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The future of apocalypse

 
 
Fist Fun
20:35 / 15.04.02
So nuclear and atomic bombs are starting to look tame compared to the new extinction possibilities science is opening up. What is your most plausible extinction scenario?
I think it is going to be a human computer virus. A self-replicating nanobot experiment goes wrong. The nanobots spread converting matter to energy as they go.
Or what about the sci-fi staple of sentient machine taking over? Is it plausible?
Or perhaps technology coupled with a class system ot meritocracy will be the downfall of "humanity":
Due to improved techniques the elite will have greater control over the masses; and because human work will no longer be necessary the masses will be superfluous, a useless burden on the system. If the elite is ruthless they may simply decide to exterminate the mass of humanity. If they are humane they may use propaganda or other psychological or biological techniques to reduce the birth rate until the mass of humanity becomes extinct, leaving the world to the elite. Or, if the elite consists of soft-hearted liberals, they may decide to play the role of good shepherds to the rest of the human race. They will see to it that everyone's physical needs are satisfied, that all children are raised under psychologically hygienic conditions, that everyone has a wholesome hobby to keep him busy, and that anyone who may become dissatisfied undergoes "treatment" to cure his "problem." Of course, life will be so purposeless that people will have to be biologically or psychologically engineered either to remove their need for the power process or make them "sublimate" their drive for power into some harmless hobby. These engineered human beings may be happy in such a society, but they will most certainly not be free. They will have been reduced to the status of domestic animals.
 
 
The Monkey
21:09 / 15.04.02
The safest bet would be some sort of pandemic...a bacterium of virus that hits that middle ground of not killing very quickly (hantavirus) but nonetheless getting the job done. Given modern santitation it would have to be airborne to impact Europe/America, but with the communicability-facilitating technologies of air travel and recirculated air, the sky's the limit.
Anyway, if the human population splits in some sort of Morlock/other guys fashion (or Alphas through Deltas, if you prefer), is that necessarily an end, or merely a change...mind you, a change that by current ethical-philosophical standards isn't very palatable.
Personally I don't think that the human race will ever eliminate itself entirely; it's more likely we'll work ourselves into a corner with overpopulation and resource depletion, then experience a die-out that will vastly reduce our numbers, thus re-balancing the ecosystem.
Personally, I think the funny one is if we experience as sudden cutoff in power sources, and/or experience an economic detonation of global proportion (if terrorists got clever and started hitting targets like other stock-trading hubs or credit and banking institutions) the West would go down hard and fast, given our complete alienation from subsistence economy, while nations where most of the population still engaged in microscale agriculture would be more likely to persist.
 
 
Thjatsi
22:45 / 15.04.02
Or what about the sci-fi staple of a sentient machine taking over?

Interestingly enough, a subgroup of transhumanists is interested in having a sentient machine take over.

Here's the basic concept from one of the more organized groups:

http://www.singinst.org/CFAI/

As far as extinction scenarios go, I think your best option is still nuclear war. However, if you want a more likely possibility that also involves a shitload of people dying, then you're going to want an influenza pandemic. Back in 1918, we had one of these that killed between 20 and 40 million people. If we had another one today, with our massive world population, it wouldn't quite be the apocolypse, but it would be close.
 
 
netbanshee
04:39 / 16.04.02
mass media hypnotises all and tell us to stop breathing...

...probably more like...can't replace the environment for our "own" needs and everyone who doesn't pass from the lack of resources dies of lonliness...
 
 
Krister Kjellin
08:40 / 16.04.02
Saw on the telly yesterday that the Milkyway will probably smash into the Andromeda in less than three billion year's time. The scenario for Earth is either to be consumed by the (very, very hot) chaos that will be the core of good ol' M31, or to be thrown into empty space, all depending on where our arm of the Milkyway is at the moment.

Now, that's what I call apocalyptic!

Hundreds of thousands of worlds, destroyed over the course of some million years.

Of course the thought of there being anything left resembling humans is just plain silly. Unless you read Olaf Stapledon's "The last and first men" as profetic.

I agree on nuclear war still being our safest bet for total destruction of the human race. At least until we figure out something worse that the H-bomb.

Why would sentient machines want to exterminate us? Let's give them rights already, and make sure they stay our friends!
The American Society for the Prevention of Cruelty to Robots
 
 
Fist Fun
12:34 / 16.04.02
I agree on nuclear war still being our safest bet for total destruction of the human race. At least until we figure out something worse that the H-bomb.

I hate to break this to you guys but you are living the luddite dream if you think nuclear war is our biggest threat. Nuclear war involves a certain amount of volition and access is highly restricted
The dangers we face in the future will be quite different. A simple accident in a science lab and the world teeters on the edge. What if the unabomber has been a biochemist, a nanotechnologist? Instead of bombs we could have destructive virii. Imagine a computer type nanotech virus wiping out brains rather than hard disks.
 
 
kid coagulant
13:09 / 16.04.02
Buk: that first quote of yours is from Kaczynski's 'Unabomber Manifesto', right? Ray Kurzweil excerpted some of it in his 'Age of Spiritual Machines' book.
 
 
The Monkey
13:54 / 16.04.02
Really, Buk, the "just one accident in a lab" idea is just as much a fictional scenario as Mutually-Assured Destruction. I don't particularly want to go into the epidemiology of it, but the likelihood of scientific industry tailoring a virus or bacterium into something that can cause a pandemic in the modern context is very slim. Even in so-called "third world" countries, where epidemics pop up in certain contexts (poor santitation, high biomass concentration), there is sufficient awareness and infrastructure to generate countermeasures very rapidly.

Even the cutting edge of biotech right now hasn't figured out how to apply our genome knowledge of the few species we have mapped. Even clandestine weapons-research still relies largely on the methodology of exposing petri dishes to counteragents and resampling the cultures that survive exposure, coupled with biologic tests in live subjects. Also, the objective of biological warfare is to generate a viral equivalent of a "bomb" - something that kills quickly, does not linger in the deployment area (has little airborne vector duration), and evades coventional defensive strcutures (by which I mean bunkers, pillboxes, etc.).

As for nanotech, it's going to be a while before even some basic issues, like microscale power sources or rod logic, have been resolved. As for brain-wiping - we aren't a hard drive, you can't just run a magnet across our skull. Once again, I don't feel like explaining the entire ion-gradient reaction that runs along the axons of nerves.
 
 
grant
15:06 / 16.04.02
Smallpox in the FedEx warehouses & sorting facilities.

Waterborne virus elminates fish, makes drinking water toxic & unfilterable.

Solar flare. My favorite.
 
 
Re-Set
15:25 / 16.04.02
Don't mean to sound like I'm nitpicking, but are we talking about an apocalypse or total human extinction?

Apocalypse, according to standard interpretation, is not total extinction, just removal of the "un-righteous" through cosmic cataclysm.

Human extinction is when there are literally no humans left, or once we have (d)evolved into something different enough to not be human anymore.

Human extinction will occur when we make our environment too hostile for ourselves, Apocalypse is when a higher power of some sort does it. In my opinion anyway.
 
 
kid coagulant
15:52 / 16.04.02
I think it's the secular kind of apocalypse. Though if there was one of a biblical sort and all the christians were called up to heaven, I'd say that the chances of their being some sort of extinction level event after that point would probably diminish greatly. But that's for another thread.

My money's on the electromagnetic pulse...
 
 
Fist Fun
16:11 / 16.04.02
Buk: that first quote of yours is from Kaczynski's 'Unabomber Manifesto', right? Ray Kurzweil excerpted some of it in his 'Age of Spiritual Machines' book.

Bingo.
 
 
kid coagulant
16:21 / 16.04.02
I've been looking at the 'unabomber manifesto' some today ( http://www.unabombertrial.com/manifesto/ ) , and like Kurzweil says, Kaczynski raises some valid points. Too bad his methods were what they were, or people may have actually listened to him.
 
 
rizla mission
23:12 / 16.04.02
I'm going with the pandemic, I think.
 
 
Krister Kjellin
07:50 / 17.04.02
Don't worry Buk. You're not breaking anyhing to anyone.

Still haven't seen that many rampant nanomachines though, so they don't worry me that much. As far as I know, we're not even sure whether it's possible to build nanomachines รก la the Borg and New X-men. So I'll worry about that when I see it.

I have seen H-bomb blasts though (well, not in person of course). They destroy a lot. Hiroshima and Nagasaki were New Year's crackers compared to modern H-bombs. And they could cause an atomic winter to boot.

This risk hasn't gone away with the cold war. There _will_ be other cold wars. We're not at history's end.

A pandemic is quite a likely event. It will probably happen sooner or later. From what I've read it's not very likely that it would make us totally extinct though. Most probably, we'll just be severely decimated, like Europe and the Middle-East during the black plague or North America during colonization.

Then again, you never know. There is a first for everything, and in this case there will be nothing but a first.

This is a depressing subject.
 
  
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