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The Spin 40 2002 | Who's Fresh? Who's Challenging?

Matthew Fluxington

16:13 / 01.03.02

Needless to say, this is horribly ridiculous and hopelessly out of touch with reality, but this is the list they came up with this year - the 40 artists whom they say "play by their own rules and speak in their own codes...making some of the freshest most challenging music of the past few years". It's worth it for the giggles, and how perplexing it is...

1. Jay-Z
2. Radiohead
3. Eminem
4. U2
5. System of a Down
6. Outkast
7. Linkin Park
8. Moby
9. Weezer
10. The Strokes
11. Basement Jaxx
12. P.O.D.
13. Bjork
14. Missy Elliot/Timbaland
15. Tool
16. Alicia Keys
17. Sum-41
18. Dr. Dre
19. Creed
20. Nelly Furtado
21. Dave Matthews Band
22. No Doubt
23. Staind
24. DMX
25. Bob Dylan
26. Coldplay
27. Gorillaz
28. Incubus
29. Fugazi
30. Eve
31. Queens of the Stone Age
32. Richie Hawtin
33. Slipknot
34. Blink 182
35. The White Stripes
36. Sigur Ros
37. The Avalanches
38. DJ Shadow
39. Definitive Jux
40. Dashboard Confessional

[ 04-03-2002: Message edited by: Flux = Expert Textpert ]

Murray Hamhandler

17:11 / 01.03.02

I think that it's funny that they excluded Trent Reznor now that he's actually releasing stuff. When he was a hermit w/no output whatsoever, Spin couldn't get enough of putting him on that list every year.
Arthur Sudnam

13:22 / 02.03.02

7 out of 40 on that list are female.
(and that's counting the white stripes and no doubt).

13:43 / 02.03.02

Linkin PARK? Alicia Keys? U2?!??! Blink...182?!?

Oy.

14:15 / 02.03.02

"play by their own rules and speak in their own codes...making some of the freshest most challenging music of the past few years"

This is the part that really kills me.

It's adspeak for "Their record companies paid us real good, so we say nice things. Bow before the crushing juggernaut-force of post-TRL propagando-economics."

While there are artists on here I enjoy, I'm not sure how many I'd characterize using their language....

[ 02-03-2002: Message edited by: [monkeys of thoth] ]

Matthew Fluxington

14:36 / 02.03.02

I agree. The other thing that gets me is that nearly the entire list is folks who were either big in the 90s, or are retro-90s (Incubus, Blink 182, etc). This is not a list of acts who I would identify with the 21st century.

And some of these people are just the usual suspects for lists like this - some people will just slap Bjork on any old list of "revolutionary artists", no matter what she does. Sorry, but I really don't think Selmasongs or Vespertine are anything to write home about, and both are far below her talents. As far as I'm concerned, Bjork stopped being a contender after she peaked with Homogenic in 1997. Five years ago. Please, let's all move on, shall we?

And I wish the Sigur Ros would go away.

21:37 / 02.03.02

So .. that list's just all the biggest sellers .. and Fugazi thrown in for luck.

Be nice if they just admitted it rather than coming on with all that 'revolutionary, groundbreaking' bollocks.

A

21:56 / 02.03.02

quote:Originally posted by Flux = Expert Textpert:

17. Sum-41

29. Fugazi

says it all, really.

10:22 / 03.03.02

Rizla, check out number 8...

11:02 / 03.03.02

Indeed. It's kind of reassuring that his unstoppable, unthinking drive towards global power and influence hasn't sent him straight to #1 though.

09:47 / 04.03.02

quote:Originally posted by Flux = Expert Textpert:
And I wish the Sigur Ros would go away

hey flux. i like you, i don't wanna hurt you. so just leave sigur ros alone. they didn't ask to be on this stoopid fuckin list.

oh, and have you checked out the new song i just pimped? H...O...T!

09:47 / 04.03.02

still .. is there anyone on that list people here find actually do make "some of the freshest most challenging music of the past few years." ?

Murray Hamhandler

09:47 / 04.03.02

quote:
still .. is there anyone on that list people here find actually do make "some of the freshest most challenging music of the past few years." ?

Missy Elliot-"Get Yr. Freak On", Radiohead-last two albums. That's about as close as I can get to it. Not to say that some of the people on the list don't do what they do well or that I don't really like a few of them, but new? Challenging? Not really. Fresh? Mmmmaybe. The Strokes, The Avalanches, the new Bjork, Sigur Ros and Gorillaz all made me smile last year, but by polishing some tarnished stuff that was already laying about.
Arthur Sudnam

09:47 / 04.03.02

I'm just pissed cuz I think Iggy Pop shoulda been on there, his last album was really good and far more "challenging" than anything Creed or Incubus could ever hope to do.

09:47 / 04.03.02

still .. is there anyone on that list people here find actually do make "some of the freshest most challenging music of the past few years." ?

I'd say Mr Sudnam is on the ball with his picks. Missy Eliot is pretty neat, and I have a weak spot for someone who samples bhangra for her hip-hop tracks. Gorillaz are fun, and their punk/hip-hop fusion is interesting even if not revolutionary. Radiohead need no explanation: they're in their own planetary system in terms of novelty.

Stretching a bit,
System of a Down has a few charms, and they're definitely the best of the bands in and around the category of hardcore. And their lyrics don't bite quite as much ass as, say, every other hardcore group. And within the category of happy-pop, Nelly Furtado is infinitely better than any other band/performer of the genre, i.e. she can actually sing, uses better riffs and samples.

Whoever said it prior is right: almost all of the rock bands are redux of 90s grunge/post-grunge...think of them a bunch of Satoris rather than one Nirvana.

Even the half-way decent ones [Coldplay, Incubus, QotSA] simply replicate a preexisting style/structure.
The hip-hop groups/performers are the same: off-list, I'd say Outkast are far more original than anything mentioned.

Linkin Park, Blink 182, and Sum 41 all deserve to be hunted and killed on national TV [thank you, Bill Hicks]. With power tools. Blunt power tools.

Matthew Fluxington

11:04 / 04.03.02

I think that in the present tense, only a few of them are major contenders - Radiohead, Jay-Z, Outkast, Missy/Timbaland, Avalanches, to a lesser degree certain songs by DMX and the new improved No Doubt - but there are plenty of worthwhile musicians on that list. I wouldn't really put much of them in any kind of vanguard, though.

By the way, it wasn't just the rock bands on that list that I was implicating were in a 90s but not quite 2000s style. C'mon - Moby? Basement Jaxx? Richie Hawtin? Please. Alicia FUCKING Keys?

[ 04-03-2002: Message edited by: Flux = Expert Textpert ]

11:58 / 04.03.02

So - genuine question - who is breaking new ground?

Haus about we all give each other a big lovely huggle?

12:13 / 04.03.02

quote:Originally posted by Flux = Expert Textpert:
As far as I'm concerned, Bjork stopped being a contender after she peaked with Homogenic in 1997.

Ah, Flux, my child, your flirtation with the mainstream remains almost lewd. What next? The Backstreet Boys? Melissa Etheridge?

Bjork sold out the moment, the very moment, that having a man playing the trumpet and yelling ceased to have her whole-hearted support as a musical gambit. Thus, approximately 82 seconds into "Sick for Toys".

Matthew Fluxington

12:18 / 04.03.02

Wow. Such a broad and inherantly silly question to ask in the short term - can we rephrase the question from who is 'groundbreaking' to who is really exciting?

Off the top of my head, I'd mention the Kitty-Yo axis (Peaches/Gonzales/Taylor Savvy, plus like minded folks like Crossover, Gravy Train, Princess Superstar, etc).

The Neptunes, for sure.

Avey Tare & Panda Bear. Yeah Yeah Yeahs. The Walkmen. Liars. The Moldy Peaches. Pixeltan. Black Dice. - the leaders of the Brooklyn scene.

The whole beard-hop phenomenon, like it or not. (the post-Company Flow people, Antipop Consortium, cLOUDDEAD and friends...)

The whole bootleg mix scene - folks like Freelance Hellraiser, Osymyso, Kurtis Rush, etc...

[ 04-03-2002: Message edited by: Flux = Expert Textpert ]

The Natural Way

12:22 / 04.03.02

God, there's so much exciting music out there... That list, it's like the fucking Brits or something....

Why not throw in Dido, just for good measure?

[ 04-03-2002: Message edited by: You and Runce ]

No star here laces

12:26 / 04.03.02

quote:Originally posted by Saveloy:
So - genuine question - who is breaking new ground?

Osymyso? (only in a horribly self-referential manner, one suspects)

Ed Case and Darqwan are doing interesting things in UK garage, but nobody here gives a toss about that, so I guess we can forget them...

The Bays (sp?) who are a new project from the peeps at Global Communications are fantastic, but unavailable on record. You have to go hear 'em live - 's sort of dancehall/dub/dance but entirely live and improvised. Curious anyhow...

I think Jim White is very innovative, but maybe it's cos it's the only record of it's type I've bought in about five years.

autopilot disengaged

12:53 / 04.03.02

lyra - you can get a couple of bays trax on the internet - though they will tend to be live recordings.

will add proper contribution later.

right now i have to try and stop being unemployed.

12:57 / 04.03.02

quote:Originally posted by Saveloy:
So - genuine question - who is breaking new ground?

Saggy Bottom Boys?

13:02 / 04.03.02

allright i agree with you mr. flux...

the walkmen are deffinitly one of my fav brooklyn (practise and record in there meridian studio in harlem) bands though! my friends worked on a live like video for them which hopefully will someday see the light of day. its great though...fits them great!

i prolly should have made his its own thread huh?

ok well the yeah yeah yeahs kinda get annoying to me...just seems s dishonest and un-sincere... she wears newly bought white t-shirts ripped and spray-painted that evening before the show... it kinda aes me sad. and the drummer looks like hessomeold dorky friend from community college that was forced to wear his most RnR outfit which ends up being a black raiders t-shirt inside out with the seaves rolled up...woah i justbashed them pretty hard...what a DICK I AM! whats my problem!!!

ok so yeah, walkmen amazing...i mea they still played out even after pauls arm was broken...its was pretty ruff around the edges for them but still kinda interesting to watch...

and then there were 3 other brooklyn local bands thatgot missed...

Major Dad --- nervous anthems for summer teens

Mechanical Hand --- amazing band by the songfght administer

the TIE REDS --- a ny punk outfit so raw

13:23 / 04.03.02

Flux:
"Wow. Such a broad and inherantly silly question to ask in the short term"

Oooh! *handbag raised to chin*

"can we rephrase the question from who is 'groundbreaking' to who is really exciting?"

No, definitely not, so there. I've probably misread the thread slightly, but bugger it, I'm still interested in this - I want to know if there are any bands or artistes out there that are doing something sufficiently new and different to that which has gone before to qualify as 'fresh' and 'challenging'. What have you heard recently that you couldn't have predicted? I've not got any hidden agenda here, I'm genuinely curious. I don't get out much these days, you see.

I'd post this as a new thread, but it seemed relevant enough to bung in here as an aside.

[ 04-03-2002: Message edited by: Saveloy ]

Matthew Fluxington

13:38 / 04.03.02

Oh. My. God. How did I manage to forget Clinic in my first go?

Of all the rock bands currently existing that I know, Clinic are the ones who most feel like something entirely new and exciting, taking the best bits of the past and recombining them into something not quite like anything else. I seriously think that they are one of, if not the, best rock bands currently on the planet.

Haus about we all give each other a big lovely huggle?

13:42 / 04.03.02

And that Levi's ad was really cool.

autopilot disengaged

15:57 / 04.03.02

music is fantastic at the moment. there's sooo much good stuff coming thru. genuine originality is always difficult to pin down - you risk rewarding clangy joe and his underwater mouse orchestra instead of somebody who may be making a more understated, sophisticated shift forward within their field.

i'd second the kitty-yo axis - chicks on speed, gonzales, peaches and co... and, though i still haven't really gotten into them, the digital hardcore peeps seem equally *challenging*.

likewise for indie hip-hop - cannibal o, mike ladd and cLOUDDEAD (though i'm aware i seem to be one of only two or three people who will admit to liking the latter) - deej shadow comin' back with a new sound...

american R&B producers - timbaland, the neptunes, jerkins et al. these guys are auteurs, baby (though they have been lucky enough to work with more-than-worthy frontpeople - aaliyah, missy e, kelis (sometimes), beck...

in a similar vein, it's nice to see the way certain uk dance producers have rejuvenated the mainstream scene with landmark work - nellee hooper, orbit etc.

at the frontiers of electronica, like 'em or loathe 'em, you've got aphex, autechre, squarepusher...

i don't follow guitary stuff quite so much - but how about the boredoms? i've only heard a portion of their latest album but it has me slavering... melt banana, too? the moldy peaches'd fit here as well...

and then there's the usual suspects who rightly make the running on the list - radiohead, avalanches etc etc.

another point, though: how about some of the other, non-musical shifts? something i'd contend could be a big deal for the future is the way radiohead, in particular, have exploited the internet to open a direct channel with their fans - and built the foundations for a real revolution in commercial terms - the band that doesn't need a record company. definitely a trend to watch, i feel...

autopilot disengaged

16:03 / 04.03.02

oh yeah - and i wanna second my approval of the gorilaz' canny fusion of punk, dub and hip-hop. but we should remember asian dub foundation do a similar thing and have had none of the success. they deserve a lot more respect than they get.

post-rock? mogwai, godspeed, electrelane?

10:05 / 05.03.02

quote:Originally posted by Saveloy:

What have you heard recently that you couldn't have predicted?

Now that's an interesting phrasing. i haven't been able to afford that much music recently, but I bought "Understanding" by The New Flesh (UK hip hop - from York(!)) on the weekend. Definitely original, not to mention dirty and funky as hell. But, could I have predicted it? Yeah, maybe I could. It makes sense within particular music trajectories. For example, a lot of the tracks take their rhythm structures much more from dub or garage, and also have that kind of 'future funk' feeling (don't quite know how to describe that, really really heavily modulated bass, crisp, cut-up beats, oddly - shaped spaces in the music). At first I was thinking "yeah, wow, that's fresh, US rap wouldn't come up with that right now". BUT... look at a lot of the other stuff on Big Dada, and there are similar explorations, then you realise how it kind of fits with people like the Neptunes, and has obviously taken the whole Warp records thing on board.

Tricky... maybe that's just hindsight. it's easy to look at any work of art and start identifying where it's come from, a lot more difficult to look at what's going on, and predict the future work.

Anyway, this is leading nowhere, just chewing over the idea.

PS. Haven't heard anything about this new shadow project, anyone got deets?

[ 05-03-2002: Message edited by: Me Called Lentil ]

No star here laces

14:18 / 05.03.02

UK motherfucking garage.

*beats self on head with stick*

I defy anyone to find Ed Case predictable. Do you want to hear something new or not? Me, I don't give a toss for new or experimental music, I'm quite happy to tread the same old paths. But if that weren't the case...

UK motherfucking garage.

Is where all the inventiveness is...

14:59 / 05.03.02

beats self on head with stick

Are you auditioning for So Solid Lyra?

OK- you win- I have judged UK Garage without actually sampling it- where do I find Ed Case and what should I listen to?

15:01 / 05.03.02

quote:Originally posted by autopilot disengaged:
... melt banana, too? ...

Melt Banana.

Yes.

Melt Banana.

They're going to places other bands don't even have nightmares about.

They're my choice for 'Who's Challenging?' as regards guitar noise, no question.

Regarding, 'Post-Rock', I think it's safe to say it's reached a stage where the genre conventions are pretty well established and it's no longer really that 'challenging' .. (but of course, that doesn't make it any less brilliant).

Having said that though, I think Mogwai's Rock Action is a genuine attempt to move on to something new .. most of the tracks on it don't easily fit into 'Post-Rock', or any other genre for that matter.. if they take the direction it looks like they're going to take, they're going to be developing a fuzzy sort of post-rock/folk/electronica hybrid all of their own..