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Discordian Ritual

 
  

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· N · E · T ·
16:09 / 02.03.07
No, not fake, N. Just severely narrow-minded, IME. If you'd bother to take a look around, you'd realize that there are a whole host of magical folk here working in a variety of trads AND that they benefit from those practices in a variety of ways. But no, you don't, and so we all have to deal with thoughtless comments such as "traditional ritual BS". It just doesn't fly here, son. Nobody's impressed and I, personally, haven't found any of your posts in this thread useful at all. I'm led to believe that there are a few different strains of thought regarding Discordia, and I know which one I'd like to hear more about. And it's not yours.

So tell us again about how we're not regularly bending your brain at weird angles. Act smug about it. Then show us what a tough soldier you are by sticking around anyway.


I see your magical folk. I also see a comfortable groupthink that simply assumes a schema to my opinion and works to marginalize it.

Because I don't have an overtly magical mindset, you can't imagine that idea informing my philosophy. Or my surly friends. Of course.

And I'm terribly narrow-minded. Tell me more about my virtues as a person, perhaps you can bait me into a bannable offence.
 
 
electric monk
16:27 / 02.03.07
Okay, so you're misunderstood. Perhaps you'd like show us where we have judged your posts in error and how we might understand what you truly meant by "traditional ritual BS"?

Nobody's talking about banning, BTW.
 
 
Quantum
16:29 / 02.03.07
Psychology's confirmation bias, if you will.

Well, yes I'd agree we see connections, but your phrasing's confused me there. Confirmation bias being a term specifically from Psychology and all.
 
 
Quantum
16:33 / 02.03.07
Mind you, I was confused by Eris would fucking anybody. as well.

Would you care to explain a bit more about this view of yours;

Doing a ritual that doesn't mock "popular paganisms of the day" or superstition in general, at least in some capacity, somehow doesn't seem appropriate to Discordia.

as it seems to assume a particular view of discordianism as satire rather than mischief.
 
 
Less searchable M0rd4nt
16:37 / 02.03.07
Well to be fair, Netaungrot, you don't seem terribly interested in engaging with what's actually being said to you. Forgive me if I'm wrong but the way you're using language makes me feel that you're bringing certain unhelpful assumptions to the table. For example, Decaying these holy threads looks like an attempt to frame any suggestion that a poster is veering offtopic or might benefit from closer engagement as borne from overwrought self-regard.

Then there's your reluctance to respond in a positive way to anything that's being said to you--you haven't responded to my question, for example, while you're happy to get into a back-and-forth with monk where you accuse him of trying to bait you into a false move so we can chuck you off the board! That's a pretty nasty accusation, wouldn't you say? As is your accusation of "groupthink." Can you back this up? Can you point out specific instances of this groupthink at work, or at least outline what you think is its general nature?
 
 
· N · E · T ·
17:11 / 02.03.07
Okay, so you're misunderstood. Perhaps you'd like show us where we have judged your posts in error and how we might understand what you truly meant by "traditional ritual BS"?

I'm referring to the deep froof. The idea that symbolic exercises dependent on the certitude of belief cause non-local changes. That doubt in the exercise which otherwise may spur someone to creative yet non-magical solutions is squelched in the name of a biological predisposition towards illusion.

I don't doubt that working this part of our human experience doesn't confer a greater sense of purpose, depth and quality to the practitioner. But is it possible that this habit of minimizing doubt costs people's critical faculty on the whole? In a period of world and local affairs that people need every last neuron of analysis they can muster?
 
 
Quantum
17:27 / 02.03.07
The deep froof? Symbolic exercises dependent on the certitude of belief? You're going to have to be a little bit clearer I'm afraid, there are a lot of assumptions implicit in your post that not everyone will agree with.
Like certitude for example ('Sureness of occurrence or result; inevitability'). I don't think magic relies on inevitability, and in fact I'd say anyone who's 100% certain their ritual will work is in for disappointment a lot of the time.
 
 
· N · E · T ·
17:40 / 02.03.07
Well to be fair, Netaungrot, you don't seem terribly interested in engaging with what's actually being said to you. Forgive me if I'm wrong but the way you're using language makes me feel that you're bringing certain unhelpful assumptions to the table. For example, Decaying these holy threads looks like an attempt to frame any suggestion that a poster is veering offtopic or might benefit from closer engagement as borne from overwrought self-regard.

To be perfectly frank, it was a frivolous comment. Perhaps my machinations are more profound than I ever imagined.

Then there's your reluctance to respond in a positive way to anything that's being said to you--you haven't responded to my question, for example, while you're happy to get into a back-and-forth with monk where you accuse him of trying to bait you into a false move so we can chuck you off the board! That's a pretty nasty accusation, wouldn't you say? As is your accusation of "groupthink." Can you back this up? Can you point out specific instances of this groupthink at work, or at least outline what you think is its general nature?

I'd rather you find something of your own accord as I don't know you well enough to recommend an item tailored to your interests. The channels that you go through to procure something of curiosity set your sensitive initial conditions. I didn't feel that was my responsibility anymore. I regret not voicing my position on account of subsequent links to the forum. I'm not here to spam the funk out of you and I felt I was being put in that position.

I thought the links and suggestions I provided were enough advertising for any interested parties to find juicy material.

In regards to the groupthink, well, the lack of a search function is a curious absence. Dependence on Google's spiders seems a tad sheisty. It has always appeared that a significant population of Barbelizers have had a similar preference for my departure before a fair judgement of my ideas or character could be surmised.

Has left me a bit jaded when it comes with dealing with this demographic.
 
 
Quantum
17:45 / 02.03.07
the lack of a search function is a curious absence.

You know there's one at the bottom of the page, right?

a significant population of Barbelizers have had a similar preference for my departure before a fair judgement of my ideas or character could be surmised.

Who, when, and what made you think that? Most Barbelisers have no idea who you are and have no preference whatsoever I suspect. Strong froof.
 
 
· N · E · T ·
17:54 / 02.03.07
Mind you, I was confused by Eris would fucking anybody. as well.

Would you care to explain a bit more about this view of yours.


She's a hideous bitch that started a war?

The deep froof? Symbolic exercises dependent on the certitude of belief? You're going to have to be a little bit clearer I'm afraid, there are a lot of assumptions implicit in your post that not everyone will agree with.
Like certitude for example ('Sureness of occurrence or result; inevitability'). I don't think magic relies on inevitability, and in fact I'd say anyone who's 100% certain their ritual will work is in for disappointment a lot of the time.


Yes. The deep froof. Not the more reasonable manifestations of superstitous experience. The particular supernatural explanations that are magic's toughest sell to the scientifically inclined.

If y'all didn't have any modicum of reason in your approach I wouldn't be here discussing ideas with you, I'd solely be making savage jokes at your expense. I'd laugh, you'd ban me, and we'd go our merry ways.

I hope to continue this at a later time, perhaps over at HIMEOBS platform PD where threadjacks (intentional AND otherwise) are not such an inconvenience.

I've got to go to work.
 
 
Quantum
18:09 / 02.03.07
'Eris would fucking anybody' doesn't make any actual sense though, does it. You're missing a verb in the middle of that attempt at a sentence, which makes it hard to understand. Likewise, froof isn't a terribly informative word, meaning variously to have hair which exceeds normal lenght and texture, an imaginary goddess or bathtime products. None of which tally with the way you're using the word, which makes me think it's one of those coinings to foster a sense of identity in a group by exclusion, like a little game of Mornington Crescent.
If you want people to understand what you're trying to say, be clearer- if you don't want anyone to understand why bother posting?
 
 
Quantum
18:11 / 02.03.07
Oh, when you come back, your reading is a bit wobbly as well. Let me repeat the question, parsed for ease of comprehension;

"Would you care to explain a bit more about this view of yours;

Doing a ritual that doesn't mock "popular paganisms of the day" or superstition in general, at least in some capacity, somehow doesn't seem appropriate to Discordia.

as it seems to assume a particular view of discordianism as satire rather than mischief."
 
 
· N · E · T ·
00:36 / 03.03.07
Eris would fucking anybody' doesn't make any actual sense though, does it. You're missing a verb in the middle of that attempt at a sentence, which makes it hard to understand. Likewise, froof isn't a terribly informative word, meaning variously to have hair which exceeds normal lenght and texture, an imaginary goddess or bathtime products. None of which tally with the way you're using the word, which makes me think it's one of those coinings to foster a sense of identity in a group by exclusion, like a little game of Mornington Crescent.
If you want people to understand what you're trying to say, be clearer- if you don't want anyone to understand why bother posting?


It makes perfect sense. You're hung up on the grammar and concrete understanding–you can't feel it. Poetry could very well give you an aneurysm. As your doctor, I recommend you lock yourself in a steel uterus indefinitely.

When existing words don't satisfy the intention, new ones are coined. This is the natural selection of language. You, chap, and millions like you, cannot. Stop. It.

I explained froof. It's a particularly virulent strain of superstitious roflcake that can induce paroxysms of headasplody.

Oh, when you come back, your reading is a bit wobbly as well. Let me repeat the question, parsed for ease of comprehension

For a cat obsessed with definitions, you sure as hell know how to utterly ruin "parse." You might want to get that uterus plated wiff titanium alloy, just in case.

[you] seem to assume a particular view of discordianism as satire rather than mischief."

Both Mr Quantum. For the time being. Discordia's heart and soul is fueled by the misery of idiots. People's capacity for owning the fuck out themselves is infinite. It's gotta be. We are the most ridiculous animal to ever fail in the canopy. Truly a special creature.


the lack of a search function is a curious absence.

You know there's one at the bottom of the page, right?


It certainly gives that impression. However, a bit of investigation yields a fat bag of bollocks. How am I ever going to stalk you people if you keep changing your monikers and preventing searches by username?

This make the Grot ah, how you say, sad panda.

Look, we've just careened this thread off the side of a well lubricated mountainside. I'd just as soon divert it into another outlet than participate in this celebration of compulsive asshattery any longer.

I wanted to provide another perspective on the topic, bust your chops a little bit and skulk out of here before something like this happened again.

How people of your intelligence could get so absorbed into the velvety folds of my scrotal flux is truly beyond me. I know I'm a beautiful primate, but

come

on.


I never wanted this thread. I wanted to say my piece and allow it to continue developing of it's own free will. Please stop making me the centerpiece of this thing before I lose control of my bowels.


If you want to talk more or exchange riposte, you know where to find me.
 
 
ONLY NICE THINGS
02:03 / 03.03.07
Living with your mum?
 
 
The Ghost of Tom Winter
05:41 / 03.03.07
Netaungrot your lack of ability to respond appropriately to questions asks merely shows your aptitude for unintellectual reasoning and discussion. Your clever "responses" (both full of mystery and wonder I might note) add nothing to your ideas but further the notion that your idea of self-betterment is obviously getting you no where. fast. so please, let us can the ego for a moment and attempt a peaceful discussion focused not on you (gasp) but on the idea of Discordian myth and ritual itself. Personally, I enjoy the topic but want to see a new side of Discordian sans the fnords.
 
 
The Ghost of Tom Winter
05:48 / 03.03.07
I recently made a figurine to resemble Eris and placed it on my semi-alter. I have to say I have felt her present more so, and in a stronger way than I have when I’ve tried to mildly reach our to other deities (I assume we all are referring to Discordian Eris and not Ancient Greek Eris here since that is the focus of the board). I do have to say I utterly despise all the shit that has been connected with discordian, I don’t think I have to explain that too much (see above). I love the take saintmae has on ritual and discordianism in general. I’d like to see some talk on an idea of a “post-fnord” Eris. From what I’ve felt in this brief week of reaching out it seems like there is a more mature Eris somewhere that is lacking the tent painting and crazy hat wearing. Anyone else have these types of experiences?
 
 
Quantum
09:51 / 03.03.07
I thnk there are plenty of post-fnord discordians out there, and I can think of some people who delved deeply into Eris in the 80s and 90s whose practice has developed out of that stuff.

Sorry for any threadrot, but I just want to respond to Nettie before I retire to my titanium armoured womb;

you sure as hell know how to utterly ruin "parse."
Mmm, 'parsing (more formally syntax analysis) is the process of analyzing a sequence of tokens to determine its grammatical structure with respect to a given formal grammar.'
You're misreading was a parsing error, lumping the first part of my post with Would you care to explain a bit more about this view of yours; instead of the second. So I reposted it without the first, obviously confusing sentence, to aid your comprehension. Thus 'parsed'.

I explained froof. It's a particularly virulent strain of superstitious roflcake that can induce paroxysms of headasplody.
It's one of those coinings to foster a sense of identity in a group by exclusion, like a little game of Mornington Crescent. But shitter.
 
 
Less searchable M0rd4nt
11:46 / 03.03.07
Oh! Nettie is this kitten, is he? I'd forgotten all about him, but then we get so many smug, self-absorbed, half-bright Fnordy McFnordpantses swinging through here to "save us from ourselves" with made-up words and lousy sentence structure it's hard to keep them all straight. Nettie distinguishes himself by being the fnordpants who's learned (a minimal amound of) NLP motivated purely by the desire to manipulate people and create distress where he cannot successfully manipulate. Gotcha. I'll make a note for next time.

I never wanted this thread. I wanted to say my piece and allow it to continue developing of it's own free will. Please stop making me the centerpiece of this thing before I lose control of my bowels.

Taking a quick shufti at my Nettie/English dictionary, I get: I wanted to get up on my hind legs and spout off without being challenged. I am now being called on my shit and it gives me a funny feeling in my tummy. You're mean. Why can't you be more like my Lj friends list?

Pickle, nobody made you the centerpiece of anything except you. If you choose to make rude, critical, poorly-written posts (hint: typos and grammatical errors are not poetry, and making up words does not make you into the living RAW) you are likely to find that some of your boardmates take an aggressive interest in what you write. This is a messageboard. People read what you write and are allowed to tell you if they don't like it. Wear a hat.

Now, since Barbelith is unlikely to become mcfnordypantsfora.com in the short to medium term, you have two choices here. You can either accept that most people here don't want to read this crap and find a way to engage meaningfully, or you can accept that most people here don't want to read this crap and fuck off somewhere else. It's your call, although I seriously doubt your ability to cope with the former and would strongly recommend the latter.
 
 
illmatic
11:52 / 03.03.07
What I find odd about N's responses is he could have just linked to some good threads on the Discordian board and said why he enjoyed them. Instead, we enter bizarro world. Oh well.

Other than that, I'm enjoying reading about people's personal experiences. Saintmae, I find your stuff really interesting. I hope the mini Barb row doesn't put you off. Occupational hazard.
 
 
Ticker
13:29 / 03.03.07
Please do continue saintmae I am also enjoying your posts.
 
 
Quantum
14:36 / 03.03.07
Yes, more good Discordianism please!
 
 
illmatic
15:04 / 03.03.07
Hopefully, these couple of responses will cut away Neurosisgrot's persecution complex. We do like new posters, see, we just like them to be able to communicate coherently!
 
 
Less searchable M0rd4nt
15:27 / 03.03.07
Yep, definatly keen to hear more from saintmae; and no, our problem isn't with n00bs. (BTW, Nettie's been here since 2002...)
 
 
· N · E · T ·
18:42 / 03.03.07
Living with your mum?

Living with my wife.


Fuck it. If you're going to continue to ride my nuts, I'll stay and you can continue to scapegoat me for messing up your thread.
 
 
· N · E · T ·
19:02 / 03.03.07
I explained froof. It's a particularly virulent strain of superstitious roflcake that can induce paroxysms of headasplody.
It's one of those coinings to foster a sense of identity in a group by exclusion, like a little game of Mornington Crescent. But shitter.


Of course, Barbelizers never play that game.

...you sure as hell know how to utterly ruin "parse."
Mmm, 'parsing (more formally syntax analysis) is the process of analyzing a sequence of tokens to determine its grammatical structure with respect to a given formal grammar.'
You're misreading was a parsing error, lumping the first part of my post with Would you care to explain a bit more about this view of yours; instead of the second. So I reposted it without the first, obviously confusing sentence, to aid your comprehension. Thus 'parsed'.


You didn't analyze squat. You reposted a portion.

So you admit to a communication error? OH NOES!!1 BARBELITH IS TEH CRUMBLING! Mordant!!1 EXECUTE THIS POSTER!


I never wanted this thread. I wanted to say my piece and allow it to continue developing of it's own free will. Please stop making me the centerpiece of this thing before I lose control of my bowels.

Taking a quick shufti at my Nettie/English dictionary, I get: I wanted to get up on my hind legs and spout off without being challenged. I am now being called on my shit and it gives me a funny feeling in my tummy. You're mean. Why can't you be more like my Lj friends list?


Ok. So you prefer to just fling shit.

First give me a moment to laugh it out my ass onto your nose.

If you had a halfway decent forum, I'd be able to search the records and provide evidence. You don't. So only wankers that have been chest deep in this forum slough for years will have any sort of hope of finding what they're looking for.

Lame.

Pickle, nobody made you the centerpiece of anything except you. If you choose to make rude, critical, poorly-written posts (hint: typos and grammatical errors are not poetry, and making up words does not make you into the living RAW) you are likely to find that some of your boardmates take an aggressive interest in what you write. This is a messageboard. People read what you write and are allowed to tell you if they don't like it. Wear a hat.

Now, since Barbelith is unlikely to become mcfnordypantsfora.com in the short to medium term, you have two choices here. You can either accept that most people here don't want to read this crap and find a way to engage meaningfully, or you can accept that most people here don't want to read this crap and fuck off somewhere else. It's your call, although I seriously doubt your ability to cope with the former and would strongly recommend the latter.


That typos are one of your primary concerns, how about you get your head out of your small intestine and go play language police with every poster's english?

Well that settles it. I'm staying. Bite it.

You're a hilarious little animal.


What I find odd about N's responses is he could have just linked to some good threads on the Discordian board and said why he enjoyed them. Instead, we enter bizarro world. Oh well.

I explained that.
 
 
ONLY NICE THINGS
19:06 / 03.03.07
Careful, guys. Any moment now he will use NLP mentalism on you.
 
 
· N · E · T ·
19:10 / 03.03.07
Careful, guys. Any moment now he will use NLP mentalism on you.

D/N/T mind bullets.
 
 
illmatic
19:23 / 03.03.07
I explained that.

No, you didn't.

Why is it, whenever you come on to the board, you seem to have these little spats? Could it possibly be something to do with you? Oblique posting style plus massive defensiveness, lack of anything meaningful to say, rapid descent into insults.

No, obviously, it's us.

I hope all you guys have learned a lesson from thsi.
 
 
Less searchable M0rd4nt
19:43 / 03.03.07
I find your implication that Barbelith IS HIDING SOMETHING pretty lame too, when in fact we have a page in the wiki dedicated to finding stuff, as well as a numer of threads in the Policy forum on the same topic. (We also have a longish thread right at the very tippy-top of said forum which talks, amongst other things, about why our funtionality isn't so hot right now. Guess the three little mouse-clicks that would have taken you over there were just too much effort.)

As for flinging shit: I've been able to offer substantiation for everything I've said about you. You, on the other hand, have resorted to essentially making stuff up. Your suggestion that one of my primary concerns is the humble typo would be a case in point. Your rude, abrasive manner and faliure to engage usefully with the board are my primary concerns. Your basic inability to communicate effectively should be more of a concern for you.

Not sure if your comment about executing posters is a suggestion that I should take out your interlocutor, or a suggestion that you yourself are being dragged behind the chemical sheds. Either way, I have no power to ban anyone. I can't even delete your posts without getting agreement from two other mods. All I can do is start a "should we ban Nettie?" thread in the Policy, which will drag on for a couple of weeks, and may or may not result in you being locked out of your account. (Incidentally, you can speed that whole process up and ensure a ban by continuing to post the way you've been posting for the last couple of days.)

Now I suggest we return to the topic at hand, which is Discordian Ritual and not The Wonderful World of Nettie. If you have any problems with me, the other moderators, or Barbelith as a whole, I suggest you take them to the Policy. I'm going to start moving to delete off-topic posts from here on in.
 
 
Quantum
00:36 / 04.03.07
*some posts deleted*
 
 
EmberLeo
21:08 / 04.03.07
I hope all you guys have learned a lesson from thsi.

Only the usual: Please do not feed the trolls.

--Ember--
 
 
· N · E · T ·
00:53 / 08.03.07
The best in Discordian ritual that I've done (I haven't been to anyone else's, just the ones I've done) seems to be somewhat light on actual magic(k) since so many Discordians aren't heavy occultists, but still personally transformative. I like using kind of silly methods to belie serious purpose, a sort of slipping in of intent behind the conscious objecting mind.

Part of the reason I abandoned the occultist, and neopagan angle to Discordianism is due to that bolded idea. You don't need superstition or explicitly magical paradigms to do that. Do you?

Discordian ritual for me, is finding those with viewpoints radically different than my own and engaging honestly and openly with them. And definitely pulling no punches. Call it bastardized tantra, trolling, asshattery, standing on your hind legs, it doesn't matter. It helps me learn about myself, others, and the human condition.

And the laughs are to be had (for those that take them) on all sides of the table.
 
 
· N · E · T ·
00:55 / 08.03.07
Offtopic post deleted by mods
 
 
electric monk
01:44 / 08.03.07
If you'd like to continue in this manner or, indeed, have any complaints, it'd probably be best if you took it here so as to avoid further rotting this thread.
 
  

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