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The Fall

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15:24 / 03.05.02

Surely a group who absolutely everyone has an opinion on? Spurred into action by this thread, I've just dug out my entire Fall collection and am now going through it, record by record. General opinion seems to have it that Smith lost it in a big way fifteen or sixteen years ago, and that everything since I Am Kurious Oranj has been pish.

I disagree. Early Fall stuff is still astonishing and there's no way that the later albums have had any chance of being as good as, say, Slates or Hex Enduction Hour, but the most recent records seem to have regained whatever it was that was missing for the majority of the 90's. Above all, they're still a brilliant covers group.

What say you?

Matthew Fluxington

18:51 / 03.05.02

I think that one very important thing to keep in mind when analyzing The Fall discography is Mark E. Smith's ever-changing cast of supporting players, so that accounts for some of the variation in quality. I think there are certain key band members who elevate Smith, certainly Craig Scanlon, Brix Smith, and Julia Nagle chief among them.

I found a really good quote about this:

"I've always got a reserve force with The Fall. Anyone gets stroppy with me, I've always got subs. Every time, I take no musician for granted. I don't like musicians. They elevate themselves, which is detrimental to the name of The Fall. I don't hold auditions, and it's a nasty thing to say, but it's like a platoon sort of thing. If the first three get shot you have another three behind them." Mark E. Smith, from SELECT January 1998.

Anyway, I think Mark really loses it through most of the 90s, and I really have no idea why. Levitate, Cerebral Caustic, Middle Class Revolt, etc - they are just dull records, the best I can say about them is that a boring, watered-down Mark E. Smith is still far more interesting than most singers.

I think Julia Nagle was a good foil for Smith, I think the more industrial keyboard/percussion that she offered up really suited MES in a way that was true to the spirit of The Fall while being fresh and different in context. I stand by my assessment that The Unutterable is among the best Fall records ever released - it's vicious and vital, it sounds like MES getting a strong second wind, and I think that's carrying on to the new record Are You Are Missing Winner?, though Nagle is no longer in the band.

14:38 / 19.11.02

For info (leading to a question): Voiceprint are re-releasing many of the Fall's studio albums on CD, and apparently in their original order, starting with Live at the Witch Trials and Dragnet (both in the shops now). You can tell them apart from any other CD versions by the big '+' which has been added to the title - possibly to indicate that this version has additional tracks (mostly singles from the relevant period) or because you get a free mystery album with each one (which you have to send off for, and which is being put together by MES. No one knows yet what will be on it). The guy who is chiefly responsible for putting these together is a longterm regular of Fallnet, the fans' mailing list, and a trustworthy sort. He hopes that these will, at last, provide decent versions of the albums after years of duff, half-hearted efforts by careless cash-in labels.

Now, has anyone heard 'Dragnet+' yet, and if so, whaddya think of it? To my ears the bass is waaaaaaaay too high. Many of the tracks are swamped in a continuous boom or rumble, so that it sounds like you're listening to it in a room under a motorway bridge. I know Dragnet has always been famous for its rough production, but this doesn't seem necessary. It's a shame because in all other respects the sound is great.

My only other experience of Dragnet is from a vinyl copy, which I don't think is an original. Has anyone heard an original vinyl copy, that they could compare with this version?

15:25 / 19.11.02

Well, I had pretty much given up on newer Fall, but then found Marshall Suite used and that has since become my favorite Fall CD by far. Check it out.

Red Cross Iodized Salt

23:39 / 19.11.02

From what I've heard, those Fall reissues are about as good as you'll find. They're supposedly a big improvement on the Cog Sinister ones from a few years back (which were apparently mastered from someone's record collection - the CD version of Live at the Witch Trials even had the needle skipping).

I think I saw a vinyl reissue of Grotesque in a record store the other week - anybody know who put that out?

The Return Of Rothkoid

01:06 / 20.11.02

Hmm. I need to hear some of this. Given that I haven't.

Sad, but true.

12:45 / 20.11.02

Has anyone heard Mark E. Smith's new 'spoken word' album?

John Peel's been playing extracts from it and, well, it's completely, utterly, brilliantly insane .. apparently the CD consists of a single 70 minute track (ala Sonic Youth's Sonic Death), with Smith's rantings (he sounds like a paranoid stand-up who's gone completely off the deep end half way through a performance, reading extracts from old military memoirs and yelling corny playground gags in a terrifying high-pitched voice) fading in and out randomly over the top of layers of fuzzy noise and industrial clanging, with various other bits of dialogue and found sounds including a woman with a heavy Japanese accent repeating everything MES says..

Says Mr. Peel: "Well he certainly hasn't become any more predictable in his old age".

08:28 / 14.02.03

News of next 'proper' Fall album, from Fallnet:

"Country On The Click" will be released in April. Here's
what you will hear.

1. Theme From Sparta F.C.

2. Protien Protection

3. Mountain Energei

4. Contraflow

5. Green-Eyed Loco Man

6. Last Commands Of Of XYRALOPHEP Via M.E.S

7. Boxoctosis

8. Ho(e)uston

9. The Past

10. Recovery Kit

11. Mike Love Xexagon

12. Susan Vs. Youth Club

10:08 / 14.02.03

That's some amazing song title action..

The Natural Way

12:23 / 20.02.03

I just want to second Flux's bigging-up of the Unutterable and, whilst I'm hardly familiar with all the band's early stuff, I can't believe tunes like Dr. Buck's Letter, Cyber-Insekt, Two Librans or Serum don't fall well within the best-thing-ever category. In my ignorance, I dispute you, Dupre!

Eject all spy-cassetes (or "sponacassetes" as I used to call them when I were a youngcock)! Destroy Dupre!

12:29 / 20.02.03

The Fall's pretty good, but I think they pale in comparison to the Mekons. Same general idea-politically, but more accessable to those of us from across the pond from England.

13:10 / 20.02.03

Oddly enough, it's the inaccessibility which appeals to me most about The Fall. The fact that, unlike other bands, I can listen to any given Fall song and not have the faintest idea where the band are coming from or what MES is going on about.. makes things more interesting.

22:28 / 20.02.03

Knickers. I don't want to come across as some faux-nostalgic wanker here. Anyhow, Runcemeboy, with the exception of Cyber-Insekt you're talking about tracks off albums from The Marshall Suite onwards, which was where Smith started getting his act back together, and The Infotainment Scan was something of a positive blip in the middle of some fairly piddling releases. Code:Selfish, Shift-Work and Middle Class Revolt, for example, don't have much going for them (save Free Range, which gives me multiple eargasms).

Mind you, he did collaborate with Inspiral Carpets on their only good (fucking great, actually) song - I Want You - around this time, so it's certainly not all bad.

Get your listening gear around the Psykick Dancehall compilation, sir. Bingo Master's Breakout, It's The New Thing, In My Area and How I Wrote 'Elastic Man' will eat yr head.

02:53 / 21.02.03

3 of the tracks were off 'The Unutterable' (wish I could write that phonetically.)

'Das Katerer' is also great. But 'Pumpkin soup and Mashed Potatoes' is not.

The album is half-great.

10:45 / 05.03.03

This might interest some of you:

The Fall Multimedia Project

Assorted Fall vids, tv appearances etc. Currently available for download:

Hit the North (Roxy), Telephone thing (Promo), outtake from the UK DVD of 24 hour party people featuring an actor playing Mark (with an authentic looking jumper), I'm Frank (from The Late
Show) and MES on Adam and Joe's 'Vinyl Justice'.

The Natural Way

11:45 / 05.03.03

'I Want You' is superb.

15:31 / 05.03.03

Indeed. For a long time I thought Smith should give up the Fall and just do collaborations. I recommend you check out Heads of Dead Surfers (with Long Fin Killie), Plug Myself In (with D.O.S.E.) and the original version of Inch (with, erm, Inch, who I think were the D.O.S.E. chaps in disguise) if you haven't already. Ooh, and the tracks he did with Elastica.

16:06 / 05.03.03

My last post was full of gibberish, wasn't it? For some reason, I was confusing Dr. Buck's Letter with F-'oldin' Money (bucks = money, see?) and Cyber-Insekt with Ladybird. Idiot.

Red Cross Iodized Salt

03:05 / 06.03.03

Cheers Sav - those clips are great. I particularly love the Adam and Joe one...Smith in fine form there.

08:01 / 28.11.03

REQUEST:

One of the fall site chappies recently offered to sort out a page devoted to listing and verifying (or dismissing) the various cock-and-bull stories that make up the Fall legend*. eg: that Motown were going to sign them until they heard The Classical, or that Miles Davis wanted to hire the Fall's rhythm section.

So, we need to compile a list. Apart from the two mentioned above, what other classic anecdotes have you heard? If you've got any evidence to support or discredit them (or even just an intelligent reckoning) then that would be good too.

at the scarwash

00:25 / 02.01.04

On the topic of M.E.S.ian goodness/badness as is currently manifested in the recordings and playings of the Fall: I've not heard the new one, but I did see them in July. It was an absolute monster of a performance. M.E.S. was very together for the first hour, and the band super god damned ferocious tight. The songlist was massive, and consisted mostly of recent work, which was awesome. For some reason, "And Therein" was my favorite of the show. Mr. Smith's prodigious pre-set Heineken-consumption ultimitely caught up with him about halfway through. He kept turning up the bands' amps until the volume was rib-crushing, and ended up stealing all of the backup mics until there was an impenetrable tangle of cords heaped on the drum riser, and no backup vocals at all. Killer show, over all.

16:24 / 02.01.04

Inevitably, I've heard most of the new Fall album on John Peel and (IMHO) it's an absolute cracker - possibly some of the best Fall stuff I've ever heard.. some of it's quite experimental, yet oddly user friendly and accessible.. there's some huge, rocking tracks and some strange quieter guitar melody/spoken word ones and.. I may have to go out and buy it I think..

Mister Six, whom all the girls

17:11 / 05.01.04

I'm just making a copy of the new Fall Lp, the new Fall Protein XMas EP, and the downloadable Peel session from the site mentioned earlier for my mate in Guam. He will be very pleased.

The New LP is quite good, the XMas thing lovingluy inaccessible, and the Peel Session in-fucking-credible. I have seen them in Boston twice now and the new band sounds so very tight. Defintely check out the multi project before the session goes away.

14:41 / 06.01.04

as a grizzled veteran of fall fandom and having had a copy of the album for a good couple of months now, i feel it is my duty to say that rizla is indeed correct. this is probably one of the best things the fall have ever done and i implore you to not only buy the album, but to catch them live asap. their cover of "walk like a man" needs to be heard to be believed.

Mister Six, whom all the girls

15:24 / 13.01.04

From: http://www.visi.com/fall/news/fallnews.html

BEST OF - Sanctuary is doing a 40 track, 2 CD best of for April release. For the first time ever, this is a compilation that covers the entire catalogue/all record labels, right up to date (The Real New Fall LP).

It is aimed at casual, first time buyers who have heard about the band or one track and don't know what to get next. As such, it is biased towards the singles (a lot of the Beggars A-sides) and there's nothing new or unreleased on it.

The final tracklisting has been cleared. I'm not going to disclose the tracklisting as it will only result in me getting about a hundred emails from people disagreeing with the songs chosen, even though it's too late.

02:58 / 01.04.04

Country On The Click WAS BRILLIANT
MES can and never will get boring
and its about time the reisues came out on 24bit remasters
the vinyl transfers were shit
which is why i always got them on vinyl

m

19:53 / 01.04.04

Anyone heard any of those fancy new DE-luxe reissues of Dragnet, Witch Trials, or Hex Enduction? Man, how many more times am I gonna have to buy those records?

The Knights Templar Boogie Machine

13:29 / 02.04.04

Was going to see mr smith and his crew last night, until i discovered that it was £14.00 a ticket, which is unheard of for a fall gig, at least to me. Maybe you pay the extra to see john cooper clarke..........

14:35 / 02.04.04

Those Reissues>

There have been two rounds of reissues done recently (in the last year or so).

The '+' reissues: ie 'Live at the Witch Trials+', 'Dragnet+', 'Hex Enduction Hour+'

The + denotes extra tracks, mostly singles from the appropriate period. They are all remastered, but from previous CD or vinyl versions, not original tapes. Hex Enduction Hour+ is excellent for sound quality. Dragnet+ is, in my opinion, very dodgy - the bass has been boosted WAY too much. I haven't heard the others but reports were good.

The 'Deluxe' reissues (the latest ones, in nice card boxes): so far they've released Live at the Witch Trials and Dragnet. These ARE remastered from the original tapes. They have extra tracks (LATWT is two discs). I've only heard LATWT, and it is EXCELLENT. Includes the Peel sessions of the time, the rare track Dresden Dolls (previously only available on bootleg 7"), single tracks and a bootleg gig recording (dodgy recording, to be honest, but hey-ho). Reports of Dragnet are also very positive. I would call these the definitive CD versions.

15:30 / 07.04.04

the deluxe reissues are fucking ace. sound quality's great, prices are very reasonable (£9 a throw from my local record emporium) and its nice to have replacements for my worn out vinyl copies.

Totale's Turns and Grotesque have been added to the roster, with Slates and Hex Enduction Hour to follow soon. fingers crossed, we'll see my personal favourite Perverted by Language shortly after that.

"can you get it together instead of showing off?"

m

00:23 / 08.04.04

I was lookin' on the back of one of those deluxe guys (I think it was Dragnet), and it looked like it had four or five versions of one song in a row. How's that play out when your listening to it? That kind of weird redundancy screws everything up for me a lot of the time.

m

08:28 / 10.04.04

I picked up the Witch Trials deluxe job a couple of days ago, and I was really happy with it. All the bonus singles are great, the Peel Sessions songs rock, and the live stuff is of tolerable sound quality. I've bought this record three fuckin' times now, and it's weird how it gets cheaper every time the recording quality gets better and number of bonus tracks increase.

10:14 / 25.08.05

This just in - a quickie review of the upcoming new Fall album, 'Heads Will Roll'. Source = not me.

"Okay, it's blinding.
I can't really give a verdict on the first two tracks as I've only listened once. But the album really only kicks off from What About Us onward.

Star of the show has to be whoever is playing bass these days. And it appears that the old casiotone has been rediscovered, but possibly in a damaged condition.

The rekkid is markjed by a determination not to use more than three notes.

MES seems a bit lazy on some songs and lacks bite. And some of the images seem to be either cliche -- 'snow is falling' in early days -- or self-parody.

But... it is a good fall record.

What About Us -- I saw a man going round town handing out drugs....he was a doctor. Throbbing. Haven't heard the session version but I can imagine this is much tougher played live.

Midnight Aspen -- a ballad by thunder! possibly MES had a remarkably good ski trip this winter. Possibly it is about Hunter Thompson.

Assume -- Television style minimalist riff

Blindness -- superb. Bass like satan farting. Again, very short guitar stabs scattered sparsly. MES does a human beatbox.

I can hear the grass grow. Cover of The Move song.Like Bobby D said when he heard Neil Young was making a rockabilly record 'that makes sense'. You can tell its psychedelia because i think there is a thermerin on there.

Bo D -- bit disappointed by this. seems rather tame, trebly guitar. it was very peculiar. Given the powerful bass on the rest of the album, I expected this to come on like Link Wray and I;ve got the surfaris instead.

Ya Wanner. MES sings the hits of QOTSA. Requires desert video.

Clasp Hands. thunders along like Container Drivers. MES experiments with a couple of 'rawk' like vocal flourishes.

early days of channel fuehrer. Another ballad. Smoky rooms, brushes on snares.

breaking the rules. here comes that casiotone.

Trust in me. I'm going mad trying to work out what this reminds me of."

11:00 / 10.10.05

Anyone else heard the new record?

Tempting as it is to roll out the old clichés ("a return to form", "is Mark E Smith the grumpiest man in rock?") it's really rather good.

There are your full coterie of manic punkabilly rockers, a slowy which gives a chance for Mr. E Smith to recite his usualk oblique poetry, and a stunning cover of the Move's "I can hear the grass grow".

If anything, I would say that the only flaw is to be found in the band's urge to take a simple garage riff, and stretch it out for the duration of your average Can track, but perhaps that would be nitpicking..

Any thoughts, O barbeloids?

All Acting Regiment

14:24 / 10.10.05

Midnight Aspen is something special. one of the best things I've heard this year. More later.

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