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Citizen Spies, or "How I learned to stop worrying and love the witch hunt."

 
 
Yagg
03:50 / 15.07.02
Ok, this is scary.

http://www.smh.com.au/articles/2002/07/14/1026185141232.html

US planning to recruit one in 24 Americans as citizen spies
By Ritt Goldstein
July 15 2002

The Bush Administration aims to recruit millions of United States citizens as domestic informants in a program likely to alarm civil liberties groups.

The Terrorism Information and Prevention System, or TIPS, means the US will have a higher percentage of citizen informants than the former East Germany through the infamous Stasi secret police. The program would use a minimum of 4 per cent of Americans to report "suspicious activity".

Civil liberties groups have already warned that, with the passage earlier this year of the Patriot Act, there is potential for abusive, large-scale investigations of US citizens.

As with the Patriot Act, TIPS is being pursued as part of the so-called war against terrorism. It is a Department of Justice project.

Highlighting the scope of the surveillance network, TIPS volunteers are being recruited primarily from among those whose work provides access to homes, businesses or transport systems. Letter carriers, utility employees, truck drivers and train conductors are among those named as targeted recruits.



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A pilot program, described on the government Web site www.citizencorps.gov, is scheduled to start next month in 10 cities, with 1 million informants participating in the first stage. Assuming the program is initiated in the 10 largest US cities, that will be 1 million informants for a total population of almost 24 million, or one in 24 people.

Historically, informant systems have been the tools of non-democratic states. According to a 1992 report by Harvard University's Project on Justice, the accuracy of informant reports is problematic, with some informants having embellished the truth, and others suspected of having fabricated their reports.

Present Justice Department procedures mean that informant reports will enter databases for future reference and/or action. The information will then be broadly available within the department, related agencies and local police forces. The targeted individual will remain unaware of the existence of the report and of its contents.

The Patriot Act already provides for a person's home to be searched without that person being informed that a search was ever performed, or of any surveillance devices that were implanted.

At state and local levels the TIPS program will be co-ordinated by the Federal Emergency Management Agency, which

was given sweeping new powers, including internment, as part of the Reagan Administration's national security initiatives. Many key figures of the Reagan era are part of the Bush Administration.

The creation of a US "shadow government", operating in secret, was another Reagan national security initiative.

(Ritt Goldstein is an investigative journalist and a former leader in the movement for US law enforcement accountability. He has lived in Sweden since 1997, seeking political asylum there, saying he was the victim of life-threatening assaults in retaliation for his accountability efforts. His application has been supported by the European Parliament, five of Sweden's seven big political parties, clergy, and Amnesty and other rights groups.)

Maybe someone is "writing me up" right now for having posted this.
 
 
Naked Flame
08:28 / 15.07.02
Sooooo glad I don't live in the US.

Any of you want to emigrate, UK Barbeloids may well have floor space.
 
 
MJ-12
11:28 / 15.07.02
Following Goldstein's cited url to http://www.citizencorps.gov/tips.html
seems to suggest a toll free number to be distributed as a clearinghouse for this kind of info, which would seem merely, IMO, of limited usefullness, except for Goldstein's comparison with the Stasi, which makes it almost farcical. I take it he's got some research beyond this?
 
 
Baz Auckland
13:41 / 15.07.02
It seems less scary if you look at the official site and see that they're unpaid informants. You could take the wording to be "we're recruiting you to keep a look out and report any suspicious activity and here's the number." Which is a bit scary, but not as scary as the article makes out...yet. I'm getting flashes of 'Radio Free Albemuth'.

That Freedom Corps stuff is damn wierd though.
 
 
Slim
15:09 / 15.07.02
Christ almighty. Well, I suppose I could become a double agent and backstab my own government. Citizen spies. Shit.
 
 
Our Lady of The Two Towers
15:51 / 15.07.02
If I'm being charitable I'd say 'beefed up neighbourhood watch', if I'm paranoid I'd say '1984 and we're turning in the darkies, not our parents.' The next logical step would be the legalisation of cocaine so that the paranoid culture will bloom.
 
 
Grendix
18:21 / 15.07.02
so i was gonna post on this topic today, and someone beat me to it. all the better. holy CRAP!! what is this shite? man, i live in america, and this, on a deep paranoid level scares the shit outta me. i mean, sure if someone was poking around a nuclear plant, i'd want it stopped, but if i was ranting about what godawful theiving prick mr w. is i'd want to be able to rant at my leasure. you don't like it, walk away. don't report me to the MAN fer jeebus' sake!

also... people who are told/trained to spy, well, if it's a slow week, might go so far as to make stuff up. hells bells, it's common knowledge in america... end of the month, don't be caught speeding. if the local cops haven't made the QUOTA they need to to bring in revnue for the force, more people get tickets. so... let's translate that to: "hmmm, I've only got three terror-suspects this month, got to get 10 to get that set of tickets to the baseball game that I want, who's been pissin' me off lately?" see? it's just that simple. also..who will take these jobs? the most well adjusted people with broad social circles? The pepole who may have felt picked on and want revenge? did none of these people ever see CARRIE?? I've been debating about getting my passport. Debate's over. I mean to get one asap (money willing)

ok... done ranting for now. hopefully the fucking patriot act won't have them coming in to my house when i'm not here to search for things, and not tell me, and plant bugs i don't have to be informed about, constitutionally. yay america.. sheesh. i love this place, honest i do. but this is TOOO far.

~keepin' it real, yo since 1983~
 
 
Yagg
02:18 / 16.07.02
BA: 'It seems less scary if you look at the official site and see that they're unpaid informants. You could take the wording to be "we're recruiting you to keep a look out and report any suspicious activity and here's the number."'

Well, ok, maybe. But all I can think about are how stupid and vindictive so many people are, and how they'll be just jumping up and down to volunteer, and then turning in everyone who looks at them wrong. Actually, in that, I see the seeds of the whole project's downfall. They're going to get so many cases that are just pure bullshit that it'll drain all the resources and the whole thing will fold.
 
 
Kit-Cat Club
11:47 / 16.07.02
Actually, I bet the whole purpose of the exercise is to keep the American public in a state of nervousness about war, terror, and so on, so that the administration can maintain the war on terror (which must by definition have no boundaries and be able to be redirected at any given moment according to the location of the latest manifestation of 'terror') for an indefinite length of time.
 
 
w1rebaby
11:58 / 16.07.02
KKC: I agree. A hotline's unlikely to make all that much difference, given that you could already call up the cops and say "y'know, I think my neighbour's building a bomb". But constant reinforcement of the "anyone could be a terrorist, let's all fight this together" message is required to keep TWAT going. Otherwise people might start thinking or something.
 
 
Naked Flame
13:12 / 16.07.02
there's gonna be a lot of this kind of thing....
 
 
Sebastian
13:19 / 17.07.02
If this is part of a "the US will become a living hell" plan, then it seems to be working.
 
 
Baz Auckland
14:54 / 17.07.02
I haven't been able to find any links yet, but:

My brother who watches a lot of PBS, Discovery, A&E, etc. told me that there is a current system of government informants that is pretty horrible. Convicted murderers and drug traffickers are given suspended sentences and are actually paid by the number of people they turn in. There are unsuprisingly a lot of abuses and false tips given.
 
 
invisible_al
16:03 / 17.07.02
The other fun part of the DEA's efforts with drug traffickers are the fortfiture laws. That criminals loose anything that is deemed to be bought with profits from drugs, these then go into the DEA and law enforcement budget. Nice little system they've got there and it no way corrupt or open to abuse.
Oh can I be the first person to whisper McCarthy in this thread? It really has that wiff to it.
 
 
Mr Tricks
00:04 / 18.07.02
Well, the postoffice just declined the invitation to become Spies . . . Hope?
 
 
Yagg
04:17 / 18.07.02
"Oh can I be the first person to whisper McCarthy in this thread? It really has that wiff to it."

Yup. I was going to call the thread "The Return of Red Hunter Joe" or somesuch. If you look at the Cold War as a model, you might expect something analagous to the Red Scare to come along, now that we have a new war to fight.

I don't mean to demean the fact that yes, this nation is just now waking up to the danger of terrorism, and yes, it needs to be dealt with. But this just does NOT sound right to me.
 
 
Fist of Fun
11:19 / 18.07.02
Before anybody else says this, I put dibs on reporting you all and if anybody else does it too I demand a 25% cut of all rewards they recover.

Because America may no longer be the land of the free, but it sure is the land of the businessman.
 
 
Hieronymus
20:06 / 27.07.02
Fight fire with fire. Just don't do it with a straight face.

Operations TIPS-TIPS is now active for you to report TIPS informants.

And an example of the TIPS phone directory to boot.
 
 
penitentvandal
11:49 / 28.07.02
I say sign up and bombard 'em with false information. Tell 'em David Hasselhoff is Bin Laden in disguise, or something slightly more plausible. Tie the spy network up chasing so many false leads it falls apart.

Operation Mindfuck rides again!
 
 
STOATIE LIEKS CHOCOLATE MILK
11:57 / 28.07.02
I think the cat's right- the very existence of the project (and its being common knowledge) will do more to frighten people (sorry... meant "put them on the alert") than any actual results to come out of it, most (if not all), I'll wager will be ignored anyway for all the reasons people have mentioned above.
 
 
Grey Area
16:35 / 28.07.02
According to a friend of mine whose mother works for the USPS, postal workers are already obliged to report anything suspicous to a department in the postal service. People posting ticking parcels, suspicious behaviour in households observed while making the rounds and the like. So this whole refusal to participate in TIPS isn't really taking a stand for civil liberties...it's just the USPS not wanting to duplicate already existing procedures.
 
  
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