BARBELITH underground
 

Subcultural engagement for the 21st Century...
Barbelith is a new kind of community (find out more)...
You can login or register.


Young, hip Christians at university campusses, the misuse and the issues

 
 
All Acting Regiment
13:04 / 13.08.07
So I want to start a general topic about people's experiences with these Christian youth groups one finds around universities and colleges. To kick off, recently they've been sidling up to the tables in the Union at our place and depositing these leaflets, in silence. They don't talk, they just leave leaflets on your table. The leaflets say "Music night" or "Book group" or "Discussion event". You have to look hard to find the "Hosted by the Christian Union" badge.

This is wrong, yes? Not quite as bad as when the Zionist society was running the student paper (with highly objective articles by the editor called "Evils of the Veil" and "Living with Terrorism"), but still very bad.

This isn't intended to be a slight against Christians generally, but on what seem to be sly recruitment methods for a particular person's idea of Christianity. What kind of qualifications does one need to start a University Christian group? And who's going to check? Most of all I worry about people who don't find it easy to make friends, who might get swept into something like this.

Your thoughts, experiences, etc.
 
 
Less searchable M0rd4nt
13:28 / 13.08.07
Complain. Make a fuss. This is intrusive, underhand and generally obnoxious behaviour and it's unacceptable. You have every right to call them on it.

I had some frightening experiences with the CU at my old tech. There were (literally) four of them but the head was a woman in a position of some power there since she ran the sports hall, which was where the common room was and so on. She was a woman of great piety but little wit and NO FUCKING BOUNDARIES. And once this woman clocked me as being into all that eeeeevvvvviiiiil occult stuff, she would not leave me alone. She would interrupt me while I was working in the study area; comments to the effect that the work I was doing had to be in that afternoon, for example, fell on deaf ears as she lectured me enthusiastically and at length on her fundie paranoid obsessions. The librarian was also a key figure in the group and would constantly criticise my choice of reading material. On a couple of occassions I caved into pressure and attended some of their fundie paranoid video sessions. These dealt with such pressing concerns as the evils of homosexuality and the world-wide satanic conspiracy.

I was already under an enormous amount of stress both at home and at school, and I really, really didn't need that shit on top of it. However, being young and more than a little timid, I did not really know how to address the issue of being everso-politely harrassed by a mature woman who was also a member of staff. It was like being stalked by a Chick tract in sportswear.
 
 
All Acting Regiment
13:46 / 13.08.07
Complain. Make a fuss. This is intrusive, underhand and generally obnoxious behaviour and it's unacceptable. You have every right to call them on it.

I'd like to, and will if when term starts again they're still at it. The only concern I have about doing so is that I can't claim that I'm in any particular danger from this lot.

The thing that really annoys me about this sort of activity is that it's needless. The Islamic society hold open days where they have old copies of the Ko'ran and other documents, rugs and clothes on display; they have speakers talking about Islamic history and various priests and community figures, young and old, male and female, ready to answer people's questions. As it was in a building I use frequently, I saw a lot of this, and the speakers remained polite and constructive even when faced with offensive or stupid questions.

Now not only is this group a minority, a lot of these kids were actually new to the country and only had a few years of speaking English. If, under all that pressure, they could manage to do something constructive and informative I don't see any reason why the Christian group has to be so underhand. I can't claim to know what ideology they're actually pushing; it might be benign, but I'm afraid I doubt it.
 
 
MattShepherd: I WEDDED KALI!
13:58 / 13.08.07
I'd be tempted to make CULT ALERT: BOOK AND FILM CLUB INVITATIONS MAY BE BOGUS warning posters and post them around campus in a midnight blitz, but that's probably my L33T M4TRIX TRIXXTOR speaking, fuelled by an abundance of office coffee.
 
 
Katherine
14:10 / 13.08.07
Has anyone talked to the droppers of leaflets? It could be they are fairly clueless or maybe shy themselves and do not realise their actions or that of their group may be coming across in a negative light.
 
 
Happy Dave Has Left
14:18 / 13.08.07
Frankly, this is a sign that they have a weak-ass brainmeme. It's also a 'recruiting tactic' that is as old as the hills, and far from confined to Christians. My wife used to go and chant for a couple of hours with the Hari Krishnas for the free sandwiches when she was a penniless student.

There will always be groups using free food, discussion or the promise of friendship and companionship to attract members. Some organisations want to disseminate relatively harmless memes(we're all into table-top gaming dude!) and hence don't need the 'hooks', whereas some, especially in an increasingly secular country like the UK, think they need to attract people in order to corner them and try and induct them.

Kids are impressionable, and many people in the 18-22 age-bracket are actively seeking to define or re-define themselves. So, yeah, vulnerable. But there are a ton of organisations out there who want the attention of young people. The fact that the Christians in this instance are relying on pretty lame recruitment tactics is a reflection of the current weakness of their position, rather than evidence of a creepy conspiracy to re-enact Jonestown in the the nearest halls of residence.

I'd go along for a debate. I know I have done in the past. It can be a little like banging your head off a brick wall, but it can also be interesting and fun, if the religious people are up for some honest debate.

If these people were actively harassing you, or your friends, I'd say take 'em on. But they're not doing anything wrong, as far as I can see. They have the right to promote their beliefs, just as you have the right to ignore them.
 
 
jentacular dreams
14:30 / 13.08.07
Whilst I'd say that nothing puts me off Christianity quite like a trip to an everyday CU meeting (there were reasons I can't quite pin down as well as the obvious aversions to fundamentalists*), I'd also encourage you to go along for one, if you feel your brain could take it. Ours usually have a few entertaining events each year such as 'grill a christian', which can be entertaining and informative simply because the people being questioned are usually open, outgoing and forthright. It's also possible that they've got vague fliers simply because they haven't quite decided what they're going to discuss (or because one print run is so much cheaper).

Speaking purely from experience, I've found that at both my current and previous universities any students were able to run a student group (i.e. no qualifications required bar enrollment), though often they needed to register said group with the union, and there was extra admin for risky physical activities etc.

If it helps we have an excellent university chaplaincy which I think would happily have an informal word if they felt that the CU were overstepping their bounds (and who's opinion the CU would respect enough to take home any message from the issue, rather than the letter of the law). Do you know how open yours is to these kind of concerns, and what it's relationship is like with the CU?

* whilst most CU's usually have something of a fundamentalist streak, they usually also contain a good number of moderates. Do you know if this event is being organised by the CU itself, or merely *members of...*, as it were?
 
 
Seth
16:42 / 13.08.07
I'm not ashamed of the Gospel.

I'm not ashamed of the One I love.
 
 
Our Lady Has Left the Building
17:28 / 13.08.07
As unlikely as it may be for me to stand up for Jehova, I should point out that from what you've said it sounds like the CU are being careful to stay well within the likely rules your establishment have for Socs to behave. Complain about them holding evil indoctrination mixers and video shows and it'll be you that's considered to be the arsecandle, not them.
 
 
Tsuga
18:06 / 13.08.07
Sounds more annoying to me than anything. If young, impressionable youth are attracted to that, so be it. It works for Seth, apparently. Seth seems alright. Whether or not you think it's a good idea for people to be christian, or conservative, or something else you're not, as long as it's not hateful it seems they should be free. I'm sure many would like to make the arguments for prejudices and hatefulness in religions, which can sometimes be true, but as a generality, not necessarily fair. Personally, I've got all kinds of problems with theism and religions, but that's not really the point, is it.
 
 
Seth
21:54 / 13.08.07
Previously on Seth...
 
 
Regrettable Juvenilia
22:01 / 13.08.07
Seth, were you making a point about open vs. stealthy Christianity? It seemed sort of ambiguous to me... and yeah, I do sort of have a problem with the disingenuousness of advertising a "Discussion event" which is actually a CU event if said event has an outreach/evangelism purpose. It's one thing for an individual, say, to invite people to have a discussion and then bring their own agenda - a lot of us do that. But when it's an organised group doing it, that's another matter, one that leaves a bad taste in my mouth. I have similar reservations about the way the Alpha Course has been marketed in the past...

"Let's have a discussion of the meaning of life over some pasta! What do you think happens when we die? Oh, that's interesting. And you? Mmm hmm, well that's one point of view. Tell you what, why don't we see what this book I just happen to have under my chair - it's called The Bible - let's just see what that says, shall we? I wonder if it will be relevant!"

We may even have discussed this before on Barbelith, actually...
 
 
Aertho
22:07 / 13.08.07
Flyb's story is how I saw the original post playing out. The antics of the CU seem eye-roll-worthy.

Also confused by Seth.
 
 
Jack The Bodiless
22:36 / 13.08.07
He's making a joke about Deliriou5!, a U2-style Christian rock band that used to do the circuit of youth Christian events back in the day. Which he thought Flyboy would get, bearing in mind our shared history.

It's harmless. Christian youth-groups have been trying the same hare-brained, 'we're-ten-years-behind-everyone-else-but-trying-to-be-hip' sad outreach stuff for thirty years now. The happy-clappy house church movement, back in the day, was an attempt to get in with the hippy kids. In 1976. Any University kid who falls for one of these pamphlets and goes along, and stays more than ten minutes, is the kind of kid who'd probably go anyway even if they advertised honestly. And namechecking the Islamic society as a peer-group example amongst the religiosocs... not the same thing. There are plenty of people who'd actively seek out that kind of society even if they weren't already Muslims. CU-style groups at University tend to attract their own, which is why they attempt to rebrand so often, and why this kind of advertising is still used. It's not a big deal, it never works, and that's why it's faintly silly.
 
 
Regrettable Juvenilia
22:50 / 13.08.07
I think you'll find that's Delireeoofive?
 
 
Jack The Bodiless
10:23 / 14.08.07
Yes! He shoots, he scores! We were just talking about that last night and how freakin' hilariou5? that name was...
 
 
Tryphena Absent
11:01 / 14.08.07
I think we're bundling Christian Union's into one rather dirty pot here. Yes, it's annoying when people organise events like this and they're not clearly marked as coming from a distinct organisation but perhaps the fundamental intention isn't recruitment. I think don't be too angry until you've gone along to an event, are aware that it's orientated around the religion and have actually pointed out to someone that they might want to make it more obvious that it's that kind of group on the literature. When they get odd or fail to take the suggestion to heart you can get pissed off.
 
 
All Acting Regiment
13:40 / 14.08.07
Aye. Like I say I'll see what they're up to when I go back.
 
 
Seth
16:32 / 14.08.07
It's harmless.

Not if you've read His Dark Materials.

Read it - it's a real eye opener!
 
 
Mistoffelees
16:43 / 14.08.07
No spoilers please! I´ve just finished the 2nd book and the 3rd one is supposed to be here tout de suite. Is there a christian rock band in the last book?
 
 
Less searchable M0rd4nt
16:45 / 14.08.07
Yes. An evil Christian rock band that eats daemon kebabs backstage.
 
 
Mistoffelees
17:16 / 14.08.07
Oh dear. I had suspected Pullman would jump the sheep.
 
  
Add Your Reply