there are TONS of comics that fit your definition, but you have to look for them.

Love and Rockets tells stories or different casts of latinoes and had some of most interesting women ever in comics.

Gloomcookie is gothy fairy tales focusing on women for the most part, but has a lot of odd characters that don't fit the "straight white men" stereotype.

Alan Moore has done a lot of wonderful books about a vast array of people, but Promethia is a job to behold.

Will Eisner's graphic novels are deeply rooted in American Jewish culture.

Stuck Rubber Baby is a graphic novel that I would recommend to anyone who doesn't read comics and deals with the smaller gay right movement within the civil right movement of the 60's.

Any of Grant Morrison's Vertigo stuff deals with people who run the gamut.

For crime stuff, the shelves are starting to fill up with it, but anything by Greg Rucka is worth reading, even if he is workingt with Batman, but Whiteout is a pair of oddly satisfying crime graphic novels set in antartica with a female lead.

(assholery) And Spawn is a black guy (/assholery)
 
 
sleazenation
08:31 / 05.08.02
moving slightly back towards the topic...

the other reason that TV tie in comics can be good for the comics industry is an entirely economic one. They make money. They milk money out of an inbuilt audience, true - but its is a revenue stream that would be lining the pockets of toy- opps i mean 'collectibles' manufacturers (and trading cards publishers etc etc.) otherwise. Some publishers such as Dark Horse use the money they gain from film and tv tie ins to finance non tie-in books - Sure you can say a lot about how poorly Dark horse are currently performing but they have broke Hellboy, sin city and give me liberty, they spear headed the starwars revival - as well as producing for a long time superior licenced titles (Aliens: Hive still ranks as an engaging SF tale while the first Aliens Vs Predator bleeds high class cinematography - of course it is penciled by a hollywood storyboarder...).

Liecenced titles can be poorly produced cash-ins, but they don't have to be and the revenue they create can be used to fund other projects.
 
 
DaveBCooper
10:26 / 05.08.02
I don’t really see the problem with this, to be honest; CSI is a pretty intelligent show (even if the ‘oneliners’ Grissom says before the title sequence have already become a bit forced and cliché), Collins is an established writer of crime-based stuff in a variety of media, and whilst I don’t know the artist doing the bulk of the work, using Ashley Wood’s rather ethereal style to depict the flashbacks seems like a good idea. Certainly suggests that they’ve thought about it.

Whilst intermedia adaptations don’t tend to be very good, they don’t necessarily have to be bad; after all, Grant Morrison threw some tarot references into his Zoids work, and whilst I think the comments above about the art in the X-Files comic raise a fair point, I don’t think the plotting was bad at all – the first year made a single story about the fleeting nature of knowledge and memory, taking in a large number of fortean topics on the way (trepannation, the prophecies of Fatima, etc).
So the stuff can be a cheap cash-in, or it can be better than you’d expect. As someone observed, we have yet to see. But at least there’s some thought been put into the creative team for the title.

As for whether adaptations are good or bad for the medium, I think they’re neutral. But when it comes to whether they’re good or bad for the business side, well, they might get people into comic shops who don’t normally go into them, and a bit of browsing might well lead them to find other things they’re interested in, be that some small press stuff, some more crime-based stuff, or even a superhero title because it reminds them of how much they enjoyed Spider-Man at the flicks this summer. Whatever.
I’m all for getting the ‘next generation of comic readers’ into the shops by making titles which may appeal to them easily available, but it never hurts to have some real-life actual grown-ups (as sfd seems to be, judging from the generally very articulate posts of hers I’ve seen) buying too…

DBC
 
 
glassonion
20:04 / 05.08.02
i thought we were done? well i'll let you have your stray bullets without having to read your review, but you aren't really trying to describe from hell as a crime comic are you? personally i liked the accents but thought the whole whodunnit theory quite unlikely. obviously spinoff comics are still always poo and warp mass appreciation of the medium in an unfortunate way. max allan collins writes like he hasn't read anything written after 1937 and ashley wood well
 
 
Solitaire Rose as Tom Servo
22:25 / 05.08.02
I'd disagree that MAC hasn't read anything after 1937....I'd put it more around 1959 or so, since he is HIGHLY influenced by Mickey Spillane, and says as much in his interviews.
 
 
bio k9
09:40 / 06.08.02
Um, my comments about From Hell & Stray Bullets were directed towards SFD. And no, I wasn't calling either of them crime comics, just recommending a couple of good comics - not full of straight white men and huge breasted women.
 
 
glassonion
16:51 / 06.08.02
c'mon: loads of straight men and huge breasted women in from hell - the gay characters that spring to mind behave horribly. crime comics / comics with crimes in. stray bullets gets compared with scorsese a lot but most of the characters aren't gangsters and teenage drama issues seem more its thing. and i mean tv spinoffs, because the kiss spinoff comic rocks. sorry if i confused folk, tetchy tetchy.
 
  
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