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Underground > Books, Criticism & Writing >

Neil Gaiman

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Ganesh

06:21 / 05.07.01

I'd agree with Kali that, for some reason, I feel a little defensive saying (on Barbelith) that I enjoy Gaiman's writing - but I do. I get irritated by his lapses into tweeness, but it's generally worth staying with him for the duration of the book.

Currently reading 'Neverwhere', which taps into some of my own excitement/trepidation about London - and makes a much better book than it did a television series.

Also bought 'American Gods' which I'll tackle soon. Kali, have you read this? What did you think?

ynh

07:03 / 05.07.01

I'm with you, Ganesh (and apparently Kali.) If it wasn't for Sandman I would have forgotten all about comics nearly ten years ago.

I read Neverwhere and it was worth the read. I can't seem to justify 26$ for American Gods... yet.

08:16 / 05.07.01

I didn't grow up with comics--I started reading Sandman when I was about 20, which combined with an interest in noir led me to Sandman Mystery Theater, which led me to the Vertigo rack which led me to The Invisibles #23 ("Hey, neat cover, whoa that guy's eyes are floating out of his head, I'll give this a whirl"). So you'll hear no Gaiman-dissing from me.

(Oh, and what does "twee" mean? I keep looking in British slang dictionaries and not finding it.)

The Return Of Rothkoid

08:16 / 05.07.01

See, you should've looked in an American one.

quote:Found 2 entries for twee.

twee (tw)
adj. Chiefly British

Overly precious or nice.

[Alteration of tweet, baby-talk alteration of sweet.]

twee adj : affectedly dainty or refined [syn: dainty, mincing, niminy-piminy, prim]

I don't know - I read most of Sandman in TP at an ex-girlfriend's house, years ago. I haven't gone back... I can't rightly say why, either. Maybe I should give Neverwhere a try...

11:05 / 05.07.01

Just bought American Gods in hardback for £10! Came out today. I read the first chapter online at work slyly this morning. (If you're interested it can be found here http://www.americangods.com/books/americangods_hc.asp )
Also picked up Harry Potter Goblet of Fire paperback for £5. Not a bad haul.

Neil Gaiman is doing a signing in Bristol next Friday but I have to be at my Girlfriends graduation! These events always seem to clash these days! Next time...

I'm a big Sandman fan and bought the first Graphic Novel at the age of 16 the day after my Gran died. It was quite a strange and emotional read especially when Death turns up. I was hooked from the start and still enjoy "Preludes and Nocturnes" as much as the others. In general people seem to regard this as the weekest of the Sandman graphic novels. I wonder if I would hold it in the same regard if I'd bought it at a more emotionally stable time of my life?

Anyway I'm a big Gaiman fan and I'm looking forward to reading through American Gods. I'll give you a comment once I've read it.

laters...

11:13 / 05.07.01

My girlfriend works in a bookstore and she got me an advance reading copy of American Gods for free, two weeks before it came out! I haven't had a chance to read it yet though...but I've vacation next week... I keep thinking I should have sold it on E bay to some Gaiman fanatic.

15:58 / 05.07.01

I'll register myself here as a Gaiman fan, too. I recommend Smoke and Mirrors if you're into short stories. They're not all good, but the best are very good indeed.

As for Sandman, it got me reading comics again after a very long period of abstinence. If, upon departing this life, one were to meet Gaiman's version of Death, I'd almost be looking forward to it.

ynh

16:13 / 05.07.01

I meant to ask this: What's in Smoke and Mirrors that's not in Angels and Visitations? And are the extras any good?

Oooh, and there's an unabridged audio of American Gods soon to be released, and read by Gaiman.

Kali, Queen of Kitteh

16:33 / 05.07.01

Actually just finished American Gods today.

Here's my take:

It is an extremely ambitious novel, and very distinctly a change for Neil. After having read him for so long, one gets a feel for what his prose is like. Everything I've ever read by him always brings to mind his very, oh, I dunno, Englishness.

Not so with this novel. This novel Neil tackles America, and there's nary a Brit to be found. It is very very much American. A completely different tone of voice, of plot, of feel. In fact, it almost doesn't read as a Neil Gaiman novel at all. It's only the subject matter--old gods going to war with new, and a human caught in between--that makes it so. I was quite startled when I got through the first few chapters but I wasn't sure whether or not it was really something he'd written. My first comparisons were honestly to those of Clive Barker's Sacrament, or Galilee. (Not that those were horrible books, they were just horribly mediocre.) It sounded like Neil Gaiman doing Clive Barker who, in turn, was writing another novel about America.

Not that that's a bad thing.

But for all that, it is very very good book. I like recognizing familiar gods and figuring unfamiliar ones (Ganesh's and I's namesakes appear). But if you're comfortable and familiar with Neil's voice, you'll be in for a surprise. This is something altogether completely different for Neil. This is an account of America as seen through the eyes of the gods our ancestors brought with them.

I can see where writing this novel took so long. It is very daunting subject, it seems, for a former Brit to write, or attempt to write, so thoroughly about rural America ( only a few parts actually take place in cities). Rural America is almost a whole 'nother country.

I recommend it, I really do. But I can also see how a lot of Gaiman's audience may be very disappointed as well...

I am currently waiting for the autographed and sketched copy Hadalis is shipping to me from Dallas.

[ 05-07-2001: Message edited by: Kali ]

01:53 / 06.07.01

It is very daunting subject, it seems, for a former Brit to write, or attempt to write, so thoroughly about rural America ( only a few parts actually take place in cities). Rural America is almost a whole 'nother country.

Yup. There's plenty of wierdness in Wisconsin, but unlike the (US) South, you have to search it out. Word has it that he actually lives near where Wisconsin Death Trip occured.

I've been meaning to read this since Niel did an interview w/ The Onion and mentioned that there'd be some Wisconsin in the book (e.g.: Throwing a wrecked car onto a frozen lake and having a lottery on when it'll break though the ice). You think that's wierd? Don't even ask me about Cow Chip Bingo....

wembley can change in 28 days

01:58 / 06.07.01

If anyone's in the Toronto area, Neil Gaiman will be at the !ndigo store at Yonge and Eglington on July 22 (I think) from 4

m (I think). Unfortunately, this isn't the store I work at. I don't know what they're thinking - we got Candace Bushnell and they're getting Neil Fucking Gaiman! Bastards, all of them.

I suppose the message is to be on the lookout for Neil in a town near you!

Kali, Queen of Kitteh

04:01 / 06.07.01

Margin Walker, the main of where American Gods is set is Wisconson, actually. The furthest South he ventures is Tennessee. But it's mostly Heartland.

And yes, that lottery is indeed a secret focal point of the plot.

deletia

07:08 / 06.07.01

I think what gets me about Neil Gaiman is his pat-on-head approach to his readers - the way he gives them reference and footnote in the same bite-sized chunk, so they can feel clever and enlightend. It seems a slightly decaf moccahcino way of going about things.

I also have the same distrust for him as I do for any writer with *fans*.

Still, Neverwhere did keep Hywel Bennet in firewood, so yay Neil.

The Return Of Rothkoid

07:08 / 06.07.01

I think Haus' point about Gaiman's tone is germane; it's what - I think - has put me off reading any of his other stuff. I quite liked Sandman, but did get a behind-the-shoulder-stands-the-author feeling when I was reading it. I like to think I'm smart enough to pick up on subtle reference myself, and the fact that Gaiman seems to infer that his readers aren't does chafe somewhat.

I read the first chapter of American Gods online yesterday and wasn't quite blown away by it - it seemed to be sitting in the comfortable prose position that I get from Stephen King's stuff - or, as Kali suggests, Clive Barker: no exertion and not a great deal of concern. Hmm. Still, if it garners rave reviews here, I might give it a whirl.

Kali, Queen of Kitteh

14:17 / 06.07.01

The entire tone of the novel is rather strange as it doesn't seem like him. It's not what I have gotten used to, but it is definitely interesting to see him take this approach.

Our Lady of The Two Towers

17:45 / 07.07.01

I'm a thick person, so I don't see that happening at all.

And it's nice to see Haus subscribing to the 'popular=shit' theory...

09:17 / 08.07.01

Basically he can write cracking dialogue and construct decent plots (the short story "Murder Mysteries" is my fave).

He does, tho, offer up rather apple pie insights into life, love, death, etc. I'd like to see him shake lose and try offending himself more often.

Kali, Queen of Kitteh

09:17 / 08.07.01

I see that sort of happening in the new book, and then I see something else.

But maybe that's what was intended by him all along.

And Loz, seeing Tann take the "popular=shit" theory?

%Why, I never.%

deletia

18:51 / 08.07.01

Actually, I didn't. I said I distrusted authors with *fans*. As opposed to readers, or people who by their books because they like them, fans uncritically consume works and products connected to the work, consuming the work as *product*, and usually finding the author's lifestyle aspirational also.

A case in point. Are there many stuffed toys/models of characters from Douglas Coupland novels?

Regrettable Juvenilia

18:59 / 08.07.01

quote:Originally posted by Nick Jordan:
If, upon departing this life, one were to meet Gaiman's version of Death, I'd almost be looking forward to it.

And this is precisely why I can respect, admire, like and enjoy Gaiman's work, but will never love it.

Our Lady of The Two Towers

19:12 / 08.07.01

But that tends to be the problem doesn't it, you say 'undiscerning fan' I say 'discerning consumer of his work'... let's call the whole thing off?

06:59 / 09.07.01

*waiting in in to buy my own 'girlfriend in a coma' doll*

14:16 / 10.07.01

Smoke and Mirrors is indeed great in places, and patchy in others. The Grail story is particularly brilliant (I forget the title).

I first saw the TV series of Neverwhere. (It was, incidentally, written for TV, and then novellized slightly differently. I've only read the opening pages, but the idea of Croup & Vandemar on the hillside is particularly good). Anyhow, I loved the TV series. My friends all thought it was a bit cheap/tacky, but I found it well executed and the ideas were great.

Gaiman on balance, all said and done, is OK. But he's not hugely remarkable. IMHO.

09:51 / 11.07.01

like many of you i too was lured back to comics by The Sandman, i think this was probably back when i thought being gothic was cool as well.

so yeah i used to be a gaiman nut, i hit that dreaming website every time i got online, and i own and have read NeverWhere, Good Omens, Smoke & Mirrors, Angels & Visitations, and the Sandman: Book of Dreams.

so i was really excited to hear about American Gods. but, when it came out i discovered that i didn't want it nearly as bad as i wanted "CHOKE"

Something just seems silly about a book with names like "mr. shadow" and shit, i dunno...

is it good?

09:51 / 11.07.01

quote:Originally posted by belbin:
Basically he can write cracking dialogue and construct decent plots (the short story "Murder Mysteries" is my fave).

He does, tho, offer up rather apple pie insights into life, love, death, etc. I'd like to see him shake lose and try offending himself more often.

I've being trying to figure out precisely why I sometimes like and sometimes loath Gaiman - that hits the nail right on the head, so to speak.

There's some excellent stuff in Sandman ,undoubtedly (the first two books being my favourites), but I kind of resent having to wade through mountains of twee shite about fairies and contrived cute moral messages in order to get to it.

I really liked the Neverwhere TV show, and the couple of Gaiman short stories I've read weren't bad either..

12:38 / 11.07.01

Hmmm, my ex-girlfriend's been waggling the proof of the New Gaiman book under my nose for the past 2 months now.... she leant it to someone before me... arse.

Still he's doing a talk and signing in Manchester tonight to which I am going... ah yes and of course the free wine.... will I be a heathen and take two glassess each time.... yup.... so long as there are people at the talk they have to open another bottle of wine until it's over..... it's great.... tum te tum....

****Bastards..... No WINE!!!!!*******

[ 12-07-2001: Message edited by: Opalfruit ]

14:18 / 13.07.01

i thought that good omens was a great gaiman book but it had pratchett in the mix which may be why it's the only gaiman novel that i truly loved. i enjoyed neverhwere a great deal but did not love it. haven't gotten american gods yet but i definitely will buy it when i happen across it in the used book store down the street.

Kali, Queen of Kitteh

16:40 / 13.07.01

And that's Mr. Wednesday.

uncle retrospective

09:11 / 14.07.01

Read Stardust, it's great.

Hated the version with the P. Craig Russel art, loved the novel.

09:11 / 14.07.01

Wow, you've got a version with P. Craig Russell art? How come the rest of us had to settle for Charles Vess?

uncle retrospective

20:35 / 14.07.01

quote:Originally posted by Jack Fear:
Wow, you've got a version with P. Craig Russell art? How come the rest of us had to settle for Charles Vess?

Hangs head, shuffles some dirt and says
"well I didn't like it did I?"

02:04 / 22.07.02

*bump*

For anyone that's interested, Gaiman's got a new book out called "Coraline". Short review here:
http://www.globebooks.com/reviews/Alice_in_Otherland.html.

11:45 / 23.07.02

my boyfriend and other friends of mine are really into neil gaiman and i -forgive me- haven't ever read any of his work. are there any tidbits online?

Our Lady of The Two Towers

15:42 / 24.07.02

Try neilgaiman.com

19:17 / 25.07.02

Coraline was excellent, and I highly recommend it. Kinda creepy and the McKean illos just add to the effect. I'm currently reading "A Walking Tour of the Shambles" in which Mr. Gaiman and Gene Wolfe give a short tour of a fictious Chicago neighbourhood. It's quite good. Gives me that same feeling as the Museum of the Strange issue of Doom Patrol. Just enough tidbits to set your mind running. Or fleeing perhaps. Published by American Fantasy, retails at 15 USD. Worth it, I think.

I'm really looking forward to his next book. It's a non-fic about Douglas Adams and the Hitchhiker's Guide. Should be out soon.

Zoom.

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