BARBELITH underground
 

Subcultural engagement for the 21st Century...
Barbelith is a new kind of community (find out more)...
You can login or register.


The Paranoid Thread

 
 
deja_vroom
16:58 / 12.09.01
I've heard that the WTC towers had devices built to make it collapse uniformly and quickly (as happened), to lower the risk of it tilting and falling upon buildings on the vicinity.

Is it true? I'm asking this because that second building collapsing looked a lot like a fucking controlled implosion.

And it makes me think of the results so far: increasing talks on heightened surveillance, the Carnivore thing etc., being implemented, and of how fast they're tracing these arab people in California.
 
 
We're The Great Old Ones Now
17:04 / 12.09.01
Think about it. Would you design a city building so that if it collapsed, it would do so messily and unpredicatably? No. You'd build it as strong as possible, and then you'd build it so that if it went down, it'd go down without taking every other nearby building with it.

So it's probably true. But not in the way you're thinking. Just in the same gallows logic we all encounter from time to time...if you're climbing with your friends, you may one day have to cut the rope on one of them.
 
 
deja_vroom
17:15 / 12.09.01
Apparently, no devices.
quote:The 110-story twin towers of the World Trade Center, which stood at a height of 1,353 feet, were designed to withstand earthquakes as well as impacts like that of a plane. This was evidenced by the fact that the buildings did not fall over on impact, says Brian Markham, a structural engineer with the Ove Arup & Partners engineering firm. The more likely cause of the buildings' collapse was the resulting fire, exacerbated by the huge quantities of jet fuel present.

When a fire ignites in a large building, its steel core does not melt, but over time it weakens. As the steel supporting the floors collapses, a "pancaking" effect will result, with each of the upper floors collapsing onto the floor below. This is why the disintegration of the towers was not limited to the top floors. With the accumulated weight of each collapsed floor, the stacked floors continued to fall. This explains why the building collapsed vertically, rather than tipping over.

Big buildings are structurally designed to withstand a blaze for between 2 to 3 hours--time enough to put out the fire and evacuate occupants. Both World Trade Center towers collapsed in about an hour, probably because the jet fuel caused the fire to burn hotter and faster than any would have anticipated.

Markham, while unaware of the fire rating for the World Trade Center buildings, suggests that even with a standard 2- to 3-hour burn time, it would have been extremely difficult to evacuate the 50,000 people estimated possibly to have been inside the buildings. He adds that the tragedy would have been compounded because, while many of the buildings' occupants could not have been evacuated via the exits, they would have been moved to ostensibly "safer floors." As it turned out, there were no safer floors.


From this article
 
 
The Return Of Rothkoid
17:29 / 12.09.01
Also supported by this page from USyd's Civ. Eng. department. It looked controlled, but I guess it was just gravity and constantly increasing descending weight taking hold, after heat and holes had compromised the structure.
 
 
We're The Great Old Ones Now
18:48 / 12.09.01
[shrug] define 'device'. The whole building is constructed to pancake rather than spill everywhere.

But yeah, sure, no architectural suicide pill.
 
 
Spatula Clarke
20:50 / 12.09.01
You might also want to check out this page.
 
 
deja_vroom
09:34 / 13.09.01
whichever word you use in english to describe what i wanted to describe not knowing the actual word.
 
 
Lost Nauth
09:34 / 13.09.01
since this is the paranoid thread i thought i'd throw something in. i was just wondering if it was possible (not that it even might have happened) to infiltrate the pentagon and steal any secrets using this plane crash as a distraction. i'm not sure on this but i think there were a couple pentagon employees that supported the jihad and in the chaos of evacuating and fire and such, i think it would've been perfect timing to go in there and retrieve stuff, but i'm not sure how tight security was or anything so it's just a paranoid thought

[ 13-09-2001: Message edited by: LokiTheBoyGenius ]
 
 
Mr Tricks
09:34 / 13.09.01
Could still be conspiracy...

Would George Dumbullya or his pupiteers be willing to sacrafice.. not only lives... the CIA does that all the time... but also the symbol.

The radio is also interviewing a guy that claims the building utilised experimental architechural design & building to cut-corners and have that building up faster & cheeper...

flashpoints...

Apparently the building was designed to support itself with supporting sheetrock walls internally... instead of standard concrete covered iron columns... then held together with a sort of external steel webbing. If you've seen the WTC towers you'll notice the fine virtical lattice.

Also consider that the Empire State building was struck by a B-25 sometime around 1925. The resulting fire lasted about 24 hours, consuming about 5 floors. it took about 3 months to repair the damage but the concrete insulated the steel pillers protecting them from the heat & ultimately saving the building as a whole.
 
 
Lost Nauth
09:34 / 13.09.01
more paranoia i forgot to add...the idea (though i personally don't buy it) that this was set up by our own government, or perhaps even a secret agency/group unknown to our government. i dunno what the motivation behind this would be other than inciting americans against arabs and getting america better equipped to handle terrorism. if war does break out (on a large scale) i do think pretty soon that the u.s. will unleash it's new laser weapons (yes, i do believe the u.s. has laser weapons [ground-based])
 
 
Mr Tricks
09:34 / 13.09.01
Well... Bin Labin was a CIA boy while the USSR was in Afganistan... so even if "they" DO pin it on him & his... it could still be an inside job...
 
 
Perfect Tommy
09:34 / 13.09.01
quote:Originally posted by PATricky:
The radio is also interviewing a guy that claims the building utilised experimental architechural design & building to cut-corners and have that building up faster & cheeper...

Also consider that the Empire State building was struck by a B-25 sometime around 1925. The resulting fire lasted about 24 hours, consuming about 5 floors. it took about 3 months to repair the damage but the concrete insulated the steel pillers protecting them from the heat & ultimately saving the building as a whole.


ABCNews story on the 1945 B-25 bomber crash.

I did a quick and dirty search on the statistics of a B-25 and a Boeing 757. The B-25 was a third of the length and half the wingspan (I couldn't find weight statistics on the 757, which would be a more useful comparison), and carried one-twelfth the amount of fuel normally.
 
  
Add Your Reply