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Physics question that's been bothering me

 
 
pacha perplexa
14:57 / 05.04.02
Thre's probably a good, obvious explanation, but I've never been aplied to physics, so pardon my ignorance :

Suppose there's an elevator on the 20th floor with a person inside ( I don't know if it matters if it's going up or down). Suddenly the cables holding it break, and it begins a free fall.

Now, with a superhuman precision, the person inside jumps miliseconds before the elevator reaches the ground, so that ze lands back after the elevator touched the ground.

I'd like to know if the person can be intact, or will ze suffer the impact of the fall?
 
 
gozer the destructor
15:09 / 05.04.02
The person inside the elevator would be traveling at the same speed as the elevator due to inertia, so their energy forcing them in the opposite direction as the elevator car would not compensate for the energy (or gravity) pulling their mass down towards the earth, I think.
 
 
pointless and uncalled for
15:19 / 05.04.02
This is true, unless due to opposing forces the elevator car had rather slow terminal velocity.

Otherwise jumping has about the same difference you get from wearing an extra T-shirt when getting hit by a car.

As I have been led to understand, the best means of surviving an elevator fall is to lie flat on your back on the floor where possible. This will mean the impact will be distributed over a larger area and do less damage. If this isn't possible, lie on your side in the feotal position. In the worst case scenario of a crowded car, bend your knees and tense. your legs will get fucked but your vital organs stand the best chance of survival.
 
 
cusm
16:25 / 05.04.02
The falling car creates a force vector down. Although you may seem to be standing still within the reference frame of the elevator, you are actually traveling at the velocity of the falling elevator.

When you jump, you create a force vector upwards. This generates a velocity upwards dependent on the force of your jump, and seconds of acceleration you get from it. This subtracts from the velocity of your fall. Unfortunately, not enough to save you.

Here are the relavent equations if you would like to calculate how much damage you take from the fall

Force = mass * acceleration
Force = 1/2 mass * (velocity)^2
Distance = acceleration * seconds^2

Wow, its been awhile since I've done physics.
 
 
Lurid Archive
22:05 / 05.04.02
My Physics is rusty enough to inflict tetanus but I think you gain absolutely nothing by jumping up. A simple conservation of energy argument shows that this is true.

For those who don't know what conservation of energy is, its like the principle that there is a really uptight bureacracy running the universe whose job it is to make sure that you don't get anything free.

OK, so energy won't be completely conserved - you'll lose tiny amounts to friction. All depending on how strong your leg muscles are. I'd need to think about it a bit more - the rust is slowing me down - but I think this loss of energy doesn't work in your favour...
 
 
Jack Fear
01:45 / 06.04.02
As is pointed out in The Worst Case Scenario Survival Handbook, the basic problem with the jump-before-impact thing is that it's extremely unlikely that the elevator car will remain intact at impact: most likely it will collapse and the debris will crush you, jumping or standing.
 
 
Tom Coates
14:19 / 06.04.02
However you should always bear in mind that there's an infinitesimal chance that you will simply pass intact through the floor of the elevator carriage and down into any subterranean structures. The chances of this kind of large degree quantum tunnelling are, however, cosmologically unlikely. But you could hope...
 
 
The Return Of Rothkoid
11:13 / 08.04.02
Interestingly, this was just covered in a magazine I was reading (in order to possibly get a job there) -
Q: If you find yourself in a free-falling lift, is there anythng you can do to lessen the impact - like jumping just before you hit the ground?

A: First of all, it's highly unlikely that a lift will "free-fall" down a shaft, because of the numerous safety devices that kick in teh minute the car starts travelling at a certain speed. However, if you do find yourself on a gravity ride to hell, jumping at the very last second will, according to the laws of physics, slightly lessen the impact.

"I've worked out that you do gain by jumping, but the gain is marginal," says David MacKenzie, professor of physics at Sydney Uni. "By jumping upwards you reduce your downward velocity, and therefore the impact when you hit the ground. But I doubt it would be enough for you to survive. In that situation there is very little you could do to survive."

Besides jumping, you could always try stanging up and using your legs as "crumple zones". This way, while your legs would shatter like pretzels, there's a small chance your head and body would remain relatively whole.
 
 
Bear
12:01 / 08.04.02
I used to wonder about things like this when I was younger, I couldn't understand why for example if your in a bus and you jump into the air you don't go flying back against the back wall. But then I also used to think the world used to be black and white, because thats what I saw on TV
 
 
pacha perplexa
11:14 / 10.04.02
Mmmm, I see... So the chances are next to nothing. Thanks, people! Now I know that if this ever happens, it's easyer to pray for a superhero.

Goldbear, it makes sense Kid's are very logical in their own way. I used to think (20 years ago, my goodness) that we were actually living *inside* planet Earth, that the sky was the ceiling, and that rockets had to make a hole in it to get into outer space.

Heh.
 
 
sleazenation
11:51 / 10.04.02
What? You mean that's not true?
 
 
Bear
12:08 / 10.04.02
I like that one Pacha. Trust adults to make things more complicated
 
 
grant
13:31 / 10.04.02
Actually, there's some good evidence that Nazi Germany shared the same belief, thanks to the Nazi party's origins with the occult Thule Society. Some of the early V2 rocket experiments, legend has it, were designed to reach the *other side* of the hollow Earth by going straight up.
There was also a utopian community in Florida, the Koreshans (no relation to the Waco wacko) whose slogan was "We Live Inside."

They put scientific apparatus
up on the beach to detect the curvature.
They wanted to make the New Jerusalem south of Fort Myers. .

The movement fell apart when Cyrus didn't resurrect himself when he died.
 
 
tom-karika nukes it from orbit
07:57 / 18.04.02
http://www.onelight.com/thei/vol3no3.html
I know this is threadrot, and has no physics in it at all, but...
 
  
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