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Come and celebrate OneWebDay!

 
  

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pointless & uncalled for
14:40 / 22.09.06
Because it allows the uninhibited flow of stupidity and ignorance?
 
 
paranoidwriter waves hello
14:42 / 22.09.06
It allows for a lot of things.
 
 
STOATIE LIEKS CHOCOLATE MILK
14:44 / 22.09.06
I used to slate the internet an awful lot. My favourite line was "yeah, my mate had Teletext when we were kids. It was wicked!" Looking back, this is probably to do with the fact that I was living with at least two total computer geeks at the time. Well, that and jealousy- everyone else was getting these cool cartoons and stuff, and I, well, wasn't.
 
 
ONLY NICE THINGS
14:50 / 22.09.06
Erm... %Because they think it's funny?% Because they haven't used it themselves for anything other than trivia (which is cool, but...)

Well, define trivia. You have used it to publish your short fiction, as have I. On one level, that's beautiful, but I don't, to my knowledge, know anyone whose life was actually saved by it. Improved, obviously, but not saved.

So, I think we can certainly celebrate the way that the Internet has impacted our lives - which is indeed remarkable. Pre-Internet, it would have been far more difficult, although by no means impossible, to do many things we do very easily now. However, I'd say that implicit in the very title of the day - OneWebDay - is the suggestion that this is one web which should be able to connect everyone, because their isn't a (forgive the pun) safety Net to catch the disadvantaged. There's a Net Neutrality message there, of course, but also a call to address the inequality in the distribution of information - especially since information is cheaper to transport than almost any other vital aid supply.

So, yes. If the Internet's a tool, why aren't we having wrench day? If it's more than a tool in some way - and I'd say that if by "the Internet" we mean "everything that goes on which depends on the Internet" then it is, how can we apply its toolishness and its otherness for maximum good?
 
 
paranoidwriter waves hello
15:02 / 22.09.06
I first had internet access of my own about two years ago (thanks to broadband and sharing the monthly cost among five people). Previously, I'd worked a lot online and also created my own website, but I felt cut off from something I knew I could use to help myself and others. It was like being barred access to a fishing rod.

I have never had up-to-date technology, ever. Even the computer I'm using now is ten years old and was passed on to me by a good friend. Indeed, one might say that I'm a Womble. And to be honest, I'm proud of it. "Making good use of the things that we find, Things that the everyday folks leave behind" is a damn good way to live (IMO), and it makes you appreciate what you have, when you have it.

Sure, the internet is full of dodgy porn and nasty pedophiles grooming innocents. But so is the REAL world. The interweb is almost a kind of reflection of Global Society (including the fact that many people, to all intents and purposes, do not "register" on Society's radar).

How one uses any tool is a reflection of one's self.

e.g. What do you use (e.g) a knife for?
 
 
paranoidwriter waves hello
15:04 / 22.09.06
Haus, stop asking me to define things. Use your dictionary.
 
 
ONLY NICE THINGS
15:05 / 22.09.06
I can't believe you are being so rude to me on my birthday, PW. You've kind of ruined today for me.
 
 
paranoidwriter waves hello
15:08 / 22.09.06
I have no idea whether you're joking or not.

But if not:

HAPPY BIRTHDAY HAUS!

And please, stop trying to derail the celebration? Go and start another thread if you want to define "trivia" or whatever. I'll gladly contribute, positively.
 
 
STOATIE LIEKS CHOCOLATE MILK
15:12 / 22.09.06
Wait a minute...

Haus is the internet?

Things seem much clearer now.
 
 
paranoidwriter waves hello
15:13 / 22.09.06
Haus is the internet?

?
 
 
ONLY NICE THINGS
15:32 / 22.09.06
Me, having some lovely birthday cake.

 
 
paranoidwriter waves hello
15:35 / 22.09.06
Careful, you're slobbering all over the carpet.

Tell you what, shall I start a Birthday thread for you? You can invite people and hopefully they won't attack you.

Cool?
 
 
ONLY NICE THINGS
15:35 / 22.09.06
Yum yum.

Anyway.


Organisation is a very good place to start. You can plan protests ahead of time using the Internet, and probably reach more people than if you were relying on flyposting, stickering etc alone. Of course a lot of those people will be outside the geographical area, or will reach the information while looking for something else, but that's cool because the cost of consuming that information to the creator is tiny once the cost of creating is taken out of the equation. That's the same principle as spam, really - create once, distribute massively. And, of course, people can opt-in.

There's a downside to that, which is that it also makes people much easier to trace. Unless you're very careful, your PC will be full of cookies, which will tie, for example, your google searches to your gmail account, or your Internet usage to your IP address. So, we're in two-edged sword territory - and I don't think an awareness of that prevents celebration. The Internet changes the way we operate, and it also changes the way we can be observed and controlled - that is, it operates in a way that is markedly different from the "real world", but covers many of the same issues.

Interestingly, in particular in light of the race to create a developing-world-friendly computer (the $100 laptop challenge), there's been some thinking that the Internet will come into its own in the developing world primarily when a) data exchange costs scale down and b) 3G phones start getting recycled. Now, that's a fascinating piece of trickledown - suddenly, millions of people are going to get potential access to Internet data services, and be able to carry it around with them. Mobile phone reception is already more reliable and easier to provide in infrastructure terms than wired telephony in much of Africa, and if you can distribute, say, lots of wind-up battery chargers you have a fairly renewable access source. That has tremendous potential to move information around, and to provide a speech-text-image fluidity that would be fantastic for distributed recovery work. I mean, sending video of your mate's arse on a Friday night is good, but sending video of, say, a broken well to an expert three days' travel away could be an actual lifesaver. That maybe can tie into the organisation of protessts in the Philippines using mobile devices - there's a Habermasian element to this, definitely.
 
 
Disco is My Class War
15:39 / 22.09.06
Haus is so the Internet. Inhabiting a jar doesn't mean you can't have tentacles that double as the optic fibres of the universe, you know. (Happy birthday, btw.)

This is really anti-joiner of me, but I don't understand this desire for everyone to all be 'All One'. The Internet is not some United Nations of Data Transfer -- in fact, it's multiple, nets rather than Net. And that's the beauty of them.
 
 
ONLY NICE THINGS
15:50 / 22.09.06
Well, I like the techhnical definition of the Internet - a series of interconnections through which a large number of computer networks are linked. And now, I suppose, lots of things that are strictly speaking computers but look like phones, TVs, hi-fis and so on... So, yes - that multiplicity, the way you can keep altering the mechanism you use to access data - is very cool in itself.
 
 
Kali, Queen of Kitteh
15:52 / 22.09.06
Wow.

Haus is the Lawnmower Man.

Wow.
 
 
Quantum
15:55 / 22.09.06
Haus, have you met my sister?



Haus, this is Gladys, Gladys, this is Haus.
 
 
ONLY NICE THINGS
15:56 / 22.09.06
Hello, Gladys. I love what you've done with your hair. Fancy a byte?

Oh come on... I had to. He made me do it.
 
 
Quantum
15:57 / 22.09.06
She's from the future you know. It's green there.

(Glancing at the forum description I find For off-topic discussion, introductions and chatting phew! Wouldn't want Gladys to get a hostile reception after all, she's sensitive.)
 
 
ONLY NICE THINGS
15:59 / 22.09.06
(Speaking of which, am I on crazy pills or have I actually contributed more to this topic, and ontopic, than anyone else?)
 
 
STOATIE LIEKS CHOCOLATE MILK
16:02 / 22.09.06
(I was just thinking the same thing meself of you, Haus).

So, has anyone done any of the OneWebDay stuff, like the Flickr thing?

I feel I should celebrate by doing some hot deathmatching (which may be one of the web's more trivial functions, but which still rocks), but I have to sleep soon so I can go to work tonight.
 
 
paranoidwriter waves hello
16:03 / 22.09.06
Haus, as it's your birthday, I'm backing out of this thread. (I knew I shouldn't have started it in the Conversation.)
 
 
STOATIE LIEKS CHOCOLATE MILK
16:06 / 22.09.06
Am I missing something? What's wrong with this thread? There's about a fifty/fifty mix of on- and off-topic stuff, some funnies, some interesting ideas... should there be something else I'm just not getting?
 
 
Spatula Clarke
16:13 / 22.09.06
"Let's celebrate!"

"Why are we celebrating again?"

"Go away. Let's celebrate!"

That's about the sum of it, as far as I can see.
 
 
grant
16:53 / 22.09.06
Were people more alone before the Internet, though, or just socially functioning in different ways?

I wrote quite a lot of letters with people, but with far fewer people. I didn't live in a terribly urban area, so finding things that fell in my category of interests (the things around which I have built my fragile identity) was very difficult. I mean, nobody knew what Marmite was, and I had to find obscure psychedelic records in cut-out bins and import racks (often after driving two hours to get there).

I don't think the concept of community can be ignored, either -- I'm not communicating as much one-on-one with a person who may or may not follow my stream of babble, but with groups of people who cluster around the complexes of things in which I'm interested or involved. Not just on here -- I'm on a few interracial/adoptive family groups, odd religious groups and a few other things. Places where I'm much less of a fringey outlier.

(I suppose that has upsides and downsides, though.)

The internet, less on the "loneliness" track, has also revolutionized schooling. As parent, can now check Edline.net for grades week-by-week instead of waiting for grim surprises come report-card day. As teacher, can organize interactive journals for writing students to workshop pieces without taking up classtime (and more efficiently than the in-person, around-the-table read & critique practice too). As a tool for sharing information in that way, it's pretty effective.
 
 
grant
17:08 / 22.09.06
On the other hand, if we were in person, I would bake a birthday cake and draw a picture of David Tennant morphing into David Warner on the top in bright blue icing.

And light 107 candles on top.
 
 
Kali, Queen of Kitteh
18:18 / 22.09.06
Well, grant, if you want, when my birthday is in November, you can make me a cake of Chris Eccleston morphing into David Tennant.

Best. Cake. Ever.
 
 
Our Lady Has Left the Building
20:17 / 22.09.06
This is a bit unfocused as I'm in a rush. Sorry about this.

I've been thinking a bit about communities, mainly because while you can talk about information management and Internet 2.0 what really matters in public libraries is reader development. When the People's Network was rolled out however many years ago it was all about getting the community onto the Internet, about giving the Information poor means to do something about that poverty. I don't think it has achieved that. It's got bums through the doors sure, though in our case book issues are still down and I've got a sneaking suspicion visitor numbers are also down, though less severely. However, the part of the community that I see most is, as far as I can judge, largely that part of the middle class that could afford to be on the Internet and just aren't.

The part of the community that the People's Network should be for, those that can't afford the kit, they aren't interested by and large. Now, I must say that this could be our fault. We have any number of problems and community outreach is a big one.

But home internet access in the UK has only broken the 50% barrier in the last three years, out of more than the number of 21,660,475 families counted in the 2001 census. The highest concentration of internet connections in the UK was the south-east of England. (Next time someone uses the term 'London clique' in disparaging terms we can at least admit that we're just following the national trends as identified by the NSO)

How much of what you do on computers really needs to be done on computers? I'm listening to iTunes right now, downloading a TV show, I have my email a click away and am writing this in my browser, but this is all enjoyment. At work I use networked computers for the system by which we track and manage our stock. I think it's all too easy and all too possible to think that because we use computers so much that everyone must need to use computers so much as well and, if they don't, they are missing out. But are the information poor really missing out, or is it that they don't need to play on computers? I'm not saying we're mistaken in offering the service, and I'd love to get the message out to the sections of the community we're not reaching, if only to be sure for myself that they know the service is available, but I'm wondering how much of what you can do with a computer or the internet is (I'm not sure what the best word is here) 'useful' on a societal level rather than 'useful' on a private/personal level?
 
 
HCE
09:28 / 23.09.06
The internet has been a mixed blessing for me. I don't have to make friends with whoever happens to be sitting next to me at the gym or at the office anymore, or go through the laborious process of softening up writers through the mail, which can take years. I figure that X% of the population is made up of people I'd like to be close to, and the internet makes it really easy to find those people. I assume that people are generally much more pleasant in person, but frankly if somebody is in other respects lovely but has an obsessive hatred of women or people of color that comes out on message boards, I'd just as soon know that up front.

I can see how some people might take this ease for granted, but that has not happened to me yet and I continue to find my web-initiated and web-based friendships a source of joy and wonder. I have mostly tended to have friends who were superficially unlike me -- differing in generation, gender, ethnicity, taste, beliefs, etc. -- but post-web this effect has become exaggerated. In particular, I have friends much younger than myself now, which is a really novel experience for me. I had a definite prejudice against young people but now find them and their music new and exciting. Likewise 'religious' folks -- which I use here as a very broad umbrella term for people who aren't common-or-garden atheists. I am very grateful for the opportunity to have had some of my more dismissive attitudes shaken out of me.

The downside is that when you have more in common with your friends than the fact that you have to occupy the same space for some portion of the day, you become very attached to them very quickly, and then they move to Chicago, and Chicago is too cold to visit except for a few weeks out of the year. It gets very expensive to fly all over the place to see your friends, and having made the switch to being regularly online, I find that the rare thing now isn't the opportunity to get to know somebody well, it's the opportunity to have a cup of tea with that person. I find myself suffering sharp pangs of longing for the chance to lie around on the sofa seeing what kind of noises we can make by drumming on our bellies or trying to beatbox, just being silly.

Even research really goes back to people for me. How often do you use google and how often do you ask people you know?
 
 
Psych Safeling
16:53 / 26.09.06
The internet has changed my doctor's life for the worse. I am at least ten times the hypochondriac I ought to be, and I now frequently fail to Respect Hir Authority as a result of my own autodidact medical wisdom.
 
 
STOATIE LIEKS CHOCOLATE MILK
18:04 / 26.09.06
I was having a similar conversation with my vet the other week- "I've looked online, and I think she's got kennel cough".
"Oh, the amount of people who tell me they've looked online... erm... yes, it's kennel cough." (Sheena's fine now, incidentally).
 
  

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