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Paging Doktor Ganesh

 
 
pointless and uncalled for
12:19 / 03.05.02
and anyone else who can provide details and commentary on this subject from an objective point of view.

Here is an article from EYE

Dr. David Healy, the British psychopharmacologist who was abruptly "unhired" in late 2000 by the University of Toronto and the Centre for Addiction and Mental Health (CAMH), will be in Toronto on May 24 to deliver a controversial lecture at the Bloor Cinema at 7:00pm.

In a presentation advertised as "the lecture that got me fired," Healy will revisit a November 30, 2000 speech he gave at CAMH that he believes led to his offer of employment being rescinded.

A lawsuit he launched against the university has just been settled, and he will become a visiting professor at the university's faculty of medicine for the next three years. Healy's case sparked an international controversy about pharmaceutical companies, research and academic freedom.

In late 2000, the university and CAMH withdrew Healy's signed offer of employment shortly after a talk he gave about the possible dangers of the antidepressant Prozac -- which he said may induce suicidal thoughts and behaviour in some patients -- in which he was critical about the role of pharmaceutical companies in suppressing negative research findings.

Healy is the author of The Antidepressant Era and The Creation of Psychopharmacology, and a frequent expert witness in legal cases involving pharmaceutical companies and selective serotonin-reuptake inhibitors (SSRIs), the class of drugs that includes Prozac.

A joint statement by Healy, CAMH and the university says that "although Dr. Healy believes that his clinical appointment was rescinded because of his November 30, 2000 speech at CAMH, Dr. Healy accepts assurances that pharmaceutical companies played no role in either CAMH's decision to rescind his clinical appointment or the University of Toronto's decision to rescind his academic appointment following upon the rescission of his clinical appointment."

Healy has kept his position as head of the psychopharmacology department at the University of North Wales, but will come to work for a week each year with students at the University of Toronto.

Jean Simpson, executive vice president and chief operating officer at CAMH, says the parties have agreed not to discuss any details of the mediation or settlement.

"We're especially pleased that Dr. Healy accepted our assurance that the drug companies played no role in our decision to rescind his clinical appointment," Simpson says.

Dr. Healy could not be reached for comment.

The Canadian branch of the company that makes Prozac, pharmaceutical giant Eli Lilly, contributed over $50,000 to the CAMH foundation between April 1, 2000 and March 31, 2001. It says it does not get involved in the employment decisions of its grant recipients. But earlier, it withdrew a donation to a U.S. centre after it published articles -- including one by Healy -- that made criticisms of Prozac and other SSRIs.


The reason I want to ask about this is the part where it says;

"the possible dangers of the antidepressant Prozac -- which he said may induce suicidal thoughts and behaviour in some patients".

I'm interested to know if this claim can be corroborated and indeed if there is any creedence that can be ascribed to this.

I have some friends who are or have been prescribed SSRIs and having read article this are concerned about it's accuracy. While they could speak to their prescribing doctor, there are concerns in Canada at the moment regarding the existing relationship between prescription writers and pharmacuetical companies, which is somewhat capitalistic in nature.

For those of you not in North America, pharmacuetical companies regularly advertise their products, including, for want of a better term, psychological medication, in broadcast and print media.
 
 
Ganesh
13:27 / 03.05.02
*sigh*

I'm aware of some of this. I think Healy's invested almost as much in his own agenda as the average drug company...

Yes, "suicidal thoughts and behaviour" are common in individuals on Prozac but I'm sure you're aware of the obvious problems of ascribing this to the antidepressant: one might as well claim paracetamol is the cause of headache. There is a school of thought which holds that very severely depressed individuals are too psychomotor-retarded (slowed-down in terms of movement and thinking) to actually carry out their suicidal thoughts - and that SSRIs improve the psychomotor symptoms before the suicidal ones, so there's a small window of vulnerability to self-harming impulses.

Personally speaking, I don't think I've ever seen Prozac - or any other SSRI - spontaneously 'produce' suicidality in someone who'd never previously contemplated killing themselves. Not convincingly, anyway. I think if antidepressant use is confined to treatment of actual illness (as opposed to unhappiness, boredom, dissatisfaction, etc.) it's a relatively safe, effective drug. Put it this way: the introduction of SSRIs has produced no correspondingly sudden leap in the suicide rate.
 
 
w1rebaby
13:37 / 03.05.02
There is a school of thought which holds that very severely depressed individuals are too psychomotor-retarded (slowed-down in terms of movement and thinking) to actually carry out their suicidal thoughts - and that SSRIs improve the psychomotor symptoms before the suicidal ones, so there's a small window of vulnerability to self-harming impulses.

I've heard people I know who've worked in psychiatric hospitals say the same thing; they've seen the very worst patients come in, who are effectively unable to do anything, and they keep a special eye on them for the first few days after they begin ADs in case they try and disembowel themselves with cutlery (and I'm not joking with that one).

I don't want to get into any great discussion about what it is I do for a living, but I deal with a lot of data on anti-depressant trials and adverse effects during those trials, and I can say that I have never seen any indication of increased suicide risk from SSRIs over placebo.
 
 
pointless and uncalled for
13:40 / 03.05.02
Thanks, that offers some insight into the situation.

Out of interest, and in no way to question your professional practices, where would you place yourself in the spectrum of pharmacuetical treatments for psychological and physiopsychological conditions? That would be as in pro, against, primary option, etc terms.

I understand if you choose to not answer that question, this being a public forum.
 
 
pointless and uncalled for
13:49 / 03.05.02
That comment being to Dr. G
 
 
Ganesh
23:37 / 03.05.02
I don't see psychological and pharmacological treatments as being in any way mutually exclusive; ideally, I'd prescribe both concurrently.
 
 
Ganesh
10:28 / 04.05.02
Rereading, I'm a little unsure what you're asking, Potus; it's difficult to accurately picture the "spectrum" you describe. I'm probably fairly bog-standard in that I believe antidepressants generally (and SSRIs in particular) are good, safe treatments for depression. They're not 'happy pills' and they won't improve a shitty life situation but if actual depressive illness is an element, they might improve things symptomatically (in terms of sleep, appetite, energy and so on) enough to tackle the larger problems. I do believe they're overprescribed, particularly in the US (where they're often combined with other psychotropic medication), and I believe the popular media is singularly irresponsible in its portrayal of antidepressants either as 'miracle drugs' - universal panaceas for life's hardships and disappointments - or alarming combinations of deadly side-effects (suicide, homicide, cancer, life-long addiction).

I'm not sure where that places me on any sort of spectrum but hope it helps answer your question.
 
 
pointless and uncalled for
12:36 / 06.05.02
That actually clarifies what I was asking for.

I basically wanted to know if where you stood between SSRI's cure all ills and all drugs are the work of corporate devils. It adds to your original answer because stance in the spectrum can affect the answer to the original question.

Hope that makes things clear.
 
 
Ganesh
17:16 / 06.05.02
No probs.
 
 
pointless and uncalled for
19:21 / 06.05.02
So, knowing what you do, do you think that this may be an interesting lecture, if taken with the correct pinches of salt?
 
 
Ganesh
14:59 / 07.05.02
Pillars, maybe...
 
  
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