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Morrison and NEW GODS?

 
 
Mark Parsons
22:14 / 11.07.07
There was a rumor awhile back that GM was doing a 4th World "event," although I know not where it originated. This sounded hugelu cool to me, especially as I view SSoV as a modern 4th World style extravaganza.

This week Jim Starlin was announced as writer for THE DEATH OF THE NEW GODS, leading me to hope that this will clear the way for Morrison's supposed reboot/event.

Any thoughts on Morrison's approach to the New Gods via SSoV 1 and Mister Miracle. Speculations as to how the franchise might be rebooted?
 
 
Jack Fear
22:52 / 11.07.07
GM has written a short prose piece for an introduction for an omnibus collection reprinting Kirby's original Fourth World stuff: maybe that's what the rumor was referring to?
 
 
TimCallahan
03:20 / 12.07.07
Grant is rumored to be at work (or scheduled to work) on next year's big DC crossover event, and some speculation indicated that it would be New Gods related. It's pretty vague and insubtantial at this point, from what I've read.

Here's what Starlin says about his project though (over at Newsarama):

"I sort of think of this project as putting an ending to Jack's New Gods' saga. Since Kirby's initial run on the characters others have presented them with mixed results. Looking back I'd say at least half of the past New Gods series have done more harm than good. So for me, Death of the New Gods is half honoring Jack Kirby, half mercy killing."

"The name of the series is The Death of the New Gods, not The Death of Some of the New Gods."

I would love to see Grant handle the Fourth World relaunch, but, "mercy killing"? Really? The New Gods are some of the more interesting characters at DC are they not?

And doesn't a "mercy killing" just admit defeat? A type of thinking that goes, "I can't come up with any ideas, so I will kill them off"?
 
 
Mark Parsons
05:05 / 12.07.07
Rumors also have Busiek doing FINAL CRISIS, which one would assume is DC's big x-pver for next year.

Starlin does point out that DC still holds copyright (or whatever) on all those cool names and hints at the New Gods' eventual reboot/revival, hence my hope that GM gets in there and does the job.
 
 
Jack Fear
10:31 / 12.07.07
And doesn't a "mercy killing" just admit defeat? A type of thinking that goes, "I can't come up with any ideas, so I will kill them off"?

Or maybe a message of respect, as in “Nobody but Jack Kirby should ever have been allowed to work on these characters, and now nobody else will”?

I mean, if it spares us another John Byrne series, that would truly be a mercy. Mercy to Jack, mercy for comics readers everywhere.
 
 
Hallo, Paper Spaceboy
15:06 / 12.07.07
Just imagine...Byrne never touching the New Gods again...
 
 
Jack Fear
15:51 / 12.07.07
"Okay, Orion—show us on the doll where the bad man touched you..."
 
 
Hallo, Paper Spaceboy
16:28 / 12.07.07
The New Gods have showed up a little bit - notably, two little Young Gods who have stayed behind on Earth - in Busiek's Superman run and they haven't across as quite as haggard as when Byrne writes them. Busiek does a good job of at least hinting at the scale and divinity roaring behind their seemingly humanoid forms, and the difficulty they have relating to humans. I'm not sure how I feel about them disappearing altogether, but something needs to be done with them one way or the other.
 
 
Mario
16:45 / 12.07.07
"Just Imagine...Jim Starlin writing Death of the New Gods."

Then go to Newsarama. *sigh*
 
 
FinderWolf
14:19 / 13.07.07
I know there's all this "Jim Starlin does cosmic stuff sooo well" nostalgia, but I never really got into Starlin's Thanos/cosmic stuff and never read Infinity Gauntlet, etc. so I feel unimpressed by Starlin doing New Gods.
 
 
Hallo, Paper Spaceboy
01:51 / 14.07.07
Does Jim Starlin have the right tone for the New Gods? Sure, he does cosmic well - but is it the right sort of cosmic? Maybe if you teamed him up with someone who does brighter cosmic things you could set up an interesting creative balance between Apokolips (by Starlin) and New Genesis (perhaps by Mozzer, to pick a name out of the air?)
 
 
Alex's Grandma
02:53 / 14.07.07
Just imagine...Byrne never touching the New Gods again...

I dare you to say that to his face, as it were, over on Byrne Robotics.

JB does appear to read it - certainly, the pompous, self-regarding oaf seems to post on there every five or six hours, even when he's asleep, to an audience of toads for the most part.

It's about time somebody arseniced JB's virtual swimming pool, I think. It would only do him good in the end. That is, if there's any hope for him.
 
 
Gaixo
13:52 / 14.07.07
I thought it was considered bad form to mention Byrne Robotics around here, much less make plans to antagonize them/it. They sure have been discussing Morrisson a lot lately, though. Three or more threads have spun off discussion of his New X-Men run. To stay barely on topic, they also briefly expressed dismay that Grant might have anything to do with the New Gods in the future.
 
 
The Falcon
15:55 / 14.07.07
I thought it was considered bad form to mention Byrne Robotics around here, much less make plans to antagonize them/it.

Dunno why you'd think that?

Anyway, I was asked to do the dutiful but really I can barely look at the site without experiencing some kind of abyssal opening before me, not unlike HP Lovecraft in Planetary/Authority. In any case, in a Deleuzian twist, JB has sworn to take his own life before all's said and done.

Haste the day.
 
 
Hallo, Paper Spaceboy
17:42 / 14.07.07
In any case, in a Deleuzian twist, JB has sworn to take his own life before all's said and done.

You know, even I - who breathes and eats comics - can't really be bothered to care enough to "end my life." That's sad. Perhaps he's uncovered the Anti-Life Equation...
 
 
Mario
12:26 / 16.07.07
The big problem with Starlin on the New Gods is that he doesn't seem to understand the characters. He's spent so much time writing pastiches of them (Thanos, Mongul, Lord Papal) that he's forgoten their core personalities.

The most egregious example that I always drag up was his take on Darkseid in Cosmic Odyssey... as a worshipper of chaos.
 
 
Hallo, Paper Spaceboy
15:01 / 16.07.07
Well, to be honest, Cosmic Odyssey isn't really a bastion of recognizable characterization in general (and, in particular, I'm thinking of Starfire, Lightray, and J'onn J'onzz), so it doesn't really surprise me that Starlin failed to "get" Darkseid as well. Thanos has never quite lived up to the majesty (?) of Darkseid.
 
 
Twig the Wonder Kid
15:31 / 16.07.07
While I love the New Gods, short of resurrecting the King himself, I can't really see anyone making a good go at them.

And the news that Morrison may be given a stab at it doesn't really get me too excited because wasn't his recent Mr Miracle mini a bit ... [ducks for cover] ... weak?

Godland fulfills my cosmic requirements these days anyway.
 
 
Hallo, Paper Spaceboy
15:47 / 16.07.07
Mister Miracle was probably one of the weaker Seven Soldiers modules, although it had some good moments. I think part of the problem was the switch-over in artists, and some severe clarity issues rather than an outright mischaracterization or missing the point of the New Gods altogether.
 
 
Shiny: Well Over Thirty
15:47 / 16.07.07
Hmmmm - I think Mr Miracle was only weak because of the slightly jarring changes in artist. I gave it a reread recently and on reflection I think it might have been the best written of the 7 Soldiers series. So I'd like to see Grant telling more of that story.

As far as Starlin goes the only thing of his I can ever remember enjoying was his run on Silver Surfer, and I think I might only have enjoyed that because I was 11 or 12 at the time. And while there is probably a need for more comic books 11 year old boys can really enjoy these days I'm not sure a project that's really only going to appeal established comic fans in their twenties and over is necessarily the right place for the guy.
 
 
The Falcon
20:58 / 16.07.07
And the news that Morrison may be given a stab at it doesn't really get me too excited because wasn't his recent Mr Miracle mini a bit ... [ducks for cover] ... weak?

I don't think you'd get much argument over that really; but in terms of, ah, grandeur and scale it was like a kind of inverse New Gods. In retrospect, it was okay, if a little boring and kinda worthy.

But. If you're talking about big event, which DC are clearly counting down to (i.e. the next time everyone gives them money,) I hardly think it likely to occur in a municipal dump, for better or worse. And Grant wrote 'Rock of Ages', which is the real and original reason I, and most likely many others, love the New Gods.
 
 
This Sunday
21:12 / 16.07.07
Kirby's New Gods (i.e., the real stuff) had both the massive grandeur and the dingy little ghetto bits. Gods stepping down to our level to infiltrate organized crime, and all.

That's one big reason I'd prefer Morrison over Starlin - temporarily ignoring that, I just don't think Starlin gets it any more than Byrne - doing a big gigantic New Gods story, is that Morrison keeps it in mind that even when Gods walk the Earth and Loneliness, Fear, and Evolution killing people left and right, while antilife does its thing... normal folks don't stop getting hungry or needing a three minute smoke break. Whereas the Thanos stuff, and much else of Starlin's has always reminded me of a kid setting up action figures in some big battle diorama that doesn't have time or space for visiting the toilet or picnics in paradisical fields (whether they end in a fight and death, or not).

Besides, Morrison understands and champions the central conceit of the whole Fourth World, which is that these are modern deities, they are mythic conglomerates of pure essential communication. They're superheroes and supervillains, yeah, it's true, but that's because Kirby, like Morrison, often treated/treats the superhero/villain as that purified, essentialized demonstration.

Flex Mentallo would have made a good Fourth World book. For that matter, so would The Filth, after a fashion. Moreso than Infinity War.
 
 
diz
08:19 / 17.07.07
I dare you to say that to his face, as it were, over on Byrne Robotics.

JB does appear to read it - certainly, the pompous, self-regarding oaf seems to post on there every five or six hours, even when he's asleep, to an audience of toads for the most part.

It's about time somebody arseniced JB's virtual swimming pool, I think. It would only do him good in the end. That is, if there's any hope for him.


Byrne Robotics was an obssession of mine a few years ago, and I have tried every variation on that approach I could think of: belligerent asshole, snarky critic, ironic hyperconformist, innocent waif asking potentially eye-opening questions.

It accomplishes nothing, and just leaves you feeling cheap and dirty and pathetic afterwards. Don't go there.
 
 
Mr Tricks
20:48 / 26.07.07
Wasn't quite sure where this would best be posted so I figured here was as good as any.

A Question asked to Dan Dido as SDCC:
    "Will we see the DC One Million future again?"
    DiDio: "With Grant Morrison writing, yeah."
 
 
PatrickMM
01:49 / 27.07.07
I too really got into SSOV: Mister Miracle on the reread. The first time through I was really caught up in the connections between the series, marveling at the overall meta narrative construction, so this seemingly unrelated tale was a bit of a disappointment. But, looking at it isolated, it's a mind bending, Lynchian look at identity and desire. It's not easy to crack, but once you break through, it's a great read.
 
  
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