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Yoofemisms

 
  

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illmatic
21:35 / 04.04.07
WP - this comes from - Nice body, but her face is rough/ugly/etc

I'm pretty sure that's incorrect. I don't know why but it just feels wrong. Most "slang" (horrid word itself) doesn't have that clever Sunday Times crossword puzzle type punnage to it, though it's easy to map on to it afterwards.
 
 
Olulabelle
22:09 / 04.04.07
I've been doing this 'parks for play' thing, where kids get to go and hang out in the park with some supervision, doing things like dance and drama. It's all very unstructured and it's free so all sorts of kids come along and all of them, regardless of sex, age or postcode think my parrots are sick and bad.
 
 
ibis the being
22:17 / 04.04.07
WP - this comes from - Nice body, but her face is rough/ugly/etc

I'm pretty sure that's incorrect. I don't know why but it just feels wrong. Most "slang" (horrid word itself) doesn't have that clever Sunday Times crossword puzzle type punnage to it, though it's easy to map on to it afterwards.


I hate to contribute this because it's so misogynistic and gross, but I just have to be a know-it-all... in the US we have the (not so new) slang "butterface," which is basically short for "she's hot except/but for her face." (Clearly it could be used to describe a man but I haven't ever heard it done.) So I don't find it improbable that "butters" has a similar root.
 
 
Benny the Ball
05:22 / 05.04.07
Benny, I'd like to turn that question on its head, because funnily enough I almost replied to your previous post by asking... what's your point?

My point, flyboy, was to answer something that WP had raised, as to whether something was from south park - I understood it to be from something else. Referred, in my reply to another post and pm exchange that we had had. And then went on to add to the overall thread with something about a conversation that I over-heard on a bus, but didn't understand, between two young people.

Your point seemed to be to belittle. Rather than PMing me to ask me what's my point, and if there was a problem, we could have addressed it, you opted instead to post in a sarcastic tone directed at me with seemingly no provication, but in full view of the board. Please don't do this in future.
 
 
ONLY NICE THINGS
07:51 / 05.04.07
But that conversation is very easy to understand, isn't it? He was behaving in an unacceptable fashion, she (his girlfriend, I imagine) was having none of it, she subjected him to some form of chastisement.
 
 
Regrettable Juvenilia
08:08 / 05.04.07
Yet again these very funny ideas come up about PMs versus the public forum in which a discussion was already taking place... I didn't send a PM because I didn't want to address you privately/direcetly, Benny, but instead wanted to make a comment that I thought applied to your post but also the thread in general. I'm sorry if you felt personally attacked, but I can't understand how being singled out by PM would have lessened this.

I can't pretend this thread doesn't make me put my head in my hands.
 
 
Olulabelle
08:10 / 05.04.07
This thread is unoffending in it's guise of 'things that kids say that we now don't get because we're too old' isn't it?
 
 
Spaniel
08:16 / 05.04.07
He was behaving in an unacceptable fashion, she (his girlfriend, I imagine) was having none of it, she subjected him to some form of chastisement.

I got that much, but I was wondering whether there was detail I was missing missing.

Frankly I find my lack of knowledge about modern colloquialisms fascinating. It's a very weird feeling - like I'm inhabiting a sterotype I had a lot of stock in as a teen.
 
 
Regrettable Juvenilia
08:16 / 05.04.07
And yet, Bennt, also, I still wonder what the point of the second and larger part of your post was - what did you think it added to the thread?
 
 
illmatic
08:33 / 05.04.07
in the US we have the (not so new) slang "butterface," which is basically short for "she's hot except/but for her face." (Clearly it could be used to describe a man but I haven't ever heard it done.) So I don't find it improbable that "butters" has a similar root.

I think it’s more likely to be a variation on “butt ugly” to be honest. This works for me more as an etymology and seems to reflect the way kids speak more accurately – shortening and distorting words rather than using deliberate puns. Interestingly enough you have two distinct uses on the same word kicking around – “butters” = ugly, a London/British thing, and “butter” as in “smooth-like” derived from US Hip Ho. I’ve only heard the former here.

I share Flyboy’s distress to a degree. I find it weird that people find slang so odd. I grew up using it, and am exposed to a lot it now as a teacher. The creative re-working of language is one of the things I’ve always enjoyed about youth culture and Hip Hop/Grime in particular.
 
 
Spaniel
09:26 / 05.04.07
Is it that people find slang odd, or is that they find it odd/uncomfortable/weird that they're so removed from social contexts where modern slang is used? Even if they haven't articulated it to themselves, I suspect it's the latter.
 
 
Quantum
09:41 / 05.04.07
The creative re-working of language is one of the things I’ve always enjoyed about youth culture

That's why I started the thread, I love discovering new (to me) words and phrases and constructions, whether it's l33tspeak or whatever. I am fascinated by naval slang from the Napoleonic wars f'rexample, and am intrigued with contemporary slang because it's not something I am immersed in. A relative ignorance of hip-hop and grime slang compounds my age and parochialism, but even so I think the girl those dudes on the bus were talking about was right to mess up her boyf. And I've heard butterface before a few times, I think that derivation is correct.

When I was a teen our slang was incomprehensible to older people, and that was sort of the point, so I'm not surprised to now find myself on the other side of the fence scratching my head when people say 'Bare'.
 
 
Quantum
10:12 / 05.04.07
On the other hand, if I start spouting geekspeak or Isle of Wight dialect, your average teenager will look slightly puzzled at best.
'Alright nippers, you'm after some nammet?'
'Piss off, grandad!'
 
 
Regrettable Juvenilia
10:25 / 05.04.07
I'm not sure I'm either distressed or offended, really. Just a bit annoyed.

Apologies to Quantum if I misread the spirit of this thread. "What's your favourite new slang?" should I guess have tipped me off that you meant favourite as in the sense of really genuinely thinking some slang is great, and enjoying the rich variance of language.

It's probably wrong of me to assume that any such thread on Barbelith will automatically become "those kids talk funny, how bizarre!" - and it didn't help that I misread Mordant's comment about "You're lovin' it" as referring to someone other than Quantum - but these days I do tend to assume that, I'm afraid...
 
 
Quantum
10:55 / 05.04.07
these days I do tend to assume that, I'm afraid...

Can't think why....

I'm actually started to think the heavy crossover between 'black' language and culture and the London youth culture makes it difficult to discuss it without sounding racist. It's a blurry line between 'those funny teenagers and their weird slang' and 'those funny foreign/black/gay folk and their weird slang'.
 
 
Regrettable Juvenilia
11:41 / 05.04.07
To be honest, I think 'those funny teenagers and their weird slang' is pretty much as bad, what with youth being so demonised at the moment. And of course class is always involved, too...
 
 
illmatic
12:02 / 05.04.07
Also, unfortunately, the way some of the statements in this thread are phrased are reflect Barbelith's class/race background - middle class and white, for the most part - without encouraging reflection on these things.

I feel that talking about these issues in a "wow, that's weird" sort of way makes it harder to have an interesting dialogue about the subject. For instance, I'm quite interested in the way large sections of the generation below me uses very different inflections in speech, inflections which seem to have some kind of West Indian/Patois influence. I'm interested in the hows and whys of this - increased integration of West Indian people? Popularity of grime and Hip Hop? What exactly? "Patois" is actually a poor description here because it doesn't catch the exact nunaces. It would seem to me to be impossible to ahve this discussion if I can't get over the fact that someone uses the word "bait" or the word "bare" as a kind of adjective intensifier.
 
 
Quantum
12:24 / 05.04.07
Demonised? I suppose you're right, hoody terror and all that. I don't know if it's a new phenomenon though, teenagers (especially boys, esp. working class, esp. non-white) have always been feared by the older folk whether they're wearing punk or baggy or grunge or hoodies.

I'd be interested to discuss other groups than london teens too, even though it does lead the rest of the country rather. I mean, other local dialects are just as fascinating and vary more widely in the playground or park than in the adult world I reckon.
Like the inflection thing, it's true in London but not so true outside. In rural or less diverse communities the kids get their slang off the telly more than grime records, in my limited experience. The widespread adoption of Ali G speak and Little Britain catchphrases are common everywhere, there's an aspiration to fit the generic teen portrayed in the media. I've noticed some yoof aspiring to speak like the Streets, in their blazers waiting for mummy's 4x4, which I think is interesting compared to the classism normally experienced by us old folk.
 
 
Regrettable Juvenilia
12:26 / 05.04.07
Slumming is nothing new, surely!
 
 
Spaniel
12:39 / 05.04.07
Quants, are you saying that you haven't heard kids in Brighton speaking with inflections which seem to have some kind of West Indian/Patois influence? 'Cause I sure have. loads of 'em, from all class and race backgrounds. I've often wondered how it came about. Something to do with he connection between the desirability (particularly for teenagers) of urban spaces and the way they've been linked to black music/street culture, perhaps?

I vividly remember an estuary English twang somewhat engulfing the small corner of Sussex I grew up in when I was about 15 (1990), and at the time I found that pretty baffling. I've always assumed it had something to do with finding an identity.
 
 
Spaniel
12:40 / 05.04.07
I mean mythical urban spaces, obvs
 
 
Quantum
12:56 / 05.04.07
Boboss- yes I have, but not nearly as much or as pronounced as, say, Tottenham. It's a kind of watered down wannabe patois to my ear.

Slumming is nothing new, surely!

True dat, but these kids don't actually go and hang out with the people they're mimicking, it's a contrived facade. As Boboss said, I think it's about constructing an identity, whether it's mockney or faux-californian. Where I grew up there's lots of surfing and skating and the adoption of 'stoked' and 'dude' and similar slang was the equivalent of the estuary twang B experienced.
 
 
Spaniel
13:00 / 05.04.07
Oh yeah, sure, it's definitely watered down.

When I moved to Brighton everything was punctuated with "MAAAAAATTTEEE!!!" Drove me batty until I started doing it.

And then it drove all my friends and family who didn't live in Brighton batty.
 
 
slinkyvagabond
00:06 / 06.04.07
Well, I'm quite drunk, and I'm also not that old, but perhaps if you're automatically equating a discussion of "strange" slang language to racism (against balck people) that is because in your experience, much of your slang arises from your black/West Indian/African American communities, then you're just being too U.K. or U.S.-centric. Sorry for sounding harsh but English slang arises from forms of English other than British or American English. Witness "Singlish" (Singapore) or even my own, Hiberno-English. Also note that plenty of U.K. slang emanates from Anglo-Asians. Anyway, doesn't slang almost always arise in what might be called marginalised communities? So really, to even try and discuss it will automatically call into play issues of class and race and therefore, without wanting to disregard these issues, might it be better to discuss it at a more theoretical level, e.g. the evolution of language and how this has occurred? And also, if someone is commenting on "youth speak" in a humourous manner, might that not signal their delight rather than their disgust, even if said "youth speak" remains largely incomprehensible to them?

Yes, I'm using my get-out-of-jail-free card, but as I said, I'm drunk, and bolshy, and I'm at home alone so there's no-one to stop me from gabbling on the internet.
 
 
ibis the being
22:04 / 06.04.07
This may be a bit simplistic, but isn't the "strangeness" of slang simply due to how rapidly it evolves? If you aren't immersed in it everyday slang will become imcomprehensible to you quickly. And why do "the youth" speak it while adults typically don't?... I would guess that more than anything it has to do with the amount of time spent in social situations. Adults typically work 40+ hrs a week (at least in the US), and spend a few hours a week socializing outside of work if that. Considering it can sometimes take me a week or two just to return a phone call, I'm not likely to be up on the latest evolution of the word cool. There's a certain amount of slang that makes its way to us old fogies via the internet, whenever it reaches that mysterious tipping point that makes everyone start saying asshat or I heart whatever. From there it finds its way to VH1 cultural commentary shows and then it dies.
 
  

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