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Paprika

 
  

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Seth
12:42 / 05.06.07
YO! I seem to remember Transfer writing something about the release date being put back to September. Heartbreaking innit.
 
 
iamus
12:44 / 05.06.07
Meh.

So he did.


Sniffles.
 
 
iamus
04:55 / 06.06.07
La La La La La.

I have a new version now which flew down overnight. I've had a minimal glance through to check the quality without spoiling it and it seems to be a perfect transfer.

I'll report back after a full watch, but it seems like a goodun.
 
 
iamus
04:56 / 06.06.07
Oooh!

Perhaps this could be a Gunbuster Marathon Thingy!
 
 
Seth
11:41 / 06.06.07
YO! If it can be put on a DVD, yes it can. Sadly I cannot put it on a DVD myself.

Mind sending me the link? Or... putting it on DVD fer me?
 
 
Seth
14:56 / 09.06.07
YO!

I have now seen this.

It finished about five minutes ago.

I aim to see it a second time before I start work at half nine.

That is all.
 
 
Seth
01:22 / 10.06.07
After two viewings in the space of about five or six hours I feel just about ready to start writing about this film. In terms of density it's like a dwarf star in that it manages to compress a distillation of Satoshi Kon's entire canon into what is essentially a superhero sci-fi character piece that's filtered through his usual superflat sensibilities and based broadly around the notion of the psychiatrist-as-shaman. For anyone reading this who has yet to experience Kon at his best (Paranoia Agent and Tokyo Godfathers) that could loosely translate as being a cross between Flex Mentallo, Eternal Sunshine of the Spotless Mind and The Infernal Desire Machines of Dr. Hoffman.

I guess any analysis has to start with the principle character, which is a minefield in itself. Dr. Chiba is a psychiatrist who uses an experimental device called the DC Mini that allows her to enter the dreams of her patients. It's still in the developmental stages, hasn't been announced to the general public and certainly not cleared for commercial therapeutic use. Despite this she is already using it in therapy sessions, and the style of therapy itself is probably just as controversial as the technology that makes it possible…

You see, when she's operating in dreams Chiba becomes a lucid dreaming superhero called Paprika… kinda. The exact relationship between Chiba and Paprika is ambiguous. If Chiba is the psychonaut and shaman then Paprika seems more like a Holy Guardian Angel, a manifestation of Chiba in the form of her True Will anthropomorphised. In shamanic terms it's like those moments in your journeying when you wear your power animal or tutelary spirit… now, I'm not going to get into the arguments here concerning whether your tutelary spirit is an aspect of you or another being entirely, and how much the dividing line between *you* and *them* is blurred in some shamanic work, but you get the idea of how interesting this is starting to get for the purposes of the film.

And it gets meatier from there. You see, Paprika is also clearly an anima figure, an idea developed by a certain C. G. Jung to describe the dislocated aspects of a male's personality that they project onto an unconsciously constructed female *other* in order to be able to interact with these elements of themselves. Integration with the anima is typically played out in dreams as a sexual union. And it's here that Kon's depiction of Chiba's therapy sessions goes bonkers. She unashamedly utilises all of the above issues of transference and projection that come with the anima figure in a deeply problematic mix of gestalt therapy, lucid dreaming, NLP style submodality interventions, shamanic bargaining/bullying and Jungian psychoanalysis. It's a peculiarly irreverent therapy-by-flirtation and if you've ever done any anima (particularly anima work in dreams) work it rings remarkably true…

… or it would, if your dreams didn't feature a real person who happened to be conflated with said Holy Guardian Superhero in the place of your anima. In dreams the anima – while being far from safe for interaction and non-problematic in terms of gender representations – at least has the benefit of not being projected onto a real person. In waking life it's much more complex, as you will invariably meet people who remind you of those bits of yourself you haven't dealt with and all your psychic baggage tends to go haywire. Here we have a character that willingly takes on this role, in fact seems to actively encourage it, even when the patient's perceived issue seems to bear no relation to any issues they may have surrounding their anima. Paprika's tools more often than not involve the tricky substance of male fantasy and she seems to have next to no reservations about things getting particularly… icky. The film readily acknowledges this problematic subtext by frequently depicting Paprika almost as an escort.

This is where I'm reminded of Angela Carter's Infernal Desire Machines of Dr. Hoffman. In all these complex psychosexual situations the issue of exactly who is dreaming which elements is deliberately confused. Without the boundaries of waking reality dreams merge and interact in a way that frequently makes you wonder exactly who is projecting which repressed parts of their unconscious desires onto whom, and the result is a film that is troubling to pin down on moral and ethical levels. As a parallel, consider the way in which Kaufman and Gondry's Eternal Sunshine of the Spotless Mind depicts Clementine in terms of Joel's projections and fantasies. For most of the film we are not seeing Clementine herself, we're seeing the version of her that Joel has constructed in his head, which inevitably contains large elements of his own anima. Despite her actively discouraging these tendencies he has a notion of her as his saviour, and so when he introduces his conception of her into a traumatic childhood memory she does exactly that: saves him, leads him away from it by the hand, tells him the bullies who pressured him into the situation aren't worth his pain. Paprika is another such saviour, but one much more willing to take on the role.

Satoshi Kon is using this context to return to one of his enduring themes: the manner in which women are idealised, simplified and objectified. He presents all this material in a mess of information and interaction, highlighting the processes involved but leaving all conclusions to one side. In terms of gender representation and repressed sexual desire made manifest this is not an easy film to watch and is even harder to dissect. Many critics have previously stated that his work specifically addresses the state of modern Japan, and while there are large elements of truth in that it's still a notion that has exoticises that culture in its implication that the film doesn't equally apply to all cultures. The outward tropes may be Japanese but the themes are universal.

There's a lot more that could be written here, but I'm resistant to writing more about the women in Paprika as once we get past these generalities we're into spoilerific territory. I'm also aware that you'll probably need to own a copy before you can rewatch it enough to analyse, which is hard for a film that's not even been released in the West.

It's worth pointing out that this story couldn't exist in live action. There have been some excellent representations of dream states depicted in the work of Lynch, Jonze, Kaufman and Gondry (and I'm sure many others), but none come close to the sheer scale and spectacle of what's on display here. It's a strength of animation that the eye is never questioning what is real and what isn't, or rather what is a filmed live action element and what has been added digitally. Everything you see is animated and so the blurring of multiple realities is totally seamless.

And if the moment comes when Captain Konakawa finally answers the question that has been posed to him throughout the film, and you don't immediately stand on your seat and cheer the roof off, you're not a friend of mine, movies or life.

Absolutely. I saw the film with Iggy this afternoon and at this moment we spontaneously started applauding, laughing and wiping a tear from our respective eyes. Astounding filmmaking. Satoshi Kon seems to share a peculiar gift with Grant Morrison when it comes to writing these uncomplicated world weary decent coppers in mental situations.

There is much, much more to write about here but I don't want to thread hog.
 
 
Nocturne
18:54 / 18.06.07
The women in Paprika? It was the men I found iteresting.

The idea of a woman being torn between her fun-loving adventurous side and her practical, let's-get-the-job-done side is nothing new. At least, I've seen it in real life, not so much in anime. So the thing that got me was the men in the series.

Every one of the men is physically different somehow. The chairman is in a wheelchair, the director is incredibly short, and the camera angle in the restaurant scene seemed to deliberately make fun of Tokita. There's a few shots where you can't see the man's face while he's talking, and you're left staring at the fat along his jawline moving up and down. Compared to his coworkers of freakish proportions, Osanai's perfection is almost as garish. The detective was the only normal one in the batch. And even he wasn't generic enough to be boring.

I can understand why Tokita was fat, it made sense with his character. And Osanai's perfection was just a tool for him to use in his quest for power. But why was the director so short? Why the glasses? And why was the chairman in a wheelchair?

Some shows have really boring men thrown in as filler characters. That didn't seem to be the case here. I found it refreshing.
 
 
Nocturne
19:01 / 18.06.07
Then again, maybe the men were weird just to contrast with Chiba/Paprika. Maybe they were supposed to act as a foil to show off her perfection. Guh. How boring. Someone please prove me wrong. I want to watch a show where men are interesting for their own sake, not because they showcase the women. Maybe I should go watch the new Die Hard movie.
 
 
X-Himy
23:38 / 18.06.07
Well, I suppose that Japanese comics and animation has a history of wider character design, even within a single show or comic (see any of Scott McCloud's books). And I am trying to think, but there really wasn't another female character other than Chiba/Paprika.

As for the chairman, other than being his motivation, "chairman" was just a hilarious joke.
 
 
Seth
16:22 / 20.06.07
Then again, maybe the men were weird just to contrast with Chiba/Paprika. Maybe they were supposed to act as a foil to show off her perfection.

I think that's a real misunderstanding of the two characters. Paprika is not a human being in the same sense as the other characters. The film makes it quite clear that she is not merely Chiba's alter ego within dreams, although the precise nature of their relationship is ambiguous (see my post above). As such she doesn't abide by the same rules as the rest of them.

And Chiba is not perfect. One of the reasons she bonds so well with Tokita is that both are ambitious with little regard for scientific responsibility. She lectures him on the subject but really she's angry with herself. After all, she's been using the DC Mini without approval too.

She's also detached from what she really wants and being dishonest with herself about her feelings. She's frequently callous and uneccessarily harsh precisely because she doesn't have her own house in order. To me she's as fully realised as the rest of the characters in the piece.

As for the chairman, other than being his motivation, "chairman" was just a hilarious joke.

Hmmm. Not so much with you on the hilarious. I only know a couple of words of Japanese but the one honorific I noticed applied to him by the others was "sensei." It makes me wonder whether that was a deliberate pun on the part of the fansubbers, reminding me a little of Mr. Glass from Unbreakable. Paprika wears enough tropes of superhero movies, after all.

But the Chairman is one of my major sticking points with this film. He's the villain, he's disabled and he's gay. He controls people via money and sexuality and his orientation is depicted pretty undeniably as a bad thing in Paprika's final commentary on men and women being a healthy duality and his unpreparedness for her consumption of him. It seems as though the gay man is just waiting to be set straight by the right het woman (although I'm not sure the term woman fully applies to Paprika in as I've detailed above)... coupled with his disability being the root source of much of his motivation, in that it is implied that he is incomplete and is choosing to control the dream realm because he cannot control his life outside. Both homosexuality and disability seem to be treated as nasty aberrations in the text.

I've tried to fanwank these aspects so that they're not making me twitch, but finally had to admit defeat in that it was an exercise in attempting to excuse the film just because I like it a lot. The commentary the film offers on the idealisation and objectification of women is complex and defies a simple reading, which is what excuses some of its more difficult material. The depiction of Osanai and the Chairman are much simpler and much ickier.
 
 
Seth
16:26 / 20.06.07
You could also say that the film plays it safe and het with the depiction of Chiba/Paprika's therapy sessions, in that she's only ever seen to work with straight blokes. Although one could also make the comment that it's typical for a man's anima to be bi and so this doesn't necessarily let anyone off the hook.
 
 
Seth
16:29 / 20.06.07
*Typical* was probably the wrong word... to explain a little, the anima is identified by Jung as the dislocated parts of a male that they unconsciously represent as female. In my limited experience I know many more bisexual women than I do bisexual men, and so I might expect repressed same sex attraction in men to be a likely contender for qualities projected onto this unconscious female other.

Good god this film is difficult.
 
 
Seth
16:40 / 20.06.07
One more thing about Chiba... if Paprika is just a mask she wears (which she emphatically isn't) then what are we to make of the fact that she allows her alter ego to be a template onto which the male characters project all their gubbins? When you start asking yourself exactly what she might get from the transaction you're into very muddy waters.
 
 
Mysterious Transfer Student
16:54 / 20.06.07
I admit that like Seth I had let the thorny matter of the film's rather conservative attitude towards male-female relations and portrayals of differently abled individuals slide, purely out of enthusiasm for Paprika the movie and perhaps Paprika/Atsuko herself.

While the former matter is just about excusable in terms of the exploration of the murky and problematic area of trying to confront psychological anima issues head-on, in an interesting and dramatic fashion (and I'll freely admit to being behind the curve on how 'accurate' the Jungian elements might be), the latter is pretty much squarely in the ugly cinematic tradition of physically disabled = twisted, bitter and therefore inevitably evil. The only get-out I permitted myself in not condemning the movie for this was that the most unpleasant character to emerge from my viewings was Osanai, who creepily longed to possess Atsuko herself rather than some idealized or projected version of her. Though the plot point of his unwillingly and revoltedly being pimped to Himuro, yet another character depicted as freakishly different physically and sexually, does flip the movie's credit right back down again on that score.

When you start asking yourself exactly what she might get from the transaction you're into very muddy waters.

You could say that it was some variant of the impulse that led her to become a therapist in the first place, except that the extreme ethical and professional dodginess of permitting such unfettered transference and projection from her male patients would seem to shoot that down. Factor in, though, the fact that she's willing to use the DC Mini in unlicensed, illegal treatments, seemingly out of sheer scientific hubris and certitude that it's going to do good - and maybe as a means of feeding her own desire for transgressive thrill-seeking. After all, she's seemingly wholeheartedly dedicated to her career and yet that'd go up in flames if the team's practices were exposed to peer review or the press. Perhaps the enjoyable illicitness of Paprika's adventures isn't just experienced by the patients.

Gah, better stop as I'm getting out of my depth on this one.
 
 
Nocturne
17:15 / 20.06.07
And Chiba is not perfect. One of the reasons she bonds so well with Tokita is that both are ambitious with little regard for scientific responsibility. She lectures him on the subject but really she's angry with herself. After all, she's been using the DC Mini without approval too.

Hadn't thought of it that way. I kinda like that interpretation.

I really see Chiba and Paprika as two sides of the same person. It's common for one person to feel torn between two different reactions to the same incident; such as when she couldn't decide whether to ride away on the racehorse or stay and help Tokita. The only thing that bothers me with this approach is the part where she talks to herself or refers to her other self in the third person. Sorry YO!, but I have absoloutely no idea what you're talking about with the whole anima thing. To me, Chiba/Paprika seemed to make one perfect woman, if the two halves could accept each other.
 
 
Seth
17:21 / 20.06.07
It's tricky, isn't it? This is why I bought up The Infernal Desire Machines of Dr Hoffman above... Albertina and Desiderio wind up in some pretty horrendous sexual situations, and yet the novel never makes it clear who wants what to be done to whom.

It's also worth noting that this film only appears to have a dividing line between *dream* and *reality* in places... in actuality it doesn't at any point. The film starts in dreams, and even when it seemingly returns to the *real* world the hole that the Chairman rent is still there. You can't place any simple reading on whether Chiba is any more real than Paprika, or Konakawa than dream Himuro.
 
 
Seth
17:33 / 20.06.07
such as when she couldn't decide whether to ride away on the racehorse or stay and help Tokita

That's not what is happening in that scene. What is happening between Chiba and Paprika is not an argument between equals, Paprika is manipulating Chiba using reverse psychology. She knows Chiba is in love with him and is using the desperate situation that they're in to force Chiba's hand and make her act on what she wants. It's about the only time in the film when Paprika operates an intervention on a female character and it makes one realise exactly which of them is only an aspect of the other. Paprika has Chiba's number but the reverse is never true.

What's more important in terms of the debate about what the two are to each other is that Paprika always acts as a guide and guardian to Chiba, never vice versa. You could argue that Paprika represents the totality of Chiba's unconscious as it is plugged into the collective unconscious (if we continue the Jungian reading), which makes this again synonymous in my experience to the Holy Guardian Angel mentioned above (others experience may differ). However if you're unfamiliar with the concept of anima all of this might be referencing with which you're unfamiliar, in which case a Jung primer may well make you see this film in an entirely different light.

It's worth noting on that score that Satoshi Kon's Jungian enthusiams are well documented.
 
 
X-Himy
11:10 / 21.06.07
I hadn't gotten the impression that the Chairman was gay, though I would certainly concede that point. Himuro was gay, and it was my impression that it was he with whom Osanai slept with to get the DC Mini, or that Osanai slept with him in order to manipulate Himuro into stealing the DC Minis. Himuro did often appear as a female doll, make of that what you will.

I was more of the impression that the Chairman's desire for Osanai's body was due to his own broken body, not a sexual desire (though I guess it could play out that way). I generally thought his idea was to possess or inhabit Osanai's body, as he did during the butterfly scene. When the Chairman becomes the giant dream monster (shades of the angry forest god from Princess Mononoke), he delights in being able to walk.

Probably the most disturbing scene for me was during the butterfly scene, when Osanai invades Paprika, ripping away the Paprika suit to expose Chiba beneath.
 
 
Seth
21:26 / 25.06.07
X-Himy: I think that the scene in which the Chairman watches Osanai die/get pulled into the vortex that's opening up in the bedroom floor has clear signifiers that they're sleeping together. They're both wearing dressing gowns, the covers on the double bed are pulled aside as though they have both gotten up pretty quickly.

Nocturne: Then again, maybe the men were weird just to contrast with Chiba/Paprika. Maybe they were supposed to act as a foil to show off her perfection. Guh. How boring. Someone please prove me wrong. I want to watch a show where men are interesting for their own sake, not because they showcase the women.

Would you also be frustrated by a text in which women are imperfect in order to contrast against and showcase perfect men?
 
 
Nocturne
22:19 / 25.06.07
Would you also be frustrated by a text in which women are imperfect in order to contrast against and showcase perfect men?

Hrmm. I dunno.

I stopped watching television about a year ago. When I went driving through a major city, I was shocked at how much the advertising focused on women. I could only count on one hand the number of billboards I saw that had men in them at all, and in many of those, the man was not the main attraction - the woman was. The camera was obviously focused on her. Since then I've started noticing how "women oriented" the movies that I watch are. In many of my favourite shows, the women are the more interesting characters. Men seem to be more filler material. I hadn't noticed it before, and I'm shocked at my own bias.

Paprika is full of interesting male characters. But if all they're there for is to counterpoint Paprika, then it's nothing I haven't seen before. Boring. Perhaps I shouldn't hold it against the show though - just because it's a common theme doesn't mean it's a bad one. And my dismay at my own personal bias shouldn't prevent me from enjoying a good show.
 
 
Seth
22:27 / 25.06.07
I don't think you should hold it against the film because it's not a problem the film has. There is only one female character - Chiba - and she is as flawed as any other character in the piece. Paprika doesn't really class as a character in the same way that Mary Poppins and Jesus aren't really characters. They're not people, they're in the mix as a kind of divinity, to level the equation.
 
 
Seth
22:34 / 25.06.07
In many of my favourite shows, the women are the more interesting characters. Men seem to be more filler material.

It's much more my observation that the complete opposite is true. I can think of far more examples in which men are portrayed as complex and interesting and women are bland ciphers. See virtually every summer blockbuster big budget movie for examples of this.

In many ways you could make a case for Paprika being the least interesting "character" in Paprika.

This might be an overstatement, but I kinda feel that any advert appearing to aim at women but in which a beautiful woman is featured is automatically also geared towards men (in terms of the intention behind the advert).
 
 
Mysterious Transfer Student
14:46 / 26.06.07
Pardon my steering us back to this topic but I didn't honestly take away the implication that the Chairman was gay from my viewings. My reasoning was that the scene YO! refers to with the Chairman and Osanai seemed to me to be more of a callback to the opening, with Paprika and Konakawa waking up together after their therapy session, than any such implied relationship. It seemed to have been established that to use the DC Mini in a collaborative fashion the two users have to be in close proximity... but then of course that's shot down by the fact that (a) Paprika isn't a physically 'real' person and (b) as discussed above, the dividing line between dream and reality is never firmly established at any point in the film. My dislike of the homophobia in the material dealing with Himuro and the negative portrayal of the Chairman's physical disability seems to have precluded me from seeing the two faults as overlapping.

Nice call on the climax's visual similarity to Mononoke, though there again there are many hundreds of anime films and series that end with the bad guy or some proxy thereof achieving 'godlike' or giant status and needing to be brought back down to size. In glib terms the Chairman is the 'final boss' to Paprika's 'hero'. One thing that had me scratching my head: was the fact that the Chairman on reaching god status still had no visible genitals a function of censorial limitations or a reference to the fact that he was impotent, creatively sterile and therefore ripe for takedown by rudely feminine Paprika?

(Sorry, this post written in a hurry and therefore the above paragraphs are full of crass imperfections, but I didn't want the thought to pass.)
 
 
Seth
19:22 / 26.06.07
Yeah, dressing gowns are only worn in scenes that couldn't take place in a conventionally *real* world. And the opening scenes of the movie do rather imply that there's more going on with Paprika and Konokawa that a therapist/client relationship would typically allow. It's definitely intended to create a fuzzy boundary between therapist/escort.
 
 
Seth
23:19 / 02.01.08
I re-watched this recently and it occurred to me that an interesting way of reading the movie is to see it from the perspective that only the male characters are dreaming. Chiba says something of herself along the lines that she either hasn't been dreaming, or hasn't been remembering her dreams. From this angle the problematic material in the film concerning representations of homosexuality, disability, gender and geek/otaku wish-fulfilment, while not being entirely smoothed over and made palatable, are certainly contextualised better. It's arguable that men are more prejudiced against people with disabilities than women, but at a subjective level I'm aware of more pejorative terminology used by men than women when it comes to the disabled. Perhaps I'm being overly kind to Kon with this line of thought, because certainly Tokyo Godfathers is not without its problematic homosexual representations. But seen in this light it does seem much more in keeping with his thematic exploration of the darker aspects of the male unconscious... he's been considerably less successful at exploring women.

It's subject matter than I always feel under-qualified to discuss on Barbelith because I don't have the theoretical credentials that many of the best posters have, but I'd still like to see the same level of critique in these anime threads rather than seeing them become a bubble that's separated from the rest of the board.
 
 
Seth
23:37 / 02.01.08
The poster formerly known as Illmatic also made some interesting comments regarding whether the final image of Chiba after having consumed the Chairman is supposed to of a hermaphrodite fusion of the two, and that it's typical for androgeny to be depicted as skewed towards the feminine because those making the depiction are usually male. While this isn't true of my own dream states (hermaphrodites usually appear bearded to me) I do recognise it as pretty typical, and again makes me wonder whether it's only the dream lives of the male characters that are being depicted. Perhaps some help from someone who has read the book would be of use here, depending on how close Kon's work sticks to the original. Given the movies close visual and thematic resemblance to his own Paranoia Agent I think he probably makes substantial deviations.
 
 
petunia
08:58 / 11.03.08
Just thought I'd bump this thread to let people know that the DVD of Paprika is for sale for £4.99 on HMV's site. Not bad!
 
 
Hallo, Paper Spaceboy
16:52 / 22.05.08
It was on display at the Vancouver Art Gallery's "Krazy" exhibit (in theory, awesome, in practice an example of Art Spiegelman's obsessions and inability to relate to certain media), and then by coincidence my friend received a copy that very day, so we watched it the other night and I loved it. It's certainly problematic and the storyline itself is a little blah, but I enjoyed it a lot. I'm going to track down a torrent of it to have another viewing and make a stab at some analysis, although I love the hazy relationship between Chiba and Paprika.

We were left feeling like the opening credits were for a WB "post-Buffy" supernatural dramedy, which was a little odd. Certain aspects were overplayed -- the toy parade was used more than it needed to be, I think -- and I really didn't get the same queer reading overs did.
 
  

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