Subcultural engagement for the 21st Century...
Barbelith is a new kind of community (find out more)...
You can login or register.

Underground > Temple >

Modern Magick - Lesson One

Page: (1)2 3

17:01 / 21.06.02

I figured I'd start this thread for those people who've gotten a start on this and want to start discussing it. So, has anyone started working on this yet?

17:35 / 21.06.02

Well, I've started reading through the chapter and keeping a dream diary, and will start in on the first ritual tonite. I'm already struggling with the urge to just skip ahead - I've done a lot of work similar to the first two rituals already, and I'm having trouble imagining that they'll keep me entertained for a month.

But yep, I am working on it already.

19:44 / 21.06.02

I've started as well. I put my "Dream Diary" by my bed last night, and was rewarded!

I was meeting someone, a Zen master/dope dealer, because I wanted to get together with him the following week to buy some pot. We were in some sort of indoor bazaar, lots of people and little stalls or booths selling this and that.

He put me off as far as the meeting went, but told me to kneel. After a moment's hesitation, I did, and receieved a transmission, an empowerment, from him as he lay his hand on my forehead. As I knelt, a girl knelt behind me and clung onto my back, in hopes (I gathered) of catching any "spill off". When I opened my eyes again, she smiled at me, and I pinched her cheek.

In my dream, this Master seemed to be a very familiar figure to me, someone I'd encountered a number of times.

I view this as being a positive omen, especially since I typically have such a terrible time holding onto dreams once I've woken up. I plan to finish reading the chapter today, and will start working the rituals tonight....

03:05 / 22.06.02

I started a little early with the practices, haven't gotten anywhere with the dream diary... nothing more than the occasional random fragment that may pop up hours after I've gotten out of bed and am away from my diary. But, I'm combining the Tarot ritual with my morning yoga and meditation (and a bit of Liber MMM) and seeing lots of things I'd never noticed before in my cards. So far, so good!

15:51 / 22.06.02

FYI, here's a moon-phase program you can download for use with one's Ritual Diary....

16:12 / 22.06.02

I've started a separate livejournal here for the work on Modern Magick. I expect I'll keep my hand-written journals as well, but this seems a decent mechanism for sharing. I've added Trijhaos and Ms. Woo as friends there... Any other participants who want to add themselves, feel free.

18:56 / 22.06.02

I'm not even going to bother with Kraig's interpretation of the tarot. I'm going to look around online and see if I can't find something different. Kraig's interpretations seem a little odd.

On the other hand, I've had great succcess with the dream diary. I've actually been able to write down some fragments instead of waking up, picking up my pencil and not being able to write anything.

As for those people who feel like skipping ahead; go for it. I planned on starting a new thread every week or two. This is a post as you go type deal so if you want to skip ahead to lesson 2,3,4 or whatever start up a thread, there are probably others out there that are wanting to skip ahead too.

solid~liquid onwards

10:40 / 23.06.02

pah,
my copy is orderd but not here yet :P :'( me is working 5 days a week, 10 hours a day...so when im not sleeping m working :P...this s the first time on the nt for a week... but on the plus side im learning to apreciate the litle time i got...sincei aint always gt tommorow to d stuff im beoming less lazy

20:35 / 24.06.02

Dream diary: good practice

Tarot interpretations: I quite like the fact that he starts out by saying, "This is my interpretation of the Golden Dawn interpretation. After a while, you can go make your own." That's where he hooks me - cool! The actual interpretations, eh.... I *am* interested in the idea that Waite et al put *false imagery* in the cards/interpretations to "preserve the secrets of the Order." Never heard that before....

Ritual diary: Only now do I realize how difficult it is to get 30 minutes to myself every day. Also, the first "relaxation" ritual is really close to some tai chi/qi gong internal work stuff, but I surprised myself by having a *lot* of trouble with it. I tried it lying down, see, and I'm totally used to doing that sort of thing with my feet on the ground, and the energy coming from the ground and from the dan t'ien, just below the stomach, instead of up from the feet themselves.

Otherwhat: I sort of surprised myself by not having a problem with the White Magick/Grey Magick/Black Magick splitting, since he clarifies that not all self-centered magick is necessarily "bad," only bringing harm to others is "bad." Which is pretty simple. However, he *really* rankled me with his offhand dismissing of Voudou as "simple" magick. I'd expect a guy who knows what a veve is to know that it's not just about assembling something and saying a few empty words, but about parlaying with spiritual entities & saints! Dammit!

But I'm gonna get what I can from his thang. The fact that he encourages further reading and doesn't mystify Crowley or any of the other Euro-mages is a point in favor.

Boy in a Suitcase

21:16 / 24.06.02

Arrgh–been behind on magick! Was going to do some TOPY stuff last night too but that fell through... bah. When are we planning to move on to the LBRP?

A. E. Waite also claimed that he had the "one, true interpretation" of the tarot that nobody else would ever, ever, never come close to figuring out. Which is kind of bullshit, but if I thought that Waite was capable of it, I would say that such a statement is kind of zen–like in the beginning of "Willow" where the village sorceror asks Willow to point to which of his fingers has magic power, and the right answer is for Willow to point to his own–nobody could figure out Waite's one true interpretation because it was Waite's that would only work for him?

The Return Of Rothkoid

22:53 / 24.06.02

Just started with ritual part of it today, though the mere act of writing down dreams (which I've been doing for about three days) has ensured that I'm already remembering/dreaming more. Cool stuff.

Like Cholister, I find Kraig's approach a bit !!! at times, but can handle it - mostly. The dismissiveness annoys, though.

The ritual parts so far have worked well: the relaxation part seemed to have some kind of good effect - particularly as I felt involuntary muscle movement (other than relaxing - felt like there was actually a ball rolling around, say) while carrying it out. Maybe a fluke? Maybe. But am continuing on, and taking this as a good sign. There'll be a bit of adjustment as I lose a day when I head home, but I'll be sticking with it - maybe just a bit more slowly than y'all...

06:33 / 25.06.02

The slow pace works for me, but I'm viewing it all like I viewed picking up an exercise program: before getting in shape, one must get in shape for getting in shape. I don't want to pull an astral ligament or anything. But maybe the experienced folk might want to move at a lesson-per-week until things pick up. Don't gnaw your legs off or anything.

One thing that I've learned is that I'm much better at remembering my dreams when I'm a lazy do-nothing burden on society: the alarm is murder on my dream recall. I'm going to just keep journaling what I can and see how it goes, and see if I can wake up on time with no alarm if there is no improvement by the end of the weekend.

Regarding tarot contemplation: Are folks generally using a new set of interpretations (Kraig's or someone else's), or going with what you already know? I'm curious as to whether I'm Forming the Associations of a Lifetime (to overdramatize) or if you change divination associations slightly less often than you change socks.

grant: Have you tried generating the energy from the point you're familiar with, and from there continuing as written? I mean, I'm sure it's good to change one's habits around, but the battle of feet vs. dan t'ien might not be worth fighting. *shrug*

Boy in a Suitcase

01:45 / 26.06.02

Hmm. How consistent are we all going to be reporting our results? Should everybody get a blog or livejournal?
So far I've been doing just the Relaxation Ritual. I used to do this a lot, but going back to it now I discovered something cool–you can do it for your internal organs too! You guys should try this, I was pretty amazed that I could actually sense and relax my organs, even my heart–maybe with work it could be like a ninja master slow-down-the-heart technique! What I did was the basic exercise where I ran the old golden ball all over my external body, then I moved up all of my bones and then all of the major organs (couldn't find my gall bladder or anything like that though). It was neat. You can actually relax them.

04:35 / 26.06.02

Is there any place you can D/L Modern Magick? Im currently poorer than..than...um..a really poor guy and cant afford the cash. Although I would like to start MM to see what result I can get and the differences from the Chaos Mag. books i've been twirling through.

06:55 / 26.06.02

"How consistent are we all going to be reporting our results? Should everybody get a blog or livejournal?"

I don't really have any objections to blogging results, but I don't think I'd have anything useful/interesting to post for a while. I'm just doing a relaxation at night, and a relaxation to tarot contemplation in the morning, to try and develop that "I'm still trancy while looking at the card" sensation--kind of like learning to waft a soap bubble across the room with a straw. It's interesting to me but presumably boring to the outside world.

16:29 / 29.06.02

Is anybody else running into lots of repeats in the Tarot meditation? I'm pulling cards I've already seen more often than I'm getting new cards: The Fool twice, The Magician twice, The Priestess three times...

I'm about ready to "retire" a card after I've seen it three times, or at least pull it out of the abridged deck for a week.

17:26 / 29.06.02

Is there any place you can D/L Modern Magick?

There probably is someplace, but I couldn't tell you where. If you're really interested, I suppose I could type up parts of the lessons and some of the basic information that goes with the rituals, kind of like an introductory packet.

Is anybody else running into lots of repeats in the Tarot meditation?

I just started running into this problem last night. I'm thinking about pulling a card out of circulation after I've contemplated it once, since I probably won't get any new feelings/insights/intuitions about it.

03:37 / 30.06.02

Trijhaos: Thanks, that would be most appreciated.

03:52 / 30.06.02

I didn't want to pull the repeats out right away - most decks use very densely layered imagery, and mine is no exception; I've definitely gotten more out of the cards the second time through. The third time through, my inspiration gets a little thin...

You might want to ask the card what it hasn't shown you yet when you draw it a second time.

16:35 / 30.06.02

I'm with iszabelle: I wouldn't be in such a hurry. The "contemplation" takes three minutes; stick with it, I'd suggest.

Consider that the practical aspect of Soto Zen consists of not a lot more than watching yourself breathe.

Solitaire Rose as Tom Servo

16:44 / 30.06.02

I picked up the book on Half.com and it showed up yesterday...LOTS of info in it, but I see that the first set of lessons are the same as the Chaos Magick book I picked up two weeks ago...guess everyone starts in the same place.

Tuna Ghost: Pratt knot hero

16:57 / 30.06.02

Tarot interpretations: I quite like the fact that he starts out by saying, "This is my interpretation of the Golden Dawn interpretation. After a while, you can go make your own." That's where he hooks me - cool! The actual interpretations, eh.... I *am* interested in the idea that Waite et al put *false imagery* in the cards/interpretations to "preserve the secrets of the Order." Never heard that before....

I have not read Modern Magick (yet. This thread has made me interested), but yeah, Kenneth Grant went on in his Practical Guide to Qabalistic Symbolism about how the Golden Dawn deliberately recorded misinterpretations on the tarot to keep the real meanings secret, but suggests that one needs to find the proper interpretations by one's self with practice.

Quick note about dream diaries and lucid dreaming: Maybe it was just a coincidence, but when I started recording dreams and doing lucid dreaming exercises, within days I started having several vivid dreams a night, and it has not stopped yet, over a full year later. Too many dreams to record, which is a shame, because I keep having deja vu of scenes from these dreams. Oh well. I suppose I should keep an eye on the one where I was a hermaphrodite and had sex with myself, though.

Boy in a Suitcase

03:18 / 01.07.02

Think that's Gareth Knight, not Kenneth Grant, unless you have a different book than me.

Tuna Ghost: Pratt knot hero

18:36 / 01.07.02

Ah, fuck. I knew that, I promise. It's sitting right in front of me, for christ's sake...

The Return Of Rothkoid

11:46 / 02.07.02

My moving home is currently playing merry hell with my sticking with the program - I get home and COLLAPSE, mostly - but I am still going to plug on through...

14:11 / 02.07.02

I've learned that a bad cold is not conducive to ritual.

Boy in a Suitcase

19:23 / 02.07.02

Anybody started the LBRP yet? I just did, haven't done these for a couple of years–for some reason it feels really really fucking great to be doing it again!
So far I've been continuing my dream diary, doing the tarot meditations (previous to all this I had already been learning the tarot correpondences from 777, which is why I've been asking all those tarot question, and doing a bunch of tarot meditations by Bill Heidrick–http://hermetic.com/heidrick/tarot_meditations.html–I'm up to the Hanged Man), and I've done three LBRPs so far.

20:32 / 02.07.02

And I've learned that stupid heat is not conducive to ritual.

Question: is anyone else actually seeing (in any form) the energy ball in the relaxation ritual? Although I can feel the effects, I can't "see" a damned thing, despite Kraig's assurances that I should be able to. Also, I have trouble focusing on the "golden ball" concept - when I think of the energy moving like a red laser scan across my body, it works much better. Too much sci fi, obviously.

I've only recently started in on the Tarot meditations, so I probably won't be starting in with the LBRP for at least another week. Right now, I'm mostly focused on the non-text lesson in all of this: the process of reclaiming more time for myself out of each day.

21:10 / 02.07.02

Ha! With me, it's a blue photocopier flash scanning up the body!
I got closer to gold (and it was a visual) while lying in a hot bath, but there came knocking on the door, shattering the concentration.

I'm pretty sure it's not a visible visual thing, more of a visualizing thing. Like closing eyes and knowing what your body looks like without opening them.

21:56 / 02.07.02

I can't "see" the golden ball at all. I know it's there and I can "feel" it's effects. This is what makes the LBRP so much fun. I don't "see" the flaming blue pentagrams, no matter how hard I try. I can "feel" the energy though. When I touch the space where my pentagrams should be, I can feel the energy they give off.

I've tried all those silly visualization exercises too. Drawing a blue cicle on a piece of cardstock, staring at it for a minute and then taking it away so that I'm left with the after-image. None of them have worked.

Of course, my experiments with the LBRP were before I started this particular course so maybe things have changed. I probably won't start the LBRP until Monday which is probably when I'll be finished with the tarot contemplation and it just feels appropriate for some reason.

01:43 / 03.07.02

Interesting. I hadn't realized until now that I'm not "seeing" the golden ball either... some things I can easily visualize with my eyes closed, but this isn't one of them and I'm not sure why. I feel it (warm and kind of fizzy/charged - almost like a small static electricity charge) and it does relax my muscles, but there's no visual component. Since it seems to be working, I'm not sure that matters.

01:52 / 03.07.02

"Visualization" isn't visual for everyone. People have different predominant senses. I'd guess that Trijhaos and iszabelle are primarily "kinesthetic" people, who relate through feeling rather than seeing.

No problem; go with what you're good at, I'd say. There are exercises one can do to improve one's literal visualization skills, but they're frankly pretty tedious...

04:48 / 03.07.02

I'm pretty strongly visually oriented - think visually, build visual models for dealing with abstract stuff, occasionally do better at communicating with diagrams than words... that's why I was so surprised to find that there was no golden ball in my golden ball. Maybe it's because I'm trying to do something that's kinesthetic? Either that or the time I've put into yoga and other body-centering exercises is starting to pay off?

Anyway, I'm not complaining. It does work. I may try really hard for a couple of days to put the golden ball into the visualization, just as an exercise, and see if it gets in the way of relaxing at all.

Boy in a Suitcase

04:50 / 03.07.02

When I visualize things, I tend not to "see" them but to experience them as certainties if that makes sense–I see them with something that is less than visual sight and more than just imagination; I do viscerally experience them but do not get a visual register. Maybe I'm a kinesthetic person, too.

16:02 / 03.07.02

I keep dropping the ball about mid-thigh. A train of thought always happens by at that time, and I forget what I'm doing. After a minute or so I remember and continue without much further distraction.

Page: (1)2 3