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Star Trek and Terrorism

 
 
Traz
03:12 / 27.11.01
I don't watch much television; I haven't had a boob tube in my possession for eight years. Back when I did watch TV, almost the only thing I ever watched was Star Trek: The Next Generation. (None of that Deep Space Nine shit.) While doing laundry tonight, I happened to catch a glimpse of one of my all-time favorite episodes, "The High Ground." Here's the ad copy from amazon.com:

quote:While delivering medical supplies to the strife-torn planet of Rutia, Dr. Crusher (Gates McFadden) is caught in the middle of a terrorist attack and taken hostage. The terrorists' leader, Finn (Richard Cox), wants Crusher to aid terrorists dying from the effects of an interdimensional transporter.

To rescue Crusher, the crew enlists the help of Alexana Devos (Kerrie Keane), the leader of the Rutian police. Alexana warns Riker (Jonathan Frakes) that Finn will not listen to negotiations.

Alexana's warning is justified when Finn launches an attack that kills several crew members and leads to the capture of Picard (Patrick Stewart). Now Riker must attempt a daring rescue before Picard and Crusher become two more victims of the Rutian conflict.


I thought I was in for a wonderful time, watching this gem from yesteryear.

It was awful; I feel like I've just discovered that Santa Claus doesn't exist. The rubber science, the silly clothes, the strained logic, Picard's pedantic speeches to Wesley and Data....uurrgghh.

No, I take that back; it wasn't awful, it was just disappointing. The relationships between the Starfleet officers and their respective hosts (Riker & Alexana, Beverly & Finn) weren't half-bad, and there were a few clever quips in the dialogue:

quote:Beverly: "Is fear your only weapon?"
Finn: "No, but it's a good one."


The three different factions were clumsily but accurately shown: the misunderstood but bloodthirsty rebels, the well-intentioned but brutal government, the idealist but hypocritical Federation-slash-symbolic-America. However, it all fell apart in a worthless, soporific ending: the Starfleet officers scratched their heads, said "Gee, why don't you just stop killing each other?" and flew off to the Never-Neverland System at Warp Nine.

I understand this episode was originally banned by the BBC since Data mentioned that terrorism did work sometimes, and listed the Irish Republican Army's victory of 2012 among his examples.

Here are my questions, then: How does this old (1990) episode stand up to modern, post-September-Eleventh sensibilities? Is it a great tutorial for teen-agers but too simplistic for adults? Do all Star Trek episodes fall into that category? Isn't there anything on television worth watching? Has there ever been?
 
 
Hush
06:27 / 27.11.01
<<Is anything on Television worth watching?>>

Probably. When you're head hurts and too early to go to bed any old shite will do. Not for it's own sake but as a mild hypnotic.

Occasionally. Really good programs are well worth watching communally. When I was younger and living in the 'Ghetto' not everyone had a TV but it nice to go around to someones house for Tea, spliff and Blakes Seven or the Sweeney.

Bizarrely. I seem to only watch the Bill and Farscape at the moment. I can only apologize for the Bill. I am a sad old man. Farscape however seems to be the best science fiction on TV, up with Blakes Seven, and with similar characters (Krace = Avon??)

No. We got rid of our TV for three months last summer, cos the kids seemed to be developing dependence on it. Not having it reduced the squabbling, increased the reading and creative collaborative play. It's probably better in winter.

What I hate about TV is the 'one thing leads to another' mentality that sets in. You turn on to pick up something on ceefax and before you know it you're watching ugly people doing ugly things.

In my world TV's only work when more than 4 people are watching, and only operate two hours a day. Those who want more can be a special licence and undergo psychiatric assessment and be offered reality counselling. I'm sure Ganesh would do this.

Thats my TV rant.
 
 
ONLY NICE THINGS
07:09 / 27.11.01
quote:Originally posted by Ian Jones is Not:
Farscape however seems to be the best science fiction on TV, up with Blakes Seven, and with similar characters (Krace = Avon??)



Farscape is indeed mighty, but Avon is a multi-faceted character whose psychological development (and/or disintegration) forms one of the key threads of the Blakes 7 narrative, whereas Krace is a martinet who shouts at his ship a lot.

Although they should both steer clear of clinging fabrics in the later episodes...
 
 
Rev. Wright
08:58 / 27.11.01
Getting back to teh title of this thread I would like to continue the idea of Terrorism as represent in Science Fiction.
Star Wars reccently came in at no.1 (with Empire Strikes Back) in a poll.
It is interesting to note that the 'rebel' forces are in fact terrorists in the minds of the Imperial Forces. (can I say that)
A very anti-imperialist text, with rebels holding out in remote locations in underground 'ice caves' and 'forest enclaves'.
The mention of Blake 7 is also relevent, I mean criminals taking on the oppressive government with hit and run tactics?
The Matrix is another text, where the heroes are in fact terrorists, they even mention the idea of civilian casualties, as necessary.
Am I barking up the wrong tree or is there something to this?
 
 
Seth
16:13 / 27.11.01
I think the attitude of Next Gen towards terrorism could almost be seen as a satire on America’s foreign policy. Fly in, interfere as much as is advantageous, swoop out with flimsy excuses, everything resets for our gallant heroes, leaving the locals to pick up the pieces. Sadly, Next Gen wasn’t planned as a subversive commentary, and any similarity between the Federation and America or Nato is purely coincidental.

Deep Space Nine, however, was a subversive commentary - the more you watch it the more you realise it was intended to be Trek’s evil, unpredictable twin. Terrorism, war crimes, and genocide were major themes throughout its entire run. The only time Next Gen gets its hands dirty are the two episodes that deal with the Maquis (Federation citizens turned terrorists due to being abandoned by a new Federation treaty with Cardassia), in particular Ro Laren’s defection. DS9 took the Maquis and ran - they were handled with conscience, their cause looked at from all angles. Major characters revealed involvement to some degree (Eddington, Riker and Yates), and their motives were not glossed over.

They weren’t the only terrorists. Kira never referred to herself as a freedom fighter, and always seemed haunted by the atrocities she committed. Sisko isn’t exactly innocent (complicit in the assassination of ambassadors and widescale environmental destruction), Quark got involved with the arms trade (on several occasions), they even played Dukat (DS9’s own Hitler) as a near anti-hero. Winn bombed the station’s school, Kira, Odo and Garak trained the Cardassian’s terrorist rebellion, the Circle nearly started a Bajoran civil war by trying to attack the Federation (memory’s a bit sketchy there) and the Federation attempted to commit genocide by poisoning an entire race.

Enough evidence. The strength of the series was that it was comparatively landlocked compared to previous Trek’s, with a pilot episode that clearly stated the intention to explore the cause and effect, action and consequence. There was no way to run away from the situation. Most of the main characters had a history in war, they were deeply flawed people, and their motives and methods were critiqued from a good many angles (there was no one stance on terrorism or war crimes portrayed). The thrilling part was to see Next Gen’s shiny, smiling American dream turning sour when territory, money, sex and religion were added to the mix. The good guys employed deplorable tactics - the bad guys were always capable of redemption (Dukat came so close).

Weyoun is the closest thing you’ll ever see to Tony Blair in fiction.

[ 27-11-2001: Message edited by: expressionless ]
 
 
sleazenation
17:46 / 27.11.01
for me star wars is still pretty sanitised when it comes to dealings with terrorists. Yes there are rebels against an empire but the empire is consistantly characterised as EVIL.
 
 
gentleman loser
22:49 / 27.11.01
I enjoyed seeing the politically correct Next Generation fall on it's ass and transmute into DS:9 and Voyager (once the Roddenberry demon was purged; he was way off track in thinking that man would outgrow his stupidity). I always thought it was ironic that Kirk and Picard were more than happy to toss out the Prime Directive (something they would supposedly defend to the death) whenever it suited them (reminds me of Bush and Ashcroft).

It always reminded me of the "We are good, they are bad. If we do bad, it's O.K. because we are good." U.S. attitude that always annoyed the shit out of me.

That's why I so digged "The Andorian Incident" from "Enterprise". I wasn't expecting the Vulcans to be turned into the bad guys (which I liked).

[ 28-11-2001: Message edited by: gentleman loser ]
 
 
Traz
02:10 / 28.11.01
The Next Generation wasn't that P.C.; I remember a few episodes condemning abortion and euthanasia. And yes, Deep Space Nine was grungier, but the dystopic view of the future wasn't nearly as memorable as the atrocious acting and clumsy scripts.

A small, mobile army isn't the same as a terrorist band; the Rebel Alliance was never shown bombing civilians, to my memory. Even in The Matrix, Neo and Trinity confined their killing of humans to the uniformed pawns of the machines.

Science fiction is laden with uncounted depictions of racism and genocide, but I can't think of any realistic, even-handed portrayals of terrorism. Fahrenheit 451? No. Dune? No. Count Zero? No...
 
 
Seth
04:27 / 28.11.01
Heh. Wouldn't that be the same Next Gen with only two good actors, and possibly five good episodes from a twenty six episode season? But I'm rotting the thread with talk of quality (I just think too many people remember this series with rose tinted spectacles, when it's dated incredibly badly).

Didn't say Next Gen was PC. I'm saying it was pretty imperialistic under it's practised inoffensive skin. Sinister show.
 
 
DaveBCooper
04:27 / 28.11.01
Isn't there some old cliche about one man's freedom fighter being another man's terrorist ? Same for spies and secret agents.

That would seem to apply here...

DBC
 
 
ONLY NICE THINGS
04:27 / 28.11.01
quote:Originally posted by sleazenation:
for me star wars is still pretty sanitised when it comes to dealings with terrorists. Yes there are rebels against an empire but the empire is consistantly characterised as EVIL.


Indeed. Again, Blakes 7's reading is far more subtle. Blake frequently has to choose between the "right" action an the one which will get the job done - threatening to destroy a surgeon's hands if he will not help a crewmember, having to decide whether to save his ship and crew by helping a race to wipe out the living products of their science experiments....this struggle is taken to its furthest extent in the issue fo Star One. To destroy Star One is to knock out the Federation's communications systems, and to score a massive blow for the rebellion - but the effectrs of doing so will kill thousands of people whose only crime is living within the federation.

Blake and his crew can very easily be painted as terrorists. There might even b e an argument that their actions made the federation a far nastier place.
 
 
The Sinister Haiku Bureau
17:07 / 28.11.01
quote:Originally posted by Traz:
...the Rebel Alliance was never shown bombing civilians, to my memory....


I guess that means you haven't seen 'Clerks' then. (theres a scene where they debate the destruction of the 2nd Death Star, on the grounds that, as it was still being built, the people on board were relatively innocent contractors, builders, etc rather than soldiers)...
 
 
Mr Tricks
18:48 / 28.11.01
Wasn't there also an episode where Picard gets captured & tortured for his Black opps Mission...

Then there was also an episode where Diana is captured by Romulans & surgicly altered to appear like one ...

Then of course there's Total Recall!!!
 
 
Ganesh
10:28 / 30.11.01
My standard contribution to a Trek-related thread, so as not to disappoint my grateful public:

I think 'Star Trek' is really shit.

Thankyou. Carry on.
 
 
invisible_al
11:50 / 30.11.01
Urrrgh 'The High Ground' First season ST:NG at its very worst, but then that series was always under the thumb of Roddebery's 'Legacy'.

But I don't think DS9 does that much better, it gets close though, showing up all of the inconsistancies in the happy shiney federation.

One episode that sticks in my head is when Sisko's girlfriend was arrested and jailed for smuggling medical supplies to terrorists (the marquis). She goes to jail for 1-2 years, quark who's a 'lovable rogue' never gets more than a slap on the wrist.

The Matrix on the other hand is slightly problematic, mainly for the scene with the lady in red. Anyone could be a Agent, so its ok to kill anyone who is still connected to the matrix, we're trying to save people from this artificial heaven, so its ok to waste a few people. They aren't terrorists, they're religious fanatics, well its one way of looking at it.

Actually come to think of it even Babylon 5 had trouble with terrorism as an issue, the whole narn/centauri thing was handled well, but the telepath terrorists were just shoddy.

Theres a point why are sci-fi freedom fighters/terrorists never allowed to be competent, I mean they are for the most part a bit shit really. 'Heros' sneal into their secret bases/escape at will, they fuck up royally and get captured by the Imperials. Thats a subtext thats all across sci-fi.
 
 
Rev. Wright
15:30 / 30.11.01
gotta say, Paul in Dune is a terrorist leader/saviour
Anyone?
 
 
Traz
08:13 / 01.12.01
Now here's a realistic depiction of terrorism in Science Fiction...

Scene: Comic book convention lecture hall, panel discussion. The room is full. Five creators sit at a long table, their names on placards in front of them. The banner behind them reads 'WORDS UP - MINORITY VOICES IN COMICS.'

HOOPER (Dwight Ewell, an angry-looking black man in a leather jacket): For years in this industry, whenever an African-American character - hero or villain - was introduced usually by white artists and writers - they got slapped with racist names that singled them out as negroes: Black Panther, Black Lightning, Black Goliath, Black Manta, Black Talon, Black Spider, Black Hand, Black Falcon, Black Cat..

VOICE FROM CROWD: She's white.

HOOPER: She is? Well bust this - regardless. (Holds up comic.) Now my book White-Hating Coon doesn't have any of that bullshit. The hero's name is Maleekwa, and he's a descendant of the black tribe that established the first society on the planet, while all you European motherfuckers were still hiding in caves and shit, all terrified of the sun. He's a strong role model that a young black reader can look up to, 'cause I'm here to tell you - the chickens are comin' home to roost, ya'll. The black man's no longer gonna play the minstrel in the medium of comics and Sci-Fi/Fantasy! We're keeping it real, and we're gonna get respect - by any means necessary!

HOLDEN (Ben Affleck, calling out from the crowd): Bullshit! Lando Calrissian was a black man, and he got to fly the Millenium Falcon!

HOOPER: Who said that?

HOLDEN (standing): I did! Lando Calrissian is a positive black role model in the realm of Science Fiction/Fantasy.

HOOPER: Fuck Lando Calrissian! (HOLDEN sits.) Uncle Tom nigger! Always some white boy gotta invoke 'the holy trilogy!' Bust this - those movies are about how the white man keeps the brother man down - even in a galaxy far, far away. Check this shit. You got cracker farm-boy Luke Skywalker, Nazi poster boy - blond hair, blue eyes. And then you've got Darth Vader: the blackest brother in the galaxy: Nubian God.

BANKY (A wide-eyed Jason Lee, standing): What's a Nubian?

HOOPER: Shut the fuck up! (BANKY sits.) Now Vader, he's a spiritual brother, with the force and all that shit. Then this cracker Skywalker gets his hands on a light-saber, and the boy decides he's gonna run the fucking universe - gets a whole Klan of whites together, and they're gonna bust up Vader's 'hood, the Death Star. Now what the fuck do you call that?

BANKY (still wide-eyed): Intergalactic Civil War?

HOOPER: Gentrification! They're gonna drive out the black element, to make the galaxy quote-unquote 'safe' for white folks.

HOLDEN: But Vader turns out to be Luke's father. And in Jedi, they become friends.

HOOPER: Don't make me bust a cap in your ass, yo! Jedi's the most insulting installment, because Vader's beautiful, black visage is sullied when he pulls off his mask to reveal a feeble, crusty white man! They're trying to tell us that deep inside, we all want to be white!

BANKY (blinking innocently): Well, isn't that true?

(HOOPER's eyes bulge. He pulls a nine millimeter from his belt, draws on BANKY and fires. BANKY goes down, falling forward into the crowd, which screams and scatters. HOOPER jumps over the table and raises his fists in the air.)

HOOPER: Black rage! Black rage! I'll kill any white folks I lay my motherfuckin' eyes on!

(The room empties. HOLDEN sits in his chair, laughing. HOOPER steps off the stage and picks BANKY's head up off the floor. BANKY grins.)

HOOPER (breaking character and shaking his head): 'What's a Nubian?' Bitch, you almost made me laugh.

[ 01-12-2001: Message edited by: Traz ]
 
 
Rev. Wright
10:59 / 01.12.01
Ok, transcript from Chasing Amy, any other point? Really it deals far more with Racism than Terrorism
 
 
Traz
09:54 / 02.12.01
No, no real point, William. I was just quoting Kevin Smith back at Johnny Haiku to illustrate my familiarity with the Jersey Trilogy and, hopefully, end a nearly-dead thread on an wacky, upbeat note.

Anyway, Maud'Dib doesn't count in my book; he was a guerrilla, not a terrorist. The Fremen didn't kill civilians; they were the civilians.

[ 02-12-2001: Message edited by: Traz ]
 
 
Gus
09:54 / 02.12.01
Captain Nemo.
 
 
The Sinister Haiku Bureau
09:54 / 02.12.01
quote:Originally posted by Traz:
No, no real point, William. I was just quoting Kevin Smith back at Johnny Haiku


point taken, Traz. My apologies for bringing your knowledge of all things Kevin-Smith related into question....
 
 
The resistable rise of Reidcourchie
09:54 / 02.12.01
Alway best not to insult another man's Kevin Smithness.
 
 
Rev. Wright
10:05 / 02.12.01
Hey I'm a self confessed fanboy too. Just thought that it was being quoted in some fascile way.

The Dune reference, I reckon, stands true. The Fremen, through the leadership of Paul, threaten the supply of Spice, which is a needed resource. In Britain legislation has been passed, as a direct result of the Fuel picket from the other year, that persons responsible for such deprivation will be considered terrorists. The supply of fuel is now seen as national security and thus demands military action, if supply is threatened.
Sounds like a similar situation to me

[ 02-12-2001: Message edited by: William Wright ]
 
 
Traz
01:14 / 03.12.01
Nobody disses my fanboyhood. I know Sci-Fi, I know comics, I know Kevin Smith's tubby ass...

Captain Nemo? Was he the commanding officer in "The Cage," the pilot episode for classic Trek? The one with the Talosians and...Jules Verne who?

And, just for fun: a book review by a high-school student who didn't do the required reading, courtesy of The Onion:
quote:Dune, by David Lynch, is the book I've chosen to read for my book assignment. Dune, which contains many hundreds of pages, is a really freaky book about the future. This one particular guy had to put his hand in a box, and he trips like it's burning up. Then, he had to learn fighting from a guy who reminded me quite a bit of Captain Picard. This fat guy with insane acne is trying to take everything over, somewhat like Darth Vader. But unlike Darth Vader, he got kind of gay on this other guy in a chapter of the book that was not my particular favorite. There's also a talking slug in a tank that you have to see to believe. The spaceships had cool design and the girl was pretty cute. You should read Dune or, even better, Starship Troopers.
 
 
Rev. Wright
08:40 / 03.12.01
quote: Nobody disses my fanboyhood. I know Sci-Fi, I know comics, I know Kevin Smith's tubby ass...

Chill fella

I say the Man from Atlantis is more of a terrorist than Captain Nemo. Lets have them fight it out.

[ 03-12-2001: Message edited by: William Wright ]
 
  
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